Mewtwo wobbling?

MRSU

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#1
Ok so I'm not completely sure on how mewtwo's disable works, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the higher the percent of the opponent, the longer disable's effect lasts. I also know that if you use disable on an opponent who is already being affected by the move, they will receive knock back rather than being disabled again. However, hypothetically, in the world of 20XX, could one be so good at timing disable that it could be used infinitely on the first frames when the opponent gets out of disable to infinitely rack on percent?
 

Ten of Nine

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#5
They can't hold shield while they're dazed, and shield doesn't come out frame one
This is like 200% wrong.

I really don't understand why kids just make crap up as they go and post here.

This is a broad statement for newer or younger people, not directed at you...

Please do us a favor and accept the possibility that you know very little and only speak on something or argue a point when you have experience or data to back it up. This applies to life as well, if you're young, well than I guess its understandable.

This will save a lot of confusion and misinformation in real life and here. Also people will respect you more.
 
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#6
Even if shield wasn't instantaneous, it's impossible to perfectly time the disable to hit on the first possible frame because mashing buttons reduces the duration of the disable. In other words, how long the disable lasts is completely random from a player's perspective.
 

SuperShus

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#7
You guys could have been a lot nicer to him he's new.

At least you're really good at making people feel bad and stifling creativity.
It's ok to be wrong, never voicing an idea for fear of being embarassed yourself is a great way to get stuck in a cubical forever, Ten of Nine Ten of Nine .
 

Ten of Nine

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#8
When you correct people then give completely wrong info.

That's a great way to end up working at McDonalds the rest of your life.

You gonna support that behavior, do you do the same thing? Go around making up data and then wrongfully correcting others.

Nah kids need to stop that stuff on this site, it's counter-productive. I don't care if someones wrong every now and then, i mean you will gain a reputation for being ignorant and unreliable....the problem here - Don't state wrong things as fact then use that false info to "correct" someone giving accurate statements. That has nothing with being new, that reveals the kind of person you are in general separate of this site or this game.

Stifling creativity? That makes absolutely no sense, the game fundamentally doesn't allow this.

You have to understand something in order to be creative with it. And a whole thread for a simple question that should have gone in an already existing thread? Nah, cmon now.
 
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Comet7

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#9
When you correct people then give completely wrong info.

That's a great way to end up working at McDonalds the rest of your life.

You gonna support that behavior, do you do the same thing? Go around making up data and then wrongfully correcting others.

Nah kids need to stop that stuff on this site, it's counter-productive. I don't care if someones wrong every now and then, i mean you will gain a reputation for being ignorant and unreliable....the problem here - Don't state wrong things as fact then use that false info to "correct" someone giving accurate statements. That has nothing with being new, that reveals the kind of person you are in general separate of this site or this game.

Stifling creativity? That makes absolutely no sense, the game fundamentally doesn't allow this.

You have to understand something in order to be creative with it. And a whole thread for a simple question that should have gone in an already existing thread? Nah, cmon now.
This is like 200% wrong.

He was talking about stuff in general, not just about the game.

You actually don't. Somebody that doesn't know much about a subject is arguably more likely to think of something weird with it than a person who has been working with that same subject for years. I can't think of any examples off the top of my head, but I'm sure SOMETHING amazing came because a person thought, "Why don't people just do (X thing that professionals never thought of before)?"
 

Ten of Nine

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#10
This is like 200% wrong.

He was talking about stuff in general, not just about the game.

You actually don't. Somebody that doesn't know much about a subject is arguably more likely to think of something weird with it than a person who has been working with that same subject for years. I can't think of any examples off the top of my head, but I'm sure SOMETHING amazing came because a person thought, "Why don't people just do (X thing that professionals never thought of before)?"
With concern to this game I was not wrong about anything. This isn't a pool room post, so the context here is Mewtwo in Melee.

I will agree in general in many other fields and arts naive people can of course have novel ideas (but they are usually highly intelligent, innately gifted or have expertise in some relevant field ). But with this game I can't think of one single example of anyone ignorant contributing anything significant in the past 14 years.
 
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SuperShus

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#11
can you educate me real fast on how you know everything about mewtwo but you have 6 posts and ive never heard of you
 

T^2

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#12
With concern to this game I was not wrong about anything. This isn't a pool room post, so the context here is Mewtwo in Melee.

I will agree in general in many other fields and arts naive people can of course have novel ideas (but they are usually highly intelligent, innately gifted or have expertise in some relevant field ). But with this game I can't think of one single example of anyone ignorant contributing anything significant in the past 14 years.
there have been plenty of things that came out of a person saying "why don't people do (x thing) in a matchup?" I mean look at what happened when pivot fsmash started being used against puff,or foxes using dtilt against puff. It revolutionized the matchups and brought them to a new meta. Crazy ideas work sometimes, please don't rip on someone cause they think somethings right or have never seen proof that it's false.
 
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Ten of Nine

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#13
can you educate me real fast on how you know everything about mewtwo but you have 6 posts and ive never heard of you
Can you educate me on how you can't read?

Never said I know everything about mewtwo, but I do know that shield comes out frame 1 and I know how disable works.

I have never heard of you and you have 230 posts. Is that supposed to mean anything or do you want to continue with these propaganda like argument techniques that make no sense? People usually resort to that behavior when they have nothing to contribute or debate.

there have been plenty of things that came out of a person saying "why don't people do (x thing) in a matchup?" I mean look at what happened when pivot fsmash started being used against puff,or foxes using dtilt against puff. It revolutionized the matchups and brought them to a new meta. Crazy ideas work sometimes, please don't rip on someone cause they think somethings right or have never seen proof that it's false.
Completely missing the point. Who made these discoveries? Clueless people that don't play melee OR people that play melee and/or marth/fox?

