You can see how swords hit in this game by the swipe they leave behind. Marths is thicker/longer in the tip while Lucina's is the same thickness all the way through. So they aren't the exact same.
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Lucina: Separate character or costume? (Confirmed separate character)
- Thread starter LancerStaff
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Asiacrasia
Smash Rookie
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Has anyone else noticed that Lucina's intro card has a "?!" Instead of the normal "!" Like every other newcomer has on their intro card.
It almost looks like her inclusion is questioned. I feel like nobody else noticed this
Can't post pics cause on mobile. Look up her intro card EX: "Lucina wakes her blade?!"
And look at all the other newcomers "Wii fit trainer weighs in!" "Robin brings the thunder!" And you'll see what I mean
Something is up with Lucina
It almost looks like her inclusion is questioned. I feel like nobody else noticed this
Can't post pics cause on mobile. Look up her intro card EX: "Lucina wakes her blade?!"
And look at all the other newcomers "Wii fit trainer weighs in!" "Robin brings the thunder!" And you'll see what I mean
Something is up with Lucina
The21stSmasher
Smash Journeyman
Exactly! Just a few seconds of her gameplay in a 3 minute trailer isn't enough.
alex6309
Smash Ace
? =\= ?!
The ?! is used to convey confusion or shock. Want an example?
Everyone excepted Chrom or Robin to be the FE character of this game. Who do we immediately see? Lucina? Bam, shocking news.
Asiacrasia
Smash Rookie
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Ehhh, nobody expected Wii Fit Trainer and she got an exclamation point
I just find it strange that EVERY newcomer has had an exclamation point except for her
EDIT: every character has a standalone exclamation except for her
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Blakexd9
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The "?!" is because of the scene in the reveal trailer. The phrase "wakes her blade?!" means that she is ready for battle, but is she going to? And as a result, Lucina doesn't actually join the battle until after Robin's introduction.
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Asiacrasia
Smash Rookie
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Well Why didn't Charizard have an exclamation and a question mark then?
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Ginger Hail
Smash Apprentice
Separate character, potential clone. We'll have to see.
Sigran101
Smash Master
Lucina was confirmed as a new playable fighter, seperate from Marth. The reveal isn't ambiguos like Ridley, as it is exactly the same as every other newcomer reveal. To say that "we can't decide one way or the other" is dumb. It's not even confirmed that alts like that exist! It's just a fan theory. How can people say we don't have concrete evidence that she is a seperate fighter? Logicly, when a character is confirmed for smash bros, they should not be assumed to be just an alt unless sakurai confirms it. They should be consideted a new seperate fighter like every other newcomer that has been revealed.
Blakexd9
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Charizard joined the fight back in Brawl.
Come to think of it, we never got a intro image for Falcon.
Forcerounds
Smash Journeyman
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Separate character, a Marth clone with who's better in the air (while Marth has a stronger ground game). Different Final Smash most likely.
She also has the potential for vastly different customizable moves than Marth such as being able to throw a Spear as a projectile.
She also has the potential for vastly different customizable moves than Marth such as being able to throw a Spear as a projectile.
Sigran101
Smash Master
A confirmation of a new character like Lucina is supposed to be concrete. I realize Sakurai is unpredictable, but he's not so unpredictable that after a character is already confirmed we have to "wait till sakurai says one way or the other".
Banjo-Kazooie
Smash Ace
Wow, expected a bit more debate here but it seems the overall thinking is that Lucina is a separate character. Some people are even saying this in a very rude way.
And while I think I'm inclined more to the character side. I don't discard entirely the custom idea; mostly because so far, Lucina looks like the cloniest clone ever cloned. Even more than Roy.
I hope Sakurai would just clarify some of these things with PoTD. Like the "Mii Fighters in 1 or 3 slots" dilema.
And while I think I'm inclined more to the character side. I don't discard entirely the custom idea; mostly because so far, Lucina looks like the cloniest clone ever cloned. Even more than Roy.
I hope Sakurai would just clarify some of these things with PoTD. Like the "Mii Fighters in 1 or 3 slots" dilema.
lightdasher
Smash Lord
Based on about 4 seconds of footage
Banjo-Kazooie
Smash Ace
I'm just telling it how I saw it, even if they were just 4 seconds. I'm also aware she might have some key differences, but those weren't presented in those 4 seconds (And why not? if Sakurai loves to show the key mechanics of each character when they are revealed).
Have a feeling Sakurai will throw us tons of Lucina/Robin/Falcon info the next weeks in PoTD. But for now, we only have 4 seconds of footage and some screenshots.
loganhogan
Smash Ace
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You fools that's no newcomer that's a veteran.
It's the return of "Roy", who by the way was never Roy to begin with. The great master of disguise Lucina dressed herself as Roy in Melee and now she's making a return.
