***Major Update/Review Again*** Another OU RMT- Balance

[xxmoosexx]

Okay. So in the light of getting fed up with trying stall in gen 5. I wanted to abuse all the new offensive stuff in Gen 5 :D

I realize some of you don't like color. I took out all color so that it would please you and your bleak lives.

THE MEMBERS
_______________

Lead

Metagross@Occa Berry
Clear Body- Adamant(+Atk -SpAtk)
252HP/252Atk/6Spe
~Meteor Mash
~Bullet Punch
~Stealth Rock
~Earthquake

I figure since Explosion got such a huge nerf that Earthquake would provide good coverage. He allows me to use a second move on my Hippowdon. Also he provides an all-important dragon resistance.
_______________
Hippowdon@Leftovers
SandStream-Impish(+Def -SpAtk)
252HP/152Def/104SpDef
~Ice Fang
~Roar
~Earthquake
~Slack Off

Hippowdon serves as a good defensive fall back. He is also a check to Dory if he comes in at full health, the sandy hippo is able to take the +2 EQ and roar away. Since Metagross has Stealth Rock I can run Ice Fang. Not only does it hurt Gliscor but also hits Dory if he tries to setup on Hippowdon. He sets up sand for my Dory and Garchomp to abuse. Nothing really out of the ordinary.

_______________
Blissey@Leftovers(ShedShell?)
Natural Cure-Bold(+Def -Atk)
252HP/252Def/6Spe
~Wish
~Protect
~Seismic Toss
~Thunder Wave

Blissey does a good job at passing wishes and taking the special hits. She has stat synergy(as in taking special hits while hippowdon takes physical), with hippowdon. Blissey takes all those hits Hippowdon can't take. So far my team seems to be stall but truly it isn't. These two pokemon just create a good pitfall for when things go south.

__________________
Roopushin@Leftovers
Guts-Adamant(+Atk -Spatk)
128HP/252 Atk/128SpDef
~Bulk Up
~Drain Punch
~Mach Punch
~Stone Edge

Roopushin is great at causing problems. I generally throw him in against Nattorei or just about any other core on a team. I opt for Stone Edge over payback because the only ghosts he would be hitting with payback for a KO would be ghosts like Gengar. I just don't see the point for Payback unless you wanted to get that KO on Desukan at +3Atk when you will just be Hazed anyways. Stone Edge will kill Desukan eventually anyways. But I wouldn't understand why they'd even let you get any boosts if they had Desukan. So, in my opinion Payback is for a niche that rarely happens.

_________________
Garchomp@Choice Scarf
Sand Veil-Jolly(+Spe -SpAtk)
6HP/252Atk/252Spe
~Outrage
~Earthquake
~Fire Fang
~Dragon Claw

This is scarfchomp. He's great. Revenges all those pesky DD'ers and cleans up well. Sweeps. Softens up the other team. Fire Fang is to clean up a weakened Nattorei. Dragon Claw is there to revenge fairly weak pokemon in situations where I don't want to be locked into battle for 2-3 turns. Outrage is to pick off those bulkier pokemon and is a great option to sweep. He most notably comes in on Thunder Waves that I see so often nowadays.

__________________
Doryuuzu@Balloon
Sand Throw-Jolly(+Spe -SpAtk)
252Atk/6Def/252Spe
~Swords Dance
~Earthquake
~Rock Slide
~Brick Break

Doryuuzu is always a threat. One turn setup and he destroys hyper offense and stall. Instant rock polish. I use Brick Break mainly because I just don't use X scissor all that much. Brick Break also kills weakened Natt's when I can't get a swords dance.



Over the past few days I've come to a realization. Your core isn't supposed to be perfect. Yeah, this is pretty elementary. But I've been so obsessed with making perfect cores and blah blah blah. It doesn't matter in the metagame right now. Unless Im playing stall which allows me to have 6 slots instead of restraining myself to 2-3. So I created a pretty solid core in Blissey and Hippowdon with weaknesses that my offesnive pokemon check and/or setup on.

I haven't played offense very much. I really need some help setting up sweeps.

ScarfChomp and Dory are great together but they lose to a couple of walls. Mainly Steel types and Ground types.
So I'm looking for an answer to Roopushin, Steel/Ground walls, and a sure-fire way to sweep through a team.

Help D:

Ideas?

