Leave Luck to Heaven – Nintendo's First Mascot, Daitōryō (aka Napoleon) Support Thread

[BluePikmin11]

Here is a cool thing I found on Twitter, an artist drew a Hanafuda character in Smash concept way back in 2015, it honestly looks hilarious as hell:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I want this.

 

[Pacack]

Here is a cool thing I found on Twitter, an artist drew a Hanafuda character in Smash concept way back in 2015, it honestly looks hilarious as hell:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I want this.

Ah, yes. My favorite character, deck of cards.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Check out what I made for my Hanafuda character analysis:

It is based on the Smash 4 project proposals done long ago:

I should do more of these to be honest.

 

[SEGAGameBoy]

Never heard of him...... ADD ME TO SUPPORT LIST!!! lol

 

[smashkirby]

Here is a cool thing I found on Twitter, an artist drew a Hanafuda character in Smash concept way back in 2015, it honestly looks hilarious as hell:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I want this.

Check out what I made for my Hanafuda character analysis:

It is based on the Smash 4 project proposals done long ago:

I should do more of these to be honest.

Just when I think character selection in Smash couldn't get anymore wacky...

 

[Pacack]

Never heard of him...... ADD ME TO SUPPORT LIST!!! lol

Gladly!

Just when I think character selection in Smash couldn't get anymore wacky...

If it makes you any more receptive to the idea, my concept and Blue's are slightly different; mine of Daitoryo is that he would be the person on the cards rather than the box itself.

 

[smashkirby]

If it makes you any more receptive to the idea, my concept and Blue's are slightly different; mine of Daitoryo is that he would be the person on the cards rather than the box itself.

Oh, I hope you know I was saying that ironically. Personally, I LOVE it when retros and overall obscure characters are added to Smash (Daitoryo included).

Honestly, after the Wii Fit Trainer(s) and Duck Hunt, I wouldn't be shocked in any way if Sakurai ends up making Daitoryo work (and I'd be all the more happy for that).

 

[BluePikmin11]

I am going to try and draw a concept for my Hanafuda character analysis. I will be drawing mostly for one move, but it will help people easily visualize a Hanafuda character's moveset better. My skills in digital drawing have improved somewhat since working with Clip Studio Paint for art projects. The question is which animal or thing from the card art should I draw, the swan or the ribbons? :>

 

[BluePikmin11]

Hate to double post, but I finally finished that concept for the Hanafuda character:

Surprisingly, it was easy and fun to draw and color this.

 

[smashkirby]

Hate to double post, but I finally finished that concept for the Hanafuda character:

Surprisingly, it was easy and fun to draw and color this.

My goodness, this looks legendary! Also, I'm picturing Napoleon playing Yu-Gi-Oh right now, and I can't stop laughing. Like, I just can't.

 

[Pacack]

Well, despite the onslaught of character deconfirmations, Daitoryo is still alive. In fact, some of his biggest competition has been taken out in the form of Sheriff as an assist trophy.

That said, we face a new dilemma; Sakurai has stated that we shouldn't expect "too many" newcomers this time around. Our newest obstacle is limited space on the roster, which leaves the very idea of a new legacy character questionable.

Do you guys think a historical newcomer is still a possibility? For that matter, what about retros? Would the inclusion of a retro like Excitebiker or Prince Sable hurt our chances of a historical character since Sakurai might want to refrain from too many surprises? Is such an inclusion even happening with the return of the Ice Climbers, or is their return effectively our "retro" for this iteration?

 

[BluePikmin11]

Even with Sakurai-based choices likely being limited to a degree, I still see a surprise historical retro character happening. I will be extremely surprised if there is no surprise.

 

[GoodGrief741]

I will be extremely surprised if there is no surprise.

Maybe the surprise is that there’s no surprise.

That would be a surprising surprise.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I do not think that would be an intentional decision at all.

