Need some advices

[BSeeD]

Hi.
Some of you may know me, I'm a french Sheik player.
Though I've never been on the top level, I'm pretty much active on the French boards, and regularly going to south of France tournaments.

Let's get to the point, my life is not interesting ^^ :

I need advices.
A lot of advices.
I'm trying to play seriously now, and I know my game is full of flaws, collected among 5-6 years of random play

So if u Sheik players out there can give me some advices, I will be very grateful.

I have only one recent video of me, but will have more soon 'cause I just bought a Dazzle.

I thank you in advance for the time u'll take to watch my "average french player match" XD and am looking forward to see your advices.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NN5pbr_-4pI

 

[mers]

You rely on fullhopped/doublejumped aerials a lot. You make it work OK, but it's getting you punished when your opponent is at low percent. Try to be aware of what moves can be CCed and when, and use more grabs or something at the beginning of each stock.

 

[Mr Wizzrobe]

I wouldn't bthrow Sheik offstage at low percents in dittos. Always better to dthrow and follow up.

I think you just need to grab more in general.

 

[trunks6262]

I agree. Your grab game is essential in this matchup so you need to make sure you get that down. Also, try to space better and use better moves in the correct situation. For example, at 2:47 you naired the sheik when he was off the edge instead of bairing him. the spacing for the bair was perfect too.

Also you dodge randomly a lot even when your opponent is high above you in the air you just spot dodge. Try to follow up some basic combos. I think because you've played for a while (and this happens to me quite a bit) you just forget some basics so make sure you go over that stuff.

 

[BSeeD]

Thank y'all for all these advices ^^

That's pretty much what I thought I had to work, and yeah ur right I have too much old stuff that I forget to use, or don't use coz I think it's too obvious.

Am gonna work on these grabs/tech chases also.

I'm gonna post some more videos in a few days so you can give me more general advices against all kinds of matchups, this of course if u have time to

 

[stelzig]

I haven't watched the video, but you have to remember that he is playing PAL. I see nothing wrong with throwing sheik off the stage with bthrow at low percents. It could even work in NTSC.

 

[BSeeD]

I know that Amsah is consistently throwing off stage when he can.

Ok, he manages to edgeguard then like 9 out of 10 times, and I don't

 

[gm jack]

It's a lot harder to edge guard a sheik than a lot of others though, especially at low percents.

The tech chase is also really quite easy, so if your gimps aren't working, the tech chase can be a lot of guaranteed damage.

 

[KirbyKaze]

B-throw is amazing in Sheik dittos if you're playing without CG (so in PAL too because PAL always has no CG).

After B-throw Sheik only has a few good options for recovery. She can FF > DJ sweetspot, DJ attack onto stage, DJ attack onto ledge, Up+B to attempt a sweetspot, etc. Almost all of those can be covered by run off FF DJ nair or super fast WD edgehog > ledgehop aerial. The only ones that aren't really covered are the attack options, but you can stuff those with a move of your own (down smash, bair, fair, needles are all good) and depending on positioning you might be able to edgehog on them anyway and then ledgehop aerial punish their whiffed move (probably fair).

It's very good to b-throw people off the stage in Sheik dittos. And in general with Sheik.

 

[Jolteon]

Stay grounded more and try to get under the other Sheik. Also try not to be above them, it's not a good position to be in. You full hop too much.

You rely on aerial approaches a lot, these are good, but try also implementing various mix-ups like: empty hops, empty hop waveland, dd grab, wd back tilt.

 

[Ministry]

B-throw is amazing in Sheik dittos if you're playing without CG (so in PAL too because PAL always has no CG).

After B-throw Sheik only has a few good options for recovery. She can FF > DJ sweetspot, DJ attack onto stage, DJ attack onto ledge, Up+B to attempt a sweetspot, etc. Almost all of those can be covered by run off FF DJ nair or super fast WD edgehog > ledgehop aerial. The only ones that aren't really covered are the attack options, but you can stuff those with a move of your own (down smash, bair, fair, needles are all good) and depending on positioning you might be able to edgehog on them anyway and then ledgehop aerial punish their whiffed move (probably fair).