 

[Tenodera]

Teeny tiny nitpick: Nattorei should have a Sassy nature to give Gyro Ball more power. As for your Breloom weakness, I'm not quite sure what to do... Looks like a very solid team otherwise!

 

[mood4food77]

for breloom, have something like gyarados absorb the sleep, then send out latios

 

[xxmoosexx]

Doesn't matter which set it is. I usually end up having to sacrifice Gyarados and then clean it up with Latios. If he switches out then I have to sac Nattorei. If I don't think he will spore than I switch in Latios. If i think he will Mach Punch then I will switch in Rando. I tend to avoid switching in Dory. So after Natt and Gyara are gone and he gets a free switch in, not only will I be amazed, but I will either have to setup a sweep before he can switch in again OR sacrifice another pokemon (depends on the remaining enemy pokemon) to clean him up. Breloom is such a douche bag lol.

Um. I guess you missed it lol.

 

[Riddle]

Why sac Gyara? Its not like Breloom is doing anything to Latios

 

[Circa]

I actually agree with him. If Breloom knows you're RestTalk then he's not even going to bother Sporing you. Unless you mean that Breloom comes in on something else, like Nattorei. Then I guess I understand, but if that's the case then you can just double switch and save them both.

Interestingly enough, basically everything on your threats list is handled by certain things that people have tried on stall. Gliscor, for instance, doesn't give a **** about basically everything on your list (outside of maybe derpmon). Aerial Ace, EQ, Toxic, and Protect should work. Going with a BulkyDos w/ Bounce and Taunt over your current set does a good job of handling most of that list too, outside of Dory obv (and Breloom if he comes in on Nattorei). I remember Wave pointing out a long while back that there may be a bit of viability in using the one herb on him as well. You know, the one that lets you forgo the charge time. MIGHT be worth considering.

But chances are that either of those suggestions will leave other things open to wreck you. So ****.

 

[xxmoosexx]

I get what your saying. I guess switching in Latios immediately would be good.

TBH unless the Gliscor is packing some atk ev's or Acrobat and fling Bulk Up Roopushin can kill him. After 2-3 Bulk ups Drain Punch breaks Gliscor's substitutes in one hit. Roopushin can take Gliscor if he has a previous Bulk Up.


I might do a major overhaul with my core soon.

 

[UltiMario]

If you switch-in Latios immediately gets Spored and would die <.>

 

[Riddle]

Let Gyara take the spore and then switch in Latios is what I meant.

 

[Circa]

I get what your saying. I guess switching in Latios immediately would be good.

TBH unless the Gliscor is packing some atk ev's or Acrobat and fling Bulk Up Roopushin can kill him. After 2-3 Bulk ups Drain Punch breaks Gliscor's substitutes in one hit. Roopushin can take Gliscor if he has a previous Bulk Up.


I might do a major overhaul with my core soon.

Ew. Didn't know that. Roopushin's a douche. I knew there was a reason I never bothered to play this ****ty metagame.

If you switch-in Latios immediately gets Spored and would die <.>

Why would Breloom risk the chance of Sporing the RestTalker when he could hit it or nearly any switch-in really freaking hard with Bullet Seed instead? Maybe in a tournament match I could see it (I know I've gone total balls to the wall just to get the W before), but on the ladder where everyone just goes autopilot? Chances are kind of slim. Unless of course you or the team are just THAT predictable, in which case you deserve to lose anyway and you should just scrap the team.

EDIT: On second thought I could see it depending on how terrified they are of Shandera or something similar, but still.

 

[xxmoosexx]

Well in the metagame im playing Shandera isn't in there.

But the opponent rarely knows or even cares whether or not my Gyarados is a ResTalker.
Thats just how bad I and my opponents are.

Right now, Im really thinking about sporting a Skarm/Rotom-H/Gyarados. Natt is great and all. But IMO he's just another forry. Grass never did anything for Natt except give him notable resistances to water and electric IMO. That and Skarm can whirilwind away a +2 Dory. Gyara can roar Roopushin out. Rotom is a great steel check/special wall to cover Skarm's weaknesses to fire and electric.

 

[mood4food77]

natt and forry are different

natt is bulkier, is not a spinner, and is either a curser or a team support
forry spins and sets up spikes

they're different

 

[UltiMario]

Natt can set up Spikes too T.T

 

[xxmoosexx]

Well. That team is a complete load of ****.

