Ike VS Projectile spammers on flat stages

[PwnageLlama]

I find myself taking a ton of damage from fast projectile spammers like Pit, Pikachu, Wolf, etc. on flat stages.
"The Grand Viper" Gets stop before getting close


What do you recommend?

 

[spartan334]

make good use of your short hop then RAR them in the face works if there no good
but if they are any good at all get creative (dodge here and there, short hop,then maybe sheild aether)

 

[Rang Flash]

I've got some experience with this stuff at SBR 1 on 1 ranked matches -- mostly against Toon Link and Pit. I suggest short hopping and airdodging, but mix it up with rolling and perfect shielding as well, so they can't punish you for being predictable.

When you roll make sure you don't get too close for them to smash or grab you, keep some distance but not so much that they will start spamming again.

After a shorthopped airdodge, if they are close, try to follow it up with AAA jab combo or a shieldgrab. mix it up with some spot dodging before the AAA if you want. Just don't be predictable.

 

[3xSwords]

i said this in another topic
but try the air dodge approach
i dont think it takes a genius to figure out
but since ike's short hop is relatively short
run at them, SH, then air dodge the projectile, FF (very important)
also very important i found once u get close to them
u should spot dodge, sheild, or attack them very quickly
b/c they'll likely do an f-smash or some sort of attack
i play against a pit and he always f-smashes or side-b's
so this is a good way to approach IMO

 

[Rang Flash]

Also, if a Pit tries to side-b once you approach them after spamming, just jump over them, fast fall and bair them from behind.

 

[Deleted member]

block them.

 

[MetalFace]

As everyone said, try to evade his attacks, but also cut down the space. Keep hold of the middle (more or less) of the field. You´ll see that your opponent wont feel as safe with his projectiles. Once your opponent is in your reach, just dont let them breathe. Use RAR, or other aerials. After that it should be way more simple, just use Ike´s dominance in close combat. Also use Ike´s range wisely.

 

[Tritan]

My buddy FluffyNeko and I actually discovered a fairly neat trick last week that we dubbed "shield dashing" or maybe shield cancelled trotting (sc trotting for short). I suppose that's more what it is. Anyways, I'll explain below.

Ike is on the left side of the Stage.

Jam right and then immediately after, hold the shield button so that it pops up at the earliest frame it can. (which happens to be about one character space for ike.) As soon as the shield pops up, ike continues to slide forward a little bit. Now here's the kicker, that shield that you just put up completely cancels the normal "stopping" animation that goes with that last little slide. Allowing you to immediately neutral, grab, spot dodge, whatever you want. It is very close to what wavedashing was in melee, allowing me to change directions really quickly. It's faster than straight running and about 10 times more useful.

To give you an idea of just how much projectile spam you can stop with this, I can close in on an arrow spamming pit without taking a single hit or leaving the ground. And it does happen relatively fast as well. It's at least doubled the speed of my ike play. I'll try to get a video up for examples but it's just a basic mechanic of shield cancelling that we already knew about, just applied a rediculous amount to ike's movement since his trot animation is so short and it's abusive for him to use.

This works with all the characters well. however some are much more effective than others. To exemplify; It does not apply as well to falcon but still works. He just covers a much larger distance before the shield comes up so it's a bit more predictable and less sporatic like Ike's is. Try it out, I'm sure once you get the timings down you can start to move really quickly while keeping yourself safe as well. Trully a crazy ike technique that has helped IMMENSELY with projectile spam. Just another reason that Ike is a beast. <3

 

[Trizzy]

Turn items on.

Or if you want an obvious & realistic scenario that for some reason no one has mentioned,

roll closer to him -> SHFF F-air as they're about to spam their next projectile.

It's worth taking a few 3% damage projectiles to land 15% F-air with a KO or combo possibility.

Try changing the way you look at platform projectile spam. Think of it as an oppurtunity.

 

[rklamer]

Indeed. It's worth the small hit to yourself to hit them hard just once. Take any opportunity to punish a shot... if they're tall enough, RAR approach them... otherwise, stick to the fair.

 

[St. Viers]

Um wolf's projectile has kinda bad range.

Pikachu's projectile is wicked predictable, and I'm pretty sure you can jab it, or f-tilt it. Worst case just jump over it, as it only has one trajectory, you can't be punished for doing the same thing t oavoid it.

I don't use Ike vs Pit, so I'd say just jump, airdodge, roll, shield, double jump->B or something to give you super armor (by using it as the arrow hits). Or again, if jab works, use that, and just slowly walk up to them

 

[Dr. Science]

First off i wish you ike players here would stop with the grand viper thing... It's worthless and it's name and use is nothing like th grand viper of sol badguy fame.

Second off, like the guy earliar said, use the airdodge approach into a shieldgrab into a nuetral a combo if possible. the airdodge will autocancel when you hit the ground giving no lag allowing you to go straight into a shield.

 

[Trizzy]

First off i wish you ike players here would stop with the grand viper thing... It's worthless and it's name and use is nothing like th grand viper of sol badguy fame.

It's not useless, it's just not as useful as a couple of guidewriters are making it out to be. It's not meant to be used as Ikes end-all trump card approach, just something to throw in the mix every now and then to keep them guessing.