 

[Pacack]

Even with Sakurai-based choices likely being limited to a degree, I still see a surprise historical retro character happening. I will be extremely surprised if there is no surprise.

I'm inclined to agree, but I'm curious as to why people are expecting so few newcomers. Was there anything said aside from just not expecting "too many" newcomers? That leads me to believe we're getting ~10-12 unique newcomers, but people are saying we're going to get just 5 or so.

Maybe the surprise is that there’s no surprise.

That would be a surprising surprise.

That would be borderline out-of-character for Sakurai. Even the first game had Ness and Captain Falcon instead of someone like Bowser. Sakurai enjoys surprising people.

 

[Nonno Umby]

I'm inclined to agree, but I'm curious as to why people are expecting so few newcomers. Was there anything said aside from just not expecting "too many" newcomers? That leads me to believe we're getting ~10-12 unique newcomers, but people are saying we're going to get just 5 or so.

Exactly. Brawl had 18 newcomers, Smash for had 17, 21 if we count DLC.
"Not many newcomers" could still be around 10 unique characters (including Inklings and Ridley), plus a couple of echo fighters.
Personally I am expecting Elma, King K. Rool, Bandana Dee and Simon Belmont, but the rest I can't really say. Hopefully Daitoryo is among them.

 

[Pacack]

Exactly. Brawl had 18 newcomers, Smash for had 17, 21 if we count DLC.
"Not many newcomers" could still be around 10 unique characters (including Inklings and Ridley), plus a couple of echo fighters.
Personally I am expecting Elma, King K. Rool, Bandana Dee and Simon Belmont, but the rest I can't really say. Hopefully Daitoryo is among them.

My list is something like this for unique newcomers:

• Captain Toad
• Donkey Kong Character
• Ashley??
• Impa (Echo potentially)
• Bandana Dee
• Isabelle (Echo potentially)
• Elma
• Simon Belmont
• Retro
• Historical

That's 10 newcomers, and it touches the really critical most requested characters while still leaving room for some surprises.

 

[Questionmark222]

I support. Would be the best historical surprise character in my book, and a nice callback to Nintendo's origins. And the fact that Daitoryo's not a videogame character doesn't hurt his chances at all, since this is also the case for ROB.

 

[Parallel_Falchion]

Consider me a supporter. I love how Smash includes historical characters like R.O.B. and Mr. Game & Watch and a throwback even further with hanafuda representation would be great. Plus it will be funny to see all the "Who?" reactions from people.

 

[Pacack]

I support. Would be the best historical surprise character in my book, and a nice callback to Nintendo's origins. And the fact that Daitoryo's not a videogame character doesn't hurt his chances at all, since this is also the case for ROB.

Consider me a supporter. I love how Smash includes historical characters like R.O.B. and Mr. Game & Watch and a throwback even further with hanafuda representation would be great. Plus it will be funny to see all the "Who?" reactions from people.

I will add you both momentarily!

If you're interested, I highly recommend looking at the historical archive in the OP. It's full of little historical tidbits that you might find worth your time.

 

[Pacack]

I've updated the OP with some additional information on the historical significance of Duck Hunt and the Light Gun.

Duck Hunt is a character which is a little less obvious about its historical ties. However, I would argue that the character represents not only the extremely well-selling Duck Hunt video game, but also the light gun as a whole. This included much earlier points in Nintendo's history, including the Beam Gun, Laser Clay Shooting System, Wild Gunman, and Duck Hunt products released in the 1970s. These products, while technically not "video games" are an early example of electro-mechanical games, which greatly contributed to the rise of the early arcade industry.

Nintendo was the predominant producer of light guns for the home in Japan at this time, and they had obtained a contract with Magnavox to produce the light gun peripheral for the first home video game console, the Magnavox Odyssey. Nintendo's involvement in the project gave them direct insight into the North American video game market, which likely influenced them to bundle a Light Gun (alongside R.O.B.) with the NES in North America. If it were not for the Light Gun, Nintendo may have not entered the home video game market at all.