MAJOR OVERHAUL UPDATE!

 

[Gates]

Why do you need Roopushin and Machamp?

Why aren't you running a second attack on Hippowdon to get rid of Doryuzu's Baloon?

 

[xxmoosexx]

Why would I try and pop his balloon when I can just roar him out? Although I will try it to see which is better. Ice Fang also does a number on Gliscor so...we will see.

Roopushin is an easy button. He comes in on any wall and gets a Bulk Up. He wreaks havoc and cracks open the other team. Roopushin also kills a weakened Dory. The only time Dory can come in is on my blissey when she isn't using Seismic Toss and Garchomp locked into EQ. Roopushin really helps with the offensive side. Although if there is a better pokemon that has better synergy with my offense that'd be great. I don't necessarily need him.


Machamp is a filler. I'd like a better pokemon in that slot. Im perfectly fine putting Hippowdon in the lead slot and letting there be a good support pokemon to hurt the other team or even aid my team's sweep. Suggestions are appreciated.



SO TL;DR---Roopushin kills weakened Dory's. Otherwise I don't need him.

Machamp is not needed at all. His perks aren't necessary and is just another annoying fighting type with Dynamic Punch.

Suggestions would be kindly appreciated.

 

[Gates]

Why would I try and pop his balloon when I can just roar him out?

So that he doesn't just come back later to set up and sweep? What do you do when Roopushin is dead and you can't take care of Dory with Roar because he's the last poke on your opponent's team? PP stall him?

Roopushin is an easy button. He comes in on any wall and gets a Bulk Up. He wreaks havoc and cracks open the other team. Roopushin also kills a weakened Dory. The only time Dory can come in is on my blissey when she isn't using Seismic Toss and Garchomp locked into EQ. Roopushin really helps with the offensive side. Although if there is a better pokemon that has better synergy with my offense that'd be great.

If you want an easy button, use Ditto. He's the ultimate easy button.

By running two fighting types you're needlessly weakening your team to psychic and flying, both of which are more popular these days than previously (psychic because of Lati@s and Psycho Break, flying because of Shaymin-S). There's also the issue of TrickChoice users locking your fighting types into a fighting move and opening up for Shandera to come in and sweep.

Machamp is a filler. I'd like a better pokemon in that slot. Im perfectly fine putting Hippowdon in the lead slot and letting there be a good support pokemon to hurt the other team or even aid my team's sweep. Suggestions are appreciated.

You could run a lead PccaGross and take Stealth Rock off Hippowdon. It still works pretty well and survives every fire attack besides Overheat is EV'd right.

 

[UltiMario]

If you want an easy button, use Ditto. He's the ultimate easy button.

I'm sorry, but Ditto is terrible, never use him.

If you mean Eccentric Ditto, then don't suggest Pokemon that don't exist, seeing as this appears to be a Wifi team.

 

[xxmoosexx]

Well. I use this team everywhere. Ditto is a possibility. I just don't have problems with Shandera right now cause' no one uses the one that troll on normal and fighting types.

I've ran into a couple Sub/CM/Flamethrower/Shadow Ball sets and they usually takes out a poke if it comes in on Blissey.

Ditto is a good easy button. But not the easy button I want. I want the button that says "Dismantle enemy core here". Ditto doesn't really do that other than a certain few situations. Unless you know of others.

And i think its quite obvious that he implied Eccentric Ditto. In which case I could care less whether this team was Wifi or not.

OccaGross is great and all. But what would he give to my team other than just setting up rocks so I could run a second move on Hippowdon?

Let me think: What would really help this team? Status, Hax, Screens, another tank to ease hits off of Hippowdon and Bliss. If you guys think of anything that would really help just post.

Porygon2. Sableye. Dual Screen Rachi. TrickScarf Lead Rachi. paraflinch Jirachi.

Hmmm....


Is OccaGross all you guys have to offer? ):

 

[Gates]

I'M ULTI AND I WANT ATTENTION AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH OH MY GOD I LOVE SUCKING ***** SO MUCH

Ulti, Eccentric is the only ability Ditto has. Just like how Speed Boost is the only ability Blaziken has and Shadow Tag is the only ability Shandera has.

OccaGross is great and all. But what would he give to my team other than just setting up rocks so I could run a second move on Hippowdon?

