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Jungle's Sheik video archive (critiques wanted)

KirbyKaze

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
17,679
Location
Spiral Mountain
grab edge or roll to edge + lightshield

pick one

when marth goes behind you, uair or turn around and u-tilt or u-smash if they're in ko range (70ish). it won't work every time though, it's sort of weird.

if they're teching away when they go behind you (fox) just dash attack. i find it not too hard to follow if you wd back when fox goes behind you, it makes it easier to react to his tech rolls with dash attacks and grabs and stuff.
 

DtJ Jungle

Check out my character in #GranblueFantasy
BRoomer
Joined
Jul 29, 2008
Messages
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Grancypher
I don't really know the marth matchup, I don't have alot of experience in it, so thanks for the edgeguard tips.
 

KirbyKaze

Smash Legend
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Nov 18, 2007
Messages
17,679
Location
Spiral Mountain
i find dash attack increasingly becoming failure against marth so now i just do needles and grab and aerials and less dash attack but still some dash attack but mostly aerials and needles and grab and a lot of shield + wd out of shield.
 

KirbyKaze

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
17,679
Location
Spiral Mountain
what i notice vs fox is that when you grab you often just stand in place after a move and grab. or you dash forward + jc grab but then you're just outside of his range and he punishes you.

you need to get a bit closer to them when going for grabs.

similarly, you're too close when you do a lot of f-tilts. f-tilt as pressure in close range is bad. the times you f-tilt in close range should be grab attempts, i think. i think you have your "time to f-tilt" and "time to grab" ideas backwards. f-tilt is the one you do when you're sort of far away. grab is the one you do when they're close.
 

DtJ Jungle

Check out my character in #GranblueFantasy
BRoomer
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Messages
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Ok. I get waht you are saying about the ftilt thing.

how do i get closer when going for the grab?
 

R3N0

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 29, 2006
Messages
1,899
needle camp the balls off of marth, when he approaches do a full jump, whatever. but make sure to space / or use needle grab. just by watching the first match i saw u need help with platform chasing. when he bounces on top of a platform from your dthrow wave land onto the platform immediately and wait for his tech / or roll or get upattack . if he get up attacks, regrab and well the whole point is to regrab fair.

if he does that annoying di where u can't ftilt fair out of dthrow then u usmash or utilt into uair or utilt into ftilt into fair.
 

DtJ Jungle

Check out my character in #GranblueFantasy
BRoomer
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Jul 29, 2008
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Grancypher
cool thanks guys I'll keep this all in mind when i play this weekend.

More vids to come!
 

soap

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 24, 2006
Messages
7,229
Location
Cleveland, Ohio
your edgeguarding on marth was nonexistant.

get to the edge and pretend to bair him then watch him go low and get edgehogged.

also instead of just dancing around waiting for his approach use grounded needles and fake charges to get him to commit to a jump or a shield then pressure intelligently with spacing.

havent watched fox yet
 

DtJ Jungle

Check out my character in #GranblueFantasy
BRoomer
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I didn't really know how to edgeguard marth before i made this thread. Experience johns.


Thanks for the tips on baiting soap :D
 

KirbyKaze

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
17,679
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Spiral Mountain
Massive block of text.

You really need to cut back on dash attack. You try to combo it when it won't, and approach with it a lot. Same goes for D-smash, but you start catching on and using it less at various points. Unfortunately, this is in part because you start using more dash attack.

You're really good about sniping him with needles. This is good. Now start grabbing the edge and hogging him or back airing him. F-tilt (IMO) is better than D-smash when they go straight at you with Illusion, it's easier to time because the initial hitbox is out longer. You seem to miss when he illusions and is far away from the stage, so work on that timing. Alternatively, grab the edge or F-tilt / D-smash / D-tilt at him.

