Joysticks... I've tried them all. I'm presenting a better solution.

[Morin0]

Badair, are you still letting people test these? I live in the USA and I would LOVE to try one of these controllers out and write a review for it. I actually have an assignment for my English class where I'm supposed to review a product so this would come in handy if I were given the chance. I also would not mind sending my OEM 64 controller to you in the future so you can mod it.

 

[Theftz22]

Potentially interested (mainly for the kart 64 community), depending on Boom's review. How much is your current price?

Wait, just saw prices in second post. Those still accurate?

 

[badair]

Badair, are you still letting people test these? I live in the USA and I would LOVE to try one of these controllers out and write a review for it. I actually have an assignment for my English class where I'm supposed to review a product so this would come in handy if I were given the chance. I also would not mind sending my OEM 64 controller to you in the future so you can mod it.

Hi, thanks for the offer but I'm not looking for more testers right now.

Potentially interested (mainly for the kart 64 community), depending on Boom's review. How much is your current price?

Wait, just saw prices in second post. Those still accurate?

Yep, still accurate.

 

[badair]

I can p2p someone tonight, I got pj64k up and running. Connection lags for some reason in kaillera even though my ping is great

 

[kys]

Ping has (mostly) nothing to do with lag. Either your internet connection is bad or you can't run project64k. Test the emulator offline to see if there is lag there, and close all your internet sucking programs like instant messengers, web browsers, torrenting porn, etc.

Also, sometimes your ISP will just suck or high internet traffic times cause lag.

 

[badair]

Ping has (mostly) nothing to do with lag. Either your internet connection is bad or you can't run project64k. Test the emulator offline to see if there is lag there, and close all your internet sucking programs like instant messengers, web browsers, torrenting porn, etc.

Also, sometimes your ISP will just suck or high internet traffic times cause lag.

Torrents; I figured it out right after I posted. Thanks. Had a lot of fun!

 

[Battlecow]

He didn't deny that it was porn

just sayin'

 

[mikeduncan23]

Any word from boom yet?

 

[badair]

Any word from boom yet?

just chatted with boom for a bit, and he's still waiting on the package. :S

 

[Purtle]

Wow, these look pretty promising.

I hope the review from boom is good.

A bit surprised that you use graphite though as I'm pretty sure the tamiya (spelling) ceramic grease is typically the better choice.

I may have to get one of these if people say its good

 

[badair]

Wow, these look pretty promising.

I hope the review from boom is good.

A bit surprised that you use graphite though as I'm pretty sure the tamiya (spelling) ceramic grease is typically the better choice.

I may have to get one of these if people say its good

I had some tamiya shipped to me from the UK several days ago, it should get here soon. I'm excited to try it. When my next batch of wii joysticks comes in, I'm going to experiment with strectching thin rubber over the hole to keep dust and skittle crumbs out of the stick.

Last week I received a pm from someone here who bought one and already received it in the mail, and it was a very glowing review. Maybe he/she will post in this thread.

EDIT: prices updated because I don't like paypal or their fees... 5$ discount for other payments listed. See post #2.

 

[SuPeRbOoM]

So I got the controller today in the mail and did some quick half an hour testing with it.

This isn't my full review, just so you guys know this in advance. Just one major(and minor) things I've noticed.

Movement on this control stick is amaaaaaaaazing. You guys won't be disappointed with moving around at all. There is no stiffness like the regular n64 control stick, just smooth control movement.

The major problem I'm having with this is the lack of max range.
http://www.livestream.com/isaissb/video?clipId=pla_812f7b9a-4b11-485a-813b-20891b7017b2
This stick failed the edge to edge test. I get lower heights than c button jumps lol! I've addressed this problem to badair already, and he's going to find a solution to the max range problem and send me another stick for more testing?

Other than the max range problem, I feel as if these sticks are fantastic to use and general movement is just plain smooth. You won't have any problems with these sticks once the range is fixed!

I'm going to test some more on this stick and make footnotes about other games that don't require precision like ssb does.

 

[badair]

Thanks boom! Wow, how embarassing. Back to the drawing board...

I've decided to test all joysticks using this program to make sure they give full range values in all directions:
http://s9.zetaboards.com/Nintendo_64_Forever/topic/7349580/1/#new

It's an extremely useful program, and tonight is the first time I've used it.

