Newbie Intro

[Slowz]

How to begin...

Well, I suppose I must start by stating that, if this thread is in any way obtrusive to the conduct of the mods, or violates any rules, please, no hesitation in deleting/locking this thread. Whatever you gota' do.

Secondly, I never type like this in casual conversation. Ever.

Thirdly, I suck.

Well, now that that's outa' the way, allow me to introduce myself. My name is Travis, but I prefer Slow/Slowz better. It's very nice to meet all of you!
My experience with Smash and its community is extremely limited, mostly watching Project: M streams, Jcaesar, Gimpy for a short time, and VGBootcamp. My impressions on it is this: it is one of the most spirited fighting game communities out there; the hype over big plays is absolutely insane.

Now, all that experience in the community is from the Melee/P:M community, not so much Brawl, but I can assume they are roughly the same. Now we encounter the issue: why DON'T I have any experience in the community of Smash?

I live in Georgia. A very secluded area of Georgia. Rough luck for me, but moving on; I'm rambling way to much.

To put it bluntly, I'm a southern-bound lover of Smash who doesn't play it nearly as much as he should (PRACTICE) and would like to make, as the title states, a Newbie Introduction.


Now, I know mechanics are everything, but I might as well pick a character to stick to. Luckily, I have picked two I would definitely not get bored of to soon: Toon Link and Lucario. As of now, mostly Lucario. (really just poking at every character but these are two that peak my interest)

I play P:M on a Classic Controller Pro, which I can SWEAR isn't nearly as reliable as I thought before I bought it, but we'll get back to that. What I'm asking for from the General Discussion (and luc/tink mains pls) is a friendly hello, and a bit of advice.

I want to know if the Gamecube/Nintendo White Controller is worth investing into.

I want to know ways to improve myself. I've done digging and found old mechanics threads, but they're mostly geared toward players of Melee and/or Smash. I have played neither on a dedicated basis.

I want to know some appeals to the aforementioned maybe-mains, Lucario and Tink.

I'd like someone I could talk/smash with sometimes. Smash buddy, you know?

I'd like a hello from anyone who actually took the time to read this. No Tl;dr here.

That's about it. Thanks for reading!

 

[HyperrCrow]

I want to know if the Gamecube/Nintendo White Controller is worth investing into.

I want to know ways to improve myself. I've done digging and found old mechanics threads, but they're mostly geared toward players of Melee and/or Smash. I have played neither on a dedicated basis.

The white GC control is definitely worth it, I bought one about two months ago and love it to death. The 10ft cord is extremely convenient at times and the control plays well once you break in the control stick.
You can improve yourself even with mechanics from Melee since P:M and Melee share an identical engine.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

I use a Classic Controller Pro and I have absolutely no problems playing P:M. Not sure what you're doing wrong. XD

Then again, I'm using custom controls. ¦D

 

[Giygacoal]

We're here when you need us. Definitely get a GC controller. Read the character guides on the website (most of which aren't conceptually outdated). I recommend turning off tap jump on your tag, by the way.

 

[Chzrm3]

Hi! : D

This is a really nice video that can potentially help you out a bunch:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4n4s5yB7ZkE

There's a ton going on in there, so you should take it slow and learn things methodically. But if you start chomping on that vid bit by bit, it'll give you a lot of stuff that you can totally practice on your own.

(Oh yeah, and those white gamecube controllers are amazing. I have two! one for me, one for my lil' bro).

 

[Slowz]

We're here when you need us. Definitely get a GC controller. Read the character guides on the website (most of which aren't conceptually outdated). I recommend turning off tap jump on your tag, by the way.

Thanks. I have actually turned off tap, it helps a lot, especially u-tilt cancels on Lucario.

 

[Slowz]

I use a Classic Controller Pro and I have absolutely no problems playing P:M. Not sure what you're doing wrong. XD

Then again, I'm using custom controls. ¦D

Probably my tenancy to mash buttons/not breaking it in enough. Discipline!

 

[Slowz]

The white GC control is definitely worth it, I bought one about two months ago and love it to death. The 10ft cord is extremely convenient at times and the control plays well once you break in the control stick.
You can improve yourself even with mechanics from Melee since P:M and Melee share an identical engine.

Thanks for the advice. Hopefully, everything eventually caries over.

Actually, thinking about it, given my location and potential devotion to P:M, would it still be worth? There are literally zero people in my area that Smash, no siblings, no neighbors, nothing.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Probably my tenancy to mash buttons/not breaking it in enough. Discipline!

