Marth Nspec Trick?

[Shonoun]

So I was just spectating a match due to getting kicked from online by closing DS a half second early, and I saw something that really confused me:
A Marth was up against a someone, (forgot who, but that doesn't matter) and he was using this neat trick where he got this large forward momentum every time he released a Shield Breaker. He used it to recover in the air. I don't have any gifs of it, but I think someone would know what I'm talking about. Anyways, I want to learn how to do that because it seems like a really cool thing to use.

 

[EternalFlame]

When Shield Breaker is used in the air, you get a small push forward. However, if you fully charge it in the air, you get sent flying really far forward in the direction you're facing. I believe it is one of Marth's new recoveries for Smash 4, though I do believe hearing someone said it was also back in Brawl.

 

[Arti]

It was present in Brawl, it was just harder to do there, if I'm remembering right. It's been so long since I've touched Brawl.

I know for a fact it's there, though. I have fond memories of doing it during this one long vertical drop in SSE near when the game came out.

 

[Darklink401]

It was definitely in Brawl. And it's back in Smash 4.

This makes recovering horizontally from a decent height no problem for Marth.

It can also be used to trick your opponent, as you will move very quickly, so you can even use it to move behind them, and nail them. Gotta be careful though, because if you do it too close, or against someone with good enough reflexes, they WILL send you flying. XD


EDIT:

It wasn't any harder than in Brawl. You might move forward more in this one (not sure) but it was always as easy as holding B in the air.

 

[Tattles]

It's sometimes a tad too powerful for it's own good, fully charged. Do not make the mistake of letting go of that B button when Marth is below or equal to the stage (depending on distance), because you will find yourself in the middle of the stage... but on the bottom.

 

[Darklink401]

It's sometimes a tad too powerful for it's own good, fully charged. Do not make the mistake of letting go of that B button when Marth is below or equal to the stage (depending on distance), because you will find yourself in the middle of the stage... but on the bottom.

I always laugh when that happens. Luckily up B can ride the stage's angle.

 

[Shonoun]

Uh, in the game, he wasn't charging it up fully... Just for a second or two. I think.

 

[Darklink401]

Uh, in the game, he wasn't charging it up fully... Just for a second or two. I think.

He'd still get a boost, but the biggest boost comes from holding it all the way,

 

[EternalFlame]

Uh, in the game, he wasn't charging it up fully... Just for a second or two. I think.

The only other option if he didn't charge it is if he had a custom move on instead. But that should be impossible online unless it's with friends. So if he didn't charge it, then I have no idea xD

 

[Shaya]

Don't rely on this. It's obviously good on wifi/in lag, but the act of charging something for almost 2 seconds whilst not really moving is extremely easy to punish in offline play, don't let this become a habit.

 

[Darklink401]

Don't rely on this. It's obviously good on wifi/in lag, but the act of charging something for almost 2 seconds whilst not really moving is extremely easy to punish in offline play, don't let this become a habit.

When I'm blown off stage where the opponent couldnt punish me, and I wouldn't be able to recover otherwise, I would do this 100% of the time. The fact I can release it early and hit my opponent from a good range if they try to gimp me (since Marth's range got nerfed, but it IS still a sword) is a plus.

 

[Tattles]

Don't rely on this. It's obviously good on wifi/in lag, but the act of charging something for almost 2 seconds whilst not really moving is extremely easy to punish in offline play, don't let this become a habit.

The only time that this is ever useful, which is far, far off to a corner, you are practically untouchable by every character. I can't think of a character that could effectively kill or interrupt you during this.

 

[Darklink401]

The only time that this is ever useful, which is far, far off to a corner, you are practically untouchable by every character. I can't think of a character that could effectively kill or interrupt you during this.

And even if they could, you're charging a shieldbreaker.
It's a pretty neat attack.

 

[Shaya]

Sword wasn't nerfed. How many times must it be said until IT WORKS.

And yeah, far off corner recovering can be fine.
but you realise that the fully charged shieldbreaker is only 2 frames in duration for the hitbox; thus only hitting things JUST as you release the charge, and still has about a half second afterwards before you can act, and the distance you travel is the same at fully charged and you cannot vary it. It also doesn't hit above or below him and is transcended priority so any other attacks *hint: projectiles* don't have to fear it.
Think about it for a while and like this if/when you understand.

I had this same argument with new players on the Marth boards like a month ago. Gaaaah
Guess this is something I'll have to cover in a FAQ/Newb Guide when I get around to it.

 

[Darklink401]

Sword wasn't nerfed. How many times must it be said until IT WORKS.

And yeah, far off corner recovering can be fine.
but you realise that the fully charged shieldbreaker is only 2 frames in duration for the hitbox; thus only hitting things JUST as you release the charge, and still has about a half second afterwards before you can act, and the distance you travel is the same at fully charged and you cannot vary it. It also doesn't hit above or below him and is transcended priority so any other attacks *hint: projectiles* don't have to fear it.
Think about it for a while and like this if/when you understand.

I had this same argument with new players on the Marth boards like a month ago. Gaaaah
Guess this is something I'll have to cover in a FAQ/Newb Guide when I get around to it.

If the alternative is dying due to not reaching, I'll gladly do it. It'd be stupid not to. Cuz if you don't, you die.

You can claim that it's bad all you want, but the fact it's worked for me most times I've used it (unless I did it stupidly) is a hard fact from my experience in both Brawl and this game.

 

[Shaya]

If you have a mid air jump you can recover from just about anything/anywhere.
If you don't have one, then using your only option is valid, sure.

But you're silly to think it isn't extremely punishable. Perhaps I should scour through my 6 years of tournament videos with Marth and find the one or two instances where I actually use it, and die for trying, but that won't convince you, so I won't bother.

 

[Darklink401]

If you have a mid air jump you can recover from just about anything/anywhere.
If you don't have one, then using your only option is valid, sure.

But you're silly to think it isn't extremely punishable. Perhaps I should scour through my 6 years of tournament videos with Marth and find the one or two instances where I actually use it, and die for trying, but that won't convince you, so I won't bother.

That's what I'm talkin bout, sistah.

I'm not saying it's not punishable, as it is (since its hitbox isnt vertical at all)

But the entire base for me defending this is under the assumption that between death and that, I prefer that.

You have to actually make it so that you release it below the stage, then immediately upB to snap to the ledge. Because doing it to fly into the stage, while funny, is pretty easy to punish.


Marth needed recovery

They gave him recovery.

I'd take that over nothing any day.

 

[kj22]

All shaya is trying to say is don't use it predictably/as a last resort. In higher levels of play, you will get wrecked.

 

[Shonoun]

Thanks for the replies, this thread has been very informative to me. Seems like you guys know a lot about Marth, mind if you help me out with something real quick? Thanks.

 

[Darklink401]

All shaya is trying to say is don't use it predictably/as a last resort. In higher levels of play, you will get wrecked.

That much goes without saying.

 

[Tattles]

Yes, but specifically in Smash 4, the situational usefulness of it goes up a lot more, because the types of situations where you would use it happen a lot more often. Can't really use past game experience as all of your argument, no offense, as it's not really justifiable in a new game.

 

[kj22]

That much goes without saying.

Then what in the world are you too arguing about?

 

[Darklink401]

Then what in the world are you too arguing about?

About whether it should be used or not.

And my viewpoint is that I'd choose to use that well then to die if I had no 2nd jump.


But it goes without saying that its extremely punishable, even by the CPUs, if used willy-nilly.