Social "I'm a Black Belt, I have no fatigue" - Sonic Discussion Thread

[SonicMario]

1. Green Hill Zone (Brawl and 4)
2. Angel Island Zone (Brawl and 4)
3. Scrap Brain Zone (Brawl)
4. Emerald Hill Zone (Brawl)
5. Sonic Boom (Brawl)
6. Super Sonic Racing (Brawl)
7. Open Your Heart (Brawl and 4)
8. Live & Learn (Brawl and 4)
9. Sonic Heroes (Brawl and 4)
10. Right There, Ride On (Brawl and 4)
11. HIS WORLD (Instrumental) (Brawl and 4)
12. Seven Rings in Hand (Brawl and 4)
13. Escape from the City (4)
14. Knight of the Wind (4)
15. Reach for the Stars (4)
16. Rooftop Run (4)
17. Wonder World (4)
18. Windy Hill - Zone 1 (4)

Two new songs, I guess.

Wishing for some Mania goodness (probs Studiopolis) and one for Shadow when he's finally revealed.

This is of course assuming every song that was ever used for Sonic returns. I think maybe at least Sonic Boom (CD Opening song) could return and maybe Super Sonic racing but I could see them replace stuff like Scrap Brain and Emerald Hill with something else instead. I think every song that was in both Brawl and/or just 4 will return though.

So a total window of 2-6 new songs.

 

[Sean Wheeler]

It would be awesome if Knight of the Wind plays when you bring all the Fire Emblem characters to Green Hill Zone.

 

[Camalange]

1. Green Hill Zone (Brawl and 4)
2. Angel Island Zone (Brawl and 4)
3. Scrap Brain Zone (Brawl)
4. Emerald Hill Zone (Brawl)
5. Sonic Boom (Brawl)
6. Super Sonic Racing (Brawl)
7. Open Your Heart (Brawl and 4)
8. Live & Learn (Brawl and 4)
9. Sonic Heroes (Brawl and 4)
10. Right There, Ride On (Brawl and 4)
11. HIS WORLD (Instrumental) (Brawl and 4)
12. Seven Rings in Hand (Brawl and 4)
13. Escape from the City (4)
14. Knight of the Wind (4)
15. Reach for the Stars (4)
16. Rooftop Run (4)
17. Wonder World (4)
18. Windy Hill - Zone 1 (4)

Two new songs, I guess.

Wishing for some Mania goodness (probs Studiopolis) and one for Shadow when he's finally revealed.

Very generous of them.

My guess is one Mania, one Forces.

 

[MonkeyDLenny]

It would be criminal of Studiopolis Act 1 didn't make it in

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Is Sonic Forces bad from a gameplay perspective?

 

[TheMagicalKuja]

So two new songs at the very least (I'd take Metallic Madness and Supporting Me over any of the new vocals though), maybe up to six if nothing that was Brawl exclusive is replaced.

Honestly, I'd throw money at Sega if they replaced Sonic Boom and Seven Rings in Hand with the Crush 40 variants.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Sonic > Eevee anytime, they don't even compare.

 

[Camalange]

Sonic > Eevee anytime, they don't even compare.

Honestly when I watched this I was shocked to not see Smashboards usernames I knew

 

[Admiral Bobbery]

I'm sure this has been said before, but can we get a Chao Garden stage? I for one would love that.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

It looks like Sonic has met his worst match-up in Ultimate.

 

[SonicMario]

I think Isabelle's inclusion made it just a little more probable for Tails to join sooner or later (Later as in DLC). And could be packaged with an echo Shadow to boot. Having 3 styles of Sonic (Even if Shadow's wouldn't be too different) would be sweet. Though I'd be afraid to have to inform you I'll move straight to Tails being my new #1 Main if he gets in heh.

But Sonic would still definitely be still 2nd.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I think Isabelle's inclusion made it just a little more probable for Tails to join sooner or later (Later as in DLC). And could be packaged with an echo Shadow to boot. Having 3 styles of Sonic (Even if Shadow's wouldn't be too different) would be sweet. Though I'd be afraid to have to inform you I'll move straight to Tails being my new #1 Main if he gets in heh.

But Sonic would still definitely be still 2nd.

Tails would be awesome.

 

[SonicMario]

Heh, nevermind what I said. What with the box theory going around. An echo of Sonic is unlikely (Sonic's 9 is already set). Shadow isn't going to be in the base game. And I doubt Tails is our final character when there's still either a Gen 7 Pokemon or Elma to get to.