It's the return of "Roy", who by the way was never Roy to begin with. The great master of disguise Lucina dressed herself as Roy in Melee and now she's making a return.
danielvdell
Smash Rookie
No, they're the same characters. Female Villager is still Villager, Male Wii Fit Trainer is still Wii Fit Trainer, and Female Robin is still Robin.
Lucina is not Marth. And if we go into hypothetical "complex" alts. (which I will for the sake of example), Dark Pit is not Pit.
Lucina stands out to me because she is the only newcomer who does not have an original moveset. I also find it very odd that Lucina even has the same idle animation as Marth and is, from what we can tell, extremely clone-ish move-wise, too. Female Robin proves we can have alts. with different voice acting and she and the other gender variants prove they can have different models, too. I know we've yet to have an alternate who is an entirely different character (not just a gender variant), but that can change.
Given that Robin was introduced with both a male and female version in the trailer (which I know is because Robin is the Awakening avatar), it's my belief that Lucina was also introduced with a male version -- Marth. I could very well be wrong, but given the overall oddness of Lucina compared to every other newcomer, this makes sense to me.
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Solbliminal
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Based on the fact she barely has any animations of her own. And don't give me any of that "slight tilt of the hand and an extra swing in the nair" crap. The fact she has anything to barely visually differentiate herself from Marth is very lazy. It is honestly an insult to have Roy removed for the same thing Lucina is being added for. She even shares some, if not all of Marth's wait animations. The only real animation work that can be seen differently between the two seems to be the taunts. And yeah, that is a problem.
Jakario
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The !? for Lucina's reveal is meant to be our reaction since people did not expect her.
So "Robin brings the thunder!" because many expected him/her to be in
While Lucina's "Lucina wakes her blade!?" is meant to be a surprise question from US the audience. Such as: "omg lucina wakes her blade!? Like, really?"
She is a new fighter! She has her own page, own moveset (unique a-air so far), and own tauntset. So she is not a costume.
So "Robin brings the thunder!" because many expected him/her to be in
While Lucina's "Lucina wakes her blade!?" is meant to be a surprise question from US the audience. Such as: "omg lucina wakes her blade!? Like, really?"
She is a new fighter! She has her own page, own moveset (unique a-air so far), and own tauntset. So she is not a costume.
Tyrannotaur
Smash Ace
Crap, wasn't paying attention and accidentally voted for costume. I'm more inclined to believe she is her own character. She is a clone though obviously. However at least that makes sense in terms of the story of Awakening. Not gonna go into spoilery details.
I was expecting Lucina and Chrom tag team and we got Lucina as a character and Robin as another character with Chrom as a tag team in his/her FS. Thats pretty awesome and unexpected Sakurai. Nice work.
I was expecting Lucina and Chrom tag team and we got Lucina as a character and Robin as another character with Chrom as a tag team in his/her FS. Thats pretty awesome and unexpected Sakurai. Nice work.
ToiseOfChoice
Smash Ace
Alt character instead of alt costume, but an alternate nonetheless. I really can't understand why people are so convinced she's "just" a clone beyond heaps of seeing what you want to see.
lightdasher
Smash Lord
Geeze it's like you guys have never seen a clone before, did anyone claim alts/skins durring Brawl days?
ToastMiller
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Probably because having a clone in brawl wasn't as weird. and for the "whail tun leenk" He needed to be represented with two models because each appeals to it's own audiences IMO.
How does this help prove that she's an alt? It really doesn't. There is no proof that she will be an alt, other than her being a clone... There have been plenty if clones in smash before. There is more going for her being a character than an alt.
ToastMiller
Smash Apprentice
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I didn't say she was an alt. Slow down.
My apologies, I thought you were arguing that she was an alt costume, I misunderstood.
The21stSmasher
Smash Journeyman
This below is ProjectAngel's post from the topic:
Why does Lucina not have a newcomer banner?
Why does Lucina not have a newcomer banner?
Hopefully this prove can kinda calm this topic down. However, it's strange... Why is her newcomer banner only shown in the mobile version of the website, while the PC verison doesn't show? That's freaky!She has her newcomer banner on the mobile version of the site.
Here:
Users of other non-mobile devices will just get the veteran square for Lucina.
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I think it doesn't show on the desktop version of the site because she and Robin share the same poster (they are both heavily featured in it) so they didn't put it on Lucinas page so that it wasn't redundant, and that would make a full banner pretty useless.
The21stSmasher
Smash Journeyman
Hm, you're right about that! Again, I just hope our prove and evidences are strong enough to calm this topic down. And hopefully end this pointless argument.
TheCJBrine
Smash Legend
You see, Lucina isn't an alternate costume for Marth. Marth is an alternate costume for Lucina.