Not much, but at least more than Machamp. OccaGross hits extremely hard and has priority like Machamp but he also has better typing, is immune to Intimidate, and has better defensive synergy with your whole team overall. 4* Psychic resistance is really important if you have Roopushin up against Lati@s, Rankurusu, Espeon, or any other powerful psychic type.

Let me think: What would really help this team? Screens

LMFAO.
Sorry, but Screens are only good on pokemon who try to wall but don't have access to WoW to his physical attackers so they use Reflect instead. Pokemon like Lugia and Latias can use this strategy effectively. Using a dedicated Dual Screener is rarely good since anything that can do that can run a better set instead.

Everything else you said probably would help your team though.

Porygon2. Sableye. Dual Screen Rachi. TrickScarf Lead Rachi. paraflinch Jirachi.

TrickScarf Jirachi is the only one of those that could work as a lead and it could actually work pretty decently. A set with Ice Punch to take care of Michevious Heart leads who try to Taunt you would be good.

Parahax Jirachi and Porygon2 could both be good, but not as leads for obvious reasons. Porygon2 does open up your team to a double fighting weakness though.

Sableye could work but I wouldn't bet too much on it.

Dual Screen Jirachi will probably help you the least out of everything you mentioned.

Is OccaGross all you guys have to offer? ):

No.

Frankly, I think you should just drop Blissey for a good special attacker and run an all offensive team. Those types of teams are a lot better in Gen V than Stall or mixed teams.

Oh, and what's the spread on your Blissey anyway?

 

[xxmoosexx]

Not much, but at least more than Machamp. OccaGross hits extremely hard and has priority like Machamp but he also has better typing, is immune to Intimidate, and has better defensive synergy with your whole team overall. 4* Psychic resistance is really important if you have Roopushin up against Lati@s, Rankurusu, Espeon, or any other powerful psychic type.

Wow. I completely forgot about how good Metagross was against Lati@s. I read all about when I read the summaries on smogon and it just completely left my mind.

LMFAO.
Sorry, but Screens are only good on pokemon who try to wall but don't have access to WoW to his physical attackers so they use Reflect instead. Pokemon like Lugia and Latias can use this strategy effectively. Using a dedicated Dual Screener is rarely good since anything that can do that can run a better set instead.

You don't have to make me sound like an idiot D*: nah, im just messing. I guess it was a pretty stupid idea.

TrickScarf Jirachi is the only one of those that could work as a lead and it could actually work pretty decently. A set with Ice Punch to take care of Michevious Heart leads who try to Taunt you would be good.

Parahax Jirachi and Porygon2 could both be good, but not as leads for obvious reasons. Porygon2 does open up your team to a double fighting weakness though.

Sableye could work but I wouldn't bet too much on it.

Dual Screen Jirachi will probably help you the least out of everything you mentioned.

I think I will opt for OccaGross as a lead and run a second move on Hippowdon.(Ice Fang)

No.

Frankly, I think you should just drop Blissey for a good special attacker and run an all offensive team. Those types of teams are a lot better in Gen V than Stall or mixed teams.

Oh, and what's the spread on your Blissey anyway?

I will try out your offensive suggestion. You are probably right. Any good special attackers you have in mind other than ScarfLati@s or CMLati@s?

Woops. I'm not looking at the OP right now but lol, did not realize I didn't post her spread.

Its the basic 252HP/252Def/6Spe, the 6Spe is for other blisseys. When it comes to seismic toss battle it's awesome. She really doesn't need any SpDef EV's because she won't be taking Uber hits, if that's what your thinking.

 

[Gates]

I will try out your offensive suggestion. You are probably right. Any good special attackers you have in mind other than ScarfLati@s or CMLati@s?

Specs Lati@s.



But seriously...

For Standard OU you could run a lot of things, but you need something with access to a fire attack. I honestly can't think of anything specific though. Heatran would just make you more weak to Roopushin and Breloom.

For DW OU, Shandera is the baseline. For this team I'd recommend ScarfShandera because it takes more effort than people think to run SubCMShandera.

And in either you could always just run Darkrai or Shaymin-S until they're banned.

Its the basic 252HP/252Def/6Spe, the 6Spe is for other blisseys. When it comes to seismic toss battle it's awesome. She really doesn't need any SpDef EV's because she won't be taking Uber hits, if that's what your thinking.

