Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Wonder Smash]

Why does it always look like you're arguing against an imaginary foe who said maybe 30% of what you're basing your replies on and doubling down on it like no one said anything about Lara Croft not being iconic (cause obv she is) or tangentially anything negative about being iconic or? I mean really what are on about yo?

What are YOU on about? Because I didn't say anything like that.

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

All this talk about PS1 and N64 and '90s console wars and man... For the next game I just want Banjo back. There's no N64 without Banjo.

 

[Super Devon]

I think Jin Kazama would be a cool pick

Along with that, My Last Stand is a song from Tekken 8 that I could not stop listening to since it came out and I’d be so down for that being in Smash.

 

[Sucumbio]

What are YOU on about? Because I didn't say anything of that.

there's no way you can convince me it's all "iconic" this and "historical" that but then not look for any of that when looking at Lara Croft.

Who? What? I'm so confused

 

[Kirbeh]

I think Jin Kazama would be a cool pick

Along with that, My Last Stand is a song from Tekken 8 that I could not stop listening to since it came out and I’d be so down for that being in Smash.

I still wish we'd gotten Sparking. I want to start a match and hear:

"I'm here noooow, doin the best I can"

 

[Wonder Smash]

there's no way you can convince me it's all "iconic" this and "historical" that but then not look for any of that when looking at Lara Croft.

Who? What? I'm so confused

Yeah, you sure sound like it.

That was about a certain poster saying that they think the Smash team won't be looking at an iconic time during a series when looking for a character to represent it.

 

[Ivander]

Seeing the talk about old games and whatnot just make me want more NSO titles soon. I know we just got Pokemon Mystery Dungeon for GBA, which is good, but for one, it's the only NSO title we gotten this month and we got the 7 NES games and the 3 Starfy games last month. And two, still plenty of titles that need to come to NSO soon in general, especially for N64, Genesis and GB/GBA.

 

[RealLuigisWearPink]

Seeing the talk about old games and whatnot just make me want more NSO titles soon. I know we just got Pokemon Mystery Dungeon for GBA, which is good, but for one, it's the only NSO title we gotten this month and we got the 7 NES games and the 3 Starfy games last month. And two, still plenty of titles that need to come to NSO soon in general, especially for N64, Genesis and GB/GBA.

Where Diddy Kong Racing

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Seeing the talk about old games and whatnot just make me want more NSO titles soon. I know we just got Pokemon Mystery Dungeon for GBA, which is good, but for one, it's the only NSO title we gotten this month and we got the 7 NES games and the 3 Starfy games last month. And two, still plenty of titles that need to come to NSO soon in general, especially for N64, Genesis and GB/GBA.

This is a weird choice, but I'd love if we got Banjo-Kazooie Grunty's Revenge or Banjo Pilot on GBA NSO. Grunty's Revenge because I genuinely think it's pretty good for a GBA Banjo game, and Pilot because I have a weird nostalgia for that game even though I only ever played it like twice when I was younger lol

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

Grunty's Revenge isn't bad. It starts off a little slow but then it starts to hit all those good Banjo vibes, in a miniature format. And then it's over, but it's a fun 4-5 hours. The harbor level in particular was very fun.

But yeah, Tooie and DKR please

 

[Perkilator]

I’m still shocked that Smash 64 wasn’t added around the 25th anniversary.

 

[fogbadge]

There's no N64 without Banjo.

and kazooie

 

[HyperSomari64]

I want to think that Rowan & Liana will come to FEH before a new game coming to Genesis NSO.
Mega Drive NSO is on hiatus at this moment due to licensing. Just look at Commodore 64 on the Wii VC

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I want to think that Rowan & Liana will come to FEH before a new game coming to Genesis NSO.
Mega Drive NSO is on hiatus at this moment due to licensing. Just look at Commodore 64 on the Wii VC

Fun fact, Rowan is tied for the worst performing Fire Emblem character on my poll. Liana is doing slightly better.

This is a shame because Fire Emblem Warriors is a fantastic game that doesn't get enough credit.

