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Ridley_Prime

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I hope for Sylux fans that he still has a chance, though he’d mostly be a bonus for me with Metroid content in Smash at this point of post-release.

After Federation Force, it’s good to see there’s more quality control for something Tanabe’s involved in, even if the delay for Prime 4 sucks. FF was a spinoff though but it’s reassuring for a mainline game’s quality to be taken seriously enough for such setbacks if it needs to. Am mixed on Retro in its current form handling it too though but I guess gives a bit more confidence than not knowing for certain what team was gonna develop the game to begin with (Namco or whoever).
 
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Does Sylux have a sizeable fanbase? I never got around to Metroid Hunters so I don't have any attachment to the character, but I feel like it's generally one of the less talked about games within the community. NES has the OG status, Super, Zero Mission, and Fusion get highlighted a lot on the 2D side, the Prime Trilogy is heavily acclaimed on the 3D side of things, Other M and Federation Force are remembered for being a stain on the franchise, Returns gets some acknowledgement for being a more recent release and more of a return to form, but Hunters always seems to coast under the radar from what I've seen.
 

IronTed

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Tanabe is still involved so I would imagine Sylux will still be involved (assuming Tanabe still wanted to do that when development began). Not sure how much influence Retro would have over the plot though.

I'm fine with Sylux if they make him compelling, and I have little faith they can. Ever since Metroid stopped copying taking inspiration from Alien you can see how they all took a turn for the worse in terms of plot. Not saying most or many are bad, but none give me confidence they can hype up a comparatively bland villain into someone that can be great.

Does Sylux have a sizeable fanbase? I never got around to Metroid Hunters so I don't have any attachment to the character, but I feel like it's generally one of the less talked about games within the community. NES has the OG status, Super, Zero Mission, and Fusion get highlighted a lot on the 2D side, the Prime Trilogy is heavily acclaimed on the 3D side of things, Other M and Federation Force are remembered for being a stain on the franchise, Returns gets some acknowledgement for being a more recent release and more of a return to form, but Hunters always seems to coast under the radar from what I've seen.
From what I've seen (at least on various forums) Hunters was well regarded for what it was (keep in mind we're talking a handheld multi-player FPS that released in 2006, back when FPS' were no where near as big as they are today), even if it had apparent flaws. It also helped mainline Metroid games were still coming out predictably. But it was obviously a one-off thing (RIP NST). Amusingly enough Hunters almost outsold Echoes despite far less critical acclaim.
 
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Gleam

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It doesn't have to be a Samus-Returns, just a graphical and some game play changes while still expressing the original style of Super Metroid. It would be the same way that Metroid Zero Mission enhanced the feeling of the original Metroid by, imo, making it far better and if nothing else, at least graphically pleasing. Super Metroid is a great game but it's still over 25 years old and it does have a few hiccups.

Space Jumping for example can be a little tedious in Super Metroid. For some reason whenever you pause at certain points, the game inputs that as some kind of complete pause and you just stop and drop. Later games would obviously fix this issue so that it didn't happen and imo, that delay or pause is one of the primary reasons Super Ridley can be such a difficult fight.

Wall Jumping I swear is like some sick joke you play on you friends. Like, come on stupid, can't you get on top of the cliff? Why you sucking so hard? Why can't you read those 3 frames of animation where Samus kicks off the wall? What are you? Bad at video games? Luckily this wasn't necessary in the long run when it came to playing Super Metroid but it just goes to show the improvements later games would make.

Then there's just other things later metroid games would add such as hanging and ball jumps.

There's no reason somebody couldn't take Super Metroid, making some graphical enhancements so we can watch Crocomire burn in glorious HD, fix up some of the more buggy aspects that did plague the original SNES version, add some gameplay aspects that weren't there before and create a game that can technically stand out from the original Super Metroid while still being faithful.

Now I wouldn't be against a 3D rendition of Super Metroid. When I first saw the trailers of Other M, with the scenes of Mother Brain, that's what I thought we we're getting at first. A graphically improved, 3D game of Super Metroid...how wrong I was.
 

Ridley_Prime

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Still think Fusion could use the Samus Returns touch more. MercurySteam wanted to do a Fusion remake to begin with, and the X-Parasite cliffhanger in Returns speaks for itself. Super Metroid holds up well enough on its own as pointed out and a remake would have scary standards to live up to.

