• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Musical Resolve: A Change in Perspective

Firus

You know what? I am good.
BRoomer
Joined
Apr 7, 2008
Messages
7,681
Location
Virginia
NNID
OctagonalWalnut
3DS FC
0619-4291-4974
Link to original post: [drupal=5086]Musical Resolve: A Change in Perspective[/drupal]

Because I seem to be incapable of blogging about (almost) anything besides music anymore, I’m back with another music blog. Ironically, despite what I blogged about two blogs ago – hating both popular music and hipster music cultures – I’ve found myself drifting more and more to a hipster sort of mentality as of late.

To call me a complete music hipster would be inaccurate, as I still own and listen to music that is now and was once popular. Still, I’m closer to being a hipster than ever, or at least since my overall “rebellious” phase back in late elementary school going into middle school. The pop music in my library has begun to bore me, and I don’t really have much urge to go out and add any more currently popular music to my library.

Truth be told, I can trace this back to a number of things. Part of it is that I’ve satirized hipsters for so long by saying, “I liked this song before it was popular!” that it actually seems to have become a legitimate thought. Also, while I generally avoid listening to the radio, particularly modern popular radio, since I’ve gotten to college, I’ve found it nearly impossible to avoid. Probably the largest factor, though, is that I’ve been burned on many of my latest pop music purchases. I bought Rihanna’s latest album, but aside from “We Found Love” (very overplayed, but still catchy with a good beat and riff) and “Farewell,” most of the album is utter trash to me. Lady Gaga’s newest album was a severe disappointment to me as well.

Even looking back on some albums in the past two years that I was initially somewhat pleased with, I realize that there was a time when I enjoyed all but one or two songs thoroughly on practically every album I owned, and that has now become my standard for an exceptionally good album.

Also, I’ve begun to think more critically about my music based off of things that various people have said. Somebody once explained to me what significance he gets from music as being the human voice, its capacity as an instrument, and its ability to therefore move him to different sentiments, particularly with female singers. This is something I’ve considered to be true for myself as well, as instrumental pieces can rarely move me as much as lyrical ones, and yet looking at all of this pop music I have, few of the artists can sing, and even fewer elect to do so without overproducing their music and adding auto-tune anyway.

Frankly, I’m tired of that. Outside of “An Ending (Ascent)”, instrumentals don’t move me nearly as much as the human voice, and the human voice accompanied by lyrics that can bear some sort of significance to me. It’s part of why dubstep fails to appeal to me at all. (The other part being that I can’t stand the bloody WUBWUBWUB and the fact that it ends up sounding like a jumble of electronic noises rather than music.)

I’ve also had many interesting conversations with my suitemate who is a complete metalhead. Aside from symphonic metal, I don’t get too much into metal – because the screaming present in much metal goes against my personal preference of the human voice as an instrument – but we feel pretty similarly on pop music. He, of course, comes at it from a much more metal-focused perspective, but these types of conversations have inspired me to look for more in my music rather than settling for a cheap, catchy beat. Then I look at all of these people partying around me, listening to the same bloody music until the next wave of popular music comes out, not even really seeming to think about what they’re listening to except that it’s what’s popular and catchy, and I’m even more inspired to look for more.

The hipster part comes in when I look through my music and realize what I’m truly satisfied by. Most of the popular rock music today doesn’t interest me. Instead, I find myself looking to the rock I started off listening to and gravitating towards those artists I’ve discovered more recently who are not very well-known, like Thriving Ivory (one of my favorite bands) or Civil Twilight.

When it comes to pop music, the only stuff I can much stand at the moment, except in some specific circumstances, is pop-rock. Avril Lavigne is, of course, somewhat popular – though not nearly as much now as she was in her “Sk8er Boi” days – but I loved her newest album because, as she even said she personally strove for, her voice is the main instrument on the album. I’ve also recently – particularly since summer – gotten into Michelle Branch’s music, although she hasn’t released an album in years (and her record company is currently withholding her new album, it seems).

Oh sure, I still have some of that generic pop music in my library, but most of all, I look for that stripped-down music, and that’s something you rarely find in popular music, especially in the music found on the radio.

