Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[CannonStreak]

geno is the only character i think is a lock

not only does square talk to nintendo now,
not only because mario rpg came back and sold 3.3 million in almost no time at all
but because hes also a fan fave, one of the last left.

3 major reasons.

Good to know, SpecterFlower. I would not call him a lock, but that is just me trying to be safe.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

People have been calling certain characters one of the last fan favs left since Brawl. It's a dishonest way of propping up certain characters while conveniently pretending others don't exist.

New fan favs come are introduced constantly. Even then, saying Geno is one of the few remaining fan favs that are old is disingenuous. There's Isaac, Krystal, Skull Kid, Lyn, Waluigi and a slew of others. We aren't running out of fan favorites. We will never have that problem.

 

[CannonStreak]

People have been calling certain characters one of the last fan favs left since Brawl. It's a dishonest way of propping up certain characters while conveniently pretending others don't exist.

New fan favs come are introduced constantly. Even then, saying Geno is one of the few remaining fan favs that are old is disingenuous. There's Isaac, Krystal, Skull Kid, Lyn, Waluigi and a slew of others. We aren't running out of fan favorites. We will never have that problem.

To be clear, I said Geno was one of the characters that I personally wanted, not one of the last fan faves out there.

You probably weren't talking about me, but still, I wanted to say that just in case if that's okay.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I'm huge a fan of Mario RPG, have been a longtime advocate of Geno's inclusion and am of the opinion that he's got a better chance now than he ever has.

And even with all that I'd still not call him a lock given the multitude of unknowable factors involved with Smash selection.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

To be clear, I said Geno was one of the characters that I personally wanted, not one of the last fan faves out there.

You probably weren't talking about me, but still, I wanted to say that just in case if that's okay.

Bruh, you literally quoted the post that said that just above Swamp.
It's clear he ain't talking about you.

 

[CannonStreak]

Bruh, you literally quoted the post that said just above Swamp.
It's clear he ain't talking about you.

Just wanted to make sure, and make it clear, just in case. That is all.

 

[Golden Icarus]

geno is the only character i think is a lock

not only does square talk to nintendo now,
not only because mario rpg came back and sold 3.3 million in almost no time at all
but because hes also a fan fave, one of the last left.

3 major reasons.

Maybe. He was a big favorite during Brawl, Smash 4 and Ultimate and Square was involved in two of those, so we have to keep expectations in check.

Mario RPG doing numbers should definitely increase his odds, but he still has Waluigi and Toad to contend with on the Mario side of things and characters like Lara Croft, Crono, Tifa, and so many more on the Square end. Not to mention every other “fan favorite” that has persisted since Brawl. Just look at Isaac who did amazing on the ballot and got a re-release before Ultimate and was only rewarded with an assist and a Mii costume. Mario RPG’s success could result in a playable Geno, but it could just as easily result in a few music tracks, or an updated Mii costume, or nothing. Ya never know.

People have been calling certain characters one of the last fan favs left since Brawl. It's a dishonest way of propping up certain characters while conveniently pretending others don't exist.

New fan favs come are introduced constantly. Even then, saying Geno is one of the few remaining fan favs that are old is disingenuous. There's Isaac, Krystal, Skull Kid, Lyn, Waluigi and a slew of others. We aren't running out of fan favorites. We will never have that problem.

This. Geno fans are a persistent bunch, but I still wouldn’t call him the next objective fan pick.

That said, if this isn’t already a tired out topic, who does everyone feel are the next big “fan picks?” Ultimate went pretty hard with the long requested crowd pleasers (Ridley, K. Rool, Banjo). I wanna say Isaac, Waluigi, Bandana Dee and Geno are probably the next big ones to throw in. Maybe Krystal and Skull Kid, but I’m not sure how vocal those fan bases are nowadays.

 

[SpecterFlower]

People have been calling certain characters one of the last fan favs left since Brawl. It's a dishonest way of propping up certain characters while conveniently pretending others don't exist.

New fan favs come are introduced constantly. Even then, saying Geno is one of the few remaining fan favs that are old is disingenuous. There's Isaac, Krystal, Skull Kid, Lyn, Waluigi and a slew of others. We aren't running out of fan favorites. We will never have that problem.

mhm, so whos more asked for than geno?

definitely not anything you mentioned except waluigi.

your own argument is disingenuous here.