Believe they said the next game would be entirely new though but regardless of what form the next 2.5D game takes, I do hope it comes out before Prime 4 now, since we’ll be waiting years on that as it is after hitting the reset button.
 
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Sylux's big problem is that Nintendo were the ones picking DLC, back when they were finalizing the choices they would have known that Prime 4's development was rocky, it's probably been like that for a long time for them to tear it apart and start from scratch again, and without having promotional potential on his side I really don't see Sylux standing a chance.

I wouldn't have minded him anymore like I would have before Ridley and Dark Samus' inclusions, with all the essentials in I'd just like for Metroid to get as much exposure as possible, but I must also admit that I've not been able to bring myself to ask for more Metroid content as I'm just super grateful for what we already have. It sucks for the people who were hoping for Sylux specifically though.
 
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IronTed

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There's no reason somebody couldn't take Super Metroid, making some graphical enhancements so we can watch Crocomire burn in glorious HD.
QFT

They will never remake Super because no matter how faithful or good it is it will never live up to people's expectations. Super is one of those games people put on a pedestal, for better or for worse. I would totally love Super Metroid with remade graphics but the exact same gameplay and feel. Maybe I'm in the minority, but Super's physics have always been preferable to Fusion's to me. Also wall jumping up one wall is amazing and doing it in ZM and especially SR is much more difficult.

I don't expect a Fusion remake either. There simply isn't the demand for a Fusion remake like there was for RoS. That, and Sakamoto straight up said he doesn't want to remake Super or Fusion. SR clearly was meant to lay the groundwork for a new 2D game that isn't a remake or remaster. A Fusion remake is something they should save for after Metroid 5.

If development for the next 2D Metroid started shortly after SR was completed, when would people expect it to come out? I recall reading that SR began development in mid of 2015, and if true that's 2 years. Not sure if a Switch game would come along so quickly, but perhaps H1 of 2020 is a realistic expectation.
 

Zem-raj

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I wouldn't expect a remake for either Super Metroid or Metroid Fusion any time soon. I think Sakamoto said it's not on the cards, so the next 2D/Traditional game should be a new game entirely. However, I'm not expecting a Fusion sequel, aka "Metroid 5". I'm expecting another interquel again.
 

slamallama

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I'm pretty relieved and a little bit excited, actually. I was (apparently, rightfully so) worried that Bandai Namco or whoever they had working on Prime 4 wouldn't be able to get it right. So that video was a rollercoaster for me. I almost stopped breathing halfway through cause I was getting a straight-up cancellation vibe from the tone. But then they announced they were taking the series back to Retro Studios, and a new Prime by Retro is something I can wait a few extra years for. We Metroid fans are used to waiting, and at least this time we know the series in good hands.

(seriously though Takahashi, don't scare me like that again)
 
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IsmaR

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I consider any news in the first place to be a blessing. Even if it wasn't delayed, I wasn't holding my breath for as soon of a release as everyone else was pining for. Certainly not the longest wait Metroid fans have had to endure, but we'll see if it's truly worth the payoff once it is all said and done. I've yet to be let down by Retro, leaving me optimistic despite most of the original team being gone.

-

As for the tourney I mentioned previously, I made it to Loser's Quarterfinals of my pool yesterday (6 wins, just outside of top 64). Better than my last time in standard singles, but it's still clear where I have room for improvement. Slowly but surely getting better at things like stage choices/awareness, not feeling hopelessly outclassed/always feeling like I could make a comeback, and not making excuses/taking losses in stride instead of beating myself up.

That said, I will continue belittling my efforts in the form of more screenshots/****posts. Have a shark jumping the Ridley:

 

Dalek_Kolt

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Also it probably meant absolutely nothing in the long run, but a couple days before the news dropped, I bought the last copy of Tropical Freeze from a Target. That money's definitely never going to end up in Retro's pocket but I felt the need to support them somehow.

Game's really good incidentally, I just wish I could play Funky outside of New Funky Mode.
 
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While yes it is a bit disappointing that the game will be delayed for some time, but at the same time, I'm glad Nintendo is being upfront and honest about this. They really care about the quality they put into their games. That's a big reason why I've been a loyal Nintendo fan since my childhood.
 