Of course, people always ***** at me over Adele, because yes, it would sound like she’d fit my criteria to a bloody ‘T’, but her music just sounds generic to me, and the whole overplayed and overrated piece that comes along with being on the radio makes it very hard for me to enjoy anything I do enjoy by her for very long. Yes, she can actually sing and play an instrument. The fact that this is now something in music that is not a baseline, but rather a plus, is just sad from my perspective. But maybe I’m just old-fashioned.

Actually, I almost certainly am, but that’s okay.

Perhaps it’s just because it’s something that I feel I almost have to myself, that nobody else can corrupt by mindlessly listening to it just because it’s popular, but I keep looking through my music and I see artists that make songs that seem to have so much more soul and emotion put into them, and it’s never the popular ones. Save for the most emotional songs, the songs from the most popular artists in my library are the ones I’ve been skipping time and time again on shuffle.

I also think a good portion of why I’m starting to grow so strongly away from popular music is the same things I pointed out in my other blog. Music is overplayed on the radio so much that even if I liked a song that gets to the radio, I rarely like it for much longer. (I’d threaten to scream the next time I hear “Domino,” but that pretty much already happens every time it comes on the radio.) People take a song that may have meaning, and then it becomes just another top 40 song and it loses the majority of the emotion I felt listening to it.

The only popular music I can find myself looking for anymore is older music – I’m talking pre-2000 – ironically, as my library has usually consisted of a majority of music that’s from the ‘90s or later. But I can’t stand this trend of electronic music in popular music. I know I already voiced my complaints about dubstep, but that goes for a significant portion of electronic music; more often than not, I don’t like listening to instrumental music much at all, video game music being the only exception to that. It’s not that I dislike it; I just prefer lyrics in my music. Besides, while I appreciate electronic music, I like music that’s – as I said – more stripped-down, basic, and honest-sounding.

I’m not about to become one of those people who generalizes an entire genre of music as terrible, because I hate that, and I’m not about to become one of the hipsters that says anything in the top 40 is automatically terrible, as both of these things are things I’ve explicitly complained about in the past. My point is that I’m just fed up with buying this music. I’m not going to delete music from my library or sell CDs, because I bought every CD that I bought for one reason or another, and there is no CD in my library that is completely without merit to me. I just want to go out and look for music in that lesser-known category, once I’m finally done thoroughly listening to all of the music in my library that I already have and haven’t gotten a chance to listen to yet.

I’m not saying this to offend anyone’s music tastes, or to act high-and-mighty because I’m done with modern popular music. I’ve just found it ironic – and a bit annoying – that I’ve found myself becoming one of those people that I’ve been annoyed at for some time now, and I felt like expressing that change. As I said, I’m not swearing off any music that becomes popular. I just want to avoid actually putting any of said music into my library, because it generally gets ruined for me through the radio, and I’m finding myself less and less satisfied with it.

I also find myself wanting to talk about my music more and more (something my friends care to do less often than I do), so if all goes well, you can expect some song/album/artist reviews coming from me sometime in the near future.

(I hope this is fairly organized and comprehensive, too, because for some reason I had trouble writing my thoughts out as I wanted to with this blog.)
 

Luigitoilet

shattering perfection
BRoomer
Joined
Jul 30, 2001
Messages
13,718
Location
secret room of wonder and despair
I honestly have no idea what point you are trying to get at beyond "i hate popular music except if it's old and therefore cool to not hate because of generational nostalgia" or "I'm a hipster even though I hate hipsters" so I'll just use your post as a means to talk about music which is pretty much my favorite thing to talk about. I'm not talking from a customer/purchaser standpoint because the vast majority of the music I listen to is pirated. I tend to only buy albums from lesser known bands/artists whom I really really respect. I don't have enough funds or free time to meet my music needs in a legal, monetary way. I also don't listen to the radio or watch TV so I can't really comment on things being overplayed.