The following images were made using the part of the program that maps the max distance of the 8 corners of the octagonal gate:

Here's a graph of one of my sticks that I've been working on tonight (notice the shortness in the diagonals, especially the top right... this one still needs work):
(EDIT: I'm going to intall a special configuration tool for MESS for my controller, because this reading may be off. I seem to get full range in the top right diagonal on the console... the edge jump works by mashing NE.)

here is a hori mini pad. (EDIT: this may be a defective controller. not my pic)

here is a brand new original controller: (not my pic)

here is a gc/wii stick wired into a controller with an ATMEGA8: (not my pic)

EDIT: of the 50 or 60+ controllers I have, this is the best OEM joystick with < 1/8" deadzone at the top of the stick:

I thought it would have gotten a much better reading than that.


Check out the n64 Forever thread above for more details on the program, and for other joystick examples. Special thanks to Sanni from N64 Forever for writing that program. If you'd like to use this program yourself, pm me and I'll walk you through it (if you have Windows). You need to use the MESS emulator. Or a flashcart...

I'm going to put orders on hold for now, maybe about a week, until I can jig these up for max range. I'm waiting on wii controllers in the mail anyway. Btw, if superboom were a paying customer, he could return that controller for a full refund or exchange. He would have been out only the $5.xx dollars to ship it back because I would have refunded the original shipping cost too. the other controllers I tested tonight do happen to pass the edge jump test. But that's irrelevant, because quality control is everything. I don't want any more range deficits passing unnoticed.

Thanks for the patience, and I'll be sure to keep you guys posted. Yes, I am going to send boom another stick once I get it all worked out.

 

[SuPeRbOoM]

bumping cause I didn't even realize badair edited his post

 

[mikeduncan23]

Regardless of whether this works out like everyone hopes, thanks for putting in the time to develop this controller. It looks very promising.

 

[Battlecow]

Yeah, note that the hori mini pad is most likely not a brand-new out-of-box model like the standard controller

 

[badair]

Mike, it's been a fun project. Thank you guys for helping me make them better. I hope they turn out.

I may have the solution to aligning these correctly.

The original white housing with the arms that hold the gears happens to have a small, round whole underneath it in the very center, but it doesn't go all the way through. I drilled a 1/16 hole all the way through it, and also through the bottom of the Wii stick's box.

Here's the cool part: there are 3 small black screws on the N64 controller--two by the mempak and one on the joystick box. I screwed one through the bottom of the white housing (it's the perfect size so as to have the threads cut into the plastic) and then up through the wii stick box. It's the perfect length as well: it goes just far enough into the stick box so as to not touch the moving parts. I laid down the epoxy, placed the stick box over the screw, and then I squared up the sides of the box with the white housing. The glue is drying right now. Edit: so far, so good.

I have a couple other tricks in mind to fine tune the range down the road. Fingers crossed...

 

[kys]

I had a quick question. I recently bought a modded N64 controller from a retro gaming shop for $15. If I can do the edge to edge, would you be willing to look at it and possibly replicate it?

I don't know anything about the specific parts, so that would be up to you to figure out, but I would be willing to send it to you to dissect and whatnot. When I get a chance to test it I'll let you know.

 

[TranqJim]

I just joined smashboards solely for this thread. I've been trying to fix controllers for months now and I'm very interested in one your controllers Badair. I have like at least 8 ****y ones that I'd be willing to trade/giveaway for your benefit

 

[badair]

I had a quick question. I recently bought a modded N64 controller from a retro gaming shop for $15. If I can do the edge to edge, would you be willing to look at it and possibly replicate it?

I don't know anything about the specific parts, so that would be up to you to figure out, but I would be willing to send it to you to dissect and whatnot. When I get a chance to test it I'll let you know.

Hi kys,

I'm curious what you mean by "modded." Sounds like a great find! If you mean that it has a GC/Wii joystick in it, it probably has an AVR or a PIC chip or something in the circuit. I'm definitely interested!

Actually, the other day I ordered 5 PIC boards and a compatible PIC programmer to mess around with. I know very little about those but I'll toy around with them some and see what happens. If nothing else, I'll learn a little. I still think the way I'm doing it is the way to go.

I just joined smashboards solely for this thread. I've been trying to fix controllers for months now and I'm very interested in one your controllers Badair. I have like at least 8 ****y ones that I'd be willing to trade/giveaway for your benefit

Hey Jim,

You should take a moment to look around. There's a lot of helpful information here if you are into emulation/Smash Brothers. Sounds cool! I'd be interested in exploring that with you down the road. For now though I'm experimenting with these until I'm confortable with the result. Last night I got carried away with my experiments and ruined 2 more wii sticks. I've almost got the range right. It's very close. BTW, I'm using a different part of the test program that returns numeric values rather than the diagrams I posted.

