Luigi MU Chart (Now Discussing: Snake)

[Muhti]

Hey guys, this is going to be a place where we can discuss Luigis's MU's against other characters, and how he does now in 2.5 compared to 2.1 Luigi,to see if any MU's changed, if the changes Luigi obtained changed how some MU's are played, I'll start by listing a few MU's that we can discuss and hopefully solidy for referencing.

Luigi Vs Wario -

Luigi Vs Mario -

Luigi Vs Luigi - 50/50

Luigi Vs Bowser -

Luigi Vs Peach -

Luigi Vs Donkey Kong -

Luigi Vs Diddy Kong -

Luigi Vs Captain Falcon -

Luigi Vs Ganondorf -

Luigi Vs Wolf -

Luigi Vs Fox -

Luigi Vs Falco -

Luigi Vs Zero Suit Samus -

Luigi Vs Zelda -

Luigi Vs Shiek -

Luigi Vs Link -

Luigi Vs Toon Link -

Luigi Vs Lucario -

Luigi Vs Pikachu -

Luigi Vs Jigglypuff -

Luigi Vs Squirtle -

Luigi Vs Ivysaur -

Luigi Vs Charizard -

Luigi Vs Pit -

Luigi Vs Marth -

Luigi Vs Ike -

Luigi Vs Lucas -

Luigi Vs Ness -

Luigi Vs DeDeDe -

Luigi Vs R.O.B -

Luigi Vs G&W -

Luigi Vs Snake -

Luigi Vs Sonic -

Feel free to add your opinions on Luigi's MU's, and bring any topic up for discussion.

Copy and pasted from the Pits MU Thread since Im too lazy

 

[Muhti]

-reserved-

 

[trash?]

Like mentioned in the general thread: Luigi v Snake is goofy as hell in snake's favor. Snake can just Side-b to edgeguard, and luigi's recovery is predictable enough where it's hard to get around it.

 

[BluEG]

Learn to sweet spot your Luigi side b and snakes edgeguarding is meh. My toughest Part of that matchup is mines limiting wavedash movement.

Honestly though, snake is easy, if you pop him up in the air he's easy to combo and hardly a threat. Use a lot of u-tilt in this one

Seriously though, sweet spotting Luigi missile is crucial for recovery.

 

[ELI-mination]

Learn to sweet spot your Luigi side b and snakes edgeguarding is meh. My toughest Part of that matchup is mines limiting wavedash movement.

Honestly though, snake is easy, if you pop him up in the air he's easy to combo and hardly a threat. Use a lot of u-tilt in this one

Seriously though, sweet spotting Luigi missile is crucial for recovery.

I very strongly disagree about mines being any kind of a problem. You just have to shield when wavedashing near a mine and the mine will explode on your shield, harming nothing.

Also, yea, you can pop him up in the air and combo him, but he can also spam up-b in the process, so you have to be precise.

Sweet spotting Luigi's side-b is indeed one of Luigi's few tricky recovery options, but if there's a Nikita missile waiting near the ledge, good luck.

The best thing to do against a campy Nikita firing Snake player with Luigi is to throw out fireballs until you screw their camping ways up enough to be able to get close with a quick wavedash approach. Then when you get in you can do your combos. But every single time Nikita hits your shield, you will slide very far away and out of range. Also, Luigi's side-b offstage is extremely easy to predict and Snake players can easily telegraph it with Nikita or F-air.

I'd say this matchup is slightly in Snake's favor.

 

[DBSammy]

Learn to sweet spot your Luigi side b and snakes edgeguarding is meh. My toughest Part of that matchup is mines limiting wavedash movement.

Honestly though, snake is easy, if you pop him up in the air he's easy to combo and hardly a threat. Use a lot of u-tilt in this one

Seriously though, sweet spotting Luigi missile is crucial for recovery.

Mines as in the down-b or down smash? If down smash you could do what Eli said and wd-shield or just fireball them. Yeah, I'd agree with Eli with the MU with Snake's advantage. I'd say around 55-45/60-40 Snake.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

I agree with Eli and above. Main issue is the Nikita. 55-45 Snake. It can be done though. Once Luigi gets in, GL to snake.

On a random note, my least favorite matchup is Sonic still (just like 2.1, but a bit easier now)

 

[DBSammy]

You know, I suppose we start back up MU discussion again.
IMO we should start with the obviously good characters.