Geno is on par with ridley, king k rool and banjo, issac, lyn, skull kid, krystal are not.

im not saying it's bad to support those. im just saying one geno is wildly more popular than all of them .
i support issac but not for a second will he ever be as much a fan fave as geno and thats fine he'll get in one day anyway.

 

[CannonStreak]

This. Geno fans are a persistent bunch, but I still wouldn’t call him the next objective fan pick.

Neither do I.

I was one of the people who hung out in the Geno thread in the Ultimate days, but I feel I was far more reasonable and far more in control of my hype, and realized Geno would not have made it in despite all the "evidence" for him. It was hard reasoning with the others there, though, as they wouldn't listen when I said to keep expectations low.

 

[SpecterFlower]

i really

Neither do I.

I was one of the people who hung out in the Geno thread in the Ultimate days, but I feel I was far more reasonable and far more in control of my hype, and realized Geno would not have made it in despite all the "evidence" for him. It was hard reasoning with the others there, though, as they wouldn't listen when I said to keep expectations low.

only feel that geno has a chance now really, or if he appear's in mario rpg 2 or not.

 

[Gengar84]

I think Geno has a pretty decent chance but I wouldn’t call him a lock either. Generally, I think it’s a mistake to view any character as a lock because nothing is ever guaranteed in Smash. If I had to pick one character as the closest thing to a lock, it has to be the Octolings (or other Splatoon character of some kind). I think that series has been too successful to pass up on a second character. Still not guaranteed but I think they’re very likely.

Maybe. He was a big favorite during Brawl, Smash 4 and Ultimate and Square was involved in two of those, so we have to keep expectations in check.

Mario RPG doing numbers should definitely increase his odds, but he still has Waluigi and Toad to contend with on the Mario side of things and characters like Lara Croft, Crono, Tifa, and so many more on the Square end. Not to mention every other “fan favorite” that has persisted since Brawl. Just look at Isaac who did amazing on the ballot and got a re-release before Ultimate and was only rewarded with an assist and a Mii costume. Mario RPG’s success could result in a playable Geno, but it could just as easily result in a few music tracks, or an updated Mii costume, or nothing. Ya never know.

This. Geno fans are a persistent bunch, but I still wouldn’t call him the next objective fan pick.

That said, if this isn’t already a tired out topic, who does everyone feel are the next big “fan picks?” Ultimate went pretty hard with the long requested crowd pleasers (Ridley, K. Rool, Banjo). I wanna say Isaac, Waluigi, Bandana Dee and Geno are probably the next big ones to throw in. Maybe Krystal and Skull Kid, but I’m not sure how vocal those fan bases are nowadays.

Lara Croft is no longer owned by Square-Enix so she’s not really competing with Geno anymore. Tomb Raider and several other franchises was purchased by the Embracer Group. They’ve been having a lot of issues lately so who knows if they’ll get a character at this point but they do own quite a few IPs that I like.

 

[CannonStreak]

i really

only feel that geno has a chance now really, or if he appear's in mario rpg 2 or not.

I'd have to agree.

I do feel he may have a better chance getting in base game next game rather than as DLC, especially if Nintendo were to be choosing DLC again for next game. I just feel it would Geno would be likelier if he were chosen as DLC by Sakurai if he had to be DLC.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

your own argument is disingenuous here.

His argument was that Geno isn't "one of the only" ones because not only are there others that exist, but they constantly fluctuate.

You moving the goalposts to "BUT GENO IZ WANTED MORE THAN -insert character-" is the disingenuous argument.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

mhm, so whos more asked for than geno?

definitely not anything you mentioned except waluigi.

your own argument is disingenuous here.

Geno is on par with ridley, king k rool and banjo, issac, lyn, skull kid, krystal are not.

im not saying it's bad to support those. im just saying one geno is wildly more popular than all of them .
i support issac but not for a second will he ever be as much a fan fave as geno and thats fine he'll get in one day anyway.

I never commented on who's the most requested. That's changing the argument..

I said we aren't running out of fan favorites. Implying any character is one of the last fan favorites left simply isn't true. There's too many popular and requested characters for that to ever be true.

 

[ninjahmos]

Come to think of it, I think people have been asking for Rayman since Smash 4. What do you think his chances are?