Music is extremely precious to me. I honestly feel like if it wasn't in my life I would have killed myself a while ago. I can appreciate any kind of music on some level, even if it is manufactured pop songs or commercial jingles that were created for the sole purpose of making money. there is still worth to be found. the beauty in art is not in its creation or the intention behind said creation, it is in the interpretation. I can't degrade a Rihanna or Lady Gaga song because I know those same songs have saved somebody's life, or comforted them in a serious time of need.

More than that, I have been emotionally moved and inspired by tons of pop music, even modern pop music. Songs like All of the Lights, Live Your Life, Paparazzi, Eh Eh Nothing Else I can Say, etc etc. sincerely hit an emotional spot in me and have me singing/rapping my heart out almost every time I hear them. At no point do I even consider the ramifications of becoming some meaningless label like "hipster" let alone do I let such a concept bother me to the point of making a huge blog about it. I think that is a sad and relatively unsatisfying way to interact with art and it makes me upset that the vast majority of people fall prey to it. If it's not "hipster" it is "this song is too stupid/too gay/too angry/too simple/too complex/etcetcetc."

There is this overbearing presence of imaging over actual emotional expression. I don't understand how anyone can criticize the incredibly strong and passionate harmonies of the Backstreet Boys without bringing up the insignificant context: they are a pop boy band and ghost writers wrote all their hits. So what? The song remains the same regardless of the intentions and circumstances behind its creation. If a BSB song moves me (and many of them have) I'm going to move. I don't know what an "honest sounding" song sounds like.

I also don't understand the checklist type mentality towards music. "Does this song have electronics/does this song have vocals/does this song have a breakdown/etc etc. and if it does/doesn't then it sucks/is awesome". Each piece of music is its own being. Whatever artistic decisions were made are done. I've heard many electro songs that were more emotional and raw than many rock songs with traditional instrumentation.

I dunno though. I try to listen to as much different stuff as I can. I get bored listening to one type of music for very long and I am always eager to hear a different form of self-expression. It builds character to go from Fela Kuti to Queen to Between the Buried and Me to DNTEL to Kanye West to Johnny Cash to Bright Eyes to Rolo Tomassi to Limp Bizkit etc etc. It's also liberating to be able to listen to all of that without getting hung up on "gee does listening to this song turn me into something else? am i now a hipster? am i now a pop-music sheep? am i now a metalhead?" no, you're not. you're just a guy who listened to some music.
 

Mr.Jackpot

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 30, 2011
Messages
1,727
Location
WA
tl;dr: i found it hard to accept that i didn't like pop music because it would make me a "hipster"
 

Firus

You know what? I am good.
BRoomer
Joined
Apr 7, 2008
Messages
7,681
Location
Virginia
NNID
OctagonalWalnut
3DS FC
0619-4291-4974
I honestly have no idea what point you are trying to get at beyond "i hate popular music except if it's old and therefore cool to not hate because of generational nostalgia" or "I'm a hipster even though I hate hipsters" so I'll just use your post as a means to talk about music which is pretty much my favorite thing to talk about.
The ironic thing is that that last point you made -- you just like talking about music -- is pretty much the point of this blog. I'm not trying to make some massive thesis or convert anyone, I just like talking about music and felt like talking about my change in perspective.

As for the two things you think I'm trying to say, let me address that.

"i hate popular music except if it's old and therefore cool to not hate because of generational nostalgia" : Did you actually read the blog and miss the part where I explained the things about popular music that I don't like? I'm not saying that all old music is good in the slightest, I even said I've never even been into terribly much older music. But I'd at least like to give it a try, because there are songs in my library that are older, and something about many of those songs appeals to me. (I swear I can't win, I got yelled at in my last blog for saying I don't like The Beatles and like popular music, now I say I want to look at older music and get away from modern pop and that's terrible too.) As for the "cool" factor, I really don't see who I have to impress, and I've never really been one to care about being "cool." I was that guy in high school who walked around and made it known that I loved Pokémon. Music is a very personal thing to me, and I listen to most of it by myself through my headphones; I'm not about to design my library based on what other people think.

"I'm a hipster even though I hate hipsters" : The point here was that I'm finding myself as more of a hipster, despite hating the general hipster stereotype of somebody who hates all music that's even remotely popular and pretends to dislike music that they actually like and all. I must've said at least three times that I'm not technically a hipster, I've just drifted to more of that mindset than before.

