Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Will]

My oddball prediction is that if Skull Kid is in the next smash, then young link might tag along too. Would be a tad weird to not have them interact in at least a reveal trailer, you know?

If this is how we get Young Link with a unique Majora’s Mask moveset then I won’t complain.

 

[Gengar84]

This is just my own personal preference but I would rather see unique movesets go to completely different characters rather than alternate versions of the same ones. That’s why I was okay cutting Zero Suit Samus and I’m not overly excited about seeing Paper Mario. Still, if they’re fun to play, I don’t mind too much and Fierce Deity Link is cool enough that a unique Young Link could still be exciting despite being another Link. I’d rather see a unique character like Midna or Skull Kid but I’d take it.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Wii Fit Trainer is a "Surprise!"/WTF character. That doesn't even need a Sakurai interview. No one saw this character coming prior to her reveal at E3 2013 and that was a lot of the joke. Even people back in the day were joking that, for as much time as people put into speculation, Sakurai managed to get the one character that no one had thought of or suggested.

Smash for Wii U/3DS just had two "Surprise!" characters between WFT and Duck Hunt.

Nobody took Rosalina as a serious option either until she got revealed. I should know; I tried making a case for her being an option for a goddamn speculation chart and got a LOT of pushback. She wasn't Toad or Bowser Jr. and "They would never add her before Daisy."
Guess she's a "surprise character" too.

Same with Robin and by extension Lucina. Thinking anyone but Chrom had any sort of chance? Let alone the avatar character? HA! You must be joking.
"Surprise characters".

And don't even get me started on Greninja. No one had a consensus on what Pokémon from X/Y was coming but one thing was certain; "a Starter Pokémon will never be without a Trainer". No one saw a solo Greninja coming. And it's not like Greninja had any sort of stardom at the time either to make it make sense.
"Surprise character".

Hell, no one actually predicted Villager either, especially not after it was made clear that someone like him would "never" be in Smash since Sakurai said it made no sense for them to fight, along with Nintendog. And those that were still advocating for an Animal Crossing character regardless all banked on Tom Nook.
Oh hey, Villager's a "surprise character" too by definition.


Oh look at that, Smash For actually has at least SEVEN "Surprise Characters".

 

[fogbadge]

there used to be an idea that floated around (had its own support thread) of a character called Masked Link, with Deku, Goron and Zora Links in a PT style trio. the idea was always Fierce Deity was the final smash so when people talk about Young Link having it for the final smash makes me think of that

 

[Gengar84]

Nobody took Rosalina as a serious option either until she got revealed. I should know; I tried making a case for her being an option for a goddamn speculation chart and got a LOT of pushback. She wasn't Toad or Bowser Jr. and "They would never add her before Daisy."
Guess she's a "surprise character" too.

Same with Robin and by extension Lucina. Thinking anyone but Chrom had any sort of chance? Let alone the avatar character? HA! You must be joking.
"Surprise characters".

And don't even get me started on Greninja. No one had a consensus on what Pokémon from X/Y was coming but one thing was certain; "a Starter Pokémon will never be without a Trainer". No one saw a solo Greninja coming. And it's not like Greninja had any sort of stardom at the time either to make it make sense.
"Surprise character".

Hell, no one actually predicted Villager either, especially not after it was made clear that someone like him would "never" be in Smash since Sakurai said it made no sense for them to fight, along with Nintendog. And those that were still advocating for an Animal Crossing character regardless all banked on Tom Nook.
Oh hey, Villager's a "surprise character" too by definition.


Oh look at that, Smash For actually has at least SEVEN "Surprise Characters".

And that’s exactly why I never rule any possibility out. Sakurai has a history of surprising us and doing things we once thought were impossible. I think that usually leaves us with a more exciting end roster than if we just got only the most speculated characters every time.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

And that’s exactly why I never rule any possibility out. Sakurai has a history of surprising us and doing things we once thought were impossible. I think that usually leaves us with a more exciting end roster than if we just got only the most speculated characters every time.