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Every speculation cycle will have its "top requested" or at the very least "the ones people talk about most".

Smash For had Skull Kid and it died down with Ultimate while the likes of Crash and Ryu Hayabusa would rise for Ultimate (but mainly DLC).

Geno too had this fluctuation. He was a big topic in Brawl, but barely existed in the Smash For scene, only to get a second wind with Ultimate (for better or for worse with how far that went, but that's another subject).


Whoever is the hot topic is always changing. Someone who wasn't a big deal yesterday can be one tomorrow. Conversely, someone who was the **** of the walk could be dust in the wind.

 

[CannonStreak]

Come to think of it, I think people have been asking for Rayman since Smash 4. What do you think his chances are?

I don't know, but given that his company, Ubisoft is a western company, the language barrier could make it harder for him to get in.

I do think his DLC in the second Mario + Rabbids game could help him some.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Man, I remember when Krystal was a top 5 most wanted character. She was everywhere. Wolf getting included and the downfall of the Star Fox franchise really hurt her fanbase, but man.

You had to be there. She was huge. She was like Palutena during Smash 4, except she was even bigger!

 

[SpecterFlower]

Come to think of it, I think people have been asking for Rayman since Smash 4. What do you think his chances are?

after mario and rabbids 1 and 2 i think theres a good chance.

I don't know, but given that his company, Ubisoft is a western company, the language barrier could make it harder for him to get in.

I do think his DLC in the second Mario + Rabbids game could help him some.

these aren't tiny corporations with no translators, there's not gonna be a big language barrier issues.

 

[Gengar84]

Come to think of it, I think people have been asking for Rayman since Smash 4. What do you think his chances are?

It’s definitely possible but I’m not really expecting Rayman for Smash. I feel like there’s a lot of competition to the likely limited Western roster newcomer slots. Ubisoft has also had its share of controversy lately. Rayman is still a somewhat popular request so I do think there’s a chance, he’s just not at the top of my list.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Come to think of it, I think people have been asking for Rayman since Smash 4. What do you think his chances are?

Honestly, I think Rayman needs to strengthen his own IP before he can be seriously considered by Sakurai. Rabbids are huge nowadays, but Rayman has been left in the dust.

It sucks because Rayman is cool, but I think he needs a revival like Crash Bandicoot or Doom to make a big splash again.

 

[SpecterFlower]

It’s definitely possible but I’m not really expecting Rayman for Smash. I feel like there’s a lot of competition to the likely limited Western roster newcomer slots. Ubisoft has also had its share of controversy lately. Rayman is still a somewhat popular request so I do think there’s a chance, he’s just not at the top of my list.

doomguy is more popular as a western pick i think during ultimate run, it remains to be seen who will be big during the next one.

geralt would feel like a lock but hes form a book, but hes like the only case I would break the rule cause the game is much much much bigger than the book outsidofe poland.

Honestly, I think Rayman needs to strengthen his own IP before he can be seriously considered by Sakurai. Rabbids are huge nowadays, but Rayman has been left in the dust.

It sucks because Rayman is cool, but I think he needs a revival like Crash Bandicoot or Doom to make a big splash again.

crash feels like another likely one.

i do agree crash > rayman in terms of likeliness.

rayman has to deal with ezio and rabbids

crash has to contend with......

Overwatch, halo, doom, fallout, WoW, and skyrim...

damn I dont think either is likely

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Man, I remember when Krystal was a top 5 most wanted character. She was everywhere. Wolf getting included and the downfall of the Star Fox franchise really hurt her fanbase, but man.

You had to be there. She was huge. She was like Palutena during Smash 4, except she was even bigger!

I remember those days. I also remember being pissed at first that Wolf got in instead of Krystal just because it felt like a disservice because she was talked about so often.

And then I started to think for myself instead of just going by what people were hyping up the most (this was before I was a member and I was a teen that didn't do any real research yet and followed the crowds) and then was glad for Wolf a lot more.

 

[Gengar84]

doomguy is more popular as a western pick i think during ultimate run, it remains to be seen who will be big during the next one.

geralt would feel like a lock but hes form a book, but hes like the only case I would break the rule cause the game is much much much bigger than the book outsidofe poland.