Fun fact; SEGA also entered the arcade game industry due to their involvement with a light gun product. Periscope was a 1965 electro-mechanical arcade game that revived the 1960 arcade industry and was SEGA's first foray from importer to manufacturer. This game was arguably the most important arcade game of its time (until Pong released in 1972.) It was also the first arcade game to be a quarter to play.

Also, I'll be working on a new moveset soon! I think my previous one is merely a mix of references without a coherent playstyle, and I want to try something a little different this time around.

Since Koi-Koi is a game centered around matching, I think my moveset's going to be tailored around using moves of the same type to increase damage dealt from combos. That's to say, if you used different moves with birds in them consecutively, you'd get a damage boost.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

If I wanted a character based on someone that actually existed in real life, I'd go for Lincoln from Codename Steam

 

[Pacack]

If I wanted a character based on someone that actually existed in real life, I'd go for Lincoln from Codename Steam

View attachment 149662

But, alas, Hanafuda is more important to Nintendo than Codename S.T.E.A.M. ever was. Surely this makes Daitoryo your second choice, no?

 

[Gallowglass]

I actually have this deck which I got in Japan. I think a Hanafuda stage would be better to represent the game then a character.

A stage in the same art style that moves through the months similar to Yoshi's stage. During certain month events would happen.

January would have the crane swoop down and attach players
July would have the Boar run across the stage like the cars in Onett stage.
November the Rain man appears and calls form storms.

This is just some examples. If anyone is interested I would fill out the whole stage idea.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

But, alas, Hanafuda is more important to Nintendo than Codename S.T.E.A.M. ever was. Surely this makes Daitoryo your second choice, no?

Well, Napoleon was apparently one of the anti-Christs foretold by Nostradamus

So that's pretty close to getting Satan in Smash

 

[Pacack]

I actually have this deck which I got in Japan. I think a Hanafuda stage would be better to represent the game then a character.

A stage in the same art style that moves through the months similar to Yoshi's stage. During certain month events would happen.

January would have the crane swoop down and attach players
July would have the Boar run across the stage like the cars in Onett stage.
November the Rain man appears and calls form storms.

This is just some examples. If anyone is interested I would fill out the whole stage idea.

Of course. I also own the deck (a few versions, actually) and the artwork for the cards would definitely make for a fantastic stage. Personally, I like the idea of the scenery changing to include the flowers of the month as the time goes on.

I'd love to see a whole stage concept if you're willing to put in the time to do it! Should I put you on the list of supporters?

Well, Napoleon was apparently one of the anti-Christs foretold by Nostradamus

So that's pretty close to getting Satan in Smash

Is that a yes? I would certainly add you to the list of supporters if you'd like.

 

[Gallowglass]

No don't put me on as a supporter. Like I said I rather have a stage than a character.

I'll try my best but I'm not the most artistic type. I'm more of the mechanics and function.

 

[Pacack]

I need an opinion, guys.

For my moveset, I'm planning on making moves of the same type do increasing damage, like how you need to match cards in Koi-Koi.

I'm conflicted, though, on whether I should keep all the traditional "yaku" pairs, including ones that aren't as intuitive (boar, deer, butterfly/moon and sake/cherry blossoms and sake,) or if I should limit it to only yaku that the player could figure out relatively easily (animals, ribbons, seasons).

I'm especially torn on the bright cards, since those don't have a consistent theme, but are easily the most iconic cards and the most useful to match in Koi-Koi.