Still waiting on the shipment of Wii controllers. Pretty much out of Wii sticks now.

 

[TranqJim]

Yeah just let me know if you're in need of controllers because I have about 12-15 at the moment and 8-10 being virtually unusable (for ssb that is). I could even take them apart a bit to speed up your process of fixing them. All in good time though

 

[badair]

Yeah just let me know if you're in need of controllers because I have about 12-15 at the moment and 8-10 being virtually unusable (for ssb that is). I could even take them apart a bit to speed up your process of fixing them. All in good time though

Sweet. Rain check? I'm set on N64 controllers for the time being... They're literally everywhere in my apartment. There are even some in my bed.

 

[YouWereAMouse]

Well, I finally found time and a computer to give my testimonial/mini-review and smashboards just logged me out and now it's gone lol.

So, to summarize: I love my new stick. At first it felt "loose" like on a gamecube controller, but I quickly realized that it was just very free and sensitive, and accurate too. I'm sure I need more time to fully adapt to it, but so far I've already lowered 3 of my BTT records by a few hundredths of a second to a couple tenths.

Overall, the accuracy, ranges, sensitivity, and snap back time are all great. As long as the durability holds up on top these sticks seem like "one stick to rule them all" because the internal parts look like they'll never need to be replaced.

I wish I had more to say but I haven't had a ton of time with it yet. Most importantly though I should say thanks!

 

[B Link]

Thanks boom! Wow, how embarassing. Back to the drawing board...

I've decided to test all joysticks using this program to make sure they give full range values in all directions:
http://s9.zetaboards.com/Nintendo_64_Forever/topic/7349580/1/#new

It's an extremely useful program, and tonight is the first time I've used it.

The following images were made using the part of the program that maps the max distance of the 8 corners of the octagonal gate:

Here's a graph of one of my sticks that I've been working on tonight (notice the shortness in the diagonals, especially the top right... this one still needs work):
(EDIT: I'm going to intall a special configuration tool for MESS for my controller, because this reading may be off. I seem to get full range in the top right diagonal on the console... the edge jump works by mashing NE.)

here is a hori mini pad. (EDIT: this may be a defective controller. not my pic)

here is a brand new original controller: (not my pic)

here is a gc/wii stick wired into a controller with an ATMEGA8: (not my pic)

EDIT: of the 50 or 60+ controllers I have, this is the best OEM joystick with < 1/8" deadzone at the top of the stick:

I thought it would have gotten a much better reading than that.


Check out the n64 Forever thread above for more details on the program, and for other joystick examples. Special thanks to Sanni from N64 Forever for writing that program. If you'd like to use this program yourself, pm me and I'll walk you through it (if you have Windows). You need to use the MESS emulator. Or a flashcart...

I'm going to put orders on hold for now, maybe about a week, until I can jig these up for max range. I'm waiting on wii controllers in the mail anyway. Btw, if superboom were a paying customer, he could return that controller for a full refund or exchange. He would have been out only the $5.xx dollars to ship it back because I would have refunded the original shipping cost too. the other controllers I tested tonight do happen to pass the edge jump test. But that's irrelevant, because quality control is everything. I don't want any more range deficits passing unnoticed.

Thanks for the patience, and I'll be sure to keep you guys posted. Yes, I am going to send boom another stick once I get it all worked out.

This is an interesting link

 

[AJS]

This is very interesting

first off i've been trying to fix these n64 thumbstick analogs for ages, and i think you might have found one of the best solutions and the best mothod for the solution. I have tried many ways to fix them and made up a few myself, they often went bad (at the worst times)

The posts I find are from 2007, which is a pain. Recently I have bought a gs-stlye n64 analog off of lukie games, yesterday in fact.

If you would like I would gladly do a review of one of these for you, and include a comparsion to the gs style. If not then i am really interested in booms review and see how well it is tested. I'd put it to mario party for a day or 5

I have put several reviews on amazon.co.uk (I'm in Ireland) if you would like to see them I can send them to you.

Get work, it is not easy to glue those kind of bits together and not make a solid lump, I have considered trying. oh by the way instead of butchering wii motes for thumbsticks have you thought about buying them off of ebay? it would be much cheaper.