This is why people are sleeping on Master Kohga fr.

 

[Gengar84]

This is why people are sleeping on Master Kohga fr.

Kohga would definitely be interesting. He’s not my top Zelda pick but I do think Smash could use more villains. Plus he was fun to use in Age of Calamity.

 

[RileyXY1]

Nobody took Rosalina as a serious option either until she got revealed. I should know; I tried making a case for her being an option for a goddamn speculation chart and got a LOT of pushback. She wasn't Toad or Bowser Jr. and "They would never add her before Daisy."
Guess she's a "surprise character" too.

Same with Robin and by extension Lucina. Thinking anyone but Chrom had any sort of chance? Let alone the avatar character? HA! You must be joking.
"Surprise characters".

And don't even get me started on Greninja. No one had a consensus on what Pokémon from X/Y was coming but one thing was certain; "a Starter Pokémon will never be without a Trainer". No one saw a solo Greninja coming. And it's not like Greninja had any sort of stardom at the time either to make it make sense.
"Surprise character".

Hell, no one actually predicted Villager either, especially not after it was made clear that someone like him would "never" be in Smash since Sakurai said it made no sense for them to fight, along with Nintendog. And those that were still advocating for an Animal Crossing character regardless all banked on Tom Nook.
Oh hey, Villager's a "surprise character" too by definition.


Oh look at that, Smash For actually has at least SEVEN "Surprise Characters".

And much of Ultimate's DLC consisted of "surprise characters".

No one saw Joker coming due to Persona being almost completely absent on Nintendo consoles. Many people thought that if Atlus was getting a rep they would instead go for a SMT character due to that series having a much stronger presence on Nintendo consoles.
No one saw Byleth coming due to the past four DLC characters all being third parties, so everyone expected the last one to follow suit. The only thing pointing in Byleth's favor was that Fire Emblem: Three Houses strangely did not get a Spirit Event while other games released around the same time like Astral Chain and Pokémon Sword and Shield did.
Min Min was another surprise character due to the assumption that "Spirits deconfirm" that a good chunk of the fanbase believed and ARMS being seen as a "base game or bust" deal. So it came as a massive surprise when in March 2020 it was revealed that the first fighter in the second Fighter's Pass would be from ARMS, but without revealing exactly who the character was, which caused theories to run rampant. These included such outlandish theories as them putting multiple ARMS reps into one slot and the fighter actually being a new character set to be introduced in a possible "ARMS 2".
Sephiroth was another surprise character. No one saw him coming due to the paltry content SE games had been getting up to that point, so no one expected another to come, let alone one from a franchise that already had a character.
While XC2 getting a rep gained traction after Min Min's reveal, everyone expected Rex to be the one to get in. Very few people expected the XC2 rep to actually be Pyra and Mythra in one slot, especially considering that transformation characters had been retired aside from Pokémon Trainer at the point, so few expected Sakurai to add a new one.
While Tekken was a popular requested series, Heihachi was the speculation favorite, especially considering that he was considered but scrapped from Smash 4. Hardly anyone expected the Tekken rep to actually be his son Kazuya.
Sora came out of left field because no one expected Sakurai to even be able to get the rights to use him. He was widely viewed as a pipe dream pick due to the association with Disney, who is notoriously difficult to work with, but Sora being the winner of the Smash Ballot ultimately gave Sakurai the passion to get the rights to use Sora, with the reason for FP2 having a 6th slot being an extra slot for Sora.

 

[fogbadge]

And much of Ultimate's DLC consisted of "surprise characters".

