I was wrong. PK flash does suck...

[Smashbros_7]

Ademisk was right. A few months ago, I went of saying awesome it was in Brawl, when I can't use it myself. Characters are to floaty to edge guard with it, and I can't juggle with it. HELP!

 

[Genuine Faster]

Yeah, PK Flash has never been too useful.

If you are REALLY talented/have no life, then you can probably find some way to use it properly. I really don't know if anybody knows of a good way to use it. It's basically a huge lag and waste of time.

Although, I've noticed that it's easier to use in Brawl than in melee, but I could be wrong. I'm able to use it multiple times in a round against very hard computers, but I'm guessing that it would be a lot tougher against actual, unpredictable players.

 

[Earthbound360]

It doesnt suck, but its not the best B move ever. Its better than PK Freeze at least.

PK Flash is pretty good for edgeguarding if you use it for mindgames rather than actually hitting them. It makes opponents not wanna sweetspot or back up away from the edge. If they move on stage while helpless, release PK Flash and punish them. If they back away, release it, and then hit them with an aerial since their recovery pattern will be more predictable. Dairs work great.

PK Flash I heard makes a good umbrella also. I dont use it often, but Ive heard it makes a protective uair since it has a guatanteed hit since it ignores priority.

 

[Smashbros_7]

I guess, but they just air dodge it. Also people are WAY to floaty edge guard with it. Even DK dodge it. DK!

 

[J Tangle]

Pk Flash still has hope. I tend to catch my opponents with PK Flash in a way similar to Lucas' up smash. If your opponent is dumb enough to continue pursuit while your charging PK Flash then they deserve the delayed attack. When edge guarding I usually short hop into PK flash while my opponents airborne or if they're aiming for the edge I release the Flash without leaving the ground so it is able to reach below the edge. But yeah, Ness' game in Brawl is outstanding compared to Melee.

 

[Jono]

I guess, but they just air dodge it. Also people are WAY to floaty edge guard with it. Even DK dodge it. DK!

Follow up with attack.

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

I love PK Flash. I find it much more useful than going after an opponent for a juggle, since it's effective for making them change course or waste a second jump, opening them up for PK Thunder.

Don't use it for edgeguarding. You should never be trying to charge it all the way up, just throw it out when your opponent's above you and watch their actions carefully. If they dodge through it, there's hardly any lag at the end of it, so you can just safely shield and punish. If they air jump, then the same thing occurs, you just chase them with PK thunder or whatever.

It's also safer than using PK thunder because a clever opponent will air dodge or attack the bolt, leaving you open. PK flash doesn't leave you open.

 

[J Tangle]

Oh yeah also PK Flash can KO Kirby while he is in stone form.

 

[AdmantNESS]

Heh, didn't know that. Also destroys annoying ledge hangers.

 

[PK-ow!]

Oh yeah also PK Flash can KO Kirby while he is in stone form.

PK Flash can make the enemy start crying uncontrollably, and in some circumstances, can make the enemy feel strange, become numb, or even be destroyed.



You know... I suppose PK Flash should work any time Lucas' Usmash would.

So then how come it never seems to apply that way?

 

[Conda]

Oh yeah also PK Flash can KO Kirby while he is in stone form.

Naw, it can't. I tested it a while ago because it seemed to kill a stoned kirby once. It just so happens that stone form has around the same duration as charging PK Flash, so the chances are that, when you hit kirby, he just started morphing back into puffball form.

Try charging PK Flash and having kirby down B when PK Flash is above him, and then hit his fresh stone. He won't budge.

 

[J Tangle]

PK Flash can make the enemy start crying uncontrollably, and in some circumstances, can make the enemy feel strange, become numb, or even be destroyed.



You know... I suppose PK Flash should work any time Lucas' Usmash would.

So then how come it never seems to apply that way?

I still haven't got to play Earth Bound

Well because Lucas' Usmash has strange hit boxes around it. While PK flash is a mobile special so it's hit box is fixed, but you know all that right? So using Pk Flash like Lucas' Usmash is based on certain situations, but those situations can be made with the yo-yo.



Anyway I don't use Lucas much does PK freeze harm Kirby in stone form?

to Condo: Oh I guess I need to do more research, but the thing is my experiences came from a kirby attacking from above with stone form, and two other incidents when kirby recovered from above and landed as stone then taking a fully charged PK Flash(which lead to a KO).

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

PK Flash can make the enemy start crying uncontrollably, and in some circumstances, can make the enemy feel strange, become numb, or even be destroyed.



You know... I suppose PK Flash should work any time Lucas' Usmash would.

So then how come it never seems to apply that way?

Because Lucas's up smash hits to the side of him and has more range than his Fsmash sideways, and double that upwards. PK Flash's hitbox is only a bit bigger than Ness.