Ohhhh that's a tough one I'll give you a moment.

P.s. That is a terrible example....How is pivot F smash a crazy idea, been done long before. Its efficient and when done right is unreactable or beats puffs approach.
 
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TIN0

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#14
Are there any signs of the opponent getting out of the disable before they actually get out?
 

T^2

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#15
Can you educate me on how you can't read?

Never said I know everything about mewtwo, but I do know that shield comes out frame 1 and I know how disable works.

I have never heard of you and you have 230 posts. Is that supposed to mean anything or do you want to continue with these propaganda like argument techniques that make no sense? People usually resort to that behavior when they have nothing to contribute or debate.



Completely missing the point. Who made these discoveries? Clueless people that don't play melee OR people that play melee and/or marth/fox?

Ohhhh that's a tough one I'll give you a moment.

P.s. That is a terrible example....How is pivot F smash a crazy idea, been done long before. Its efficient and when done right is unreactable or beats puffs approach.
You're missing the point I was trying to make. Ideas like this can innovative and change the way we play the game. Dont **** on people just because you think the ideas stupid, or you "know" it will never work. Being open to things like this is what makes our community grow, and outlash like yours is what drives away a lot of creative thinkers from giving their ideas to us. In short:
Be more open to ideas and don't be that guy.
Thank you.
 

TIN0

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#16
Also, does anyone have any frame data for mewtwo's down-b and timings for when the opponent gets out? Do they just get up instantly and can react frame 1? Also, there could be a way to do it by doing down-b to a move with very little end lag and knock back then repeat the process.

Guys, just ignore his hate. You can listen to his comments but when he criticizes the group and just makes it worse, ignore him. We are here to discuss about mewtwo. Not about how we are stupid. Listen to everyone and critique, but don't hate.
 
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T^2

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#17
Guys, just ignore his hate. You can listen to his comments but when he criticizes the group and just makes it worse, ignore him. We are here to discuss about mewtwo. Not about how we are stupid. Listen to everyone and critique, but don't hate.
I have absolutely no frame data to work from, I'm more of an experience guy. Just can't stand when people do stuff like that. Keep fighting the good fight man, hit me up if you have any matchup specific questions.
 

Ten of Nine

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#18
You guys are absolutely right. I will leave this fruitful topic alone, feel free to repeat conversations that have happened in 2007 by much more experienced players.

I'm not hating or calling anyone stupid. Do not confuse ignorant or naive with stupid. But if some of you continue to not read properly or comprehend then I don't see how you'll be able to have any sort of productive conversation no matter the topic.
 
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Cyndane

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#19
Listen guys, there is nothing wrong with fruitful debate. When the debate turns into argument, flaming, or trolling, then it is not ok. Please stop with the negative comments.

Move on with the discussion.
 

SuperShus

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#20
the reason the OP's suggestion is impossible is beacuse it is impossible to know when they will be out of disable because the animation loops and they are sent to wait when it is over unless they were buffering an action, or timed the input one frame before disable ended.
disable puts you in sleep, mashing makes it end faster than normal, so it is very likely either player will be able to time any actions for the first frame unbuffered. Mixing up sheild spot dodge and roll would make getting anything after disable much less reliable than just smashing them or grabbing
since taj is the expert and 9/10 times he grabs after disable, I suggest grab. but I know smashes can be a good option as well

using disable in the first place is odd because it only hits if they're grounded and facing you, which is even weaker of an option than dtilt which is crouch cancellable.
it has good range and can hit taller characters when they're crouching so it could be useful
 

BeldorTN

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#21
the reason the OP's suggestion is impossible is beacuse it is impossible to know when they will be out of disable because the animation loops and they are sent to wait when it is over unless they were buffering an action, or timed the input one frame before disable ended.
disable puts you in sleep, mashing makes it end faster than normal, so it is very likely either player will be able to time any actions for the first frame unbuffered. Mixing up sheild spot dodge and roll would make getting anything after disable much less reliable than just smashing them or grabbing
since taj is the expert and 9/10 times he grabs after disable, I suggest grab. but I know smashes can be a good option as well

using disable in the first place is odd because it only hits if they're grounded and facing you, which is even weaker of an option than dtilt which is crouch cancellable.
it has good range and can hit taller characters when they're crouching so it could be useful
Agree overall, but Disable causes tumbling if it hits an airborne opponent. So it still connects.

Not that it matters much as it's still useless if you don't catch your opponent off guard. Which is unlikely considering how slow disable is.
 

MookieRah

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#22
Ok, so I'm going to say something in general terms, cause honestly I think both sides of the argument is being a bit silly :-P.

It's fine for newbies to ask questions, and honestly being able to feel like you can ask stupid questions and not get flak for it means you are in a great learning environment, and that is what we should strive for.

That said, when a newbie begins to debate with someone as if they are knowledgeable, then they kinda need to be shut down. BUT, that doesn't mean that you bash them, it just means that you say something like, "Hey, you are wrong. You are new. Stop acting like you are an expert. Here are the facts." You also can't expect everyone to behave perfectly every time, so as long as it's not a hardcore flame it's not like it's the end of the world.
 

TIN0

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#23
Could mewtwo's downthrow be almost like an infinite chain? Just wondering.
 

MookieRah

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#24
Nope. It's not even as good as it seems xD. I used to think quite highly of it, but now I know it's limitations quite thoroughly. Think of it as a Marth forward throw, but it actually deals decent damage.
 
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