Seriously, though. They didn't show Lucina in the intro as much as they showed the other characters, and characters in other intros. Her moves may be half-Marth and half-Unique, or she's just like Marth with the moveset but different gameplay-wise. They probably just didn't work on her as much as other characters and just used some Marth moves as placeholders in the trailer, although of course that doesn't seem very likely.
Seriously, though. They didn't show Lucina in the intro as much as they showed the other characters, and characters in other intros. Her moves may be half-Marth and half-Unique, or she's just like Marth with the moveset but different gameplay-wise. They probably just didn't work on her as much as other characters and just used some Marth moves as placeholders in the trailer, although of course that doesn't seem very likely.
But is it? Is it really?
TheCJBrine
Smash Legend
The difference between the slash from their swords implies that.
The fact that their slashes are even different implies Lucina isn't just a costume.
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UltimateWario
Smash Master
I think she's a clone of Marth.
Which is why she isn't being as "played up" as the other newcomers. Sakurai introduced her as a supplement to Robin, who was today's real star. Sakurai knows she's not a big deal, since she's just a clone of Marth, but she's still technically a newcomer and gets the banner.
Which is why she isn't being as "played up" as the other newcomers. Sakurai introduced her as a supplement to Robin, who was today's real star. Sakurai knows she's not a big deal, since she's just a clone of Marth, but she's still technically a newcomer and gets the banner.
alex6309
Smash Ace
CORRECTION:
Captain Falcon was the real star.
UltimateWario
Smash Master
Well, I didn't want to go around stating the obvious.
KageJuin
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Maybe it is important to note that Lucina says a line inthe japanese trailer: this is the hero of light's power. Before attacking C Falcon.
Lucina has the Falchion and is dressed as said hero of light. If viewed from this lens it seems to indicate she is a costume of Marth, but needs an image on the website since she is a character, not just a different version of marth in the games of origin. Notable circumstantial evidence: Moves have the exact same animations as opposed to her unique ones from her own game, including her idle stance. Exact same height as Marth. Exact same moves down to the details when compared to Marth.
The Falchion was reforged in Awakening, which means it's slashing animation will indeed look different if it's Lucina when compared to her base Marth. This is not proof that she is separate from Marth at all.
Add in the simple fact that Sakurai is trying to avoid clones, he would never have Lucina have a copy moveset, especially since he went out of his way to leave Chrom out of the game as playable.
He picked Lucina because he also voiced his desire to add more female characters.
I do not know why the English trailer changed her line, but she references having Marth's power. Combine that with her lack of screen time as a newcomer and the '?!' While having the exact same animations as Marth save a few...
Not to mention Sakurai clearly stated many more characters would have alternate costumes, I would say Lucina is a costume which has the announcer change his lines.
She foreshadows Dark Pit joining and maybe even Roy with the options to change special attacks.
My two cents.
Remember her line is: 'this.. Is the hero of light's power! ' and preps her sword after which we get the 'Lucina joins the battle?!'
Subtle hints. Anyone who has followed Sakurai over the years knows this may be him hinting at new game mechanics.
source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lf9ZxmcUYWs
Lucina has the Falchion and is dressed as said hero of light. If viewed from this lens it seems to indicate she is a costume of Marth, but needs an image on the website since she is a character, not just a different version of marth in the games of origin. Notable circumstantial evidence: Moves have the exact same animations as opposed to her unique ones from her own game, including her idle stance. Exact same height as Marth. Exact same moves down to the details when compared to Marth.
The Falchion was reforged in Awakening, which means it's slashing animation will indeed look different if it's Lucina when compared to her base Marth. This is not proof that she is separate from Marth at all.
Add in the simple fact that Sakurai is trying to avoid clones, he would never have Lucina have a copy moveset, especially since he went out of his way to leave Chrom out of the game as playable.
He picked Lucina because he also voiced his desire to add more female characters.
I do not know why the English trailer changed her line, but she references having Marth's power. Combine that with her lack of screen time as a newcomer and the '?!' While having the exact same animations as Marth save a few...
Not to mention Sakurai clearly stated many more characters would have alternate costumes, I would say Lucina is a costume which has the announcer change his lines.
She foreshadows Dark Pit joining and maybe even Roy with the options to change special attacks.
My two cents.
Remember her line is: 'this.. Is the hero of light's power! ' and preps her sword after which we get the 'Lucina joins the battle?!'
Subtle hints. Anyone who has followed Sakurai over the years knows this may be him hinting at new game mechanics.
source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lf9ZxmcUYWs
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UltimateWario
Smash Master
I would like to point out that Dark Pit is the only character so far who has been shown completely, his name said, and everything, but we don't know his role in the game.
Methinks that's borderline decomfirmation, but this is Sakurai we're talking about.
Also Dark Pit is clearly his new Meta Knight, so...
Methinks that's borderline decomfirmation, but this is Sakurai we're talking about.
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Differences in their slash? What differences? You are grasping at straws.
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