Is it true that Brawl is completely broken?

[Slugma128]

I've heard that some characters can rank up damage from 0 to 100 and beyond with the opponent unable to do anything. That wasn't the case with Melee, was it?

 

[Tristan_win]

As much as I would like to see Zamus support this isn't the place to do it.

 

[AlexX]

Inescapable combos that go that high? With hitstun as low as it is in Brawl? No, that's not possible.

 

[Slugma128]

Dedede's chainthrow is just one example. Fox's reflector is another one (against a wall). And I heard there are more.

 

[Browny]

it can get close to it, though i think 100% is going way too far

Lucario can CG fast fallers/heavyweights and finish with undodgeable combos to get from 0-70%. a few others can CG but not to that high %.

obviously theres the IC 0-death, but that was in melee anyway.

 

[AlexX]

Dedede's chainthrow is just one example. Fox's reflector is another one (against a wall). And I heard there are more.

Dedede's chainthrow is only inescapable by 2 people: DK and Bowser. Mario, Luigi, and Samus can't be chaingrabbed more than 5 times due to stale moves, and the others have ways to escape it (and some like Olimar can't be chaingrabbed at all).

Fox's wallshine can't be done just anywhere. It requires a wall and proper set-up in order to do.

 

[Slugma128]

Wario can't escape it either. And what do you mean by "stale moves"?

Yeah, but if you have a wall?

 

[AlexX]

Wario can't escape it either. And what do you mean by "stale moves"?

Wario can indeed escape it, and stale moves refers to the fact moves get weaker if you keep using the same one over and over.

Yeah, but if you have a wall?

How many stages have a wall? Most don't, and if you're on one that does, your opponent has to pin you against a wall before they can perform the moves. If they focus too much on doing that, you'll probably get the upper-hand more easily.

 

[Slugma128]

No, he can't. And it doesn't matter how many times Dedede uses it, Wario (and most other characters besides Jigglypuff) ALWAYS flies the same distance to the left or right without being able to do anything at all.

 

[lethminite]

No, he can't. And it doesn't matter how many times Dedede uses it, Wario (and most other characters besides Jigglypuff) ALWAYS flies the same distance to the left or right without being able to do anything at all.

my troll-dar is going off

 

[Slugma128]

Don't call me a troll, I've tried this myself. He can't avoid it!

 

[KosukeKGA]

^ Ignore Mr. Troll-dar.

Slugma, what you say is true. For example, there is the Pikachu on Fox chaingab (can go up to 80%), and also the CG by Falco (usually up to 40 or 50%).

The game is really unbalanced unlike Melee.

 

[Empy]

To answer your question. No it's not true that Brawl is completely broken.

 

[Yuna]

There are several chaingrabs that will take you from one end of a stage to another with each grab moving forward so little that it'll be 0-100+. There's also Marth's and Pokémon Trainer's grab release on Ness.

Also, the one people always forget: Zamus' Dsmash Chain on a few characters.

Wario can't escape it either. And what do you mean by "stale moves"?

Yes he can.

Yeah, but if you have a wall?

Only, we banned them all (except for stages with temporary walls).

 

[KosukeKGA]

It's really so unbalanced to the fact that some characters are just not downright usable because of certain things.

 

[Monshou_no_Nazo]

I personally don't consider Brawl as broken as people come off (it's definitely unbalanced, but not unplayable). The main reason we get complaints like chain grabbing or camping is because they are not "exciting" or "cool" strategies. Even if camping is the best strategy, most characters still have options to work with to prevent stalements from happening. I personally play in such a way where I try to space myself and put myself in safe positions to attack as much as possible.

 

[Slugma128]

There are several chaingrabs that will take you from one end of a stage to another with each grab moving forward so little that it'll be 0-100+. There's also Marth's and Pokémon Trainer's grab release on Ness.

Also, the one people always forget: Zamus' Dsmash Chain on a few characters.


Yes he can.


Only, we banned them all (except for stages with temporary walls).

How does he then? I didn't manage to di it.

"We" like in...?

 

[KosukeKGA]

I personally don't consider Brawl as broken as people come off (it's definitely unbalanced, but not unplayable). The main reason we get complaints like chain grabbing or camping is because they are not "exciting" or "cool" strategies. Even if camping is the best strategy, most characters still have options to work with to prevent stalements from happening. I personally play in such a way where I try to space myself and put myself in safe positions to attack as much as possible.

Why would you play something boring when you can play a game we all know which is much more fun?

 

[Yuna]

How does he then? I didn't manage to di it.

"We" like in...?

Dunno. I don't play as Wario, so I don't know how Wario gets out of DeDeDe's chaingrab. Just that he can. Try DI:ing and jabbing.

"We" = The Competitive Smash Community

 

[Slugma128]

Dunno. I don't play as Wario, so I don't know how Wario gets out of DeDeDe's chaingrab. Just that he can. Try DI:ing and jabbing.