There’s also a lot of hugely iconic Western characters that aren’t commonly speculated for Smash. I think something like League of Legends or WarCraft could be pretty huge and be a cool surprise since very few are talking about them for Smash.

What about Turok? I feel like he’s in a pretty similar situation as Geralt where he debuted outside games but is more known for their games. Turok’s popularity was from a different time period but he’d make a cool N64 era rep if those kinds of characters are ever on the table.

 

[Nabbitfan730]

Geno is my no.1 pick along with Shadow but saying he's a lock is just honestly reaching delusion territory. We SMRPG fans have been burnt before and it's best to have low expectations.

Geno's best chances were at Brawl and Base Ult and none came to fruition. Atp, i would be satisfied with Deluxe Mii Costume and we still couldn't get that whilst others did so...yeah.

I hope the remake definitely boost his chances but Smash 6 release period may be too far from the remake's release to have an impact.

Mega Man, K.Rool, Ridley, Banjo were able to get dreams made but i don't think Geno would be as lucky.

 

[CannonStreak]

Speaking of western characters, the ones I'd like to be in Smash Bros. happen to be Crash Bandicoot and Spyro the Dragon. Maybe Crash should be first, but hey.

 

[Golden Icarus]

Man, I remember when Krystal was a top 5 most wanted character. She was everywhere. Wolf getting included and the downfall of the Star Fox franchise really hurt her fanbase, but man.

You had to be there. She was huge. She was like Palutena during Smash 4, except she was even bigger!

Wait that is such a good comparison and I’m just now realizing how damn lucky Palutena really is. If she didn’t make it into Smash 4 she would have had a harder and harder time getting her chance and I could even imagine her and Krystal competing for the same spot in Ultimate of “mostly irrelevant fan favorite staff wielding robbed goddess with a loud, yet sadly dwindling fanbase.” That would have been wild.

 

[SpecterFlower]

There’s also a lot of hugely iconic Western characters that aren’t commonly speculated for Smash. I think something like League of Legends or WarCraft could be pretty huge and be a cool surprise since very few are talking about them for Smash.

yeah, in general i feel people dont like to specualte LoL, Fortnite, Genshin, or WoW or those types of games really despite how huge they are.

also, if there's an indie rep i gotta say stardew valley farmer is very likely, game sold 30mil, its a phenomenon
it also made me stop buying story of seasons games cause they suck im so glad someone just did it better.

either terraria or stardew
maybe hollow knight if they want more core gamers.

in general theres a lot from the west people dont speculate, it usually limited to activiosn, bethesda and ubisoft.

 

[Perkilator]

I decided to compile a few lists of potential newcomers for the next game.

Spoiler: Consistent requests

* denotes characters that might overlap with the "newcomers I want" list

• Waluigi*
• Geno
• Toad
• Dixie Kong*
• Raven Beak*
• Bandana Waddle Dee*
• Meowscarada
• Tinkaton
• Lyn
• Noah & Mio*
• Ring Fit Trainee*
• Dr. Eggman*
• Chun-Li*
• Rayman*
• Crash Bandicoot*
• Shantae
• Dante
• Dragonborn

Spoiler: Newcomers I want

• Magolor
• Gholdengo
• Sigurd
• Veyle
• K.K. Slider
• Estelle Bright
• Aigis
• Bridget

Spoiler: Potential personal picks by Sakurai

• Power Pro-Kun
• Zaegreus
• Fire Emblem newcomer
• Pokémon newcomer
• Joke newcomer

 

[KingofPhantoms]

There are a ton of fan favorites with varying degrees of support that I could name off the top of my head that haven't gotten into any Smash game yet.

And Geno's support and recognition became considerably more spare as most younger fans have either never heard of or otherwise have no attachment to him or Super Mario RPG. And that didn't change until the remake released.

Also, I'm gonna say it right now: outside of perhaps the main protagonists of Nintendo's biggest franchises, absolutely no character is a lock. Or a shoo-in. Or a guarantee. Whatever term or buzzword you want to use. People called a vast number of characters for Smash 4 a "shoo-in", including Ridley and K. Rool well prior to that game's release.

And guess what? Neither of them ended up playable in that game. And while they eventually did make it into Ultimate, a large number of other characters who were considered "shoo-ins" at some point or another didn't even make into Ultimate like they did, either.

