What are some good combos with Fox if I can't waveshine yet? I'm practicing it, but it's definetly going to take me a long time to do it on a semi-consistent basis. I tried shffling nairs/bairs, but I seem to ALWAYS get shield grabbed. I even tried timing it so I would end up just a little behind them, but of course, that doesn't always happen. As of right now my play is 90% JC'd up throws into uairs, but that's all I have going for me and that really reduces my "mix it up" play. Is there anything else I can try?
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If I can't waveshine at all yet...
- Thread starter thedough
- Start date
mukoe890
Smash Apprentice
im not a fox main but a falco, but what i see commonly is a full jump into a shine then jump away. The way that helped me waveshine with falco was after I hear the *glink* in the shine i thought pause for a split second then wavedash, because I always did it too early. but I know with fox its a different story. have ya tried the champ combo yet?
SCOTU
Smash Hero
It won't take you as long as you think to waveshine. Your shffls are probably not LC'd. Either that or not FF'd. Make sure you do both, then shine. The shffld nair>jc usmash is a great combo. Also, try the mathos combo: laser>laser>laser>laser>repeat.
Falco&Victory
Smash Champion
I think mathos throws in a few blasters every once in a while
Yeah, if you can't waveshine yet, learn to. Cerealiciously, waveshining is a great technique. I decided to learn it yesterday and my game is much better now. It's only a jcd shine into a wd. It harder with falco IMO, because he has the hardest WD in the game, other than Bowser's.
SCOTU
Smash Hero
????
there's no JC shine involved. Unless you're double waveshining (multishine>waveshine).
Falco's WD being the hardest is a matter of opinion. It's not the slowest. Not the second slowest. Not the fastest. Not the second fastest. It's extremely middle timing (well, using mean, median, and mode, they all return 5 frame jumpers, but just looking at the options, it's in the middle).
I find falco's waveshine hard because it has a longer hitlag.
Micheloxx
Smash Ace
man try to shfflcancelling with d-air, an shine, shine its faster than a grab, so tryt to do that, t will work
shinkazenokizzu
Smash Apprentice
dont give up keep at it. personally just work on dair to shine then try wavedashing out of your shine. it time it will feel natural.
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
Aerial, shine, Jump out. Its simple, easily applicable to any situation, and a useful tactic to master when working your way up to waveshines. It also beats shield grabs (if you lcancel the aerial right).
You should also try some grab comboing. Uthrows to whatever. Usually only uairs and bairs are useful after the uthrow...but on Fastfallers (Fox, Falco, Falcon) you can abuse many other moves (utilt, SH nairs, usmashes) into re-grabs.
You should also try some grab comboing. Uthrows to whatever. Usually only uairs and bairs are useful after the uthrow...but on Fastfallers (Fox, Falco, Falcon) you can abuse many other moves (utilt, SH nairs, usmashes) into re-grabs.
im not a fox main but a falco, but what i see commonly is a full jump into a shine then jump away. The way that helped me waveshine with falco was after I hear the *glink* in the shine i thought pause for a split second then wavedash, because I always did it too early. but I know with fox its a different story. have ya tried the champ combo yet?
this person know what he's talking about
I like falcos wd better than foxes, i dunno it just seems to auto time perfectly for me.
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
opposite for me. Fox's jump is so fast so its literally simultaneous. No thinking required.
SCOTU
Smash Hero
Fox's is one frame faster, falco's is one frame slower. Neither is closer than the other.
Goldkirby
Smash Ace
Fox's wd = feel's like you press the buttons at the same time. Almost.
5 framers like Marth, Falcon, Dr. Mario, etc.. - A little slower, you can now "feel" separate button presses, but it is a fast separation
6 framers like Falco - Definitely feel the 2 separate button presses for WDing. The timing on this is much harder for me b/c I learned to WD with fox first. I can still do it occasionally though. I can only waveshine somewhat reliably with falco without hitstun atm, since I am used to fox's rythm, and I don't slow it down enough for falco. Then again I hardly play falco, so meh.
Those are just my opinions on how the wavedashes feel when I try them. I can do 4 and 5 framer's wd's with ease, but anything slower then that, I have trouble with.
5 framers like Marth, Falcon, Dr. Mario, etc.. - A little slower, you can now "feel" separate button presses, but it is a fast separation
6 framers like Falco - Definitely feel the 2 separate button presses for WDing. The timing on this is much harder for me b/c I learned to WD with fox first. I can still do it occasionally though. I can only waveshine somewhat reliably with falco without hitstun atm, since I am used to fox's rythm, and I don't slow it down enough for falco. Then again I hardly play falco, so meh.
Those are just my opinions on how the wavedashes feel when I try them. I can do 4 and 5 framer's wd's with ease, but anything slower then that, I have trouble with.