"We" = The Competitive Smash Community

That's exactly what I've tried, but it doesn't work! Wario is completely immobile long enough for Dedede to grab again. I want to see proof that he can get out of it.

I see. Smashboards?

 

[Monshou_no_Nazo]

Why would you play something boring when you can play a game we all know which is much more fun?

For a multitude of reasons not a part of this thread, but I still find Brawl enjoyable.

 

[Scavenger XIII]

Don't know about 100% broken but its sure an unbalanced and badly coded mess.

 

[Slugma128]

But what exactly makes it so unbalanced? Please not only write "it is". Explanations, anyone?

 

[DRaGZ]

It's not particularly unbalanced, especially in comparison to other fighting games.

 

[KosukeKGA]

Lol, yes it is (sorry Slugma, rofl).

MK + Snake > The Other Characters

Also, like I said in my previous reply, some characters are unusable in certain events.

 

[Yuna]

But what exactly makes it so unbalanced? Please not only write "it is". Explanations, anyone?

God Tier vs. Bottom Tier is ridiculous. Also, there's a God Tier, that's how bad it is!

In Melee, Mewtwo vs. Fox was nowhere near as imbalaned as God Tier vs. Bottom Tier is in Brawl. There's a bigger Mid Tier in Brawl, though. But the gaps between the tiers are bigger.

 

[Slugma128]

What's MK?

Who is god tier then? And who is bottom? And why?

 

[Yuna]

What's MK?

Who is god tier then? And who is bottom? And why?

You've supposedly been around since 2002 and should therefore know your way around Smashboards. How about you actually go out and educate yourself on Brawl for once instead of making threads expecting people to feed you every single bit of information?

(The answer to these questions, and most of your other ones, are easily found on these boards... in fact, the answer to one of these questions can be found in the other thread you made)

 

[Slugma128]

You've supposedly been around since 2002 and should therefore know your way around Smashboards. How about you actually go out and educate yourself on Brawl for once instead of making threads expecting people to feed you every single bit of information?

(The answer to these questions, and most of your other ones, are easily found on these boards... in fact, the answer to one of these questions can be found in the other thread you made)

Seriously, what's up with the attitude on Smashboards??? Are you not welcome if you're not a smash expert?

 

[Adapt]

No, its just that people here expect that others do a minimum amount of research before making a thread to ask question that have already been answered 20 times.

And you have been here for 6 years... surely you must be able to find it

 

[KosukeKGA]

<_< I get the feeling that you are simply just trying to waste everybody's time Slugma.

But that's just me. Don't mind me.

 

[waks]

Seriously, what's up with the attitude on Smashboards??? Are you not welcome if you're not a smash expert?

You dont have to be an expert to know that MK = Mortal Kombat.

 

[takieddine]

DeDeDe has an infinite In-place downthrow chaingrab on some characters, if that isnt dumb. I dont know what is.

 

[wasabicheese]

i find brawl to be more balanced than melee, but just barely

 

[KosukeKGA]

Well, you are finding wrong. <_<

Brawl is more unbalanced than Melee and this is a fact. Don't ask me why (I don't feel like explaining), it just is.

 

[Kros]

That's why Tiers are gonna be weird when we realize them.

 

[Dis4ster]

You dont have to be an expert to know that MK = Mortal Kombat.

You're not being serious right?


And about brawl being unbalanced: It's true but not at a level that you can't win against an MK (For people who don't know how to use google or smashboards: Metaknight) or Snake. Also a lot of chaingrabs can be broken. And just keep away from the wall if you're fighting a marth or fox.

 

[waks]

You're not being serious right?


And about brawl being unbalanced: It's true but not at a level that you can't win against an MK (For people who don't know how to use google or smashboards: Metaknight) or Snake. Also a lot of chaingrabs can be broken. And just keep away from the wall if you're fighting a marth or fox.

I was sarcastic <_< I use MK too, you know

 

[Slugma128]

I don't have as much time as you seem to have, deepdiving into Smash like there's no tomorrow. I have a job and many other games to play. There's no way I could train as much as you do.

As a whole the attitude of these boards only welcome similar minded, those who already are experts or those who put an hour for research before creating a thread.

 

[Yuna]

I don't have as much time as you seem to have, deepdiving into Smash like there's no tomorrow. I have a job and many other games to play. There's no way I could train as much as you do.

If you'd actually read that other thread you posted, you would've known that Snake and Meta-Knight dominate tournaments.

As a whole the attitude of these boards only welcome similar minded, those who already are experts or those who put an hour for research before creating a thread.

Or 5 minutes. Most of the stuff you want us to answer is common knowledge for anyone who's been here for more than 1 month and read more than 2 threads each day.

It's tiring and annoying to have people expect us to do all of the work for them, creating threads asking questions whose answers are easily found on the boards... in more than 10 different threads... most of them stickied or linked to from a sticky.

You're not just a non-expert who doesn't put down an hour of research before creating a thread, you don't do any research nor do you even hang out here and then you waltz in here and create a lot of threads expecting us to do all the work for you.