Music is extremely precious to me. I honestly feel like if it wasn't in my life I would have killed myself a while ago. I can appreciate any kind of music on some level, even if it is manufactured pop songs or commercial jingles that were created for the sole purpose of making money. there is still worth to be found. the beauty in art is not in its creation or the intention behind said creation, it is in the interpretation. I can't degrade a Rihanna or Lady Gaga song because I know those same songs have saved somebody's life, or comforted them in a serious time of need.

More than that, I have been emotionally moved and inspired by tons of pop music, even modern pop music. Songs like All of the Lights, Live Your Life, Paparazzi, Eh Eh Nothing Else I can Say, etc etc. sincerely hit an emotional spot in me and have me singing/rapping my heart out almost every time I hear them. At no point do I even consider the ramifications of becoming some meaningless label like "hipster" let alone do I let such a concept bother me to the point of making a huge blog about it. I think that is a sad and relatively unsatisfying way to interact with art and it makes me upset that the vast majority of people fall prey to it. If it's not "hipster" it is "this song is too stupid/too gay/too angry/too simple/too complex/etcetcetc."
Well, thanks for all but insulting my way of listening to / enjoying music just because you do it differently, especially since you don't seem to understand where I'm coming from.

First of all, I absolutely love music; it's probably my favorite thing in the world. What you said in that first paragraph? I agree entirely. I live through my music. I listen to music that expresses how I feel, music that makes me feel something, music that has significance to me. What exactly creates that significance varies from song to song, for me and for anyone else. Everybody takes a musical piece differently.

As for your judgment of hipsters -- and therefore me, since you're assuming that I'm a complete hipster -- I agree, and that's exactly why I don't like the stereotypical hipster and why my point was that I'm not one of those. My only criterion for music is this: it has to make me feel something. Not "Oh, it has to have this exact chord progression," or "Oh, it can't be from an artist who's actually well-known."

I'll get back to this point in later pieces of this response.

There is this overbearing presence of imaging over actual emotional expression. I don't understand how anyone can criticize the incredibly strong and passionate harmonies of the Backstreet Boys without bringing up the insignificant context: they are a pop boy band and ghost writers wrote all their hits. So what? The song remains the same regardless of the intentions and circumstances behind its creation. If a BSB song moves me (and many of them have) I'm going to move. I don't know what an "honest sounding" song sounds like.
I don't know what "honest-sounding" is either. I just feel it. I can tell you songs that sound like that to me, and I can tell you songs that don't. What you fail to realize in your entire criticism of the way I listen to music is that we actually seem to be fairly similar. It's just that I'm trying to describe it in words and you seem to hate even trying to do that much. If a song makes me feel something, it makes me feel something. And of late, I've found more and more that the songs that make me feel the most have what I can only seem to describe as an "honest" sound. Natural, basic, simple. I don't know. It might not be an accurate description, it's just what I feel.

I also don't understand the checklist type mentality towards music. "Does this song have electronics/does this song have vocals/does this song have a breakdown/etc etc. and if it does/doesn't then it sucks/is awesome". Each piece of music is its own being. Whatever artistic decisions were made are done. I've heard many electro songs that were more emotional and raw than many rock songs with traditional instrumentation.
It isn't a checklist at all. Yet again you're making assumptions. From lots of experience listening to music, I've learned what sorts of things I enjoy in music more than others. Some electronic songs are certainly more emotional and raw than some other songs out there. Normally, though, what makes me feel more is a song with vocals that isn't electronic. I'm just talking about the things that I've learned I tend to prefer in music. It isn't a checklist. I don't "decide" what music I like, just as I don't "decide" what food I like.

I dunno though. I try to listen to as much different stuff as I can. I get bored listening to one type of music for very long and I am always eager to hear a different form of self-expression. It builds character to go from Fela Kuti to Queen to Between the Buried and Me to DNTEL to Kanye West to Johnny Cash to Bright Eyes to Rolo Tomassi to Limp Bizkit etc etc.
And so do I. I've got pop, rock, country, folk, electronic, rap, metal, old, new...I've got a ton of different music in my library, and I'm always trying to expand my tastes. Expanding my library with a new artist or genre is a great feeling for me.