But I think they'll be certainly make for some prime DLC candidates. They could even get in together as a Sonic character pack.

 

[Sean Wheeler]

What do you mean by Sonic's 9 already set? What's 9 in Smash terms?

 

[SonicMario]

What do you mean by Sonic's 9 already set? What's 9 in Smash terms?

First, take a look at this box

LEFT SIDE (Not shown in the image)

| 1 2 3 4 4e 5
6 7 8 |

|17 18 19
20 21 21e 22 23 24 |

| 32 33-35 36 37 38 39
40 41 42 |

|54 55 56
57 58 59 60 60e? 61 |

RIGHT SIDE (The one actually showing in the image)

9 10 11 12 13 13e
14 15 16 |

|25 25e 26
27 28 28e 29 30 31|

|43 44 45 46 47 48
49 50 51-53 |

|62 63 64
65 66 66e 67 68 69? |

Bold and italicized is Sonic's number. And the set of 9 Sonic is in has the full 9. The only echo that can be on the box is someone in the 54-61 Row (Palutena to Cloud that is) which is why Ken (Which is why I put a question mark next to 60e) is currently seen as the only true lock right now beyond just rumored heavily already. This also hints at only one more unique/semi-clone newcomer which is rumored to be Incineroar. But at the very least it's damning for any echoes prior to Palutena to make it. There could very well still be more unique/semi-clone newcomers then just one. But as for echoes? I think at the very least it points to Ken being our final base game Echo. So Shadow will likely have to wait until Echo Fighter DLC happens unless he's a Semi-Clone. But if Sonic gets a Semi-Clone like Isabelle, Tails feels more likely for that right now.

Though I doubt Tails is in the base game either. If Tails ever gets into Ultimate he'll have to be DLC as well I imagine. I've mentioned this already in the past even before all this but we could at least still get a Sonic character DLC pack of Tails + Shadow together in DLC.

 

[TyrantLizardKing]

I'm not putting faith in Tails, there's too many factors in favour of Shadow that point to him being in at least before the former. I personally would rather have Eggman next in line as I think there's a lot of fun things you could do with him, and Smash could always use more villains.

 

[SonicMario]

I'm not putting faith in Tails, there's too many factors in favour of Shadow that point to him being in at least before the former. I personally would rather have Eggman next in line as I think there's a lot of fun things you could do with him, and Smash could always use more villains.

I think there's reason enough to believe both can get in at some point. Especially come DLC time where even in Smash 4 it didn't seem to give a damn about overrepresentation (An additional 2 Fire Emblem characters) or 3rd party fanmade rules (Ryu, Cloud, and Bayonetta all broke a conception on 3rd parties in Smash).

So even if Shadow does make it in as a Sonic echo in the base game. There's reason to believe Tails is still possible come DLC time. Though I'd personally like it more if Shadow still being a Sonic echo was saved a little later. So Tails and Shadow come in as a character pack. Less complaints from those who dislike Sonic also since they could just choose to not buy it.

And I think Eggman personally at this point is better suited for being a Spirits boss alongside Dracula being famous 3rd party villains.

 

[Sean Wheeler]

Well, a lot of leakers are claiming that Shadow is in. But I refuse to believe them because I want Tails.

 

[SonicMario]

Well, a lot of leakers are claiming that Shadow is in. But I refuse to believe them because I want Tails.

I prefer Tails too. But at this point, I'm changing my view on terms of speculation on this part. (Albeit only one can be arguing to be hinting at Shadow, and that's Jon from Gamexplain. Albeit unless the Smash direct is this week or next week we're not sure about that as his "predictions" usually seem to come like the week of a direct incoming such as calling Isabelle as not an echo and the Final Fantasies prior to September's direct. Verge has still not mentioned Shadow at all)

If Shadow's in, cool. I will no longer be as salty about him as I would of been if he had been revealed 48 hours ago even if he turns out not to be an echo fighter. So I've changed a bit on that end.

As for Tails there's still a decent amount of room for him to be DLC later regardless what happens with Shadow. Because who knows where DLC takes us. I wouldn't count out getting both Tails and Shadow eventually. I still kind of hope Shadow's saved for DLC so we still have Tails + Shadow as a character pack on the table so that everyone's happy. But yeah.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I'd be really happy as long as any of these characters get in:

Tails / Knuckles / Shadow / Metal Sonic / Amy

I think it's a coin flip between Shadow and Tails. There is always the chance that they're holding the Shadow AT back, you know? But that's a tad more unlikely. I'm in desperate need of a Sonic counterpart. I don't know why. I need to show off some more Sonic love in smash. Maybe it's the lack of good alt colors... (Seriously, why can't we have Super Sonic as a recolor? His final smash sucks anyway).