It's very good to b-throw people off the stage in Sheik dittos. And in general with Sheik.

lol at kk proving everyone wrong

shows how much people know matchups...

 

[BSeeD]

B-throw is amazing in Sheik dittos if you're playing without CG (so in PAL too because PAL always has no CG).

After B-throw Sheik only has a few good options for recovery. She can FF > DJ sweetspot, DJ attack onto stage, DJ attack onto ledge, Up+B to attempt a sweetspot, etc. Almost all of those can be covered by run off FF DJ nair or super fast WD edgehog > ledgehop aerial. The only ones that aren't really covered are the attack options, but you can stuff those with a move of your own (down smash, bair, fair, needles are all good) and depending on positioning you might be able to edgehog on them anyway and then ledgehop aerial punish their whiffed move (probably fair).

It's very good to b-throw people off the stage in Sheik dittos. And in general with Sheik.

That's what I was thinking.. Saw Amsah do this a lot.

Thank you for the reaction coverage though, ccoming from u I'm pretty sure it's all right.
I'm always trying to punish a fast recovery while b-throwing, a lot with ftilt off the stage, but it doesn't work that much. I'll try running of/WD edgehog and attack like you said.

And I'm going to focus more on ground game also. Thank y'all.

 

[Van.]

i watched the first match

i think you had a few sh dairs OoS that were weak, and maybe just aerials out of shield in general

i thought you could have just wd'd out and grabbed him a few times

aerials out of shield should only be used against spacies imo. I think you have time to wd out in every other mu. i'm sort of hesitating to say all this because grabs aren't as good in PAL so it could be that SH aerials OoS is like a default punish in PAL, but for some reason idt so. Then again i constantly prove i know nothing about PAL, so idk.

 

[BSeeD]

I use both versions at home so I can tell you :

Sheik's grab is not as powerful in PAL than in NTSC, but still it's a good weapon for sheik.
Even if u don't have the same chaingrab oppurtunities, ur still relying on tech chase.

Ur getting a good point though, cause I know my grab game is just not enough, and I'm often choosing something else over grabbing.

I think that's because I don't trust my tech chases.
Coz I suck @ tech chasing -_-

Do someone knows a way I can practice tech chasing at home, alone ?
I know it's a very big part of Sheik's metagame, but still can't make it the good way...

 

[Van.]

^Do you have a hacked wii?

 

[BSeeD]

Huh, yeah, but I don't think it's relevant there

If ur asking that because I said I have both versions, it's just because a friend of mine bought me a Japanese Gamecube and Melee back when he went there on holidays, two years ago.

 

[Van.]

Huh, yeah, but I don't think it's relevant there

Actually... it is!!!

Basically I just use an elastic on a controller I don't care about to hold the Z + C-stick down and set that at P2. This causes the controller to, in matches where C-stick is enabled, constantly buffer sidestep. In P1 I have my own controller.

"There's a Melee hack for C-stick in training mode. So I set the CPU on human (remember how it constantly buffer sidesteps now?) and then just down throw, then switch controllers to make the human DI and tech various ways, and then switch back to my own controller to try and get the boost grab distance correct or grab them before the sidestep goes through. It lets you know your timing is accurate within 3 frames or so. I also feel it helps me get used to recognizing the tech animations better.

But it requires some hardware and software and not everyone gets good results out of practicing it this way.

I feel it really helps me, though. If you already own a hacked Wii, and have access to a blank DVD + the means to burn a copy of SSBM, it may be worth looking into. The hack also has debug mode and some other nifty features anyway so that might be worth trying for those too. It's available somewhere in the Melee Workshop in Melee Discussion."

~KirbyKaze

 

[BSeeD]

Ohhh. Nice tip !

I'm definately trying this.

But I guess, there's no need for a hack, I can just do the same in Versus mode, no time no stock, am I right ?

Thanks 4 the tip though. ^^

 

[Van.]

funny because i always thought there was no need for the hack, but i never asked kk about it because i figured there was a really obvious reason i was missing.

you might be right, lol

 

[KirbyKaze]

'cuz you can reset damage in training mode and control damage so you can practice specific stuff and screw around

idk i guess it's not totally necessary but i find it extremely convenient