 

[Kirbeh]

I want to think that Rowan & Liana will come to FEH before a new game coming to Genesis NSO.
Mega Drive NSO is on hiatus at this moment due to licensing. Just look at Commodore 64 on the Wii VC

So never?

 

[Wonder Smash]

All this talk about PS1 and N64 and '90s console wars and man... For the next game I just want Banjo back. There's no N64 without Banjo.

It just got me thinking more about Crash for Smash.

 

[Sucumbio]

Yeah, you sure sound like it.

That was about a certain poster saying that they think the Smash team won't be looking at an iconic time during a series when looking for a character to represent it.

Okay so I reread the last 3 pages like 4 times dude there's really nothing saying that. If they want Lara Croft / Tomb Raider in Smash then they'll likely go with her more recent (ps3 onward) look and for moveset ideas. But that's not to say they won't reference her og game some kinda way.

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

I just got me thinking more about Crash for Smash.

Yeah Crash would be cool. I don't have much else to add lol, but he'd fit like a glove.

 

[fogbadge]

Fun fact, Rowan is tied for the worst performing Fire Emblem character on my poll. Liana is doing slightly better.

This is a shame because Fire Emblem Warriors is a fantastic game that doesn't get enough credit.

they were on the poll? man I really messed up on the FE page

 

[Wonder Smash]

Okay so I reread the last 3 pages like 4 times dude there's really nothing saying that. If they want Lara Croft / Tomb Raider in Smash then they'll likely go with her more recent (ps3 onward) look and for moveset ideas. But that's not to say they won't reference her og game some kinda way.

Then you must still be confused because that is what was said. He specifically mention how the series being big in the 90s as one of the reasons people brought her up and it's something he doesn't see the Smash team looking into.

 

[BritishGuy54]

Crash feels like a DLC pick. Possibly. I’m unsure on him, it definitely seemed like people wanted him purely because the N. Sane Trilogy released around the same time as Ultimate’s DLC.
And also because he’s another Platformer, and some fans felt starved in Ultimate due to likely feeling alienated by fighting games and JRPGs getting priority.

With Crash seeming to go back into dormancy, I question his chances. He will certainly be a name being thrown around, but I imagine we will just have to see where this bandicoot will go next.

And, let’s be real, Steve will get priority. It’s Minecraft.

I actually wonder whether Banjo may get sidelined this time around in favour of Crash in DLC. I don’t know if they want to bring back too many veterans in DLC, and I don’t imagine Microsoft will join the base roster.

 

[Ivander]

N64 is probably the system that has the most games I want and remember playing that aren't yet on. Besides the Rare titles and Smash 64, there's also the Mystical Ninja games, the Bomberman games, Castlevania 64 Legacy of Darkness, Ogre Battle 64, Quest 64, the Chameleon Twist games, Resident Evil 2, Mischief Makers, Rayman 2 and Star Wars Rogue Squadron.

But still, there's still a lot of titles I want in general that aren't on NSO. And as I mentioned before, if you companies aren't planning on re-releasing an old Nintendo/Genesis title onto modern consoles, there's nothing wrong with putting them on the NSO.

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

They should also put GameCube games on the VC.
I have to say I like the HD remake approach they've had. Playing Metroid Prime, TTYD and Wind Waker with modern graphics is very cool. And there's a few other games that would warrant such a treatment, like Prime 2 of course and F-Zero GX my beloved.
But smaller games like Starfox Adventures, Toadstool Tour, Eternal Darkness, Chibi-Robo and the likes are never going to get remakes. Virtual Console would be the only way to play those games officially.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

And, let’s be real, Steve will get priority. It’s Minecraft.

I actually wonder whether Banjo may get sidelined this time around in favour of Crash in DLC. I don’t know if they want to bring back too many veterans in DLC, and I don’t imagine Microsoft will join the base roster.

I feel like Banjo could be base game just because of his connection to Nintendo-era Rare and the fact that they're not really using him for much otherwise. He could be DLC again, but if I remember right Banjo was pretty easy to license and he followed second place after Sora on the Fighter Ballot if the posts I'm looking at are correct. So he's very popular, was easy to get, and Microsoft isn't doing much else with him, so it sounds like a pretty easy deal once again if he needs to be relicensed or something.