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Personally, unless Nintendo can put something together for early 2020 at the latest, I wouldn't expect any 2D game before Prime 4. Within a year or so of its release, Nintendo would be directly competing with itself by releasing anything Metroid related.
 

Zem-raj

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Personally, unless Nintendo can put something together for early 2020 at the latest, I wouldn't expect any 2D game before Prime 4. Within a year or so of its release, Nintendo would be directly competing with itself by releasing anything Metroid related.
Since Metroid Prime 4 has restarted development (from scratch), and if it takes maybe 3 or 4 years of development time, it'll probably be out by 2022 at earliest. Metroid Samus Returns released in 2017, so unless there's a game between now and 2022, it'd be a 5 year gap between games. Besides, it's not like a new 2D Metroid and Prime 4 being out around the same time would definitely harm sales, since Fusion and Prime both released together in 2002 (merely days apart), and Zero Mission and Prime 2 both released in 2004, and all those did fine. Plus we had games releasing in 2005, 2006, and 2007 (Pinball, Hunters, and Prime 3 Corruption, respectively).
 

IronTed

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The like/dislike ratio on Nintendo's apology video is impressive. 117k to 4.2k. Hopefully this and the surprisingly realistic reactions (speaking about actual fans, not concern trolls) will show Nintendo (and the industry at large) that transparency and candidness is far more effective than PR spin and silence.

Edit: Why are we assuming that A: a 2D Metroid game would have similar budget to a Prime game and B: that such a game would be very early in development? If such a game did exist it would have been likely greenlighted in late 2017. There would certainly be no reason to wait over a year to begin development on a new game, if SR was indeed successful enough to warrant a sequel.
 
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The like/dislike ratio on Nintendo's apology video is impressive. 117k to 4.2k. Hopefully this and the surprisingly realistic reactions (speaking about actual fans, not concern trolls) will show Nintendo (and the industry at large) that transparency and candidness is far more effective than PR spin and silence.

Edit: Why are we assuming that A: a 2D Metroid game would have similar budget to a Prime game and B: that such a game would be very early in development? If such a game did exist it would have been likely greenlighted in late 2017. There would certainly be no reason to wait over a year to begin development on a new game, if SR was indeed successful enough to warrant a sequel.
Well, back then another 2D game would have been viewed as competition for Prime 4, which they likely expected to release in 2019 or 2020. Greenlighting one now would also put it into competition with Prime 4, I believe, which is likely to be 2021 or 2022 release.
 

Porygon2

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Does Sylux have a sizeable fanbase? I never got around to Metroid Hunters so I don't have any attachment to the character, but I feel like it's generally one of the less talked about games within the community. NES has the OG status, Super, Zero Mission, and Fusion get highlighted a lot on the 2D side, the Prime Trilogy is heavily acclaimed on the 3D side of things, Other M and Federation Force are remembered for being a stain on the franchise, Returns gets some acknowledgement for being a more recent release and more of a return to form, but Hunters always seems to coast under the radar from what I've seen.
In the wider community, no, but he does have a very niche, semi-ironic fanbase that pops up in Metroid threads to embrace his obscurity from time to time. Basically an excuse to make dumb Metroid OC. It's quite funny, as was the Sylux/Dark Samus pairing.
Capture1.PNG
 

IronTed

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Well, back then another 2D game would have been viewed as competition for Prime 4, which they likely expected to release in 2019 or 2020. Greenlighting one now would also put it into competition with Prime 4, I believe, which is likely to be 2021 or 2022 release.
I get what you're suggesting (that the two sub-franchises are viewed as cannibalistic) but t I don't see how Nintendo would view it that way. They still produce 2D and 3D for Mario and Zelda, and in the case of the former often release them roughly a year or so apart. Prime was never meant to be a substitute for 2D Metroid (it launched the same day as Fusion), and everything Nintendo has said and done proves they have much interest in both series. If Prime 4 is a 2022 title as you suggest (I fully endorse this assumption), that leaves a ton of time to release a new 2D Metroid without either feeling cramped.
 

Cosmic77

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If we were to get any kind of promotional DLC, I'd argue Sylux and a Gen VIII Pokemon would be the frontrunners.