 

[pokemongeof]

My opinions:

Marth-Luigi 70/30
Falco-Luigi 65/35
Mario-Luigi 55/45
DK-Luigi 40/60 (luigi's favor)

 

[Squartle]

Luigi's pretty great against big characters in general. Their hurtboxes are really easy to nail with a misfire or a sweetspotted B-up. DK is the easiest of the heavies, IMO. Bowser presents a bigger threat with his armor frames, but overall I think that MU's pretty even. DDD might be the worst because of how easily he can grab punish and gimp Luigi's recovery into oblivion. Also, jet hammer is pretty **** against WD approaches.

 

[Paz]

What is Luigi's best course of action in matchups against characters with large disjointed hitboxes? (All the sword wielders and DDD) Baiting attacks with WD's and having them commit seems like the best option but it is still quite difficult, especially against Ike who is just so punishing.

 

[awesome13579]

The thing is that Luigi Tornado clashes with nearly everything, and it comes out fast. With that in mind, he can stop many projectiles, such as Sheik's needles. The Tornado is also really good for approaching/combos, and it can be acted out of really fast with aerials to punish people who try to punish it.
When versing Snake, Luigi has it tough, I'd say about 35/65. I don't know how the Tornado does against Snake's missiles, but his other projectiles will explode on him, and his pressure can be canceled if Snake is shielding with a grenade drop. In addition, Snake's Up B is frame one, so he can easily escape Luigi's pressure, which is usually from aerials. However, Snake is combo'd easily, so once Luigi gets in, it could be at least 60 percent dealt, or even death.

 

[Viceversa96]

My opinions:

Marth-Luigi 70/30
Falco-Luigi 65/35
Mario-Luigi 55/45
DK-Luigi 40/60 (luigi's favor)

I think Mario-Luigi is 60-40 Mario's favor. Mario's nB is better and limits movement. Mario can cape Luigi's nB. Mario can edgeguard Luigi easily with cape, bair, and fair during side b's aerial lag. Mario has better kill setups. Luigi can combo Mario well though and edgeguard Mario good too but that's about it.

 

[WINK ;)]

I agree with Eli and above. Main issue is the Nikita. 55-45 Snake. It can be done though. Once Luigi gets in, GL to snake.

On a random note, my least favorite matchup is Sonic still (just like 2.1, but a bit easier now)

Lets be honest here, is Sonic really a threat?

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

Lets be honest here, is Sonic really a threat?

Janurary 14th, 2013 was my post. As in, this wasn't the newest version of Project M without a broken sonic.

Back then, this was the old Sonic. AKA, i faced Wizzrobe. AKA, I got decimated like every other Luigi.

I honestly think the worst matchup currently for me is King D3 and maybe zelda, both out spaces mad hard.

Keyword, both for me (though I do think Zelda is really difficult and G-Reg/Fly show that King D3 is really hard also.

 

[Fortress]

With that in mind, he can stop many projectiles, such as Sheik's needles.

Are we talking a single needle, which is pretty believable, or a larger amount of them thrown at once?

 

[DBSammy]

Are we talking a single needle, which is pretty believable, or a larger amount of them thrown at once?

I would think it's just one needle.

Lets be honest here, is Sonic really a threat?

Yeah, Sonic is a threat. The update from 2.6 to 3.0 made him a very solid character. IMO the matchup is slightly in Sonic's favor.

 

[Fortress]

I was going to say, pretty sure that Sheik's needles can shut out Weegee's down-special.

 

[Cubelarooso]

I don't have much experience playing against Snake mains, but from what I've gleaned in friendlies against non-Snake mains playing Snake, he can be a very dangerous opponent. Snake wants to keep opponents on the ground, as that's where a lot of his strength lies. Since the ground is also where Luigi's mobility is, you might have to change up your style a bit in this matchup. More jumps, more fireballs, more stationary.

First are his bombs. Grenades and mines can limit your movement, but aren't too much of a threat. Fireballs take out mines, and with proper timing they can stop a grenade right after Snakes throws it, possibly to blow in his face. On the other hand, shoot it too late and the opposite will happen, and fireball's endlag means you're much less likely to escape face-blowing. Luckily, Snake can't make much out of a successful 'nade. AGTing might also be effective, but I haven't experimented.

Next ground-threat is Snake's grab. Don't get grabbed. Don't do it. Up-throw C4-stick is easy to land, and Up-throw C4-detonate kills early with no chance of escape.

Last is the tranquilizer. If you're WDing in and he shoots you, you'll carhop right into him. This can take him by surprise the first time, but he'll also see just how convenient it is. It can also work the other way if you're sliding away at the time, but that's not as likely and still not safe. Better options when you see or expect it are to shield (which leaves the danger of grab), jump (which halts your progress), or ftilt (generally safest option).