No one saw Joker coming due to Persona being almost completely absent on Nintendo consoles. Many people thought that if Atlus was getting a rep they would instead go for a SMT character due to that series having a much stronger presence on Nintendo consoles.
No one saw Byleth coming due to the past four DLC characters all being third parties, so everyone expected the last one to follow suit. The only thing pointing in Byleth's favor was that Fire Emblem: Three Houses strangely did not get a Spirit Event while other games released around the same time like Astral Chain and Pokémon Sword and Shield did.
Min Min was another surprise character due to the assumption that "Spirits deconfirm" that a good chunk of the fanbase believed and ARMS being seen as a "base game or bust" deal. So it came as a massive surprise when in March 2020 it was revealed that the first fighter in the second Fighter's Pass would be from ARMS, but without revealing exactly who the character was, which caused theories to run rampant. These included such outlandish theories as them putting multiple ARMS reps into one slot and the fighter actually being a new character set to be introduced in a possible "ARMS 2".
Sephiroth was another surprise character. No one saw him coming due to the paltry content SE games had been getting up to that point, so no one expected another to come, let alone one from a franchise that already had a character.
While XC2 getting a rep gained traction after Min Min's reveal, everyone expected Rex to be the one to get in. Very few people expected the XC2 rep to actually be Pyra and Mythra in one slot, especially considering that transformation characters had been retired aside from Pokémon Trainer at the point, so few expected Sakurai to add a new one.
While Tekken was a popular requested series, Heihachi was the speculation favorite, especially considering that he was considered but scrapped from Smash 4. Hardly anyone expected the Tekken rep to actually be his son Kazuya.
Sora came out of left field because no one expected Sakurai to even be able to get the rights to use him. He was widely viewed as a pipe dream pick due to the association with Disney, who is notoriously difficult to work with, but Sora being the winner of the Smash Ballot ultimately gave Sakurai the passion to get the rights to use Sora, with the reason for FP2 having a 6th slot being an extra slot for Sora.

I’d say there’s a difference between no one seeing something coming and being surprised. Cause surprise certainly wasn’t what I felt when I saw him on the smash website

 

[Guynamednelson]

And that’s exactly why I never rule any possibility out. Sakurai has a history of surprising us and doing things we once thought were impossible. I think that usually leaves us with a more exciting end roster than if we just got only the most speculated characters every time.

I mean yeah Smash fans are bad at guessing but a lot of the unexpected characters make a lot of sense in hindsight and would've been backed by corporate mandates. Villager for example isn't like adding a random side character from Mole Mania, they're the main protagonist of a multimillion selling series. Robin and Lucina are also still main characters from the game that turned FE into not only a million-seller, but a multimillion one.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Wii Fit Trainer is a "Surprise!"/WTF character. That doesn't even need a Sakurai interview. No one saw this character coming prior to her reveal at E3 2013 and that was a lot of the joke. Even people back in the day were joking that, for as much time as people put into speculation, Sakurai managed to get the one character that no one had thought of or suggested.

Smash for Wii U/3DS just had two "Surprise!" characters between WFT and Duck Hunt.

By that definition, “Everyone is Here!” would be a surprise ROSTER as a whole because everyone was speculating cuts at the time, giving us 65 “surprise characters” from the start. And that’s not going over newcomer picks like;

• Ridley due to him missing out on Smash 4 because “too big”
• Incineroar due to the Grinch Leak making people assume we’d get no new Pokemon and those who did mostly flocked towards the Grass starter because the triangle must be complete
• Joker being more closely associated with PlayStation (despite Cloud proving this was a false argument at the time)
• Banjo because people were arguing Steve would be the Microsoft rep
• Terry due to how many people went “who this?”
• Byleth because everyone expected Dante
• Steve since people assumed Banjo would be the one Microsoft rep after we got him
• Sephiroth due to no one expecting Final Fantasy to get any content
• Pyra and Mythra due to Rex getting a Mii outfit for Fighter Pass 1
• Kazuya due to the Heihachi Mii dropping a year prior
• Sora in general

You see how making the definition of “surprise character” loose can lead to some crazy stretches to define anything as a “surprise character”?

Being surprised by a character and being the token “surprise character” are two different things.

 

[Gengar84]

I mean yeah Smash fans are bad at guessing but a lot of the unexpected characters make a lot of sense in hindsight and would've been backed by corporate mandates. Villager for example isn't like adding a random side character from Mole Mania, they're the main protagonist of a multimillion selling series. Robin and Lucina are also still main characters from the game that turned FE into not only a million-seller, but a multimillion one.