Speculating, thinking up character and moveset ideas, and being hyped for potential and likely newcomers is all perfectly fine, it's why we're all here. But we really need to stop saying that characters are guaranteed. Especially when in this case, we're in an early stage of speculation where we currently have absolutely no information on the next Smash game or what it's going to be like yet. At a certain point, it's bound to just be setting up yourselves and several other fans for disappointment. And that itself would likely factor into and worsen the inevitable cycle of people bad-mouthing Sakurai and the other developers for not putitng their personal favorites or perceived "deserved" or "likely" characters into the game.

 

[ninjahmos]

Speaking of western characters, the ones I'd like to be in Smash Bros. happen to be Crash Bandicoot and Spyro the Dragon. Maybe Crash should be first, but hey.

I would love that. The problem is that they’re both owned by Activision Blizzard.

Also, the music in Spyro's original games is composed by Stewart Copeland (The Police), so I doubt they’d be able to use the Spyro music, but it’d still be pretty cool.

Hopefully, they’ll be able to use Josh Mancell's music for Crash.

 

[Gengar84]

Speaking of western characters, the ones I'd like to be in Smash Bros. happen to be Crash Bandicoot and Spyro the Dragon. Maybe Crash should be first, but hey.

I feel like Crash would come before Spyro for Smash. I think the fact that he was thought of as the Sony mascot during the PS1 era gives him a great rivalry theme with Mario. Spyro doesn’t really have that to the same extent.

 

[SpecterFlower]

Geno is my no.1 pick along with Shadow but saying he's a lock is just honestly reaching delusion territory. We SMRPG fans have been burnt before and it's best to have low expectations.

Geno's best chances were at Brawl and Base Ult and none came to fruition. Atp, i would be satisfied with Deluxe Mii Costume and we still couldn't get that whilst others did so...yeah.

I hope the remake definitely boost his chances but Smash 6 release period may be too far from the remake's release to have an impact.

Mega Man, K.Rool, Ridley, Banjo were able to get dreams made but i don't think Geno would be as lucky.

dont worry i hate geno the character and hate the game.

there;s no bias here other than how much i dislike him.

im a special kind of delusional.

but with mario rpg he's basically destined to become the best selling mario rpg plus his vocal fanbase the stars have aligned.

geno > paper mario tbh

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I got y'all's shoe-in right here.

 

[CannonStreak]

I would love that. The problem is that they’re both owned by Activision Blizzard.

Also, the music in Spyro's original games is composed by Stewart Copeland (The Police), so I doubt they’d be able to use the Spyro music, but it’d still be pretty cool.

Hopefully, they’ll be able to use Josh Mancell's music for Crash.

So? Just use Skylanders or the Legend of Spyro music?

Seriously, though, isn't Activision-Blizzard owned by Microsoft now?

 

[SpecterFlower]

I would love that. The problem is that they’re both owned by Activision Blizzard.

Also, the music in Spyro's original games is composed by Stewart Copeland (The Police), so I doubt they’d be able to use the Spyro music, but it’d still be pretty cool.

Hopefully, they’ll be able to use Josh Mancell's music for Crash.

nuh uh


they're owned by microsoft

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I remember the Brawl days of speculation, I never went on forums, I would just watch every YouTube video on the topic I could find. Good times.

Out of all the characters not in Smash yet Geno and Krystal definitely seemed like the most requested/talked about back then.

 

[CannonStreak]

nuh uh


they're owned by microsoft

Which, to me, would make it easier, given how two MIcrosoft characters are in Smash Bros. already. I can't say it would be easier by a lot, though.

 

[SpecterFlower]

i know i said geno over paper mario but paper mario has much better moveset potential and I hope paper mario comes in the next game.

in general my most wanted are all not likely.

SonicMetaphor said:


Which, to me, would make it easier, given how two MIcrosoft characters are in Smash Bros. already. I can't say it would be easier by a lot, though.

at this point there's no easier or ease, its literally if Nintendo wants it or not.

nobody will say no we don't want out character in smash

when smash ultimate the game has outsold most series's total sales.


also if krystal is to come shes gonna need a star fox revival shes a main character in pretty much.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Man, do y'all remember when Masked Man (from Mother 3) of all characters was requested?

That was a trip.