Not sure I'd say it's a bad matchup, though. Luigi can use his speed to get in before Snake sets up, which makes him completely vulnerable. He can't do much to escape besides blow himself up, but Luigi can get out and back in fast enough that proper prediction renders that useless. He's also very easy to edgeguard, and is a big, slow target for misfires.

 

[Cubelarooso]

Haven’t really cracked the Mr. Game and Watch matchup yet, but I play against one regularly and have learned some stuff I think. Haven’t found a good way to approach him when he’s in the air: his aerials are all pretty strong and long-ranged, and he doesn’t seem as vulnerable diagonally as he looks. Mostly I think it’s better to bait out a dair or fair and punish after he lands and dtilts. Wait for the dtilt, expect it until he starts grabbing.

Beware of dtilt in general. CC dtilt is a menace, and it wrecks butts at the ledge. It’s long-ranged and has good follow-ups. Getting popped up by dtilt, dair’s landing, throws, etc. is bad. G&W can use his range and Up-B to chase quite effectively, which can be dangerous with low ceilings.

Don’t get confused by Up-B. It always seems to go a bit higher and hit a bit longer and wider than I expect. You also need to keep track of his jump or you will get a fun surprise after Up-B. If you’re not sure, assume he has it. Being able to attack after Up-B also isn’t as great while recovering as you’d think. The length of his aerials can keep him from using them if he can only reach the ledge, and the lack of ground negates his follow ups. On the other hand, the chop is very strong, so it’s worth going for.

Oil Panic is also less significant than it might seem. He can’t always go for it, he can’t always react quickly enough to go for it, it’s often a bad idea when he can go for it, and a single drop isn’t much better than his normals, anyway. He’s also left open after bucketing unless he immediately spills it, in which case you needn’t worry about it building up. Overall, it hasn’t changed my Fireball game much, and I don’t feel pressured to change it more.

This isn’t much of a matchup analysis, I suppose, just a list of insights I’ve had for facing the G&W I face. Putting it all into words has actually alerted me of some things that I need to pay more attention to, so… uhh… thanks for that. I know G&W’s vertical combos seem long, but I haven’t paid attention to how much they do, and thus how much of a threat they truly are. I haven’t noted how exactly he’s getting most of his kills. I haven’t really tried bair against aerial G&W. No clue what to do with stages.

Umm… I don’t really feel very advantaged or disadvantaged, so Imma say the matchup’s even.

 

[Krusty Kid]

How do you guys feel about the Ganon matchup?

 

[DBSammy]

That's a MU I heavily dislike. He's heavy, we're light. He outranges us and he hits like a goddamn tank. Honestly, I don't know the MU too much, but I feel that if we don't play it in a more methodical way, we get bopped really easily. Stick and run. Go in, deal some damage amd get out. Don't try to overextend, or you'll get ran over.

 

[SuperNova!]

How do you guys feel about the Ganon matchup?

Based on my experience, I'd say it's in Luigi's favor. Fireballs and down-b can stop Ganondorf's side, down, and neutral b moves before they can do any damage. This gives you an opportunity to get close and deal some damage. Luigi can easily outmaneuver him both in the air and on the ground. Ganon can be a little intimidating when you're trying to get back on stage, though.

 

[Cubelarooso]

My experience is very different. Wizard Foot cuts through pretty much anything, and Flame Choke "grab armors" stuff fairly often. It's much better to stay distant and alert, ready to WD out of range and punish the considerable endlag. Pelting with Fireballs can be done if you're completely out of range, though.
The air is nearly the worst place you can be. He can greatly out-maneuver and out-range Luigi aerially, and just one fair or bair can change the tides. The worst place, though, is being under him and vulnerable, because if dair doesn't kill, the followup should. On that note, remember that Luigi can sweetspot the ledge from fairly far away, to preserve brainmeats.
With Dorf's strength, Luigi's floatiness can't be relied on to dampen punishes, so you must play much safer than other matchups. However, he himself can't do much once Luigi gets started. Hence, I wouldn't say it's an unfavorable matchup.
Some last advice: Learn the Ganon's Side-B habits (I've played many, and they're all different in if/when they use it and how they follow up), and be careful going out to edgeguard (fair is still ridiculous, remember to tech Up-B stagespikes, and nothing's more embarrassing than getting Ganoncided).

 

[Broasty]

Dat Zelda matchup sucks. Seriously, has anyone else experience this hell?

Your only approach is basically WD->shield grab or f-tilt....except Zelda can play fireballs on the ground and f-up your WDs. Off ledge, Fireballs stop rolling and any get up except attack get up, but WAIT, no matter your choice, Zelda can react with Neutral B or U-Smash.

Seriously, I've never see such a horrible matchup for Weegee.