For reference, these are the bright cards:

 

[Koopaul]

I kind of feel a Hanafuda stage might be better than a character. These obscure retro characters are usually a lot of fun because of how strange they are. Seeing a Napoleon looking guy running around with a deck of cards would be kind of strange but certainly not as fun as something like Mr. Game & Watch.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

I love the idea of a hanafuda character. The idea of using cards and summoning card things, it tickles me fancy. Also I feel until something happens like Game and Watch being called the oldest character in the game again I have some confidence in Daitoryo. I feel the biggest hurdle to a hanafuda character is the smaller roster. IMO we can expect 6-10 newcomers not counting echos. Space is kinda cramped, hopefully a hanafuda rep makes it.

 

[Pacack]

I kind of feel a Hanafuda stage might be better than a character. These obscure retro characters are usually a lot of fun because of how strange they are. Seeing a Napoleon looking guy running around with a deck of cards would be kind of strange but certainly not as fun as something like Mr. Game & Watch.

Well, I certainly wouldn't say no to a stage (I'd take any hanafuda stuff I can get,) but a hanafuda character could be a really quirky and fun way to represent Nintendo's origins. I mean, a Napoleon-looking guy running around with cards could be kinda hilarious alongside the likes of Mario and Link, right?

Plus, I imagine that, if someone brought up Mr. Game and Watch before his inclusion, a lot of people would have also said that a Game and Watch stage would be good enough too. That said, we got a character, and since then he's been well-received because of how Sakurai included him.

I think that he would be well received if he was a character. That said, you're more than welcome to your stance. Would you be interested in brainstorming some ideas for how a hanafuda stage could work?

I love the idea of a hanafuda character. The idea of using cards and summoning card things, it tickles me fancy. Also I feel until something happens like Game and Watch being called the oldest character in the game again I have some confidence in Daitoryo. I feel the biggest hurdle to a hanafuda character is the smaller roster. IMO we can expect 6-10 newcomers not counting echos. Space is kinda cramped, hopefully a hanafuda rep makes it.

I'll add you to the support list, Phantom! :D

 

[Koopaul]

I mean, a Napoleon-looking guy running around with cards could be kinda hilarious alongside the likes of Mario and Link, right?

Plus, I imagine that, if someone brought up Mr. Game and Watch before his inclusion, a lot of people would have also said that a Game and Watch stage would be good enough too. That said, we got a character, and since then he's been well-received because of how Sakurai included him.

Perhaps. I don't know. The problem is because he looks like Napoleon he wouldn't have his own iconic look. Unless he got a redesign that was very striking, I think he would be kind of a boring looking character. Mr. Game & Watch is a 2D shadow that beeps and boops and moves with missing frames. It's very striking and quirky. But that's just my stance.

I'm think if I was 10 years old and knew nothing about Hanafuda cards, and saw some Napoleon looking guy I might not like him. But as a 10 year old I'd definitely would think Mr.G&W would be funny and cool.

I actually saw someone suggest a walking deck of cards. I think that would be a lot more fun.

Would you be interested in brainstorming some ideas for how a hanafuda stage could work?

Well yes. I thought about a stage where you fight on top of a table in a Japanese home from 1889. On the table is a deck of Hanafuda cards. Randomly a card will be drawn from the deck and float in the air. The whole stage will then transform based on the picture on the card. Like a beautiful garden or hillside all drawn in the same 2D illustated style. The stage then transforms back into the Japanese home and the process repeats.

 

[HypnoMaster372]

I would be totally up for anything Hanafuda-related whether a character or a stage, especially since it’s how Nintendo begun!

 

[Arcadenblog]

Add me to the list! In terms of bombshell retro reps, I can't really think of much else that falls within the same leagues as Mr. Game & Watch.

IIRC, someone here brought up the idea of a sentient Virtual Boy.

 

[Pacack]

I would be totally up for anything Hanafuda-related whether a character or a stage, especially since it’s how Nintendo begun!

Add me to the list! In terms of bombshell retro reps, I can't really think of much else that falls within the same leagues as Mr. Game & Watch.

IIRC, someone here brought up the idea of a sentient Virtual Boy.

I'll add you both to the list of supporters!