I also feel like Steve could be base game just because I feel like you'd bargain for a little more with him if you spent like 5 years deliberating on him and because programming stages to work with Steve's blocks from the start without Steve in the game basically announces to the world "Hey, we're bringing Steve back, there is no suspense on his status". This one I'm less sure on since Minecraft is still an active game and is still very popular, so Microsoft could do it like I think Square will for Cloud/Sephiroth.

These are just kinda the vibes I get though.

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

For Banjo and Kazooie I choose to trust the final splash screen in their trailer. They're posing next to Mario, DK, Link and a bunch of classic Nintendo characters + Sonic, Megaman and Pac-man. They're part of the main cast.

...until the next game at least.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Honestly I think Steve might be in the next base game just because that'll be the only way for half of the people who crashed Twitter reacting to his reveal to actually get a chance to play as him.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

For Banjo and Kazooie I choose to trust the final splash screen in their trailer. They're posing next to Mario, DK, Link and a bunch of classic Nintendo characters + Sonic, Megaman and Pac-man. They're part of the main cast.

...until the next game at least.

Yeah I'm kind of of this opinion too. Might not mean anything, but Banjo's trailer was treated as a big "coming home" moment, with the DK crew cheering like wild when it showed them, and the final splash screen with them surrounded by Mario, Villager and Isabelle, Wario, all the Kirby characters, Inkling, Pikachu, etc.

Plus like, since Microsoft aren't doing anything with him, might as well throw him at Nintendo to get some of that Smash Bros. licensing money for basically no work on their part, right? Sounds like a pretty good plan to me, anyway lol

 

[Perkilator]

Plus like, since Microsoft aren't doing anything with him, might as well throw him at Nintendo to get some of that Smash Bros. licensing money for basically no work on their part, right? Sounds like a pretty good plan to me, anyway lol

Plus they don't seem to have any further plans for Crash or Spyro, so why not at least let the Banooca have a go in Smash?

Actually, speaking of which: you guys now how Crash was on the "that's not Nintendo!" section of the super old Smash poll? According to SmashWiki, apparently three characters have yet to appear in Smash in any way. Said list of characters does not include Cash Banooca but instead Ogma, a Blast Corps robot, and Doraemon in that order. And that's despite Crash very much being on that poll.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Plus they don't seem to have any further plans for Crash or Spyro, so why not at least let the Banooca have a go in Smash?

Actually, speaking of which: you guys now how Crash was on the "that's not Nintendo!" section of the super old Smash poll? According to SmashWiki, apparently three characters have yet to appear in Smash in any way. Said list of characters does not include Cash Banooca but instead Ogma, a Blast Corps robot, and Doraemon in that order. And that's despite Crash very much being on that poll.

I'd be okay with Crash or Spyro, though if Crash gets into Smash, I'm gonna have to ask that the team work to preserve his movement mechanics. Like Down Tilt is the slide, but you can jump out of it to preserve momentum from the slide into your air speed and make your first jump higher, stuff like that.

 

[Sucumbio]

Then you must still be confused because that is what was said. He specifically mention how the series being big in the 90s as one of the reasons people brought her up and it's something he doesn't see the Smash team looking into.

I can't speak for anyone but me but to be fair I agree that back during melee / brawl spec times she could easily be considered both iconic and important to gaming and that doesn't go away as time goes on rather it becomes codified especially if the game keeps getting remade/brought back.

But as for her being ignored by Sakurai who knows lol

 

[Louie G.]

Plus they don't seem to have any further plans for Crash or Spyro, so why not at least let the Banooca have a go in Smash?

It’s way too early to say Microsoft isn’t doing anything with Crash. We don’t really know their future plans, and Crash Team Rumble just came out last year (even if it flopped). It’s incomparable to Banjo’s IP stasis spanning over a decade, and frankly I think Crash Bandicoot would be a notably more expensive pull. Microsoft has not demonstrated the same generosity with Crash that they have been doing with their Rare legacy titles as of late.