That being said, Sylux is easily replaceable. A lot of his popularity stemmed from people who had given up on Ridley, but now that we have him AND DS, I don't feel like his supporters have been as faithful as they used to. Honestly, I think many of them would be happy with any new Metroid character.
 

IronTed

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If we were to get any kind of promotional DLC, I'd argue Sylux and a Gen VIII Pokemon would be the frontrunners.

That being said, Sylux is easily replaceable. A lot of his popularity stemmed from people who had given up on Ridley, but now that we have him AND DS, I don't feel like his supporters have been as faithful as they used to. Honestly, I think many of them would be happy with any new Metroid character.
Sylux always struck me as the bargaining phase of Metroid character support "well if Ridley's too big, then maybe...". I lurked in the Ridley support thread in the dark days of Sm4sh speculation, and I recall a user basically saying "Ridley's never getting in, we should just ask for Sylux instead."

To be honest, with Ridley and Dark Samus, I don't even really want anything else. I'm very satisfied, and it feels greedy to ask for more.
 
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Since I will be leaving to Mexico this upcoming Friday, I decided to do the Valentine's Day stuff early just in case I don't get the chance to make when the 14th arrives:
View attachment 189240
xD I honestly had a lot of fun making this one, specially the rhyme.
Can't say that's a pairing I ever expected to see, Ridley and tall blonde space babes usually don't go so well together.
 

AndreaAC

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Can't say that's a pairing I ever expected to see, Ridley and tall blonde space babes usually don't go so well together.
Hahaha! xD Well, Rosalina is the total opposite to Samus in many other aspects, so both of them being tall blondies doesn't really affect anything.
 

Cosmic77

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Sylux always struck me as the bargaining phase of Metroid character support "well if Ridley's too big, then maybe...". I lurked in the Ridley support thread in the dark days of Sm4sh speculation, and I recall a user basically saying "Ridley's never getting in, we should just ask for Sylux instead."

To be honest, with Ridley and Dark Samus, I don't even really want anything else. I'm very satisfied, and it feels greedy to ask for more.
Same. Metroid is argueably the most lacking franchise when it comes to potential newcomers. The fact that we miraculously got four is more than enough for me.

https://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/43317

Patch notes:
Forward Air Attack: Shortened the amount of time you cannot grab edges after using the move.
Down Air Attack: Shortened the amount of time you cannot grab edges after using the move.
FS Meter: Increased power.
Well, it's progress. Let's hope this is only the beginning.
 
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Gleam

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Ridley was honestly fine as a character and didn't need buffs nor am I surprised he didn't get any. He's a surprisingly balanced character with applicability of a very good character and flaws that keep him from being broken. You can't make everyone Top Tier Inkling without really screwing around with the character mechanics.

The only thing I wish could be fixed was the control of Wing Blitz. Distance, power, priority, that's all good but it is still a pain to control this move and it's something that can be really good against campers and projectiles. This thing will eat through K. Rool and Belmont's projectiles and has enough distance to cover yourself. If they get too projectile happy, you just shove right through that junk.

However, it's still difficult to get an idea, if there is one, of controlling yourself. So many times I've tried to do a nice downward Blitz and just flew upwards. I don't know if it has something to do with stage direction or enemy direction or if the game is just laughing at me. But this move, which is a decent in recovery and has many applications, is screwed over by a poor design choice when it should've just emulated a simple 8 directional control path.

Other than that, and maybe having Usmash kick from the front and not behind, I'm fine with Ridley. He's already considered by many right now to be a solid Mid Tier character, many, myself included even put him around the High Mid Tier and one could make an argument for Low High Tier. I'd hate for to get buffed so much he turns into Bayonetta.

And not that he'd be as broken but we all know what happened with Bayonetta.

The classic, don't fly too close to the sun, or else Nintendo will nerf you to hell and back.
 

Ridley_Prime

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That said, my condolences to K. Rool getting nerfed who wasn’t even broken, and I suppose Mega Man even though he was a painful matchup for me before as Ridley.

Glad Rosalina got some needed buffs too along with Incineroar and some, even if she won’t be as good as in SSB4. Being able to short hop easier simply by pressing both jump buttons is also nice.

Piranha Plant’s an alright bait and trapper I guess.
 

