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leave olimar?

Juanda991

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 29, 2008
Messages
70
Location
Cali Colombia
:urg:, well guys, first i want to say that i love olimar, is so cute and very powerful, but.....recently ive been playing with pro players and is really hard to beat theirs, why? edgehog and the ****ing olimars recovery, very good players are really fast in doing edgehog and olimar can do nothing, another thing is when you play another player who always is trying to take out you from the platforms, when you are far the platform is imposible to recovery, so.......:confused:need urgent help, is olimar good for top matches, i have to leave him?, thanks for reading.
 

Zacke

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 5, 2007
Messages
60
Location
Sweden
That problem will be solved if you just avoid the hits.

No, seriously, Olimar has a big problem when going outside of the stage, and that's why it's more important to dodge and avoid attacks. You can try throwing a purple pikmin, to get the opponent away from the edge (although I have never been able to perform it...)
 

Zori

Smash Champion
Joined
Mar 5, 2008
Messages
2,300
Location
the vortex
Yeah i felt this way too but now im used to being off the edge keeping your cool off the edge is 75% of the battle. I almost prefer the edge, amazing things can happen you just got to keep your cool
 

DanGR

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
Apr 10, 2008
Messages
6,860
just try not to get hit? that's the only advice I can really give you. If you have to use the whistle even, the first thing that comes to mind should be to get on the ground.
 

Jarri

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 21, 2007
Messages
387
Location
Belgium
Stay on the ground for like almost the entire game, unless you space or can perform a combo with an uAir/upB. Do not stay at the edges, roll away from them or punish your opponent for bring you there with a dSmash.
 

asob4

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Messages
2,968
Location
Palmdale, CA
i actually agree with zori, a lot of my game is surprisingly off stage
just stay focused and keep your second jump, if they edge hog you, do a rising fair and stage spike them hehe
if you're right next to it just up b immediately and get there before them
 

Zacke

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 5, 2007
Messages
60
Location
Sweden
Yeah, Olimar can get edgehogged easily, but he can edgehogg really easy, too.
So being of stage could make your opponents die from the massive mindgames behind Pikmin Change! xD
 

Dr. Hyde

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 3, 2007
Messages
715
Location
Sarasota, FL
meh I lose most of the time cause I get hogged but I win most of the time because I kill people easily.

I guess you need to kil them more than they are killing you.
 

Excellence

Smash Champion
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
2,137
Location
The Legion of Doom Headquarters
There are a number of tricks and mindgames which can help you in a situation like this. The first thing I'd like to say is try to stay away from the edge, play center stage. If you do find yourself going off the edge here are a few things you can do.

1. Save your second jump, don't use it until you come near the edge. If your opponents are anything like my own, they look to edgehog you and they'll hop right on the edge thinking you've got no more jumps. At which point, you jump on the stage and Up B if necessary, for that added boost in height to get over the lip of the stage.

2. When your at higher percentages, you should be aware that Purple Pikmin are now your best friends. They create opening for you to not only attack, but to recover safely. As I said earlier, save your second jump. As you approach the ledge, don't panic and go balistic. Carefully wait until your in like and throw the Purple Pikmin at the person. They will either get off the ledge or take the hit. If they take the hit, the Pikmin can potentially kill them at higher percentages. If they get off the ledge using invincible frames to avoid the hit, get angled up with the ledge and use Up B to recover.

3. If your 2nd jump didn't quite get you over the ledge, and you would like an opponent off the ledge you can use neutral air. Neutral air has multiple hits and will knock the opponent off because it has a fairly long hitbox and stays out a while. At which point, Up B your way back on to the edge.

4. If your coming in on a 45% angle, you might want to f-air your opponent. If you smack them into the stage, the effect is similar to that of a spike and they'll usually die, either alone or with you. =P You can also give U-Air a shot, it has more upward reach, so if you know your not going to land a f-air, use this one. The only problem with up air is that the animation is a little long and after you land it, you may not have enough reach with the U-B to grab the ledge.

5. This one is a bit risky, but it plays a nice mind game for the opponent. If your at a high percentage along with your opponent, kill the both of you. Line yourself up, and launch a Pikmin Spear (U-B) straight into their back. Try and have Red or Purple at the end, since they have the most knockback. If done correctly, your opponent will be sent flying to their death, faster than you! That means if there is absolutely no way around it, and your on your last stock, you win!

6. If your off screen, you may want to try tossing all your Pikmin off the screen to die. This sounds a little stupid, but if you do that Olimar's 2nd jump gets a lot more height. It's also possible for your Up B to grab the ledge even when your a ways from it. When you do this, your opponent will usually get off the ledge, because they do not expect you to be coming back. The only problem is, what to do once your back on the ledge? Simple! Down Tilt, knocks your opponent into the air at higher percentages and can juggle at lower percentages. There is also running, so yeah.