Try to edit posts instead of double posting, buddy. Take it slow with the CCP if you have do. Mess with the controls some and see what works for you. To give you something to try out, this is how I use mine. Practice it with it for a day or two and see if you can get used to it. :3

Classic Controller Pro:

x & a = Jump
y = Special
b = Standard Attacks
L & R = Grab
ZL & ZR =Shield
Tap jump off.

 

[EdgeTheLucas]

Try to edit posts instead of double posting, buddy. Take it slow with the CCP if you have do. Mess with the controls some and see what works for you. To give you something to try out, this is how I use mine. Practice it with it for a day or two and see if you can get used to it. :3

Classic Controller Pro:

x & a = Jump
y = Special
b = Standard Attacks
L & R = Grab
ZL & ZR =Shield
Tap jump off.

I prefer b for specials and a for attack, it's better for the thumb's position. But to each his own, after all I can do advanced techniques but I have a hard time being able to use anything other than l-canceling and shffling so I guess I'm not as pro.

 

[Cokes-a-Cola]

Man I hear ya.

I haven't met any smashers yet either, but I only really started getting heavily into the scene after Evo2013. I decided to focus most of my training efforts on PM instead of Melee due to it being a newer experience, and that I greatly enjoy the concept of a balanced cast.

Currently I've only been been practicing in the training modes and against CPUs, I've tried to get my roommates to play with me, but they get demoralized really fast, and then quit. I'll be attending a local tournament soon, so hopefully I'll meet some cool people there!

As for controller, I'm really not sure how viable everything is. I use a wired GCN controller just in case of input lag being an issue, back when I played Brawl (and Brawl+ for awhile) I used the Wiichuck, but I decided it was time I retired that.

Good luck though! I love PM a lot, and I think it's well worth playing even if you don't know anyone else who does.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

I prefer b for specials and a for attack, it's better for the thumb's position. But to each his own, after all I can do advanced techniques but I have a hard time being able to use anything other than l-canceling and shffling so I guess I'm not as pro.

I argue the opposite. The placement of b and y feels comfortable enough to emulate "A and B" feel on the Gamecube Controller if you keep your thumb on b and switch it to y only when necessary. Plus, x and a are in the same spots as "X" and "Y" on there too.

But I'm not gonna ramble on about something I've previously rambled about, so read up more of why and how I think so here. :3

http://smashboards.com/threads/poll-so-what-controller-do-you-use.340953/#post-15879384

 

[Rizner]

Greetings. For the controller, i t's whatever you're comfortable with. If you do get a cube controller, though, make sure it's Nintendo brand - the off brands fall apart super fast in my experience. The new white, extended cordcontrollers would be best, but used Nintendo brand ones also can be good. To get experience playing others, you could try playing on Wi-Fi. I am not a huge fan of it because I haven't gotten used to it, but from what I've heard it's a lot easier to go from Wi-Fi to in person matches and is a great place to train up and play against people. Aside from that, check out where t tournaments are around ga, and if you see people dr ive by you to get to them ask around on the threads if someone could pick you up on their way. Might be hard depending on who it is and just how far in the middle of nowhere you are, but could be worth trying.

 

[Paradoxium]

Ask anything, we will answer it

When I was a beginner I had a clear goal in mind
Learn what to do, and how to do it

 

[Slowz]

So, I've been fiddling with Lucario mechanics. I love it, my favorite character for sure.

So, I decided to try out the ole' level 9 cpu's... and...

I really need to fight real people. It's ridiculous, the reads the cpu's do are absurd and their timing is spot on. Not to say that, maybe one day, practice permitting, I could reach that. In the meantime, am I doin' it right?

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

So, I've been fiddling with Lucario mechanics. I love it, my favorite character for sure.

So, I decided to try out the ole' level 9 cpu's... and...

I really need to fight real people. It's ridiculous, the reads the cpu's do are absurd and their timing is spot on. Not to say that, maybe one day, practice permitting, I could reach that. In the meantime, am I doin' it right?

Let me give you a tip with fighting CPUs.

Practice fighting Level 6's first. Seriously, fight them for awhile or a few days and work your way up. By the time you get up toe Level 9's, you'll be glad you did. XD

 

[HyperrCrow]

I really need to fight real people. It's ridiculous, the reads the cpu's do are absurd and their timing is spot on. Not to say that, maybe one day, practice permitting, I could reach that. In the meantime, am I doin' it right?

The effort is there, you just gotta push yourself. The CPU's aren't really that hard, although they're a huge step up from Melee CPU's. Their reaction time may be spot on, but trust me, if you can't defeat a CPU you won't stand a chance against a human player.