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
Its the only way man. Not waveshining will only get you so far.
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
:/
why post that? Waste of space
why post that? Waste of space
Yea, it's also for those with brains.
siresword
Smash Cadet
agreed! i learned to WD with fox too, and lol i main falco, and a lot of time i can consistently WD much better with fox than falco, just cuz his is a little weird. (slower i guess)
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
Fox has a faster jump, and therefore a faster wavedash.
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
Ask a girl.
lol.
(i hope you got that.)
lol.
(i hope you got that.)
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
wah? Was that directed towards me?
...my statement was made in reference to the lesser used definition of the word brains. Its a part of regular, everyday street slanguage.
It is also very x-rated.
...my statement was made in reference to the lesser used definition of the word brains. Its a part of regular, everyday street slanguage.
It is also very x-rated.
my main is fox, what i might suggest is practicing short hoping out of your shine? if your not able to waveshine, you can always start a combo with shine, shffl dair, and starting a whole set of combos from there.
either that or go to melee and face a level 1 link with your handicap 3 and his 9, so hes a real heavy character, from there you can just practice waveshining til you get it right. (its how i learned mine)
~but hey, imma smash n00b :] (apperently)
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
No need to get testy. I can be as stupid or as silly as I want, regardless of what you think.
I also never once implied I was special or funny. Are you just having a bad day?
im havin a bad day *cry*
no but seriously, no need to get all serious about this, its smashboards :] no arguing on the forums
Anyway.
A good way to practice shining is just to practice wave dashing properly. By properly I mean jumping first, then angling the control stick and then air dodging. I've met a lot of people who don't jump first, and this is a particularly troublesome habit when it comes to playing fox/falco, or anyone, as you get better.
When you're proficient enough at that practice just shining, and then wave dashing, treat it as two seperate motions. Once you get comfortable with that speed up the process until you can wavedash out of your shine. Another good way to practice is wavedashing out of your shield. You'll know if you aren't jumping first if you sidestep or roll.
A good way to practice shining is just to practice wave dashing properly. By properly I mean jumping first, then angling the control stick and then air dodging. I've met a lot of people who don't jump first, and this is a particularly troublesome habit when it comes to playing fox/falco, or anyone, as you get better.
When you're proficient enough at that practice just shining, and then wave dashing, treat it as two seperate motions. Once you get comfortable with that speed up the process until you can wavedash out of your shine. Another good way to practice is wavedashing out of your shield. You'll know if you aren't jumping first if you sidestep or roll.
I wonder how things would have went if I laughed it up with you, instead of putting you down about it
Well.. after many hours in training mode I think I've finally got it down. Though, when I tried shffling a nair into a waveshine into a grab, my brain couldn't compute so many motions in that half or so second >_>. Time to train the brain XD
Professor Pro
Smash Legend
its hard to tell you what comboes you can do because it sounds like you still have a little trouble with L-cancelling but if they keep on shine grabbing you, you should do a shine so they can't grab you
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
One can only wonder... :/Brookman said:I wonder how things would have went if I laughed it up with you, instead of putting you down about it
Okay, I've pretty much got it down, but my question is, when I'm waveshining a character with less traction, like say a Marth (whom is my training partner/rival is, so I play against Marth alot), I know I need to walk/dash a bit afterwards, but I was watching this great fight http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqQB55d-Tdw and @ ~1:57, Isai waveshines Marth but doesn't seem to dash afterwards, how does he cover the distance to grab him? Is it because he hit Marth in the air? And @ ~2:00 he waveshines him again withiout the dashing...?
Perfect wave dash. When you wave dash you have to bring the control stick as close the the horizontal line as possible.
Also, make sure you're wavedashing out of the shine as quickly as possible (or at least close). That's another big part of wave shining marth/wave shining in general. Just give it some practice when you're alone and pay attention to it specifically when you're playing someone. It's not too hard to get down, just bash your head against it for a while.
Also, make sure you're wavedashing out of the shine as quickly as possible (or at least close). That's another big part of wave shining marth/wave shining in general. Just give it some practice when you're alone and pay attention to it specifically when you're playing someone. It's not too hard to get down, just bash your head against it for a while.
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
I still suggest you go for the dash.
Walking/Perfect Wding is good but...Dashing and grabbing or dashing and JC usmashing is usually guarantee'd. You should practice the perfect WD anyway though.
Walking/Perfect Wding is good but...Dashing and grabbing or dashing and JC usmashing is usually guarantee'd. You should practice the perfect WD anyway though.
shinkazenokizzu
Smash Apprentice
my controller is messed up ='( now my fox isnt as good
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
My friend John said the same thing.