Is Brawl dead?

[F. Stein]

I know. Maybe those avid Melee fans would then appeal to Brawl if we did that. Of course, that's why Project M came into existence. But still, it was just an idea.

Tell you what, I will keep on thinking about how Brawl can be revived. This was an awesome game. Granted all things expire (sorry to say that, but it is the case) but Brawl should not have died the moment Smash 4 was released in 2014.

I still don't get your logic lol. I'm an avid melee player. How does banning the most appealing part of brawl, the huge roster, make me like it more?

 

[Andyomon00]

Yo I've been watching this thread for a while and want to add my two cents

I'm going to but it simply: I genuinely believe that brawl is dead. Dead in that it has little to no tournament interest or relevance anymore.

For a competitive fighting game, the random and unbalanced elements of brawl are unacceptable, highlighting the mindset this game was designed in.

While all of this is bad, what really killed brawl is what you guys are doing right now. judging from what I have seen on this thread, you guys are trying to apply a band-aid to a fatal wound. You try and try to fix what's broken by trying to make alternative rule sets(mainly the banning of characters and the use of items) and play in a different game mode to try to yield competitive results.Doing this not only splits the already small community of brawl but, serves as further stagnation for the game.

 

[meticulousboy]

I still don't get your logic lol. I'm an avid melee player. How does banning the most appealing part of brawl, the huge roster, make me like it more?

Hmm. Well, the only other thing I have in mind is to just discover new things about each character that no one has ever discovered and show off those techs in competitive settings.

 

[meticulousboy]

Yo I've been watching this thread for a while and want to add my two cents

I'm going to but it simply: I genuinely believe that brawl is dead. Dead in that it has little to no tournament interest or relevance anymore.

For a competitive fighting game, the random and unbalanced elements of brawl are unacceptable, highlighting the mindset this game was designed in.

While all of this is bad, what really killed brawl is what you guys are doing right now. judging from what I have seen on this thread, you guys are trying to apply a band-aid to a fatal wound. You try and try to fix what's broken by trying to make alternative rule sets(mainly the banning of characters and the use of items) and play in a different game mode to try to yield competitive results.Doing this not only splits the already small community of brawl but, serves as further stagnation for the game.

The release of Brawl was a sign that Sakurai was at his best. Brawl is slower than Melee, air dodging no longer leaves a character helpless, and even a story mode.

I get what you're trying to say, but at least pitch in on how to revive the game. Granted the only way we can is to host tournaments, but people have to be willing to join. Doesn't have to be big.

 

[Respect38]

Comparing banning Meta Knight to a "bandaid" almost seems to indicate a misunderstanding of the situation that Meta Knight caused. And nobody who is serious is suggesting banning anyone more than Meta Knight. [except maybe Ice Climbers as well, I guess]

The random elements of Brawl [I assume you're referring to tripping?] are heavily overstated in the impact it had on Brawl. Brawl died/is dying because of Meta Knight, Ice Climbers, and, to some extent, the gameplay that it provides not being as popular as the other Smash games. The impact that tripping has had on Brawl is likely more due to the meme it caused the game to become and less on how much tripping actually impacts the game.

 

[meticulousboy]

"Oh. You took my stock because of one trip?"
It is hard to determine whether or not that would be true if the tripping did not occur.
The tripping was probably meant for humor in a casual setting, but Sakurai (assuming this was his intention for competitive players) probably wanted to throw in a game - changing mechanic to increase the chances of a hype crowd, like we saw at Super Smash Con.

 

[Andyomon00]

Comparing banning Meta Knight to a "bandaid" almost seems to indicate a misunderstanding of the situation that Meta Knight caused. And nobody who is serious is suggesting banning anyone more than Meta Knight. [except maybe Ice Climbers as well, I guess]

The random elements of Brawl [I assume you're referring to tripping?] are heavily overstated in the impact it had on Brawl. Brawl died/is dying because of Meta Knight, Ice Climbers, and, to some extent, the gameplay that it provides not being as popular as the other Smash games. The impact that tripping has had on Brawl is likely more due to the meme it caused the game to become and less on how much tripping actually impacts the game.

But that's just it, no one character should be able to beat the entirety of the cast with ease that's just bad game design. But that's beside the point

The thing is that they resolved the issue with MK by banning him. The problem is that after that there was no definitive rule set that would fix the damage already done or just still exists. Brawl became the butt of many jokes in the competitive community and could not be taken seriously by anyone.

On the subject of tripping, In a competitive setting, A random element like that boils the game down to "who wins the RNG machine?" A competitive game should come down to someone's skill as a player, and tripping throws all that skill out the window.

The tripping was probably meant for humor in a casual setting, but Sakurai (assuming this was his intention for competitive players) probably wanted to throw in a game - changing mechanic to increase the chances of a hype crowd, like we saw at Super Smash Con.

I'm sorry but I have to disagree, no one designing a game to be competitive would ever let something like tripping or Meta Knight go under their radar.

 

[Respect38]

We all realize that both Meta Knight and tripping were bad game design.