 

[Cokes-a-Cola]

So, I've been fiddling with Lucario mechanics. I love it, my favorite character for sure.

So, I decided to try out the ole' level 9 cpu's... and...

I really need to fight real people. It's ridiculous, the reads the cpu's do are absurd and their timing is spot on. Not to say that, maybe one day, practice permitting, I could reach that. In the meantime, am I doin' it right?

The CPU's in this game are an interesting beast.

Sometimes they make insane reads, or shield grab you in a way that feels completely inhuman. And then sometimes they randomly jump offstage and kill themselves.
Their biggest flaw besides the SD'ing IMO is that they recover way too predictably, making them quite easy to edge guard.
Though they can be very ridiculous too, I'm not sure what some more seasoned players think, but if some of the CPU flaws were worked out, I think they'd be pretty darn challenging.
I've dropped some matches to CPU's before, but you get better at it with practice. I remember getting absolutely destroyed when I first picked up Pikachu against a lvl 9 Ike, I think I only got 2 stocks off on my first attempt before I lost, I felt completely demoralized. But the great thing about computers is that they don't adapt while you can. (This also puts yourself in a dangerous mindset if you get too used to it though.)

I've heard some opinions that people should skip training on computers all together, and focus on wifi instead. Though I'm personally not sure how to set that up with minimal lag. Most wifi matches I've tried have been simply terrible.

 

[Slowz]

The CPU's in this game are an interesting beast.

Sometimes they make insane reads, or shield grab you in a way that feels completely inhuman. And then sometimes they randomly jump offstage and kill themselves.
Their biggest flaw besides the SD'ing IMO is that they recover way too predictably, making them quite easy to edge guard.
Though they can be very ridiculous too, I'm not sure what some more seasoned players think, but if some of the CPU flaws were worked out, I think they'd be pretty darn challenging.
I've dropped some matches to CPU's before, but you get better at it with practice. I remember getting absolutely destroyed when I first picked up Pikachu against a lvl 9 Ike, I think I only got 2 stocks off on my first attempt before I lost, I felt completely demoralized. But the great thing about computers is that they don't adapt while you can. (This also puts yourself in a dangerous mindset if you get too used to it though.)

I've heard some opinions that people should skip training on computers all together, and focus on wifi instead. Though I'm personally not sure how to set that up with minimal lag. Most wifi matches I've tried have been simply terrible.

See, this is what I'm most worried about, that the mindset of fighting CPU's will stick and my entire purpose for fighting them would be null and void.

So, I suppose I need a regime. But where to start? Also, to Wave and Hyper, out of say 6 matches, I ended up breaking positive 4-2. I actually had moments where I thought I was doing some tricky mind game shenanigans.

 

[Cokes-a-Cola]

See, this is what I'm most worried about, that the mindset of fighting CPU's will stick and my entire purpose for fighting them would be null and void.

So, I suppose I need a regime. But where to start? Also, to Wave and Hyper, out of say 6 matches, I ended up breaking positive 4-2. I actually had moments where I thought I was doing some tricky mind game shenanigans.

I don't think you should worry too much about that.
IMO, if you're starting out I would recommend going into training mode and practice L canceling, wave dashing, dash dancing, as well as other things you think could be useful. (I also practiced moonwalking so I could get more distance when using offstage back-airs).
Once you have an alright grasp on these things in training mode, then you can go practice them against a fighting CPU (maybe not a level 9 one, since your head won't be entirely in these games), this way you're improving in practical ways without needing to worry much about advancing your mindgame strategies, that stuff can come later.

 

[Slowz]

I don't think you should worry too much about that.
IMO, if you're starting out I would recommend going into training mode and practice L canceling, wave dashing, dash dancing, as well as other things you think could be useful. (I also practiced moonwalking so I could get more distance when using offstage back-airs).
Once you have an alright grasp on these things in training mode, then you can go practice them against a fighting CPU (maybe not a level 9 one, since your head won't be entirely in these games), this way you're improving in practical ways without needing to worry much about advancing your mindgame strategies, that stuff can come later.

Moonwalking is just making a half circle on the left stick, isn't it? Not terribly clear on that one.

So don't bother with 9's until I have a lot of this down to muscle memory. Got it.

 

[HyperrCrow]

Yeah that's good. I'm not gonna say fighting CPU's is bad, because during my competitive Brawl days I fought them so much that I played like them in the sense of the timing. Although it's better to do as Cokes says and practice things like L-canceling because this game is a whole different beast and you have to get accustomed to the techniques. Once you've got a good grasp on them I would suggest working up from level 6's like Wave said and eventually finding a Smash partner online if you can.