In both cases I can see them only altering the recovery move. Maybe a B neutral too.
Shadow could get Mewtwo's teleport.
And Tails could get something like Duck Hunt's flight.

As for neutral specials... I admit I would like Shadow to keep as many of Sonic's spinning moves. So maybe change Shadow's Side or Down B instead? Would be kind of cool giving him either Stomp or Bounce (in particular, because of the irony that it was the one move he didn't have that Sonic did in SA2).

And Tails... I don't like him using the gun from Battle. I just don't. But I wouldn't mind him using the "bombchu" that he uses in both Tails Adventure and Sonic Battle.

 

[SonicMario]

I'd be really happy as long as any of these characters get in:

Tails / Knuckles / Shadow / Metal Sonic / Amy

I think it's a coin flip between Shadow and Tails. There is always the chance that they're holding the Shadow AT back, you know? But that's a tad more unlikely. I'm in desperate need of a Sonic counterpart. I don't know why. I need to show off some more Sonic love in smash.

In both cases I can see them only altering the recovery move. Maybe a B neutral too.
Shadow could get Mewtwo's teleport.
And Tails could get something like Duck Hunt's flight.

As for neutral specials... I admit I would like Shadow to keep as many of Sonic's spinning moves. So maybe change Shadow's Side or Down B instead? Would be kind of cool giving him either Stomp or Bounce (in particular, because of the irony that it was the one move he didn't have that Sonic did in SA2).

And Tails... I don't like him using the gun from Battle. I just don't. But I wouldn't mind him using the "bombchu" that he uses in both Tails Adventure and Sonic Battle.

I don't know about coin flip. I think both Tails and Shadow are possible at this point. Just one or both may have to wait until DLC. Tails would be an Isabelle-style semi-clone, Shadow being an echo. And if they both miss base game. They can easily be packaged together for a Sonic character pack to buy.

If anything's in the base game. I think Shadow as an echo is the most likely. But I do feel like the Tails + Shadow pack would have it's appeal. Plus those who really aren't fond at all of including more then just Sonic in their game can choose not to buy them. Everyone wins!

 

[Sean Wheeler]

I would prefer if the Sonic newcomer wasn't a hedgehog. You know how bad it was that every Fire Emblem character wielded swords just because the series icon was a sword? Well, just because the title character was a hedgehog and his head is the series symbol doesn't mean all Sonic characters should be hedgehogs. I want to see Tails get in first before Shadow.

 

[SSB_Chai]

I'm honestly excited for Sonic looking to be more aggressively focused since I couldn't stand how he played in Brawl or Smash 4, which is sad considering how much of a Sonic nut I am, hope this breaks the trend.

To me, this more aggressive approach is how I've always believed Sonic should play. I first picked up Sonic in Smash 4 as my co-main because of Robin's sheer lack of speed, and before I started reading guides on the character I just liked playing him as a super fast mix-up character that utilizes grabs and spin dash/charge for brief combo starters. I later learned from the top Sonic player in my state, (shout out to my favorite WI Smash player, PowPow) and he informed me about how valuable the defensive properties of spin dash cancelling are for Sonic's neutral game. He was right, but I just didn't like playing him defensively, even if that meant not playing optimally.

I gotta say though, I will miss spin dash cancelling into shield, and C-Bounce cancelling into shield as options to mix up my grab game. Sonic sliding the way he did via spin dash cancelling felt so remarkably satisfying.

Unless he feels really clunky in this game, I will definitely be using Sonic as my co-main to Incineroar. Incineroar looks like he has the same speed problem that Robin has, so Sonic still works great for me, and I love the new direction that I feel Sonic will take with the removal of spin dash cancelling, and the mechanical changes in the game that let him do whatever he wants out of his remarkably fast dash!

 

[War Anvil]

Sadly, we learned Shadow's an Assist Trophy this past Thursday. Oh well, that justs make me want a Nintendo/Sega themed Smash spinoff even more...