But then we also get characters like Duck Hunt, ROB, Ice Climbers and Mr. Game and Watch who didn’t really have anything to promote or any recent appearances and just gave Smash a fun, quirky character that offered something unique in gameplay. Even though it’s from Mario, I don’t think Piranha Plant was the most logical character to go with if the wanted to promote anything but it brought its own fun charm.

 

[BuckleyTim]

Wasn't sepiroth actually pretty desired on Japanese fan polls? Also rex could've really been it had technical concerns not gotten in the way. Also I feel like a lot of consensus felt like spirits stopped mattering with vol 2 since y'know... Second time around and all that. Heck, if sakurai is right then Sora is the opposite of a surprise character because he did it for the overwhelming desire that smash ballot proved existed for sora.

There's a lot of swerves, yes, but surprise is gonna be an element of smash due to the nature of this being a lot of characters being forced into the fighting game mold. Rosalina is just straight up a popular character; it's not surprising in the same sense as duck hunt even though they're not normally fighting game material on either count. Yes we get lost in the weeds if we try to say a casual rep is inherently a surprise (was animal crossing rep requested heavily in the interirm between brawl and 4? I'd say that's not really a surprise if people wanted to see it)... Though Wii fit probably didn't have a huge fan desire push spurring it's inclusion.

It's all relative and blurry but at the same time I think we're labelling different kinds of surprises under the same banner when they're all different cases with different contexts and circumstances.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Kazuya due to the Heihachi Mii dropping a year prior

Fun fact: This wasn't the first time a franchise got Mii costumes before a fighter in DLC anyway. Smash 4 had Chrom and Black Knight costumes released before Corrin was announced.

 

[BuckleyTim]

I wonder if we'll see any more intentional misdirection like the heihachi mii costume rerelease, especially now that there's more third party mii costumes than ever.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Fun fact: This wasn't the first time a franchise got Mii costumes before a fighter in DLC anyway. Smash 4 had Chrom and Black Knight costumes released before Corrin was announced.

Smash 4 shouldn’t really count because its DLC scheduling was a giant mess. Only half of its 6 Mii outfit waves ended up being timed with character releases, and only two of them were actually themed around the fighter that released.

There were also quite a few Sega and Capcom costumes before Bayonetta and Ryu, which is pretty similar to your Fire Emblem example. Square Enix was the only one NOT to drop any Mii stuff outside of their character’s release.

In comparison, Ultimate’s waves were far more structured, with outfits relating to the character’s series and/company on top of always dropping when the character does too. So Kazuya and Aegis ended up being strong misdirects due to us relying on that pattern.

It’s all about the context of things.

 

[BuckleyTim]

Aegis? Did they do any Xenoblade mii costumes im forgetting about?

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Aegis? Did they do any Xenoblade mii costumes im forgetting about?

Rex’s outfit was a bonus for buying Fighters Pass 1.

Nia’s was also in base game.

 

[Gengar84]

Joker’s inclusion is making me think of what other characters we could get in the same vein where they’re generally popular outside of Nintendo’s fandom but are rarely if ever speculated for Smash. I think we could see another unexpected but popular character like that as the first DLC character to mirror Joker. I suspect that the final DLC character could mirror Sora’s situation in that they’re very popular and requested but people might think they’re impossible for one reason or another. I have a few suggestions for who these could be but people are probably tired of me talking about them right now. So what do you all think we could see if we keep the same general pattern as Ultimate’s DLC?

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Joker’s inclusion is making me think of what other characters we could get in the same vein where they’re generally popular outside of Nintendo’s fandom but are rarely if ever speculated for Smash. I think we could see another unexpected but popular character like that as the first DLC character to mirror Joker. I suspect that the final DLC character could mirror Sora’s situation in that they’re very popular and requested but people might think they’re impossible for one reason or another. I have a few suggestions for who these could be but people are probably tired of me talking about them right now. So what do you all think we could see if we keep the same general pattern as Ultimate’s DLC?