 

[Cokes-a-Cola]

Moonwalking is just making a half circle on the left stick, isn't it? Not terribly clear on that one.

So don't bother with 9's until I have a lot of this down to muscle memory. Got it.

That's definitely what I personally would recommend, especially if you don't have friends who actively want to improve to train with.

Once things like L Canceling and wave dashing can be performed by muscle memory, I'm sure you'll do much better against others who take the game more seriously. You might not beat them, but at a technical aspect you'll be playing at a slightly more level field.

EDIT: Oh yeah, moonwalking is like a half circle on the analog stick without passing the center. Once you hit back on the stick you hold it for a second, your character will gain some backwards momentum.
I'm not the best at explaining, but it's fairly well documented in other areas + youtube tutorials

 

[Malion]

Welcome! To you and to me obvs... I'm also from Georgia boonies how about that... and these White Gamecube controllers are news to me! I have a black and orange one but a white one would be pretty dang sweet.

 

[Slowz]

Oh

Welcome! To you and to me obvs... I'm also from Georgia boonies how about that... and these White Gamecube controllers are news to me! I have a black and orange one but a white one would be pretty dang sweet.

Oh, sick. What county? I'm in Coffee.

 

[Malion]

Oh
Oh, sick. What county? I'm in Coffee.

A bit further north in Jefferson County.

 

[Starcutter]

I've fought CPUs until I almost always would win. then I went up against my cousin, who had even said right before the match he had a lot of trouble with the CPUs. I lost.

moral of this experience, practice on other players. it's better then on cpus.

 

[br8k]

Yeahh, as someone who has a tendency to play mindlessly BECAUSE it's what works on CPUs, I advise against playing against high level CPUs. A lot of Smash is reading your opponent and reacting. I've gotten a lot of kills on CPUs by charging a smash attack and watching them walk into it.

CPUs just play in a completely inhuman way. They don't react like humans. They react entirely on a moment-by-moment basis while humans (who can't respond instantly) focus more on patterns and anticipation. It makes a big difference.

 

[SixSaw]

I think it's possible to get worthwhile practice out of CPUs, but you have to very deliberate about it. Since, as br8k said, CPUs play on a moment-by-moment basis, the only aspect of your game you'll really be able to improve by fighting them are your moment-by-moment reactions. Basically, play like them: stop predicting, since trying to predict CPUs will only cause you to pick up bad habits. Approach the fight as a series of isolated scenarios. Treat it as an exercise in producing spontaneous reactions to a given situation, ie: "when this move is coming out I want to position myself here". Stop caring about winning. There's no prize for beating the CPU.

 

[Urielhelix]

This is some good stuff, thank you!

 

[Darkgun]

A new Lucario player! Oh oh, have you had a look at the Lucario boards yet? I'm sure there's something in there that'll help ya.

I would link a beginner's guide

(I should finish it up, I guess....)

Related to CPU training, forming habits while fighting CPUs is easy. Forming bad habits. Especially with a character who relies so heavily on how the opponent acts in mitigation. The suggestion to break things down into specific chunks of play is a good one, as, for example, I no longer look at edge-guarding CPUs as "Here is how I do it." so much as "Here is how I do it if my opponent recovers in this manner." Treating each situation as a possibility, and then understanding the outcome from each interaction and why it happens. That... probably sounds more complicated than it is.

 

[Slowz]

A new Lucario player! Oh oh, have you had a look at the Lucario boards yet? I'm sure there's something in there that'll help ya.

I would link a beginner's guide

(I should finish it up, I guess....)

Related to CPU training, forming habits while fighting CPUs is easy. Forming bad habits. Especially with a character who relies so heavily on how the opponent acts in mitigation. The suggestion to break things down into specific chunks of play is a good one, as, for example, I no longer look at edge-guarding CPUs as "Here is how I do it." so much as "Here is how I do it if my opponent recovers in this manner." Treating each situation as a possibility, and then understanding the outcome from each interaction and why it happens. That... probably sounds more complicated than it is.

Yea, I've had a look-see. And a post is coming soon, believe me. Also, it's probably just me, but I swear I have delay on the CCP, maybe because it's wireless, maybe because I'm bad.

Anyhow, that's usually what I attempt to do. I'm having a hard time bringing everything together with Lucario: you have not only the standard Dashdance/L-Cancel/Wavedash/land to learn, but a plethora of mechanics that make or break his combos.

Also ASCing is giving me a headache. HOW DO PEOPLE DO THIS OH GOD