I’m not saying Crash in Smash won’t happen, it would just be for decidedly different reasons than Banjo & Kazooie.

 

[RodNutTakin]

Plus they don't seem to have any further plans for Crash or Spyro, so why not at least let the Banooca have a go in Smash?

Actually, speaking of which: you guys now how Crash was on the "that's not Nintendo!" section of the super old Smash poll? According to SmashWiki, apparently three characters have yet to appear in Smash in any way. Said list of characters does not include Cash Banooca but instead Ogma, a Blast Corps robot, and Doraemon in that order. And that's despite Crash very much being on that poll.

That poll is wild, shows how people viewed character choices extremely differently when Smash was in its infancy.
There is a timeline out there where Melee had James Bond and Doraemon throw hands versus each other.

 

[Gengar84]

Okay so I reread the last 3 pages like 4 times dude there's really nothing saying that. If they want Lara Croft / Tomb Raider in Smash then they'll likely go with her more recent (ps3 onward) look and for moveset ideas. But that's not to say they won't reference her og game some kinda way.

I’m not so sure. Smash went with the classic designs for Mega Man, Banjo and Simon I think there’s some precedent for going with older designs. Classic Laura Croft is also more cartoony which fits with Smash’s aesthetic more than the more realistic modern games.

 

[Kirby Dragons]

I think Lara could reasonably be added at any time, but there's no big push for her. I'm also worried about her unique moveset potential, as there's multiple other characters who use a similar pool of weapons.

 

[CannonStreak]

I think Lara could reasonably be added at any time, but there's no big push for her. I'm also worried about her unique moveset potential, as there's multiple other characters who use a similar pool of weapons.

That said, why do I imagine Sakurai saying this?

“For her neutral special, she uses two guns!”

 

[Kirbeh]

I've been meaning to replay the classic TR games (and finally finish the first of the reboot titles,) so I guess I'll be taking notes along the way and try to come back with a move set to try and sell the thread on for funsies.

Lara aside though, with all the PlayStation talk, I actually started to think about how I'd even want them to be handled.

In terms of actual likelihood, I don't see it, but to entertain the idea for a bit I think what I'd prefer is a dedicated fighter pass just for Sony characters.

Probably not what most would want to see, but I think Nintendo and Sony actually playing ball with each other would be the sort of big deal you'd want to celebrate or put major emphasis on in some way.

They could maybe try playing into the old rivalry thing by making in game rivalries with some of the characters.

Toro and Kuro for Mario and Luigi.
Astro for Kirby.
Either (modern) Kratos or Aloy for Link.
Ratchet (and maybe Rivet) for Fox (and Falco.)
Etc.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Firstly, no, I'm not letting it go. What he (and the other poster right above me) said about me was very offensive and you expect to just forget about that? Heck no! Not until he retracts what he said. In fact, he shouldn't even bother telling me how he feels about my posts if he himself doesn't care about how I feel about his post. It just shows what kind of person he really is.

Second, just because Sakurai can be unpredictable, doesn't mean he has no consistency. What has been consistent is the iconic status of characters, so there's no way you can convince me it's all "iconic" this and "historical" that but then not look for any of that when looking at Lara Croft. The most likely issues are the company that currently owns her and the fact that she uses real-world weapons.

OK, 2 things:

The first is that what SpeedWeed was trying to say is that the reason why people kept bringing up Lara Croft as a sleeper pick and then saying pretty much nothing else about her was because the people doing this weren't actually fans of Tomb Raider; They'd bring up that she was iconic, but didn't actually know anything about her, and so had nothing else to say. The comment about her being "popular in the 90's and people forget that it isn't the 90's anymore" was more to say that she's not nearly as popular or iconic as she was back then, which is true to an extent. She's known as a gaming relic, but isn't as much in the cultural zeitgeist as she once was. He wasn't trying to say that there weren't fans of Tomb Raider or anything, just that they don't majorly overlap with smash fans.