Yeah, I figured as much. I just wanted to know if you were running any SpD EVs.

Assuming you do want to keep this guy, if you're running this set, you might as well just run evo stone Chansey. Evo Stone Chansey has 10 less HP and 9 less Spe but gains 50 more Def and a lot more SpD. Running Bold 252 HP/212 Def/44 Spe gives you the same speed stat and it still has higher Def even though it's not maxed out. Timid 252 HP/252 Def/0 Spe accomplishes the same thing and is actually more efficient since it'll put your Chansey's speed at least 2 points above the one your currently running.

 

[xxmoosexx]

I prefer Blissey over Chansey in a sandstorm. That's just the way I like my special defensive *****s. ....that's the way uuhhuuhh uuhhuuhh i like it uhhuuhh uuhhuuhh....

And lol. I actually see people use Specs Lati@s.

Hmmm...

ScarfDera would be pretty useful I guess. Argety. If Latios got a legitimate fire move I'd be ecstatic.

So why do YOU think I need a fire move? I have my own opinions as to why I think my team needs it but I want to hear it from you.

And what does ScarfDera being harder to use than SubCMDera have to do with recommending him for my team lol?

 

[Gates]

You need a fire attack because your only ways of dealing with Scizor and Forry is Garchomp Fire Fang, which doesn't do much since it's physical. There's also Nattorei, and while you do have Roopushin, he doesn't like taking 12% from Iron Barbs, 12% from Leech Seed, 12% from Rugged Helmet, and 6% from Sandstorm all in the same turn while Nattorei doesn't even have to attack. Depending on how they EV Natto, Drain Punch might not even 2HKO. A special attacker with a fire move (even if it's just HP Fire) will remedy this quite a bit.

And you got it the other way around - CMShandera is harder to use than ScarfShandera. CM Shandera is greatly assisted by TrickScarf users, paralysis support, etc. since the best time to send him in is on a choiced Normal/Fighting/resisted/entry hazard move and his speed is quite low. You don't have any of the aforementioned things on your team, so the CM build is going to be a lot harder for you to set up. ScarfShandera, on the other hand, is just a normal revenge killer. He doesn't need anything special to help him sweep because he's not designed to sweep. He's designed to go in there, Overheat, and then switch out. Nothing more.

 

[xxmoosexx]

K. I didn't think about Forry as a problem. Scizor was but I usually would throw roopushin in against him.


Thanks for your help Gates.

 

[mood4food77]

roopushin doesn't do that great against scizor, especially when statused

fire moves are necessary unless in the rain, in which any pokemon's hydro pump will deal a **** ton of damage

also, why ice fang over stone edge on hippo? ice fang is a really bad move, the only pokes you hit significantly harder with it are garchomp, dory, and flygon (that matter) and hippo already does a good job against them anyways and flygon isn't that hard to take down (he just runs away a lot, delaying your chance)

 

[xxmoosexx]

I opt for Ice Fang because of how many Dragons are running around and Gliscors love to switch in on Hippowdon for some reason. Lati@s loves to switch in on Hippowdon and I've seen a couple Flying types come in. Such as Togekiss, Shinpora, and sometimes a Zapdos.

My Roopushin has Guts on it. Im paranoid that I will get status'd and I run Guts just to troll people.

Honestly my team has gone down hill with Blissey gone. My team just doesn't have that great fall back that she provides. Im putting her back on.

So it looks like I need a fire move/special attacker and something that can kill Roopushin. Start brainstorming guys!

Honestly, I've been having a hard time killing anything with Doryuuzu believe it or not.

 

[mood4food77]

you do realize that you beat like 90% of all people cause you're running chomp and dory in SS?

you could throw 2 other pokes in there and this team would still win cause of how retardedly good they are

to make this better, you don't need blissey or metagross at all, make hippo your lead, use heatran on a balloon, and then just put something else in there

seriously, making a SS team with dory and garchomp is stupid easy and boring, you beat everything

 

[xxmoosexx]

Yeah I do realize.

But I suck at pokemon. I need training wheels.
Offense in particularly i suck at. Let me put this into perspective for you.

I have a hard time setting up with my dory.

 

[mood4food77]

you come in on something that can't 2HKO dory, like blissey, then set up SD, then proceed to sweep