It's also liberating to be able to listen to all of that without getting hung up on "gee does listening to this song turn me into something else? am i now a hipster? am i now a pop-music sheep? am i now a metalhead?" no, you're not. you're just a guy who listened to some music.
I'm not getting "hung up" on anything, I just found it interesting to note the direction my music library has taken. I may, from time to time, notice what kind of perspective other people would have when looking at my library, but I've never changed what I listen to because of it. I only listen to something that makes me feel some sort of emotion.

I didn't go and attack your way of listening to music, I didn't say that pop music is bad, that any type of music is bad, that anybody should look for what I'm looking for in music. I just expressed my opinions and tastes in music, and I don't see why you had to jump on me and start acting holier-than-thou over it. I have all three of Lady Gaga's albums, three of Rihanna's albums, both of Ke$ha's albums, all three of Selena Gomez's albums, Britney Spears's newest album, Katy Perry's newest album, Nicki Minaj's first album, all of Taylor Swift's albums, all of the A*Teens's albums, even an album by Hilary Duff. I'm not deleting any of it, and there are songs from all of those artists that really have meaning to me and make me feel something. I simply have found that those artists don't have music that makes me feel as much as the other kinds of artists in my library. So I'm looking for a new direction in my music. I'm looking to add something else to my library.

I don't understand how you can have an entire post which seems to be based on the idea that any music can have value and that you should just listen to whatever music you enjoy instead of getting caught up in this thing or that, and yet your entire post is criticizing the way you perceive my way of listening to music.

tl;dr: i found it hard to accept that i didn't like pop music because it would make me a "hipster"
Gee, I love it when people try to tl;dr without even knowing what they're talking about.

I haven't listened to pop music for the majority of my life. I started out actively listening to my own music library back in around 2002, and only for the past two years have I really looked into pop music at all. Nothing was hard to accept. It's a slow realization over time that the pop music just doesn't seem to be doing it for me anymore. And I don't give a flying **** what it makes me, I like whatever music I like and I hate it when people pretend to like or dislike something just because they want to be cool or whatever.

If it's too long for you to actually read, please don't try to summarize it.
 

Luigitoilet

shattering perfection
BRoomer
Joined
Jul 30, 2001
Messages
13,718
Location
secret room of wonder and despair
lol, I didn't realize you would take it so personally. I was just teasing you with my little OP summaries and the majority of my post isn't directed towards you specifically. I was using some of the stuff you said as a jumping-off point to talk about a mindset that is very prevalent. I tried to use words such as "people" and "somebody" as opposed to "you" or "Firus" because I was speaking generally. Sure, some of the things you said had me presuming a fair amount about you specifically I guess, but I wasn't directly attacking you, just ruminating on the apparent divide between me and many other "musically inclined" people when it comes to the way they approach the art.

I think what caught my eye more than anything is that the majority of your post is focused on the perceived popularity of things, artists that were hyped up for you and failed to live up to said hype, the way other people react to music and how you disapprove of that, how old or new a song is, etc etc. All that stuff, to me, is insignificant. That's not really music discussion. It's pop culture discussion. Nothing wrong with that of course, and it is difficult to talk about any modern music without bringing in pop culture into the discussion. Still though, I'd rather hear more about why you like vocal-centric music over instrumentals or what qualifies as real/raw/honest music to you or anything about the actual music...and less of the talk about the correlation between the things you like and how popular they are.
Sorry to offend you.

also, what in the hell does this mean

I don't know what "honest-sounding" is either. I just feel it. I can tell you songs that sound like that to me, and I can tell you songs that don't. What you fail to realize in your entire criticism of the way I listen to music is that we actually seem to be fairly similar. It's just that I'm trying to describe it in words and you seem to hate even trying to do that much.
what is my post up there composed of, if not words?
 