As for non-Daitoryo bombshell retros, the other prominent contenders are probably Diskun and the Joker from Nintendo's western "trump" cards.

Other than those two, Popeye would count, but that one's a bit iffy since he's third party and won't be in the common domain until 2024 in the US.

Oh, and someone on here once suggested the kangaroo from the Mini Game Series toy line, which would be a neat toy era representative.

 

[Dreamking]

I like the idea of Hanafuda getting recognition in a Smash Bros game. I've had the Hanafuda theme on my 3DS for years. I like the idea of Daitoryo being a character in the roster. I wonder what his trailer would be like. I imagine something like a tunnel through time which shows clips of Nintendo's past with a clock running backwards. As we get close to the end, the screen lights up and when it fades, we find ourselves in a lush and colorful scenery in the style of Hanafuda.

If not a playable character, then make Daitoryo as an Assist Trophy and have a Hanafuda themed stage.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

This one is on my potential WTF/retro characters list so count me in

The only other likely WTF/retro is probably I can see is mach rider because of the gun sakurai wanted from that toy and his song is in melee and forward and like the cards referenced in quite a few games

 

[Pacack]

I like the idea of Hanafuda getting recognition in a Smash Bros game. I've had the Hanafuda theme on my 3DS for years. I like the idea of Daitoryo being a character in the roster. I wonder what his trailer would be like. I imagine something like a tunnel through time which shows clips of Nintendo's past with a clock running backwards. As we get close to the end, the screen lights up and when it fades, we find ourselves in a lush and colorful scenery in the style of Hanafuda.

If not a playable character, then make Daitoryo as an Assist Trophy and have a Hanafuda themed stage.

This one is on my potential WTF/retro characters list so count me in

The only other likely WTF/retro is probably I can see is mach rider because of the gun sakurai wanted from that toy and his song is in melee and forward and like the cards referenced in quite a few games

I'll add you both to the list of supporters in a moment!

By the by, all, it occurs to me that there's a better series icon for hanafuda in Smash than Nintendo's old Japanese logo.

This is the Marufuku seal, which originates from Nintendo's origins as "Marufuku Nintendo" way back when they were first created. The image above was made by someone else, but I'm going to look for a larger size and make one for the OP.

 

[Pacack]

How's it look, folks?

The logo is 福 "fuku," the Japanese word for "fortune" inside of a 丸 "maru," or circle. 丸 also can mean "purity" or "complete," so when combined, 丸福 means "complete/pure fortune." Fitting for a company that produces cards used in games of chance.

This symbol appears everywhere in Nintendo's early history. It's basically Nintendo's seal of quality from that time period. It's all over Nintendo's original Kyoto building and its hanafuda products.

Spoiler: Images

Note that the first image has an additional symbol with "Napoleon" and ナポレオン intersecting in + shape. (ナポレオン is simply Napoleon in Japanese.) This could potentially also act as a series symbol, but it's less common than the Marufuku symbol.

 

[Gallowglass]

So I haven't had a lot of time working on the Hanafuda stage but I'm working on it. This is what I have so far.

The stage is based on the cards and art style but doesn't focus on any particular game (like koi koi or oonsoo). The background is going to have paper cutouts of the flowers and artwork (similar to a Paper Mario). It has 12 segments with each one representing the flowers and months they have. Each segment last for 1 minute before transitioning to the next month. I was going to do 5 minutes per segment to give it a full hour but then I realize that is a lot of animation. He time you start the level it starts in a random month.

I have a few things I'm debating on.

1. Should the stage platforms change during the months and if they do how do do the transition? Or should they be like Smashville and have it change in the background but really effect the overall landscape of the stage.

2. I feel like the ribbons should do something as well whether it be give items or stat boots. Also whether the minor animals play a role or just be back drop?

3. How should some of the major images interact? Like March's and December's bright cards or the sake cup.

For those who don't know the decks here is the list of all the cards. It goes January to December Left to Right.