 

[Cubelarooso]

I don't have too much Zelda experience. Particularly, not enough to learn how to get through Dins.
I do know that the second half of Nayru's is vulnerable despite crystals still being visible. You'll want to learn the heels' spacing; she can really surprise you with it, and Luigi's an easy target. Be wary of Farore's fire hitbox, I know I love using it when I play Zelda; it turns the tide quite well, but she risks appearing right over a nair .
Not sure I'd say she's the worst, but definitely one of them, and it's notably easy on her side. Luigi can get going on her though, and she's easy to edgeguard if you fireball and follow to hit her if she Nayru's, and keep within edgehogging range since Farore's landlag is punishable.

 

[ThegreatVaporeon1]

Luigi/Samus: 45/55...luigis movement get stopped by samus' ledge canceled missles and zair. Plus she's a floaty so she's harder to combo.

Luigi/Zelda: 35/65...pretty similar reasons to samus where dins halts luigis movement options. Nayru can be annoying, and her non sdi able usmash can kill luigi early. Not to mention she has an easy edgdguard
against luigi.

Luigi/D3: 40/60....luigi can combo d3 but d3s disjoints can make it hard for luigi to approach, plus d3 has many options to easily gimp luigis recovery.

Luigi/Sheik: 40/60..needles..do i need to say more

As for Luigi/Snake, I think it's about even. Snake can throw projectiles to throw luigi off, but luigi has a combo game on snake, not to mention his fireball stops snakes down smash.

 

[Hyper Crasher]

Matchups in my opinion
This is in no particular order
[-2]

[-1]

[0]

[+1]

[+2]

Characters that aren't listed are matchups I haven't fought yet, so I'm not too certain on how the matchup goes
From my experience, it doesn't seem like there are any matchups that are near unwinnable but does have some really hard matchups.

 

[ThegreatVaporeon1]

So it just me, or does Kirby's down throw completely destroy Luigi? I know floaties in general suffer Kirby's down throw, but is there any way to avoid the follow up? I always get ftilted or upsmashed even though I di up and away from the down throw.

 

[Cubelarooso]

Yeah, it's terrible. My best advice is to DI down and in front of him, the goal being to tech ASAP. It looks like he can still get a guaranteed follow-up on reaction, but the Kirby I play against never could, so I'm not sure. Still, going for the tech is pretty much always the best option.
As a fellow Luigi whose main sparring partner has been a Kirby, know that I feel your anguish in this matchup.

 

[Scaremonger]

Matchups in my opinion
This is in no particular order
[-2]

[-1]

[0]

[+1]

[+2]

Characters that aren't listed are matchups I haven't fought yet, so I'm not too certain on how the matchup goes
From my experience, it doesn't seem like there are any matchups that are near unwinnable but does have some really hard matchups.

Do you actually think Luigi beats Ganon and Dedede? Also, Luigi annihilates Yoshi. I don't think Fox and Falco are -2 either.

 

[Hyper Crasher]

Do you actually think Luigi beats Ganon and Dedede? Also, Luigi annihilates Yoshi. I don't think Fox and Falco are -2 either.

I made that off of experiences, I've beaten most of the Ganons and D3s I've fought. I've only faced one Yoshi and I may be a little ignorant of the matchup so that may be a factor, and for the spacies, it feels like they still beat Luigi pretty hard, but they aren't as bad as they were in Melee, it's probably something like a 65:35 now that I think more about it.

 

[Scaremonger]

I made that off of experiences, I've beaten most of the Ganons and D3s I've fought. I've only faced one Yoshi and I may be a little ignorant of the matchup so that may be a factor, and for the spacies, it feels like they still beat Luigi pretty hard, but they aren't as bad as they were in Melee, it's probably something like a 65:35 now that I think more about it.

Assuming you're a luigi main in melee, have you ever actually fought a good Ganon main in that game?

And yeah, luigi obviously doesn't win or go even with spacies, but I wouldn't put them in the same range of bad as Marth.

and as for Yoshi, he just has no answer for Luigi's nair. That move just completely ****s Yoshi up, to put it bluntly. That, along with his difficulty edgeguarding luigi, his inability to combo luigi, and luigi's crazy wavedash make the matchup really unfavorable for Yoshi. I only know about the melee mu, but I doubt it's changed much between games.

 

[Hyper Crasher]

Assuming you're a luigi main in melee, have you ever actually fought a good Ganon main in that game?

And yeah, luigi obviously doesn't win or go even with spacies, but I wouldn't put them in the same range of bad as Marth.

There are like two in my state and I've only faced one, it doesn't seem that bad so I always assumed it was in Luigi's favor. Normally I just keep moving, taking advantage of the fact that Luigi can combo Ganon pretty hard.