These are all the ways I could think of to get back on the ledge. If you manage to be agressive about it like myself, your opponents will think twice before ledgeguarding you. I hope this helps. =]
 

Zacke

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 5, 2007
Messages
60
Location
Sweden
5. This one is a bit risky, but it plays a nice mind game for the opponent. If your at a high percentage along with your opponent, kill the both of you. Line yourself up, and launch a Pikmin Spear (U-B) straight into their back. Try and have Red or Purple at the end, since they have the most knockback. If done correctly, your opponent will be sent flying to their death, faster than you! That means if there is absolutely no way around it, and your on your last stock, you win!
But if the opponent rolls up, they can avoid it with the invincibility frames, and you will get owned, right? =/

6. If your off screen, you may want to try tossing all your Pikmin off the screen to die. This sounds a little stupid, but if you do that Olimar's 2nd jump gets a lot more height.
WHAT!? Really!? =O
 

Excellence

Smash Champion
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
2,137
Location
The Legion of Doom Headquarters
But if the opponent rolls up, they can avoid it with the invincibility frames, and you will get owned, right? =/

WHAT!? Really!? =O
Yeah, you do sort of uh... get owned. *Cough* It's still good though, if there is no other option, you may as well go for the double suicide.

And yes, if Olimar has no Pikmin the height of his jumps are increased and his Up B can grab ledges from a distance. I'm not sure what the exact distance of it is, but it looks to be he grabs the ledge from the distance of about 2 Pikmin lengths. If you do it, throw the Pikmin away from the screen so that they die instantly and you don't have to wait for them to fall.
 

Olimarman

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 30, 2008
Messages
763
Location
New York
Having no pikmin doesn't affect the length of your 2nd jump but it does greatly increase your upb. Olimar will grab it at a point in the attack where he wouldnt without pikmin and he gets a lot of height. This hard to pull off though since tossing your pikmin takes time to do. You should only do this if you have 1-2 pikmin but if you can throw the 3 you have do that also. Excellence basically covered everything, especially the up-b spike. Not all opponents expect it and they don't always decide to edgeguard you after they know they can easily be spiked. Up-b boosts you up enough sometimes to make it back without grabbing. WAC when your getting pushed further away from the stages edge, sometimes you can even edgeguard others that way. No matter what though, never give up Olimar. His greatest weakness can be overcome somewhat easily.
 

Rapid_Assassin

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 8, 2005
Messages
4,163
Location
RI
Whistle everything. Can't edgeguard you if they can't knock you off the stage to begin with.

He can do well in tournaments. Who were you going to go with if you were to give him up?
 

Puddin

Smash Lord
Joined
Jan 10, 2008
Messages
1,333
Location
Na'wlans
6. If your off screen, you may want to try tossing all your Pikmin off the screen to die. This sounds a little stupid, but if you do that Olimar's 2nd jump gets a lot more height.
That completely defeats the purpose of recovering. What good is recovering if you will die Pikmin-less the instant you get back on the stage?

I have to be honest, I really don't care if you choose to stop using Olimar, this is your choice, but you will have to understand that Olimar is not the only character with disadvantages such as being edge guarded.. Of course you could just go main Snake and Second MetaKnight, then you would never have to worry.
 

Excellence

Smash Champion
Joined
May 19, 2008
Messages
2,137
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The Legion of Doom Headquarters
That completely defeats the purpose of recovering. What good is recovering if you will die Pikmin-less the instant you get back on the stage?

I have to be honest, I really don't care if you choose to stop using Olimar, this is your choice, but you will have to understand that Olimar is not the only character with disadvantages such as being edge guarded.. Of course you could just go main Snake and Second MetaKnight, then you would never have to worry.
Let me help you get a few things straight. First off, you throw your Pikmin off screen AWAY from the stage when you have two or fewer. Then as you approach the ledge, you use Up B and it has a reach of about two and a half pikmin lengths.

Another thing, if you don't care, don't waste your time. Save your sweaty little fingers the excerise of typing up a post. When people post things like you, you really don't help a thread, you make them worse.

Sit on it, understand it, and be quiet.
 

Puddin

Smash Lord
Joined
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Messages
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Na'wlans
Is there a problem with posting what I think? I wasn't trying to be negative if I was coming off so, I was just saying that no matter who he chooses to main there will always be some sort of disadvantage.

If you only have two Pikmin left, chances are you'll die anyway, and again it defeats the purpose of recovering if you recover with no Pikmin all you did was add a few minor details to your post it doesn't change the fact.

Please try not to post so rudely, I was simply saying that it's his choice as to who he mains and it was none of my concern, no need to reply with such a rude post.
 

Juanda991

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 29, 2008
Messages
70
Location
Cali Colombia
thank you guys, im really happy now!, there are a lot of advices in this threat and this will help me and other olimar players, thank you again!
 

Zori

Smash Champion
Joined
Mar 5, 2008
Messages
2,300
Location
the vortex
Wet my Whistle would make a good combo video name 0-0 that was so random but for some reason reading this thread made me think about it.
 

Puddin

Smash Lord
Joined
Jan 10, 2008
Messages
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Na'wlans
haha, Zori that name sounds a bit...provocative.

I don't fight Snake often so I don't know how much I live to.
 