Firus

You know what? I am good.
BRoomer
Joined
Apr 7, 2008
Messages
7,681
Location
Virginia
NNID
OctagonalWalnut
3DS FC
0619-4291-4974
lol, I didn't realize you would take it so personally. I was just teasing you with my little OP summaries and the majority of my post isn't directed towards you specifically. I was using some of the stuff you said as a jumping-off point to talk about a mindset that is very prevalent. I tried to use words such as "people" and "somebody" as opposed to "you" or "Firus" because I was speaking generally. Sure, some of the things you said had me presuming a fair amount about you specifically I guess, but I wasn't directly attacking you, just ruminating on the apparent divide between me and many other "musically inclined" people when it comes to the way they approach the art.

I think what caught my eye more than anything is that the majority of your post is focused on the perceived popularity of things, artists that were hyped up for you and failed to live up to said hype, the way other people react to music and how you disapprove of that, how old or new a song is, etc etc. All that stuff, to me, is insignificant. That's not really music discussion. It's pop culture discussion. Nothing wrong with that of course, and it is difficult to talk about any modern music without bringing in pop culture into the discussion. Still though, I'd rather hear more about why you like vocal-centric music over instrumentals or what qualifies as real/raw/honest music to you or anything about the actual music...and less of the talk about the correlation between the things you like and how popular they are.
Sorry to offend you.
Bah, I suppose that's the nature of the internet. Hard to tell where people are actually coming from and hard to tell the inflection and whatnot with which they're speaking.

Anyway, I see your point about pop culture discussion vs. music discussion; I suppose this blog was not as focused on the music aspect as even I would have liked. I almost put in a couple extended examples of artists that I've been particularly enjoying as of late and what it is exactly that I enjoy about them so much, but I figured it'd just extend the blog and be something that most people skip. And ultimately, I was more trying to just talk about the change in perspective overall that I've had, since I've blogged about opinions and tastes in music in a few blogs in the past.

As for why I like the music I like and all...well, let me start with the vocals piece. I consider the human voice to be an instrument, just like piano, guitar, synthesizers, etc., and just as somebody may particularly prefer a single one of those instruments, just as somebody may find it particularly moving to listen to an orchestra, I find that capacity in the human voice, particularly in female singers. I will listen to some music in which there may be weaker vocals, or some bad singing, but it tends to be somewhat grating for me. The other piece of why I enjoy vocals so much is that lyrics are generally how I make a strong connection to music. Sometimes only the instrumentals to a song can move me, but much of what creates the emotion in music for me is the particular words that are sung and the inflection with which they are sung.

Speaking to the "honest" piece, it's a bit hard to describe, but I'll try. There are certain artists who seem to have this capacity over others, for me. I almost want to say that it's an acoustic sound, but there are songs that feel that sort of way to me that aren't actually acoustic. I suppose, to some extent, it's just music that's softer, more melodic and more emotional, rather than fast-paced and catchy. Most of Avril Lavigne's debut album (Let Go) feels this way to me, which is why I love it so much. Songs like "I'm With You," "Mobile," "Tomorrow," "Things I'll Never Say," and particularly "My World" just have this quality to them that feels stripped-down, raw, and honest to me. Many of the songs were clearly written by a ~15-year-old, but I think that adds to the innocence. It may even be the memories I've created with the music, since I recall listening to that album a lot when I first got it. Much of Tonic's work on their newest, self-titled album (I don't have much else by them yet) also feels this way to me, like "I Want It To Be", "Resolve," and "Nothing Is Everything," as well as Ben Jelen's work in general, particularly "Counting Down" and "Setting of the Sun."

I don't know if that explained it well at all, but that's the best I can do. It's a bit hard for me to explain in words.

also, what in the hell does this mean

what is my post up there composed of, if not words?
What I meant is that your descriptions of your music-listening habits everywhere in your post seemed to be focused mostly on music making you feel something, and you seemed reluctant to put any more of a label on why you like it than that. I may have been incorrect (which is why I said "you seem"), but that's how it came off to me. It's not really a positive or negative thing; I know there are a number of people who don't like putting direct descriptions on things like music.
 
Top Bottom