I doubt it’ll be the same pattern to begin with because if there are cuts, selling returning veterans would be on the table.

 

[BuckleyTim]

Fair enough, but I wouldn't call rex's mii costume a fake deconfirm like we thought heihachi's was. I think xb2 getting something as soon as they announced the dlc extension was something that was hopefully(?) in people's minds. Him being included in pass 1 as the bonus mii costume feels like a "we would if we could" situation, and when more dlc came up look who showed up!

...not rex, but given that the initial plan was to include him before technical limits set in I still think it doesn't really count as misdirection at least from the initial point when the mii costume was made.

Am I splitting hairs? Yes, but it's the nature of internet forums

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Fair enough, but I wouldn't call rex's mii costume a fake deconfirm like we thought heihachi's was. I think xb2 getting something as soon as they announced the dlc extension was something that was hopefully(?) in people's minds. Him being included in pass 1 as the bonus mii costume feels like a "we would if we could" situation, and when more dlc came up look who showed up!

...not rex, but given that the initial plan was to include him before technical limits set in I still think it doesn't really count as misdirection at least from the initial point when the mii costume was made.

Am I splitting hairs? Yes, but it's the nature of internet forums

Actually, you strike a damn good point I hadn’t thought of until now; REX was the original idea, despite having already been a Mii outfit.

Thank god I noticed that years AFTER Ultimate ended because evidence that DLC Mii outfits don’t deconfirm characters would’ve actually been like opening Pandora’s Box.

 

[Gengar84]

I doubt it’ll be the same pattern to begin with because if there are cuts, selling returning veterans would be on the table.

It’s just a guess but I feel like returning veterans will be sold separately from the fighter’s pass at a reduced price. I think the passes should be reserved for brand new exciting characters. I feel like veterans kind of dilute the hype of the passes since they probably wouldn’t get the same treatment of cinematic trailers, a new stage, music, or other things a brand new character could bring.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

It’s just a guess but I feel like returning veterans will be sold separately from the fighter’s pass at a reduced price. I think the passes should be reserved for brand new exciting characters. I feel like veterans kind of dilute the hype of the passes since they probably wouldn’t get the same treatment of cinematic trailers, a new stage, music, or other things a brand new character could bring.

Other fighting games sure as hell don’t do that.

If they make veterans separately, it would mess up with the release of the actually new stuff anyway because it’s not just a matter of copying and pasting code. We’ve seen how many changes characters get between games, it’s still a good amount of work.

It would be better to make newcomers and veterans all a single pass while also informing people how much of each we get. Heck, they could even reveal the veterans if they wanted.

 

[BuckleyTim]

Actually, you strike a damn good point I hadn’t thought of until now; REX was the original idea, despite having already been a Mii outfit.

Thank god I noticed that years AFTER Ultimate ended because evidence that DLC Mii outfits don’t deconfirm characters would’ve actually been like opening Pandora’s Box.

In that vein I find it very funny that we still don't have a concrete answer to if assist trophies deny a characters chances to be a dlc down the line. Smash clearly had bigger fish to fry character-wise, and spring man never seemed to be ignored due to being an assist. Rather, it was everyone and their developer uncle that works at Nintendo agreeing that he was bland compared to anyone else on the roster. Like, did sakurai even bring up the assist trophy at all during his presentation on min min?

 

[Gengar84]

Other fighting games sure as hell don’t do that.

If they make veterans separately, it would mess up with the release of the actually new stuff anyway because it’s not just a matter of copying and pasting code. We’ve seen how many changes characters get between games, it’s still a good amount of work.

It would be better to make newcomers and veterans all a single pass while also informing people how much of each we get. Heck, they could even reveal the veterans if they wanted.