Kyas

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 19, 2008
Messages
341
Location
right over there
If you are getting killed on the edge, then work on your edge game. Memorize the spacing of your up B, too: most players are unaware of how long the tether is and will leave the edge too early. You can also take advantage of Olimar's weakness by edgeguarding aggressively, as it is one of his little-known strong points. You see, once Oli is ON the edge, it's as safe a place as any. So edgeguard away! Nobody expects that from Olimar, even though his tether means he can time edgehogs perfectly with practice. Also, I can't tell you the number of times a simple U-air below my opponent could have saved me from an edgehogged death.

Oh yeah, one thing I forgot: I main two characters.

Olimar doesn't work for everyone (Marth, MK, etc.) if you both are on the same level skillwise. I suppose if you were just incredible it wouldn't matter, but being incredible is hard. Look for another character that's different from Olimar (and can counter different people), but still works for you, and main both.
 

Kyas

Smash Journeyman
Joined
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Messages
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right over there
Is there a problem with posting what I think? I wasn't trying to be negative if I was coming off so, I was just saying that no matter who he chooses to main there will always be some sort of disadvantage.

If you only have two Pikmin left, chances are you'll die anyway, and again it defeats the purpose of recovering if you recover with no Pikmin all you did was add a few minor details to your post it doesn't change the fact.

Please try not to post so rudely, I was simply saying that it's his choice as to who he mains and it was none of my concern, no need to reply with such a rude post.
So you're saying that it's better to let yourself die to avoid... getting killed? What?
 

Puddin

Smash Lord
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Jan 10, 2008
Messages
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Na'wlans
I'm saying no matter what you do chances are you'll die :ohwell: If you were at a high enough percent to be knocked away in need of recover, and you only have two Pikmin then chances are you would be KOd no matter what you did.

Throw away your Pikmin and you're left with high damage and no Pikmin being forced to fight of your opponents advances to try and KO you with tilts and Dash Attacks, not exactly Olimars strong spot. It doesn't matter if he gets an extra boost if you've got no Pikmin, you'll probably just be put right back into the recovering situation.
 

BlackWaltzX

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 11, 2007
Messages
1,013
I'm saying no matter what you do chances are you'll die :ohwell: If you were at a high enough percent to be knocked away in need of recover, and you only have two Pikmin then chances are you would be KOd no matter what you did.

Throw away your Pikmin and you're left with high damage and no Pikmin being forced to fight of your opponents advances to try and KO you with tilts and Dash Attacks, not exactly Olimars strong spot. It doesn't matter if he gets an extra boost if you've got no Pikmin, you'll probably just be put right back into the recovering situation.
Even if you recover at all, you can in the least make them diminish their KO move, as they will generally use it.
Also, if you are good at dodging and whatnot, you can still stay in the game. Even if you get 1%, it makes it better for you. Even if they diminish their most used move, it's easier.
 

DarkStraw

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 4, 2008
Messages
179
Being pikminless is not that big of a deal, what a joke. Theres any number of things you can do to get pikmin without getting hit, Spotdoge/pluck one/spotdoge

roll spotdoge pluck, roll roll roll pluck pluck pluck, Nair jab or tilt pluckpluck
whistle cancel an attack, PLUCK
if you doge any move, or hit them with anything you get time to get at least one pikmin, then you can shield grab.
 

Puddin

Smash Lord
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Messages
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Na'wlans
Oh my god, look I am just saying the chances of surviving without Pikmin are slim, oh wow you can roll, spot dodge and pluck, so your opponent sits and watches you roll away and pluck a Pikmin?. Obviously your opponent will be waiting for you to try and roll away to pluck Pikmin, they are not going to let you get away with it without a fight, one hell of a fight at that.

I'm not saying it's impossible but it would be difficult to do.
 

Snail

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Messages
1,043
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Utrecht, The Netherlands
Oh my god, look I am just saying the chances of surviving without Pikmin are slim, oh wow you can roll, spot dodge and pluck, so your opponent sits and watches you roll away and pluck a Pikmin?. Obviously your opponent will be waiting for you to try and roll away to pluck Pikmin, they are not going to let you get away with it without a fight, one hell of a fight at that.

I'm not saying it's impossible but it would be difficult to do.
Hmm, yeah. I still think it's better to somehow get your opponent off the edge than to throw your pikmin to death and try to survive that way. Although, if it's the only way, it's better than nothing. Pluck is such a fast move that any mistake by your opponent will allow you to pluck, thus survive.
 

WhoseReality?

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
134
Guys, when you start off with three stocks, you've got to hold on to each one for as long as you possibly can. I don't care if I am stuck tilting if I'm alive a little longer to do a bit more damage. And all you need is one hit or one good roll dodge and you have time enough to get back in business.

Another point about this discussion, if you are trying to make it back to the stage with two or three pikmin, throw them at your opponent. time the lounge when they're not around and then they can come backto you quick with a whistle. And it'll really surprise people when you make it back with no pikmin. Even a lot of Olimar players aren't aware that having no pikmin to recover is better than having three.
 
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