 

[Dr. Science]

See my problem is with the name and the limited mindset, that you should just use u-tilt after it... instead try being diverse... it doesnt seem like someone should get credit for such a simple tech that is pretty much second nature to anyone with mindgames. Simply not always trying to hit with a move that has no lag if you don't hit...

 

[pyroroth]

I usually SH or full jump and then either charge his >b or release it quickly to get some distance making them move creating an opening for an attack, or hitting them with it then doing follow up combos.

 

[Fishin]

Approaching is a matter of using short hops and aerial dodges correctly. Once you're close, many opponents tend to try and hit you with a smash, so shield grabbing tends to be good. Side B can also work once you've closed in decently (just start charging it in the air).

 

[fire_wulf]

My buddy FluffyNeko and I actually discovered a fairly neat trick last week that we dubbed "shield dashing" or maybe shield cancelled trotting (sc trotting for short). I suppose that's more what it is. Anyways, I'll explain below.

Ike is on the left side of the Stage.

Jam right and then immediately after, hold the shield button so that it pops up at the earliest frame it can. (which happens to be about one character space for ike.) As soon as the shield pops up, ike continues to slide forward a little bit. Now here's the kicker, that shield that you just put up completely cancels the normal "stopping" animation that goes with that last little slide. Allowing you to immediately neutral, grab, spot dodge, whatever you want. It is very close to what wavedashing was in melee, allowing me to change directions really quickly. It's faster than straight running and about 10 times more useful.

To give you an idea of just how much projectile spam you can stop with this, I can close in on an arrow spamming pit without taking a single hit or leaving the ground. And it does happen relatively fast as well. It's at least doubled the speed of my ike play. I'll try to get a video up for examples but it's just a basic mechanic of shield cancelling that we already knew about, just applied a rediculous amount to ike's movement since his trot animation is so short and it's abusive for him to use.

This works with all the characters well. however some are much more effective than others. To exemplify; It does not apply as well to falcon but still works. He just covers a much larger distance before the shield comes up so it's a bit more predictable and less sporatic like Ike's is. Try it out, I'm sure once you get the timings down you can start to move really quickly while keeping yourself safe as well. Trully a crazy ike technique that has helped IMMENSELY with projectile spam. Just another reason that Ike is a beast. <3

I normally just SH airdoge my way across the level and then straight into an fsmash... but i like the way this sounds. Tried it in training mode and it looked very cool and worthy of mentioning, after you get the timing down. I have yet to try it against my arrow spamming pit friend though

 

[PwnageLlama]

Thanks for all the input.

This is a little off topic. I seem to be having trouble RARing. When I turn around, I go into the slide animation, which leaves me very open.
What am I doing wrong?

About the Grand Viper-
It is useful as a word with a common meaning- I don't want to say "I'm gonna play that cool guy with the big sword" every time I play Ike.

 

[Tritan]

I normally just SH airdoge my way across the level and then straight into an fsmash... but i like the way this sounds. Tried it in training mode and it looked very cool and worthy of mentioning, after you get the timing down. I have yet to try it against my arrow spamming pit friend though

I agree, the timing is everything for sure. Definitely more useful once I got used to dropping the shield fast enough and starting the dash again in the right frames. With enough practice, I'm fairly certain one could perfect shield just about any projectile (leaving ike with advantage frames) while still closing the gap.

I actually like the SH air dodge idea too and I've recently mixed it in with the shield dashing I mentioned earlier. It's been working great and even allowed for some mixup by air dodging over them once I closed the gap. I've found that it's generally slower than shield dashing but without a doubt worth throwing in to mix things up since it's not really at a disadvantage to shield dashing other than horizontal speed. Mind games.

I would forget about this technique online vs anything but blue latency. The timing is too strict for any input lag. :/ Great offline trick though. Bought some new camera batteries so hopefully I can get that vid up after work today. Glad someone else got to try it out though. ^_^

 

[Hinote]

Thanks for all the input.

This is a little off topic. I seem to be having trouble RARing. When I turn around, I go into the slide animation, which leaves me very open.
What am I doing wrong?

About the Grand Viper-
It is useful as a word with a common meaning- I don't want to say "I'm gonna play that cool guy with the big sword" every time I play Ike.

The whole point is to cancel the slide with a jump, and then you're able to attack at the same time.

 

[menofuntall]

If you don't mind losing the ability to C-Stick Smash or some other use of the C-Stick, map the C-Stick to Special. As you're running, smash the C-stick (okay, maybe you don't need to smash it) in the opposite direction of the way you're running. It'll launch you into an auto-RAR, and if you map Attack to a button that uses a different finger than the control stick or the C-stick, you can press that immediately after the RAR to go smoothly into a B Air.

 

[Deleted member]

It's not useless, it's just not as useful as a couple of guidewriters are making it out to be. It's not meant to be used as Ikes end-all trump card approach, just something to throw in the mix every now and then to keep them guessing.

Any technique where you forfeit all control of your character sounds like a useless technique to me. You can move with it, but you can't choose what you hit 1 vs 1 and you can't cancel it. I don't use it, and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone that wants to win.

 

[TedBoosley]

Against Pit specifically, you just need to relentlessly pursue with aerial forward-Bs. He'll take more of a beating trying to get away from you than you will from the arrows pursuing him.