The second is that I would advise against feuding with Mr. Weed. I agree that the accusation made against you was pretty weighty, but the cause of it was a misunderstanding due to a failure to articulate what was actually meant. This particular instance is a bit extreme in subject matter, but this kind of thing happens a lot. In fact, I've increasingly been finding that most long arguments on this thread go on for as long as they do because someone is not understanding what the other is trying to say. Heck, it's half of why I'm so wordy; I'm over-explaining in the hope that it makes my point clearer (it doesn't).

And at the end of the day, this is discussing a recreational activity as a recreational activity. I'm not gonna tell you to forgive him - whether or not you should is up to your discretion - but moving on from the issue is a good idea, as staying angry at people just makes things less fun for everyone.

 

[Wonder Smash]

OK, 2 things:

The first is that what SpeedWeed was trying to say is that the reason why people kept bringing up Lara Croft as a sleeper pick and then saying pretty much nothing else about her was because the people doing this weren't actually fans of Tomb Raider; They'd bring up that she was iconic, but didn't actually know anything about her, and so had nothing else to say. The comment about her being "popular in the 90's and people forget that it isn't the 90's anymore" was more to say that she's not nearly as popular or iconic as she was back then, which is true to an extent. She's known as a gaming relic, but isn't as much in the cultural zeitgeist as she once was. He wasn't trying to say that there weren't fans of Tomb Raider or anything, just that they don't majorly overlap with smash fans.

The second is that I would advise against feuding with Mr. Weed. I agree that the accusation made against you was pretty weighty, but the cause of it was a misunderstanding due to a failure to articulate what was actually meant. This particular instance is a bit extreme in subject matter, but this kind of thing happens a lot. In fact, I've increasingly been finding that most long arguments on this thread go on for as long as they do because someone is not understanding what the other is trying to say. Heck, it's half of why I'm so wordy; I'm over-explaining in the hope that it makes my point clearer (it doesn't).

And at the end of the day, this is discussing a recreational activity as a recreational activity. I'm not gonna tell you to forgive him - whether or not you should is up to your discretion - but moving on from the issue is a good idea, as staying angry at people just makes things less fun for everyone.

First, why does it matter if it's "not the 90s anymore"? No matter what decade it is, if there's a major time period during the series run, it's relevant to the series and character's iconic status and it's something worth looking into. Plus, with the series having three major hit games, thinking she's still something of the past is crazy. You might as well apply this to Crash too.

Second, this isn't feuding with Speed Weed. I'm avoiding all contact with that dude. I even left his Battle of AGES thread after following it for a while. And if anything, I'd rather you not make anymore excuses for him. I don't know why you keep doing that. Sure, misunderstandings happen a lot but people do admit to it in the same conversation. He still to this day never said that his outrageous accusation was a misunderstanding. Instead, he just keeps posting here like nothing happened and ignores it even whenever I bring it up. He clearly doesn't care.

(As a matter of fact, who does? I mean, nobody else called him out on it but they want to call out certain other people that I'm not going to name. Way to be fair, huh?.)

Moving on would be better if he takes back what he said. Until then, I'm sticking to how I feel and how I handle it. To think that I'm the kind of person that would use somebody's death to push for a character inclusion? That is absolutely insane and I'm not going along with other people making excuses for him, unless he says these things himself. This goes for Verde too, by the way.

 

[Borskaboska]

Fun fact, Rowan is tied for the worst performing Fire Emblem character on my poll. Liana is doing slightly better.

This is a shame because Fire Emblem Warriors is a fantastic game that doesn't get enough credit.

Rowan and Liana? But those guys are already in smash, it's the floating lady and the little star dude.

 

[robot067]

I definitely think Steve will be in the base game. The only way I can see him not making it is if programming his building and mining mechanics on all the new stages is too much work. He has a ton of pull with younger audiences in a roster mostly filled with older characters. Just imagine Steve on the box art of the next smash, it would sell billions .

Square Enix's characters seem to be the most at risk of licensing weirdness. Dragon Quest shouldn't be too difficult though. It's main hurdle was the old composer charging a fortune for the music, and he's dead now so that's out of the way. FF7's tracks are still very expensive, but I could see Nintendo being more willing to shell out the cash to get Cloud and Sephiroth in the base game with how huge of a reception Seph's reveal got.