Also, I hate the way PK Flash never worked on bosses and powerful enemies in Earthbound. It was so annoying.

 

[J Tangle]

Naw, it can't. I tested it a while ago because it seemed to kill a stoned kirby once. It just so happens that stone form has around the same duration as charging PK Flash, so the chances are that, when you hit kirby, he just started morphing back into puffball form.

Try charging PK Flash and having kirby down B when PK Flash is above him, and then hit his fresh stone. He won't budge.

OK, so I just did some research and PK flash does kinda work on Kirby while he's in stone form. By kinda I mean Kirby will take knock back from the Flash, but will sustain no damage. SO depending on the damage Kirby already has; PK Flash can still be deadly to him in his stone form.

 

[AdmantNESS]

Because Lucas's up smash hits to the side of him and has more range than his Fsmash sideways, and double that upwards. PK Flash's hitbox is only a bit bigger than Ness.

Also, I hate the way PK Flash never worked on bosses and powerful enemies in Earthbound. It was so annoying.

I remember it working on Thunder & Storm (Instant Kill/Might have to use more than once) during a playthrough. Can't remember anyone else.

This might help for Flash weaknesses

http://files.fobby.net/0000/06cf/cyricz-battle_and_enemy_guide.txt

And I'll have to practice using Flash as an umbrella.

 

[RednaXale]

I like it for team battles.
Also, it seems to have a bigger range than it looks (although it was way better in Melee). I've killed some people with it who thought they were dodge rolling out of it, but PSYCH!

 

[Smashbros_7]

I WISH it was like in earthbound. I want my enemies to CRY ****it!

 

[Mezna]

PK Flash is one of those few use moves. There aren't alot of situations that you can use it. The easiet time I find it is when a person is recovering. As soon as they get off the stage flying I just start "chargin ma layzah", and by the time they get back to the stage it's **** near super charged. You've got one of 2 options here. Aim for the edge so that they get hit by it when they're coming up to it, or try and hit them as the get up from the ledge. It seems hard at first, but try it a couple times. People know PK Flash is slow, but they also know it hurts, so they don't wanna get hit by it. And if they don't know it hurts, teach them >=)

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

It was terrible in Melee. It's wonderful now. In Melee, the only good thing about it was its lingering hitbox. But in Brawl, it comes out really quickly when uncharged, making it a great umbrella projectile.

The release is also instant and precise.

People really need to stop using PK flash as an edgeguard or KO move and start using it to scare opponents away from Ness during juggles, which usually opens up for punishment if you did it correctly.

 

[cHooKay]

I use pk flash more that i use the bat. I dunno, rather ftilt, its pretty hard using the bat and i always get punished using the bat, rather complain about that rather than pk flash. If you can't find a use for pk flash, use it to scare people when the recover, or mind games: do a quick pk flash then assault them...

Remember, you can use a PK Flash to make an enemy wet their pants...

 

[Earthbound360]

NESSBOUNDER, when I say edgeguard with it, I mean scare them away from the edge to setup for something good. Occassionally though, a bikeless Wario and understage Ike can be pwned directly by Flash.

And chookay, bat is still a good smash. Not as good as stick or melee, but a few tricks can help you land it. Try skid mindgames or a delayed smash on sidesteppers. The timing throw them off.

 

[Conda]

The high damage of the bat is definately nice. You gotta admit that.

 

[cHooKay]

The high damage of the bat is definately nice. You gotta admit that.

Yeah that would be nice, too bad its extremely hard to hit people with since its god awful slow. Against pro players, its dam n near impossible to hit some one with the bat...

 

[Conda]

No duh it's hard to land. But slow moves are never impossible to land. That's like saying it's impossible to land Lucas's usmash. I know it's a different move, but you just need to learn when to use it. If it's just once per match, then at least the bat is getting some use. It's not entirely useless, as a hard-earned 23 someodd % is a very nice payoff for a fsmash.

 

[cHooKay]

No duh it's hard to land. But slow moves are never impossible to land. That's like saying it's impossible to land Lucas's usmash. I know it's a different move, but you just need to learn when to use it. If it's just once per match, then at least the bat is getting some use. It's not entirely useless, as a hard-earned 23 someodd % is a very nice payoff for a fsmash.

dude i didn't say it was impossible, i stated that it is "dam n near impossible", which suggests that i have landed a few hits with the bat. Anyways, this nerf has reduced ness's KO potential in the long run, you can't really rely on it like. Mindgames? Big whoop, rather mess with ness' PK Flash. How can you actually call a move that you can rarely apply useful?

