Nana sharing the ledge with enemy :/

[infomon]

Hey all,

This has only ever happened to me twice, by sheer misfortune, but it's something to watch out for. While using Belay to recover, Nana can actually share the ledge with the enemy, allowing Popo to fall to his doom.... with a broken heart

The timing is difficult, but I've been able to do it a couple times in training mode (dual-wielding wiimotes o_O). When the ICs hit up-B, there's a moment where it decides if it will be a tether recovery or not. The ledge has to be free for it to decide to tether the recovery, but the opponent can grab the ledge while Nana zooms toward it for the tether. In that case, Popo will be left as if the up-B had hit an opponent; he gains almost no height and is in the useless-falling state.

It's a subtle point, but it's possible that some opponents could take advantage of this to improve their IC gimping. Up-B is a really dangerous recovery; the opponent can hit Popo out of it, or jump into Nana thereby ruining Pop's recovery, or grab the edge early to prevent Nana's recovery, or share the edge with Nana to leave Popo falling. Or stay on the stage and ruin Popo during his return.

 

[KRDsonic]

I've had that happen to me before in a wifi battle and I was so confused. The person I brawled recorded but he never uploaded it :/

 

[ShadowLink84]

Yes its most hilarious when its done though.

 

[Miller]

Yea, it has happend to me a few times, but im pretty sure Popo still flies upwards, doesnt he?

 

[infomon]

Yea, it has happend to me a few times, but im pretty sure Popo still flies upwards, doesnt he?

I think Popo gets a bit of a hop, like when your up-B hits someone; he has a decent ability to drift horizontally, but not a lot of vertical. Hmm I might be wrong about this. When it happened to me yesterday, Popo was left way too low to recover, but I don't remember the details. In my training-mode testing, I was only able to pull off the shared-ledge when the ICs were basically horizontal from the edge (so that Nana wouldn't just smack the opponent from below), and in this setup, Popo was once able to drift onto the stage. But I think if we'd started the tether lower, we would have been stuck, especially since the opponent is hogging the ledge (with our woman!).

I'd like to test it against opponents with B-moves that can quickly snap the ledge from a distance, to see if there are practical ways this can really be put to menacing the ICs. But I'm not often with other people to test stuff. Also, it makes me sad to learn ways to exploit the ICs weaknesses, lol...... Most people I play with are perceptably inexperienced at fighting ICs, so this level of meta-game is irrelevant anyway.

 

[I.iZ.nO.1]

The same thing actually happend to me yesterday during a wifi match and i was about to make a post about it when i ran into this thread.

 

[GimR]

When it happened to me it forced Nana off the ledge, lol?

 

[infomon]

When it happened to me it forced Nana off the ledge, lol?

Oy? Heh, sounds like we've got some work to do, figuring out these subtle up-B mechanics.

Or we just get lazy, and suffer random deaths every blue moon

 

[VirtualVoid]

It only happened to me two times, in both of them Nana fell from the edge when my opponent grabbed it and Popo got a rather short boost but still enough to reach the stage.

The height Popo gains when this happens is probably affected by the time between Nana grabbing the edge and the opponent grabbing the ledge. I have no idea how it's affected though.

 

[Bnzaaa]

It happened to me at Castle Siege. My Popo swung like Tarzan to his doom.

 

[DemonicTrilogy]

Yeah... Usually when I see my opponent rush to the edge as I am recovering back to it from below, I assume that they are going to edge hog so I use squall hammer. I have never had this happen to me before... Usually if the opponent occupies the ledge when I belay, even when the character is in invincibility frames, I do the non-tether belay...

 

[Hit973]

This has never happened to me before...
Thanks for the warning though. Now I won't be surprised if it does

 

[Jam Stunna]

I always knew Nana was a cheating *****.

 

[FrozenHobo]

This has never happened to me before...
Thanks for the warning though. Now I won't be surprised if it does

this. i've never seen this happen before but now i know to be careful.

 

[Byronman]

I've never had this happen. Interesting........

 

[DemonicTrilogy]

This "ledge sharing" would explain why you don't edge hog Nana and why Nana doesn't ledge hog you...

 

[Miles.]

I have had it happen but it was much different.

Nana edge hogged the opponeent off the edge AND Popo was flung up onto the level.

 

[Byronman]

This "ledge sharing" would explain why you don't edge hog Nana and why Nana doesn't ledge hog you...

Yeah but she edge hogs others right?

 

[DKKountry]

As if their recovery wasn't already gimptastic enough if your Nana isn't around, now she can mess things up even if she's with you lol.

 

[infomon]

Nana edge hogged the opponeent off the edge AND Popo was flung up onto the level.

Yeah but she edge hogs others right?

Yes, Nana usually edge-hogs opponents; if she is on the ledge, noone but Popo can grab it.

But in the very rare circumstance that an opponent grabs the ledge while Nana is tether-flying towards the ledge, then they will actually share it, and hog it from Popo.

 

[0RLY]

Can this happen with another character's tether? Like Sheik on her chain and Nana on the ledge, and popo getting pwnt?

 

[infomon]

Can this happen with another character's tether? Like Sheik on her chain and Nana on the ledge, and popo getting pwnt?

No, in all of my tests, the opponent's tether loses. The sequence is like this:

1. Ice Climbers use up-B
2. Ice Climbers' up-B decides it's going to be a tether, so Nana starts zooming towards the ledge.
3. Shiek uses side-B
4. Shiek's side-B decides it's going to be a tether, and her whip snaps the ledge while Nana has just about reached, or has reached, the ledge
5. Shiek's whip unsnaps from the ledge, like a missed tether. Meanwhile, Popo gets tether-pulled to the ledge.

Kinda weird, eh? It was really hard to pull off by myself in training mode >.<

 

[DemonicTrilogy]

I think this is because main recoveries have priority over a character's secondary recovery that is a tether...

 

[infomon]

Eeks, actually that makes me realize, maybe it has to do with controller port #? This seems like a likely candidate for that sort of stupidity.

Hmm, in my Shiek experiment, ICs were port #2, Shiek was #1. I don't feel like testing it the other way now, though.

All this is pretty abstract though, it'd be very rare for this to matter in an actual match (ie. it's not worth fighting for controller-port over).

 

[DemonicTrilogy]

????O_O
I wouldn't think this would have to have anything to do with controller ports...

 

[infomon]

Well, a bunch of other random subtle contests in Brawl are decided based on controller port #.

The priority thing is another possibility, but I'm not sure I understand it.

 

[DemonicTrilogy]

I'm saying that it might be possible that since the main recovery move for Ic's is Belay, it out prioritizes other people's tethers that are secondary recoveries like sheik's chain and lucas's snake rope.

 

[Byronman]

I think the controller port is likely for this happening, but how does that work online?

 

[infomon]

I read in some thread once that online, there is still a notion of who's the true P1 vs. P2 etc. Although it's hard to tell, because everyone sees each other mapped differently... but there's some way to figure it out. I forget what though