Issue(s) with hovering after teleport

[Clockmire]

Hey guys,

So I've been playing around with Mewtwo and I noticed a couple of things about his hover that have confused me and I wanted to check if they were a) known, b) intended, or c) I'm just messing up my controls:

1. Falling off of a platform and teleporting (without using my second jump - I have tap jump off) apparently prevents me from being able to hover afterwards.

2. Jumping, doing an aerial attack, then teleporting also prevents me from hovering.

I'm a bit paranoid and, in all honesty, hope that it IS just me messing up. Any confirmation would be greatly appreciated though!

 

[DrinkingFood]

PMBR had some dumb idea that you should only be able to jump or hover after teleport in really weird, random situations
The design is really ****ty for being so inconsistent, apparently PMBR was worried that teleport was going to be a silly move
Newsflash- it's a fast teleport in a movement based game of course it's gonna be ****ing silly
so they made it have some awkward technicalities, and then told nobody about said technicalities, and there are now several threads/posts about it
basically, roll a dice twice; if the second number is higher than the first, you can jump after your teleport
otherwise, **** you, you deserve to die for going for swag ass teleport edgeguards

 

[Endeby]

I'm pretty sure you can always hover/jump if you teleport while on the ground. Using it in the air, however, will always eat your hover/jump. MK's Dimensional cape has a pretty similar mechanic.

Seem pretty consistent if you ask me, or am I missing something here?

edit: Okay, so you can actually use teleport for a short time after you jump, but not after just walking off a platform. Interesting. Would be great if someone in the PMBR could tell us how this work.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I will consider testing this to find out the answer. I'm not from the BR but I could probably find out if I could just understand what exactly you were asking.

 

[oRi0n]

He wants to know if the following mechanics are known and intended, known but unintended (might need to be fixed), or unknown and unintended (again might need to be fixed):

1. Walking/falling off a platform and teleporting removes your ability to hover (whereas if you had jumped and teleported you WOULD be able to hover).

2. Performing a single jump and doing an aerial attack then teleporting (without using your second jump) removes your ability to hover (whereas if you had just jumped but had NOT used the aerial attack you WOULD be able to hover).

I haven't personally tested either of those to verify, but I can definitely confirm that you should be able to single jump > teleport > hover (or even do a super short hover followed by your second jump). I do this as a follow up all the time (I have L bound to jump to assist with hovering) by simply hitting and holding L to full jump, hitting teleport at the top of that jump, then you come out of the teleport in a hover and chase the opponent with aerials. Obviously your second jump is far more useful than hovering if your opponent was at high % and is really way up there, of course at that point you probably shouldn't be using your big upward attacks (up throw and fair) unless the opponent is at kill % anyway (or unless you're super duper pro with uair and you can place it accurately enough to hit them straight up and over the ceiling).

 

[KuroganeHammer]

OK my theory is:

I think that once you've fallen a certain distance after your first jump and you use teleport you won't be able to use your second jump

walking off ledges seems to make the game think that you've fallen that distance already which is why it won't let you use it

inconsistent, yeah

 

[Clockmire]

Right, ok. So it is an actual inconsistency - I was wondering if I was doing something strange for a while!

@ Aerodrome: I played around with it a bit more today, and did notice what you mentioned, namely even if you jump from the ground you can't hover/second jump out of teleport if you wait too long. I think it's a time mechanic rather than distance, though - you can fast fall and still be able to teleport then hover at much lower heights then if you didn't, for example.

BUT this doesn't relate to the problem with aerials cancelling the second jump - I can uair and teleport in a shorter time than the longest interval in which I simply jump then teleport and was still able to hover, but the hover/second jump was still lost after doing the aerial.

So I guess 3 things can make you lose your second jump out of teleport - 1. Waiting too long after using your first jump, 2. Falling from a platform or edge instead of jumping and 3. Using an aerial prior to teleporting.

No reason why this is the case, though!

Oh, and possibly more things of course. I think there's some issue with the edge as well - if you jump from the ground and grab the ledge then you can hover, but you can't otherwise? I'll investigate some more.

If anyone knows any other instances in which you lose your second/jump hover feel free to post! Finding all the situations would probably be beneficial

 

[KuroganeHammer]

merged your posts

It's probably intentional because of how versatile Mewtwo's recovery is. I am not sure if the inconsistencies were intentional though

you're probably right about air time btw

 

[DrinkingFood]

it's almost like
*gasp*
like it feels and looks like a glitch
glitches and this have something in common
bad game design
except one is intentional

 

[iamanobody]

I doubt it's intentional. If they need another way of limiting it I'm sure one exists that's better than this, it must be a glitch. There's no way to predict it or understand why you didn't have your DJ/hover unless you already knew about it. I've also found that doing a single jump(short or full), an aerial and then teleporting removes your double jump. I don't think it's intended to have teleport remove double jump because it seems to me that teleport>hover was intended as part of Mewtwo's game(and is really cool if you ask me, if really empowering).

edit: Reading above it looks like the attack thing was already mentioned, but I forgot to mention that if you jump far off the stage, fall down, and teleport you also lose your second jump. This is pretty much guaranteed suicide.

In addition, I think it's intended, but I've found that when doing two aerials in a hover, the second aerial cancels the hover and will not be hover cancelled. If it is a glitch, I think it's alright functionality because Mewtwo's already quite possibly good enough as he is and it's not too hard to find out.

 

[CeLL]

The way I understand when you can hover is:

Option 1: Mewtwo hovers if he has his midair jump and hover, and on the first frame that he can input a jump after he finishes an animation (or the first interruptable frame of an interruptable animation) the jump button is being held down and is not released until the sound effect starts.

Option 2: Mewtwo hovers if he has his midair jump and hover, and is in a standard aerial state or interruptable animation and the control stick is down while the jump button is pressed and held until the sound effect starts.

(For either option you must be in the air the entire time)

The only way I know to lose your hover but not midair jump are using hover (for a very short time). Note that while grabbing a ledge refreshes your midair jump, it does not refresh your hover.

[collapse=Some things to support this view]

You can't hover immediately after walking off a platform or the stage with option 1. This can be explained by the fact that there is no animation for walking off a platform or the stage.

Since the first frame of the platform drop animation is the first frame when you can input a jump, you have to be holding jump on that frame to use option 1. If you jump, then hold jump to do your midair jump, then land on a platform and press down (while still holding jump), you will hover. This does not work if you land on the ground, because you are not in the air. On a platform, if you press down, you are in the air immediately.

You can use option 2 after dropping through a platform, because the platform drop animation is an interruptable animation.

You aren't in the air during the first frame on which you can input a jump after a grounded jump (an interruptable animation), which explains why option 1 doesn't make you hover as soon as you jump if you hold jump. Option 1 does, however, make you hover on the first frame after Mewtwo finishes his grounded jump (an animation) if you are holding jump.

(Theoretically there might be a specific frame after the platform drop animation where you could start holding the jump button without holding down and still hover. Of course, this would be frame perfect. I'm not sure it's actually possible, though, because you might need to already be holding the jump button on the frame in question, which implies that you would need to press the jump button after the first frame of the animation, but before the last frame, which would make you jump)[/collapse]

This is not a glitch involving hover. It involves the midair jump. After using (1) an aerial, (2) falling off a ledge without jumping, or (3) waiting a certain amount of time, before teleporting, you lose your midair jump. You cannot hover without your midair jump. As such, hover is only affected by this glitch indirectly.