You SH needles too much in close combat and very unsafely. You do a lot of SH rising needles, but those are punishable. Needles give barely any shield stun, and if you miss you get hurt. What soap does is much safer, if you like SH needles in close quarters, he SH needle charges and if they come at him with SHFFLs he just unloads them and grabs them, and if they shield, he just cancels and wavelands away / spaces Fair. I modified his strategy and do Nair --> grab if they block because it's gayer (IMO) but Fair spacing is also very good. SH rising needles without a platform like Yoshi's or Pokemon Stadium (neutral position) or FoD at the right height is a bad idea. Too much can go wrong.

The Sheik ditto(s) were basically you killing yourself, getting B-thrown into a gimp, and missing the regrab or tech chase and being punished for it. I don't have a real comment other than that.

For tech chase, if he doesn't tech, you can just crouch right next to him pretty safely and CC his get-up attack into dash attack or whatever you want so long as it's not too weird. Spawn told me this and it's pretty gay. Marths do it into tipper sometimes but for your purposes it's probably just regrab or dash attack. Works until like 100.

I lied. F-tilt is very good against Fox pretty much all the time except when he's blatantly ducking and waiting for it, and when you're so close he can punish it.

After like 30 if you're having trouble regrab tech chasing, you can just F-tilt and knock him over if he techs in place, or dash attack if he tech rolls. It's easier to hit. It also does more damage on the initial blow. It's also very easy to follow with crouching stuff because most of the time F-tilt will knock him over (they'll try to sidestep / shine) and if it doesn't you can just tech chase from it or combo from it. You miss a lot of tech chase and it's not necessary to do a billion regrabs, you just need them high enough so they can't CC your F-tilt during their tech.
 

soap

Smash Hero
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Jan 24, 2006
Messages
7,229
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Cleveland, Ohio
ya but a billion regrabs is pretty mentally demoralizing

kk, i prefer the fair spacing cuz i use the autocancel almost everytime cuz i play drephen and he will sidestep all my aerials regardless, and if i try to delay nair on his shield he always calls it and slaps me first.

so i autocancel fair and grab his sidestep lag.

btw the timing for teh fullhop fair autocancel is fastfall at the peak of the fastfall, fair a second later. Do that after full hop needle put away. It works good to rev. full hop needle and come down with that on the back of shields > grab.
 

soap

Smash Hero
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Jan 24, 2006
Messages
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Lol all these anti-Drew strategies.

I hope you beat him one of these days.
only played him in tourney the one time.

but i was rusty and he had revival of melee sheik dittoes the weekend before.

But ya i got all mad and embarrased and went home and made some strats m2k style haha.
 

DtJ Jungle

Check out my character in #GranblueFantasy
BRoomer
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Thanks for all the advice.

Just a comment. I was having needle store johns for some reason (I normally don't) and so those rising needles were supposed to be needle stores. Even the ones that somehow worked on accident. But that's just me johning and having to work more on doing it consistently.
 

soap

Smash Hero
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u gotta hold the b button down, release b button and trigger at same time. get into that habit and u will never mess up
 

soap

Smash Hero
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Messages
7,229
Location
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i used to mess it up too.

but if u set a standard for something in regards to tech that u do everytime, u will never mess it up.

its like a free throw, mechanics yield reproducability.
 

soap

Smash Hero
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Jan 24, 2006
Messages
7,229
Location
Cleveland, Ohio
ya, jungle, u like didn't have to pick up sheik to hang out on the sheik boards lol.

nobody here is a sheik main anymore.
 

DtJ Jungle

Check out my character in #GranblueFantasy
BRoomer
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hehehehe. but i like her :(

hey if i suck so much haley why are you saying you want to learrrn from me

HUH HUH

:D

chiyochan top tier.
 

Drephen

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 25, 2004
Messages
3,008
Location
Columbus, OH
WHY DO YOU ALL HAVE LITTLE ANIME GIRLS AS YOUR AVATAR

i dont wanna have to fit in but i will if i have to : /
 
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