Anyway, since I'm struggling to add something to the discussion right now, I'll definitely lump Sonic in with K. Rool, Pikachu, Richter, and maybe even Piranha as my top five characters to play once I get Ultimate. I certainly hope that Sonic will get even better despite the nerfs due to his new, more committed playstyle!

Hey, don't look at me, I think Shantae actually being in would be best-- (shot)

 

[Camalange]

We still have 5 DLC slots to fill so I wouldn't count out anyone at this point.

 

[TheMagicalKuja]

On the bright side, Studiopolis has been confirmed as being a selectable song in the game!

...still really wish Sonic got his two GHZ zones replaced.

 

[SonicMario]

We can confirm that every previous Sonic song from both Brawl and Smash 4 are returning except for 1: Right There, Ride On. That seems to have been cut.

Kuja already mentioned Studiopolis. But we can now 100% confirm Fist Bump and Sunset Heights from Sonic Forces.

Should be nice to have the Sonic CD Sonic Boom song back.

 

[Gregory2590]

not gonna lie
can't wait until the game comes out so we can start creating stupid as **** names for techs again. i'm still loling at bsbs & knuckles

 

[YoYoFantaFanta]

Do we know the different ways we can unlock Sonic yet?

 

[SonicMario]

Do we know the different ways we can unlock Sonic yet?

About as random as anyone else in Vs. Matches or Classic mode. It seems to be pretty randomized. (Albeit apparently 3 different streamers managed to get K. Rool with Link, while Jigglypuff was gotten with Ness by one person and then Kirby with another. So there might be some that are specific for god knows what reason. But the point is you can get characters by playing through Classic Mode)

In World of Light though...

Spoiler: World of Light

It looks like based on the map paths, that you get to the Sonic section of the map faster if you rescue Marth. There's a picture of the full map. And at that path where you choose between Marth, Sheik, and Villager. Left seems to have a road to checkered grass that is iconic to Green Hill Zone. So if you want Sonic as fast as possible at least in World of Light. You probably have to pick Marth.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Do we know the different ways we can unlock Sonic yet?

We have it each character you have to beat classic with for a different fighter and possibly other modes

It’s mario you have to beat clsssic with for sonic so you can unlock him first if you wanted.

 

[Gregory2590]

We have it each character you have to beat classic with for a different fighter and possibly other modes

It’s mario you have to beat clsssic with for sonic so you can unlock him first if you wanted.

oh really?
brb being a mario main for 10 minutes

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

oh really?
brb being a mario main for 10 minutes

Take a look

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...KgEpjgU3jXL1FYk/htmlview?usp=sharing&sle=true

Info by the streamers

 

[YoYoFantaFanta]

http://kuroganehammer.com/Ultimate/Weight

Sonic is so much lighter now.

 

[Demon-oni]

Quite a few of the speedy characters seems to have taken a hit to weight from the looks of that list. If you'd told me at the start of smash 4 that fox was the same weight as Mewtwo I'd call you insane.

That said, it isn't too terribly large of an amount for sonic to have lost. 8 weight is around 10% ish difference if I remember correctly, unless that formula has changed some in the transition to ultimate. And 10% while noticeable, won't break Sonic anyway since he doesn't have a very risky playstyle to begin with.

 

[Camalange]

Happy Ultimate Release Day!

 

[Spitfire16]

We back in there. Still a Sonic faithful, profound sadness on the lack shield cancel shenanigans but I like that he feels more honest this time around. RIP Spin Shot as well, or at least I think so, been trying to do it since release and no luck.

Edit: Never mind, got it lol

 

[Camalange]

We back in there. Still a Sonic faithful, profound sadness on the lack shield cancel shenanigans but I like that he feels more honest this time around. RIP Spin Shot as well, or at least I think so, been trying to do it since release and no luck.

Edit: Never mind, got it lol

Yup, Spinshot is still in it but ONLY works via Spin Dash. Spin Charge no longer works from what I can tell.

 

[iSpiN]

What is the timing for spin shot now?

 

[Spitfire16]

Yeah, back in Smash4 my go to option for Spinshot was flicking the c-stick with Spin Charge, now I gotta really focus down on the way of the Spin Dash, which I ignored because I was never consistent with it but I've been doing it pretty consistently in Ultimate. Not sure why.

How are we feeling about Sonic so far? Obviously he's still a good character, but so are a lot of other characters this time around. I'm surprised at how many people are saying Palutena is up there, of course it's too early to tell, but nevertheless, how we feeling about the blue blur now that we've had our hands on these reworks?