I'll enjoy reading about the outcome of your project (that is assuming you not done)

 

[Naisora]

Wow this is awesome. I always did hate the way the 64 analogs felt. Especially when for some reason it falls off the center and starts hanging on a corner :/. Hopefully this controller turns out well so I can buy a couple of these babys. Not just for SSB, but other games as well.

 

[badair]

For those of you wondering, apparently my shipment of controllers was lost in transit... I've been in touch with the seller.

 

[badair]

Good news:

"We will reship to you immediately and hope you will get the new package soon .
And hope our instant communication and way of handling the problem will not influence your good immpression of our shop as something happened in transit is out of our control.
If the package still does not arrive in time ,please be free to email us we would like to give you a satisfied answer then !
And it will be highly appreciated that if you can contact us once the first parcel turns up."

I think shipping time is like 3 weeks though.

 

[rustyw]

You're AWESOME for doing this! I'm really excited about these, and a glowing review from Superboomfan is, to me, as good an endorsement as they come. Are you waiting to ship controllers until you get range issues figured out? If I ordered some controllers from you should I expect to receive them with the range issues perfected?

 

[badair]

You're AWESOME for doing this! I'm really excited about these, and a glowing review from Superboomfan is, to me, as good an endorsement as they come. Are you waiting to ship controllers until you get range issues figured out? If I ordered some controllers from you should I expect to receive them with the range issues perfected?

Thanks! Yes- to both questions. I'm in a bind right now though, because before I can do either I need to get some joysticks to work on. They should be here in a couple weeks, I imagine. I also got some PIC chips to toy around with, if all else fails. But I don't think it will come down to that.

 

[AtotheZ]

I'll definitely buy a couple when they are ready, glad you are doing everyone such a service

 

[badair]

Update:

I'm filing a dispute with BillMeLater for the controllers I purchased, obviously this eBay seller is trying to scam me. I talked to a rep today on the phone. The seller stopped replying to my messages. I guess he didn't realize that BillMeLater has a later filing deadline for disputes than does PayPal.

I'd like to order another handful, maybe 3 or 4 for now. Money is really tight right now; I'm wrapping up finals week and then I'll start working over the break. I don't want to make any promises about when I'll have some more controllers but I'm doing my best to get this project back up and running.

To those of you who have expressed interest in the project--thanks for your patience.

I'm not going to let these 50+ n64 controllers in my closet go to waste!

 

[prisonchild]

what colours do you have? i guess with fifty controllers you must have pretty much every colour...

 

[badair]

actually, mostly just grey, black, green, and blue. I have a handful of clear purple ones and maybe one red one.

 

[rustyw]

What if I were to purchase one now? Would that speed up the process at all, seeing as how money seems to be a bottleneck at this point?

 

[badair]

What if I were to purchase one now? Would that speed up the process at all, seeing as how money seems to be a bottleneck at this point?

I bought 3 Wii controllers on credit, which will give me 6 joysticks. I bought from the U.S. this time, so the estimated delivery is between Dec. 17 and Dec. 21.

Thanks though!

 

[badair]

first off i've been trying to fix these n64 thumbstick analogs for ages, and i think you might have found one of the best solutions and the best mothod for the solution. I have tried many ways to fix them and made up a few myself, they often went bad (at the worst times)

The posts I find are from 2007, which is a pain. Recently I have bought a gs-stlye n64 analog off of lukie games, yesterday in fact.

If you would like I would gladly do a review of one of these for you, and include a comparsion to the gs style. If not then i am really interested in booms review and see how well it is tested. I'd put it to mario party for a day or 5

I have put several reviews on amazon.co.uk (I'm in Ireland) if you would like to see them I can send them to you.

Get work, it is not easy to glue those kind of bits together and not make a solid lump, I have considered trying. oh by the way instead of butchering wii motes for thumbsticks have you thought about buying them off of ebay? it would be much cheaper.

I'll enjoy reading about the outcome of your project (that is assuming you not done)

Somehow I missed this post. What do you mean about buying them on ebay? Do you mean the individual joysticks? If anyone knows anything about how to buy bare joysticks (perhaps someone in the electronics mfg industry), I'd really like to know! I'd like the exact same ones from the OEM wii controllers.

 

[badair]

Controllers are in, I'll get right to work when I get back from the holidays on the 26th.

 

[SuPeRbOoM]

gimieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee one

Spoiler

for a review

 

[badair]

Ok, I'm back now--we got snowed out of my hometown. I'm getting to work.