Yeah, I think they’d have to reveal what characters are veterans beforehand. While I want every character back, it would feel kind of bad getting hyped up about who could be added to Smash only to see it be someone we just had in the last game sold at full price without any of the extra things a newcomer would bring, especially following Ultimate’s “Everyone is Here!” in the base game. Returning veterans in other fighting games are typically more exciting than Smash because they usually come with new visual designs and bigger gameplay changes that Smash veterans typically get. So that way they still feel pretty fresh despite being a returning character.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

In that vein I find it very funny that we still don't have a concrete answer to if assist trophies deny a characters chances to be a dlc down the line. Smash clearly had bigger fish to fry character-wise, and spring man never seemed to be ignored due to being an assist. Rather, it was everyone and their developer uncle that works at Nintendo agreeing that he was bland compared to anyone else on the roster. Like, did sakurai even bring up the assist trophy at all during his presentation on min min?

All he brought up was that he shared a similar name with a manga character iirc

Personally, I think Assist Trophy don’t deconfirm characters but we haven’t seen any example of it happening in the same game the AT is present in so I’m not going to fully lean on it until we see it at least once.

 

[Golden Icarus]

Nobody took Rosalina as a serious option either until she got revealed. I should know; I tried making a case for her being an option for a goddamn speculation chart and got a LOT of pushback. She wasn't Toad or Bowser Jr. and "They would never add her before Daisy."
Guess she's a "surprise character" too.

Same with Robin and by extension Lucina. Thinking anyone but Chrom had any sort of chance? Let alone the avatar character? HA! You must be joking.
"Surprise characters".

And don't even get me started on Greninja. No one had a consensus on what Pokémon from X/Y was coming but one thing was certain; "a Starter Pokémon will never be without a Trainer". No one saw a solo Greninja coming. And it's not like Greninja had any sort of stardom at the time either to make it make sense.
"Surprise character".

Hell, no one actually predicted Villager either, especially not after it was made clear that someone like him would "never" be in Smash since Sakurai said it made no sense for them to fight, along with Nintendog. And those that were still advocating for an Animal Crossing character regardless all banked on Tom Nook.
Oh hey, Villager's a "surprise character" too by definition.


Oh look at that, Smash For actually has at least SEVEN "Surprise Characters".

I get the point you’re making here, but the massive difference between WFT and all of those examples is that the other characters were at least brought up in discussion, considered and then largely rejected as contenders. Most popularity polls would include Greninja, Robin, Rosalina, etc., they had entire support threads and plenty of people would play devil’s advocate for them. They weren’t the “consensus picks,” but they weren’t undetected by any means.

WFT was completely missing from everyone’s radar. Is there one discussion post anywhere on this entire forum that mentioned the trainer from Wii Fit even once before her reveal? Maybe she wasn’t deliberately intended as a surprise character, but she’s one of very very few Smash characters that weren’t even included in any conversations because they were so far beyond what people ever would have predicted.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Actually, you strike a damn good point I hadn’t thought of until now; REX was the original idea, despite having already been a Mii outfit.

Thank god I noticed that years AFTER Ultimate ended because evidence that DLC Mii outfits don’t deconfirm characters would’ve actually been like opening Pandora’s Box.

I felt like that Rex costume was never a deconfirmation for FP2 anyway because you weren't going to be buying the bonus XC2 costume and an XC2 challenger pack in the same pass. Plus with that costume being in version 1.0 of the game, I think it still technically counted as base game content.

Like, did sakurai even bring up the assist trophy at all during his presentation on min min?

He just said ARMS' director personally choosing Min Min was why she got in.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I get the point you’re making here, but the massive difference between WFT and all of those examples is that the other characters were at least brought up in discussion, considered and then largely rejected as contenders. Most popularity polls would include Greninja, Robin, Rosalina, etc., they had entire support threads and plenty of people would play devil’s advocate for them. They weren’t the “consensus picks,” but they weren’t undetected by any means.

WFT was completely missing from everyone’s radar. Is there one discussion post anywhere on this entire forum that mentioned the trainer from Wii Fit even once before her reveal? Maybe she wasn’t deliberately intended as a surprise character, but she’s one of very very few Smash characters that weren’t even included in any conversations because they were so far beyond what people ever would have predicted.