Gleam

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I actually wouldn't be surprised if Plant becomes an annoying matchup for Ridley. His large frame makes it extremely easy for his attacks to hit including Poison which can lead to anywhere from around 25-40+% damage, all while being comboed with through other moves. It makes a deadly edge and ledgeguarding tool.

However, the big threat I believe will be his Neutral B which can eat through most things. I believe it can even eat through Ridley's recovery, Not only that it's a nice anti-aerial move, basically protecting Plant from above and can be maneuvered around him. For Ridley, who relies heavily on moves like Fair and Nair, that can make things pretty difficult in approaching. The good thing is that we have a projectile and Plant does suffer under those who can force approach like that.

Plant is also surprisingly fast despite some of his sluggish feel at times and he can combo as high as 130%.

The potential mindgames, mixups, edgeguarding tools and Ridley's own natural flaws could make this a potentially difficult fight.
 

Cutie Gwen

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I actually wouldn't be surprised if Plant becomes an annoying matchup for Ridley. His large frame makes it extremely easy for his attacks to hit including Poison which can lead to anywhere from around 25-40+% damage, all while being comboed with through other moves. It makes a deadly edge and ledgeguarding tool.

However, the big threat I believe will be his Neutral B which can eat through most things. I believe it can even eat through Ridley's recovery, Not only that it's a nice anti-aerial move, basically protecting Plant from above and can be maneuvered around him. For Ridley, who relies heavily on moves like Fair and Nair, that can make things pretty difficult in approaching. The good thing is that we have a projectile and Plant does suffer under those who can force approach like that.

Plant is also surprisingly fast despite some of his sluggish feel at times and he can combo as high as 130%.

The potential mindgames, mixups, edgeguarding tools and Ridley's own natural flaws could make this a potentially difficult fight.
Thing is that the plant is pretty stubby, especially when compared to Ridley's great amount of disjoints. Then again Fsmash has some reach and I frames
 

Dcas

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I actually wouldn't be surprised if Plant becomes an annoying matchup for Ridley. His large frame makes it extremely easy for his attacks to hit including Poison which can lead to anywhere from around 25-40+% damage, all while being comboed with through other moves. It makes a deadly edge and ledgeguarding tool.

However, the big threat I believe will be his Neutral B which can eat through most things. I believe it can even eat through Ridley's recovery, Not only that it's a nice anti-aerial move, basically protecting Plant from above and can be maneuvered around him. For Ridley, who relies heavily on moves like Fair and Nair, that can make things pretty difficult in approaching. The good thing is that we have a projectile and Plant does suffer under those who can force approach like that.

Plant is also surprisingly fast despite some of his sluggish feel at times and he can combo as high as 130%.

The potential mindgames, mixups, edgeguarding tools and Ridley's own natural flaws could make this a potentially difficult fight.
Ridley destroys the plant, everything we do is faster or has more range. Ridleys mobiliuty is way better.
 

Gleam

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I completely disagree with that. Plant's level of mindgames and setups are things that can easily give Ridley a hard time. His great size makes him easy to rack up damage with poison and Neutral B as well as even Down B can all but shut down Ridley's approaches from the air, forcing Ridley to make other less profound options. Neutral B can literally knock Ridley out of his attacks including his Side B and can actually knock him out of Wing Blitz, one of the few moves capable of having greater priority.

In fact Neutral B can, in a sense, entirely cut off Ridley's aerial approach without very proper spacing. The spiked ball does an interesting amount of damage, lasts a while has high priority. In use, I have personally yet to see Ridley ever get off his side B before the ball falls on his head in a flat stage. It, along with Poison and even Down B forces a surprisingly level of spacing on the Dragon.

Even if you do manage to space yourself properly, the spiked ball lasts for a few frames on the ground. You could get the hit in, miss the ball hitting you and then accidentally run into it trying to go for a follow up.

And I've only mentioned it once, but on the issue of Poison. This thing can do a whopping 60% damage and even around 25% at its worst. It's going to be darn near impossible for Ridley to avoid taking this damage thanks to his frames an this poison can be used for edgeguarding, ledgeguarding and mixed with other moves. It all but guarantees that Plant can rack up damage while still keep space between him and Ridley.

This is not a fight Ridley can underestimate at all.
 
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