(1) That's why some of us tried to [and still are trying to] get him banned. (2) You can pretend that tripping is a big deal, it just isn't. Plenty of people have played Brawl competitively over the years and still do when it shows up to majors. The fact is, there are random elements to fighting games--reads, 50:50s, etc.-- and compared to all the other random elements, [even when the other person on the side of the "random element" is your human opponent] of which Brawl is quite reliant due to the defensive nature of the game, tripping simply is not a big deal. The best players still win consistently.

I could go into the random nature of some of the stages as well, but there's no real point: you are simply wrong in thinking that tripping is a major problem. If it was, then this game would not have had a large competitive for 6 years, and it certainly wouldn't have people still playing and caring about it right now.

Technically there have been pushes to play Brawl on a mod that removes tripping, but it hasn't gotten momentum yet. Hopefully someday, but it's more important to focus on getting it at tournaments right now more than anything.

 

[meticulousboy]

Brawl was the first Smash game that had the legal stage Smashville. Not only that, the Yoshi's Island stage was also legal. If anyone misses that stage, all the more reason to try Brawl again. The 3DS has that stage, but how little do we see 3DS tournaments.

 

[Aslik]

Bums me out. I recently got Brawl, and there's hardly any competitive scene.

 

[shadee88]

Bums me out. I recently got Brawl, and there's hardly any competitive scene.

While that is correct
there are online tournaments though you can sign up for

 

[SuperSqank]

Even though the game died, Brawl will always remain my favourite Smash game even if the game isn't the best competitively.

 

[Tankster]

Smh. Probably the only comment I'll make on the subject. Brawl's not dead. It's being played online. Obviously, the game is rarely being hosted at national tournaments other that GOML and SSC. Also, it's just different in general (tripping, hit stun cancel, etc.) However, it's still being played. It will eventually rise again, but not at the level of the other games, and definitely not as quickly as the other games. Period.

 

[SuperSqank]

It does seem like the game has slightly risen in popularity this year as it has felt like the game has been showcased in a couple more tournaments with a few more entrants. Obviously nothing huge but it's great to see that the game feels slightly less dead now than it did earlier on in Smash 4's life and I'm hopeful that the game will continue to slowly rise. I've been getting into the game myself more than any other Smash game recently so that's something I guess.

 

[KEYLIME SSB]

I mostly play Melee now, but once in a while I'll dust off my brawl disc solely for the reason that you can make a custom stage that is a fully enclosed box, making sure that no one dies and percentages reach upwards of 500%.

 

[shadee88]

It does seem like the game has slightly risen in popularity this year as it has felt like the game has been showcased in a couple more tournaments with a few more entrants. Obviously nothing huge but it's great to see that the game feels slightly less dead now than it did earlier on in Smash 4's life and I'm hopeful that the game will continue to slowly rise. I've been getting into the game myself more than any other Smash game recently so that's something I guess.

most people who entered brawl are Smash 4/Melee players who want to make extra money or enter it as a joke.
only less than 10 entered brawl exclusively

 

[SuperSqank]

most people who entered brawl are Smash 4/Melee players who want to make extra money or enter it as a joke.
only less than 10 entered brawl exclusively

Yes, I am aware that a large majority of people who enter Brawl tournaments are X Brawl players who mainly focus on Smash 4/Melee now and that there’s only a small handful of Brawl only players these days. It’s definitely better than nothing.

 

[TheHumanSonikku]

I also think it's because of the stigma Brawl has.

Some people are scared to even touch Brawl due to the backlash they can get

 

[Grizzmeister]

I was in Walmart today buying Halloween candy and noticed that new copies of Brawl are still available. Guess the game isn't dead after all.

 

[shadee88]

Yes, I am aware that a large majority of people who enter Brawl tournaments are X Brawl players who mainly focus on Smash 4/Melee now and that there’s only a small handful of Brawl only players these days. It’s definitely better than nothing.

Which is sad since not a single brawl only player won a brawl tournament since the post Smash 4 release

 

[SuperDoom1]

brawl was starting to choke by 2013, because metaknight remained prevalent, and, as a result, every stage that made the ice climbers tolerable was banned, making ICs have no real bad stages to play on.

Fox

If Meta Knight had stayed banned, I think that more players would be left and maybe Brawl wouldn't be quite as dead as it is.

Fox

The game is dead since the best characters were MK and Icies. What if Peach and Puff were the best characters in Melee ?

Fox

I would say Brawl is dead mainly because of the tier lists being solely based off of Meta Knight and how well they perform off of him.

Fox

Brawl is looking even worse as time goes on. I'm one of those few people that could accept what Brawl was, flaws and all, even while playing Melee. People left it for varied reasons. Most will go to the scapegoat of tripping, but whatever nobody liked it. Others, like me, just don't want to deal with Meta Knight anymore. I stopped watching tourneys, because the top 8 where filled with MKs. Everything about him just dragged people down. So much that nobody complains about him in 4 because they feel he deserves it, almost nobody even plays him. Also Smash 4's balance is another reason. You can pick up a character and roll with them and at least get results.