On the opposite end of the coin, R.O.B. and Duck Hunt, who very much are designated "surprise characters" for Brawl and For respectively, DID get some form of discussion prior to their inclusion and were not taken as seriously either especially not R.O.B. after the R.O.B. Squad was shown for the SSE and that counted as a "disconfirmation" for everyone.


It literally doesn't matter if a character had discussion or not.

You can be surprising as a concept without being the designated "surprise character".

 

[Louie G.]

It’s just a guess but I feel like returning veterans will be sold separately from the fighter’s pass at a reduced price.

I don't know if I fully buy this yet, but at the same time surely if they keep the Ultimate Fighter Pass model something has to give. They're probably not going to sell back Wolf for the same price or with the same esteem they would Master Chief - by default, veterans would probably offer less content than a fully new character + universe. Although third party vets, like Sora, could probably justify being full price again. The only catch I see with that is bundling returning third parties with new characters, like giving Sora an echo fighter, but ideally they also deliver on new stages and/or music.

I think the best model moving forward may be to sell first party veterans in waves alongside new characters. Let's say DLC kicks off with whoever, a third party newcomer, and we get one or two veteran reveals in their character presentation who are sold in a package deal? Like I unno, Resident Evil pack with Jill Valentine + a stage + music and then Incineroar. And collectively maybe that's $10 or part of a greater $40 Fighter Pass, with the price bumped understanding we may end up getting double the characters.

 

[Super Flygon]

Official - Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

I've also always pictured Skull Kid having a "turn you into a Deku Scrub" attack, and I don't think it would be particularly hard to balance. Just make it so the Deku Scrub can still run, jump and shield but nothing else (think Pyra when she doesn't have her sword), and make the effect obviously...

smashboards.com

Two months ago, I posted a roster prediction, and I've now made a few minor changes since then. I substituted the general Pokemon icon for Meowscarada. While I don't particularly care which Pokemon character gets in next, I do expect one in the base game and I feel Meowscarada is the most likely one. Coincidentally (or perhaps purposefully), all of the fully evolved starters in Smash were owned by Ash. Liko is the new star now and she has a Floragato (which could end up evolving into Meowscarada).

I swapped Kass with Master Kohga. I feel like there is more creativity to be done with him and he helps represent both BOTW and TOTK.

EDIT:

Forgot to post what my roster would actually look like now lol.

 

[Michele]

Nobody took Rosalina as a serious option either until she got revealed. I should know; I tried making a case for her being an option for a goddamn speculation chart and got a LOT of pushback. She wasn't Toad or Bowser Jr. and "They would never add her before Daisy."
Guess she's a "surprise character" too.

Same with Robin and by extension Lucina. Thinking anyone but Chrom had any sort of chance? Let alone the avatar character? HA! You must be joking.
"Surprise characters".

And don't even get me started on Greninja. No one had a consensus on what Pokémon from X/Y was coming but one thing was certain; "a Starter Pokémon will never be without a Trainer". No one saw a solo Greninja coming. And it's not like Greninja had any sort of stardom at the time either to make it make sense.
"Surprise character".

Hell, no one actually predicted Villager either, especially not after it was made clear that someone like him would "never" be in Smash since Sakurai said it made no sense for them to fight, along with Nintendog. And those that were still advocating for an Animal Crossing character regardless all banked on Tom Nook.
Oh hey, Villager's a "surprise character" too by definition.


Oh look at that, Smash For actually has at least SEVEN "Surprise Characters".

At this rate can we make smashboards member the 'surprise character'

 

[PersonAngelo53]

I f

Joker’s inclusion is making me think of what other characters we could get in the same vein where they’re generally popular outside of Nintendo’s fandom but are rarely if ever speculated for Smash. I think we could see another unexpected but popular character like that as the first DLC character to mirror Joker. I suspect that the final DLC character could mirror Sora’s situation in that they’re very popular and requested but people might think they’re impossible for one reason or another. I have a few suggestions for who these could be but people are probably tired of me talking about them right now. So what do you all think we could see if we keep the same general pattern as Ultimate’s DLC?

