ly consider shiek as luigi's worst match up?

[Blea Gelo]

Im asking this guys, to see things from another shoes insted of mines, because here in Venezuela, thers a really really really goo sheik, but i dont know like, it doesn't looks like if sheiks were the worst luigi's match up. Luigi has a great recovery, and can neutral shiek, throw up to Fair, in low percentages dsmash so utilt if its fast..

there are petty good things a luigi can do vs a sheik

 

[Grunt]

I don't know if there is any specific Luigi matchup thingy around here, but i always found Marth to be harder.
both are a pain in the *** though.

 

[KirbyKaze]

needles shut luigi down really hard. she also has more priority and can play a game that forces you to attack into her better range, platform game, and take advantage of your awful aerial mobility. n-airing sheik out of combos only happens when the sheik is dumb and goes for combos that won't work.

marth is gay, though, let nobody tell you otherwise.

 

[Winston]

needles shut luigi down really hard. she also has more priority and can play a game that forces you to attack into her better range, platform game, and take advantage of your awful aerial mobility. n-airing sheik out of combos only happens when the sheik is dumb and goes for combos that won't work.

marth is gay, though, let nobody tell you otherwise.

Agreed. A sheik who plays smart really is quite a bad matchup for luigi.

However, I still think marth is worse, considering he can do everything sheik does to you, plus marth-style gayness.

 

[RaynEX]

Luigi has a great recovery

Never say that again. Besides being helplessly predictable and linear, it can be beaten by any well-timed attack. Luigi's recovery leaves much to be desired, to say the least.

 

[GodheadsLamentX]

Sheik is beatable. Grab combos and spaced Ftilts do wonders. Nair is the combo breaker (complimented with good DI)

Marth, I feel would be the most problematic matchup. He can gimp and set up ken combos easily.

 

[otg]

Marth and Sheik are definitely his worst matchups, but Sheik more so because how much she outmanuevers and overpowers him in the air. Luigi is dumb slow in the air, and a smart campy Sheik will make it so that:

A.) she never gets grabbed, thus ending luigi's combo game
B.) Not even bother trying to combo out of grabs because Luigi will almost always break out with Nair
C.) destroy his recovery with Needles, Nair or Bair.

Pretty much like Godsheadxlament said, Luigi can try and outspace with Ftilt, but so many of Sheik's other moves out prioritize and outreach him.

 

[Blea Gelo]

yeah yeah i understand all of your ponts.. But a good sweetspotted Fowad Smash its the end of luigi.. think that when u r playing a shiek, u just cant jump much.. Do thers no oportunity fo her to Fair, and make jabs its pretty good, i mean the thee jabs but not so fast, is petty good because they take shield out and u can grab later..

 

[KirbyKaze]

sheik platform game + needles > luigi

it's ****. it's wonderfully difficult to break.

also luigi's nair is great but seriously who goes for more than d-throw aerial against luigi. you can't tilt combo him really because of his cc and low hitstun anyways so i don't know what combos you're combo breaking.

marth is gay because he can just do big sweeping hitboxes that ignore your nair combo breakers but the flipside is that you can waveshield camp him and actually defend whereas with sheik she has the option to constantly force you to attack her (which means attacking into her superior range and, on some moves, priority).

i get that marth's gimping game seems awful and like it could make it worse but a smart sheik will gimp just as hard and wreck just as many recoveries. and because of the needles she doesn't even have to worry about random misfires messing up timings. it's awful.

 

[Ace83]

best stage against sheik for luigi?

 

[otg]

best stage against sheik for luigi?

FD maybe? Out of the neutral levels, Sheik would probably do better on Yoshi's, battlefield, and FoD (maybe certain transformations within Pokestadium). Dreamland's platforms are a little too high for Sheik to TRULY abuse you on them, plus your recovery might be a little better there.

I'd say Dreamland or FD.

 

[KirbyKaze]

FD maybe? Out of the neutral levels, Sheik would probably do better on Yoshi's, battlefield, and FoD (maybe certain transformations within Pokestadium). Dreamland's platforms are a little too high for Sheik to TRULY abuse you on them, plus your recovery might be a little better there.

I'd say Dreamland or FD.

all neutrals are awful except pokemon stadium and final destination where it's bad but less horrific

dreamland, fod, yoshi's, and battlefield give her that magic top platform and dl also gives her space to control which sucks. basically the 3 platform stages suck because she can use the top platform to retreat while avoiding going to the ground, where you do better, and play completely to her strengths, which you don't want.

stadium is actually really good on neutral part imho because there's no top platform for her to retreat to so she has to actually go on the ground where she's somewhat open but not really but it's something. transformations suck but whatever just waveshield camp and retreat and do stuff until it goes back to neutral.

fd is good for luigi in general.

 

[otg]

But don't you think that the fact that platforms are bigger and higher up kind of take away from Sheik's advantages? She can't react/punish nearly as fast as opposed to other platform levels, plus the fact that it's so huge will keep Luigi alive for longer, while Sheik's recovery is exploited on any stage.

Hmmm, good point on the space control though. ****, Luigi's hardest fight indeed lol.

 

[KirbyKaze]

big stage makes it brutal to make her get off the stage and high ceiling takes away your ko power on d-smashes and nair and luigi's random crap.

it's not so much the punishment on dl64 that makes it gay it's that she controls space better there than on any other level against him. and there's less reward for hitting her if she manuevers the fighting to the middle of the stage. it's like... you can't knock her off far enough to even force her to up+b until past 100. it's gay.

moreover, the whole "living for a while" thing doesn't really apply to luigi much. he's dead vs sheik anytime he's off the level the needles and fair/bair/nair and other crap pretty much secure his death.

sheik's gay.

 

[otg]

big stage makes it brutal to make her get off the stage and high ceiling takes away your ko power on d-smashes and nair and luigi's random crap.

it's not so much the punishment on dl64 that makes it gay it's that she controls space better there than on any other level against him. and there's less reward for hitting her if she manuevers the fighting to the middle of the stage. it's like... you can't knock her off far enough to even force her to up+b until past 100. it's gay.

moreover, the whole "living for a while" thing doesn't really apply to luigi much. he's dead vs sheik anytime he's off the level the needles and fair/bair/nair and other crap pretty much secure his death.

sheik's gay.

Ahhh, makes sense. I gotcha.