 

[Scaremonger]

Normally I just keep moving, taking advantage of the fact that Luigi can combo Ganon pretty hard.

...Well yeah, in Melee Kirby can combo Ganon pretty well too, lol. Ganon is combo food, I don't really think that's a valid reason to say who wins the matchup. It's like saying X vs Falcon is in X's favor because X edgeguards Falcon for free. Yeah, everyone does, lol. Ganon is really good against floaties in general because his strength just sort of nullifies the advantage of floatiness, which is the resistance to comboing. He only needs to hit you like 3 times and you're pretty much done. And luigi's recovery vs Ganon's edgeguarding is kind of hilarious.

 

[Hyper Crasher]

...Well yeah, Kirby can combo Ganon pretty well too, lol. Ganon is combo food, I don't really think that's a valid reason to say who wins the matchup. It's like saying X vs Falcon is in X's favor because X edgeguards Falcon for free. Yeah, everyone does, lol. Ganon is really good against floaties in general because his strength just sort of nullifies the advantage of floatiness, which is the resistance to comboing. He only needs to hit you like 3 times and you're pretty much done. And luigi's recovery vs Ganon's edgeguarding is kind of hilarious.

*Tornadoes up then gets stomped* It's not really a matchup I've thought too much about since there aren't any Ganon's in my state. Plus there are other matchups I'm mainly worried about like Marth. However it is interesting to learn that Yoshi gets bodied by Luigi though.

 

[Kaysick]

I personally think vs is 50/50. I played the MU for about three hours on Friday and my friend and I were taking games off each other back and forth. The only things I can completely remember is that you can Nair out of Ike's jab combo, DI away the B-throw > Bair combo he has, do not challenge his U Air.

 

[Broasty]

I personally think vs is 50/50. I played the MU for about three hours on Friday and my friend and I were taking games off each other back and forth. The only things I can completely remember is that you can Nair out of Ike's jab combo, DI away the B-throw > Bair combo he has, do not challenge his U Air.

From my current knowledge (best Ike I played was Strongbad at CEO), I do agree on this one. on one hand Ike can easily be wiff-punished. On the other hand...if Luigi get's hit, he goes FLYING or SLIDING off stage. So honestly no one's at the advantage except whoever wins in the neutral game.

And yeah, luigi obviously doesn't win or go even with spacies, but I wouldn't put them in the same range of bad as Marth.

I can definitely agree that Luigi has a hard MU against Spacies since his only reliable options of approach are WD->Down Smash or WD-Ftilt. But bad for Marth? Dude, a fireball a day pisses the **** out of Marth away. All ya gotta do is play some good Footsies to win the matchup, no worries about projectiles...just good old fashion WDing/Dash Dancing.

 

[Scaremonger]

I can definitely agree that Luigi has a hard MU against Spacies since his only reliable options of approach are WD->Down Smash or WD-Ftilt. But bad for Marth? Dude, a fireball a day pisses the **** out of Marth away. All ya gotta do is play some good Footsies to win the matchup, no worries about projectiles...just good old fashion WDing/Dash Dancing.

Marth still outspaces everything else Luigi has by a longshot. There are a lot of really great Melee Luigis that I've seen switch characters vs Marths that are significantly lesser skilled than them. Marth is definitely Luigi's hardest matchup in Melee. I do realize that fireball is changed, but Marth doesn't really have that big of a problem with Falco's lasers either, which is definitely a more difficult to deal with projectile than the green fireball. Luigi can also edgeguard spacies really, really well, and it's difficult and awkward to combo him with that nair. Keep in mind that Fox also has no shine combos on Luigi, and he's floaty enough to where Falco doesn't get much off of a shine at mid-late percents either.

 

[Broasty]

Marth still outspaces everything else Luigi has by a longshot. There are a lot of really great Melee Luigis that I've seen switch characters vs Marths that are significantly lesser skilled than them. Marth is definitely Luigi's hardest matchup in Melee. I do realize that fireball is changed, but Marth doesn't really have that big of a problem with Falco's lasers either, which is definitely a more difficult to deal with projectile than the green fireball. Luigi can also edgeguard spacies really, really well, and it's difficult and awkward to combo him with that nair. Keep in mind that Fox also has no shine combos on Luigi, and he's floaty enough to where Falco doesn't get much off of a shine at mid-late percents either.

Although Marth out does Luigi in range...Luigi has the ability to wiff punish Marth REALLY hard...and Marth is definitely a character that has to worry about Wiff Punishes due to how much End Lag exists on his attacks. With a stored greenie, Luigi can take out Marth in one punish combo.