I feel like 2b from Nier automata makes a lot of sense for Joker’s spot, specially with how much she has been in crossovers fighter lately.

Also maybe for Kazuya’s spot it be another fighting game character like a Guilty Gear, Killer instinct, Virtua fighter character.

And for Terry Bogard’s spot probably a nicher character but with a big legacy. Am guessing a Nihon Falcom character makes a lot of sense for this spot, specially since it’d another studio that can potentially add a lot of music from their catalog of games like with Terry’s fighter pack.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

At this rate can we make smashboards member the 'surprise character'

Warchamp for Smash.

 

[DarthEnderX]

What do you think of the potential of comparatively smaller series that still have some connection to Nintendo like Disgaea, Battletoads, Contra, River City, Chrono, and Octopath Traveller getting a character in Smash?

Low, low, high, high, low, mid.

This is just my own personal preference but I would rather see unique movesets go to completely different characters rather than alternate versions of the same ones.

Not me. If a character isn't being classified as an Echo, I want them to have a completely unique moveset.

Finish decloning Ganondorf, the Links, Falco Wolf, Lucas and Isabelle!

Actually, you strike a damn good point I hadn’t thought of until now; REX was the original idea, despite having already been a Mii outfit.

It's just Rex.

There's only one REX:

It’s just a guess but I feel like returning veterans will be sold separately from the fighter’s pass at a reduced price.

I would definitely prefer that DLC be split into "Veteran Fighters Passes" and "Newcomer Fighters Passes".

Otherwise, every veteran reveal is just going to be a huge letdown for the internet.

With a separate Veterans Pass, there's no reason to have CGI trailers, or string out reveals. They can just be like "Here's the 5 characters in this pass".

 

[Guynamednelson]

with the price bumped understanding we may end up getting double the characters

That would be too expensive. We're likely going to be spending $70 on a new Smash game, and you'd be adding $40 on top of that for a grand total of $110 just for one game+pass. At least when you pay a similar price for SSBU, you get two passes.

 

[Louie G.]

Joker’s inclusion is making me think of what other characters we could get in the same vein where they’re generally popular outside of Nintendo’s fandom but are rarely if ever speculated for Smash.

A lot of the same stuff I brought up the other day, really - there are a fair bit of sleeper hit western picks I can see slipping in while the community is generally fixated on scrimblos and shooty men. Assassin's Creed, maybe Elder Scrolls / Skyrim (Dovahkiin was among the 'popular' characters who were revealed in that second to last Mii costume wave), Hades, Portal...

I think it'll finally be time to let FromSoft in on the fun too, and Dark Souls at least gets some mentions every now and again, but they could subvert the typical protagonist / avatar expectation or jump over to Elden Ring instead. The prospect of a character associated with some Chinese company, like from League or Genshin, is pretty a compelling case too but I'm definitely not quite sold on it yet.

Puyo Puyo used to get a good amount of talk as well but feels like it's fallen by the wayside recently. The IP is still massive in Japan reaching or potentially surpassing the brand recognition of Sonic out there - I think the appeal overlaps with Smash fans quite a bit, but it's a lapse of knowledge for fans whose perspective is western centric. Sega discussion is now dominated by a second Sonic character and Yakuza often gets the newcomer nod... which is another series that I think matches a Joker level of excitement, but given Kiryu's pretty public crossover barriers I can't be too confident in it.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

and Yakuza often gets the newcomer nod... which is another series that I think matches a Joker level of excitement, but given Kiryu's pretty public crossover barriers I can't be too confident in it.

If only there was a fan favorite character who has also been given some spotlight that could work as a substitute....

 

[Louie G.]

If only there was a fan favorite character who has also been given some spotlight that could work as a substitute....

He's genuinely who I would want the most too, so no complaints at all if they're cool enough to do it.

Feel like his dynamic with the rest of the cast would just be hilarious, would love to know which characters people would gravitate toward drawing him with.