I mean it is sad to see Brawl go because it's ATs are the most amazing things in a Smash game. Maybe some day it could come back ( with the shiny new rule of Meta Knight being banned). Also Wolf. He doesn't deserve to stay on Brawl.

FOX

Yeah when there's nothing but Meta Knight everywhere back in Brawl.

Brawl became a lot less fun...

FOX

Meta Knight being OP

FOX

For a competitive fighting game, the random and unbalanced elements of brawl are unacceptable, highlighting the mindset this game was designed in.

While all of this is bad, what really killed brawl is what you guys are doing right now. judging from what I have seen on this thread, you guys are trying to apply a band-aid to a fatal wound. You try and try to fix what's broken by trying to make alternative rule sets(mainly the banning of characters and the use of items) and play in a different game mode to try to yield competitive results.

FOX

Comparing banning Meta Knight to a "bandaid" almost seems to indicate a misunderstanding of the situation that Meta Knight caused. And nobody who is serious is suggesting banning anyone more than Meta Knight. [except maybe Ice Climbers as well, I guess]

FOX

But that's just it, no one character should be able to beat the entirety of the cast with ease that's just bad game design. But that's beside the point

The thing is that they resolved the issue with MK by banning him. The problem is that after that there was no definitive rule set that would fix the damage already done or just still exists. Brawl became the butt of many jokes in the competitive community and could not be taken seriously by anyone.

Any questions?

 

[loops0]

brawl isn't a person you dummy

 

[SuperDoom1]

brawl isn't a person you dummy

Need I say anything?




(lool)

 

[Tankster]

Fox

Fox

Fox

Fox

FOX

FOX

FOX

FOX

FOX

Any questions?

Smh. I did seen it all

 

[XenoFalcon95]

Brawl vs. ssb4 usually isn't even a question for most people, but for me I just really like playing mk in brawl and no character in ssb4 feels quite like him. It's a little upsetting to see it pretty well completely dead compared to the other games.

 

[SuperDoom1]

Smh. I did seen it all

You against the truth?

 

[Tankster]

You against the truth?

Eventually, 20xx is going to end.

 

[SuperDoom1]

Eventually, 20xx is going to end.

Fair point.


MegaMan will be a reality soon, and when he is, all Fox players will be TAS levels of perfection and Melee will be an over-exaggerated RPS tourney.

 

[loops0]

20xx will never end because it'll never happen.
perfection is a myth and scientifically impossible. imperfection is what created the world (and universe) around us, and it will for sure not come from humans, even less likely from a nintendo fighting game.
pack your bags guys, you've all been played.

 

[Lucky Luis]

Is brawl dead considering the sm4sh scene is growing really quickly? Or is there some revival of brawl going on? I was just wondering because I'd think it would be incredibly sad if that would be the case.

In my opinion, I believe Brawl died when Nintendo discontinued the online services. I too loved playing Brawl but I guess they wanted to move onto Smash 4 Online Mode.

 

[embargo]

yes, it's been dead

 

[Applebutter61]

In my opinion, I believe Brawl died when Nintendo discontinued the online services. I too loved playing Brawl but I guess they wanted to move onto Smash 4 Online Mode.

Couldn't have put it better myself. And all I own is Brawl.

 

[SuperDoom1]

20xx will never end because it'll never happen.
perfection is a myth and scientifically impossible. imperfection is what created the world (and universe) around us, and it will for sure not come from humans, even less likely from a nintendo fighting game.
pack your bags guys, you've all been played.

A mistake is NOT what kickstarted the universe, God is.

 

[Applebutter61]

A mistake is NOT what kickstarted the universe, God is.

Amen to that, brother

 

[loops0]

we all have beliefs, i believe in the scientific explanation, i got a bit too carried away with that lol.

sorry if i offended anyone :'v

 

[The Neutral]

A mistake is NOT what created the universe, God is.

This man speaks the truth. Jesus is Lord.

 

[SuperDoom1]

This man speaks the truth. Jesus is Lord.

Amen.

Amen to that, brother

 

[Actem]

Brawl was widely panned when it came out, but some people still enjoyed it. It was also very accessible since it was on the Wii, so Brawl sold the most copies of any Smash game if I'm not mistaken.

The competitive Brawl scene wasn't and I believe never will be larger than Melee's, but I think many people are still willing to play the game.

+It has tourney mode, which is really nice.

I was just playing the game this morning with my brother and we had tons of fun!

So yeah, I wouldn't say Brawl is dead but Melee and Smash 4 will continue to be more "alive."

I think Brawl has potential, but that's just my opinion.

 

[Applebutter61]

I think one of the main things brawl has going for it is definitely

Freakin' great character.

 

[Grizzmeister]

Maybe this recent Wiimmfi exploit will help bring people back to Brawl?

Lots of people don't have someone local to play Brawl with but being able to play online again might spark their desire to revisit the game. Considering that 100 million people own Wii consoles and 13 million copies of Brawl have been sold it's hard to believe the game will ever die as long as there's a hackless way to play online again.