Lucas' usmash has a way more fatter, larger range than the bat and a better disjointed hit box up top and the side and its not that slow (actually a tad bit slower than the bat), the bat has extends out with way more less range (extremely skinny at that) and its just as slow. The lucas' usmash can't really be compared to the bat, because the range, application, and priority of lucas' usmash tops the bat. Generally, it isn't really that hard to land a hit with his usmash because of its properties, especially if you compare that against the bat.

Besides that, I do find it awkward that i use PK Flash more than the bat. IDK, like I guess because of fact that it explodes instantly on the release makes it easy for me to combo utilts and uairs with it, and the fact that I can blow up people who tend to sweet spot the edge....

 

[Ademisk]

I manage to hit people with it.

 

[Earthbound360]

Ademisk, you hit everyone with it.

Chookay, I wouldnt say it turned down his killing potent. In melee, I hardly ever used the bat to kill. It was all about spiking, bair, bthrow, and nair.

 

[Aevin]

I love PK Flash. I find it much more useful than going after an opponent for a juggle, since it's effective for making them change course or waste a second jump, opening them up for PK Thunder.

Don't use it for edgeguarding. You should never be trying to charge it all the way up, just throw it out when your opponent's above you and watch their actions carefully. If they dodge through it, there's hardly any lag at the end of it, so you can just safely shield and punish. If they air jump, then the same thing occurs, you just chase them with PK thunder or whatever.

It's also safer than using PK thunder because a clever opponent will air dodge or attack the bolt, leaving you open. PK flash doesn't leave you open.

Perfectly summarizes my feelings about it.

I also wanted to say that in my experience, PK Flash only works on Kirby's stone when fully charged. I fight a Kirby main who helped me test this. Uncharged, nothing. Fully charged, it broke right through. I'm unclear on whether it actually does the damage (since someone her suggested it didn't). Never looked carefully at his percentage, but it definitely hits Kirby's stone when fully charged.

 

[LavisFiend]

Feather it and it's effectiveness is surprising.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I've noticed that it works rather well in stages with fall through platforms like Battlefield and Distant Planet it can be used to screw with your opponents. Even when it's barely charged, it will still send people skyward and be used as an alternative to PK thunder if you want to mix things up. Regarding the "umbrella effect" some people have been talking about, it works rather well against the more floaty characters like Dedede, Jigglypuff, and Wario.

 

[eHerbieInReverse]

The umbrella also works pretty well against Link, Pikachu, and basicallly anyone with a down-air that has high priority because, as someone said, it isn't even tangible until released so it just ignores priority.

Anyways, I find it pretty useful. Like someone else said, hit them off the stage, run towards end of stage, SH PK flash and depending on the situation and the other player (knowing them would help), aim the PK Flash towards yourself or the top of the ledge, or at the bottom of the ledge and release early. I definitely make a lot of my kills, maybe 15% of my 1v1 kills this way. Pikachu can often quick attack into it if you're good at timing it, Fox is the same way, Falco can easily be denied because of his tendency to >B into it.

If they go for an under approach of ledge-grabbing, don't short hop PK flash, get close to the edge and let the PK flash fall below the ledge (seeing as it goes slightly below Ness' original feet position) and release.

I think the main thing with it is to not use it too often, and to understand that the beauty of PK Flash is that it fully charges at the peak of it's arc; so don't be afraid to let it go.

 

[Conda]

The whole time it moves downwards, it's fully charged? Cool

 

[eHerbieInReverse]

To my knowledge, yes the charge peaks at the peak of the arc that the Flash travels. [:

 

[Conda]

[ 8



10charscansuckmyballs

 

[Aevin]

To my knowledge, yes the charge peaks at the peak of the arc that the Flash travels. [:

I'm pretty sure it occurs slightly after the peak. Maybe about a quarter of the trip down? Or maybe it's simply as soon as it starts back down after hesitating at the top. I'm pretty certain it's not fully charged as soon as it reaches the peak, at least.

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

Oh yeah, and PK Flash fully charged wrecks shields. As does Ness's baseball bat...as does PK thunder 2... as do the yo-yos...oh wait, everything Ness does wrecks shields.

Another fun thing to do is occasinally you'll be in a situation where the opponent is coming down towards you after a juggle, and you're already charging a fully charged PK flash (perhaps the opponent is recovering above the stage with a double jump, or you dragged them on with a high PK thunder) and as they're falling towards you, PK flash is also descending. You can bet that any smart opponent will try to air dodge if they can't avoid it any other way. So you just wait for them to air dodge, and then time PK flash to release just after the invincibility frames wear off. If you did it right, you can follow them down past their air dodge an blast them.

 

[Conda]

And if they DI sideways? lol

 

[eHerbieInReverse]

I've done what you've said a couple of times, NESSBOUNDER. [: It's quite fun. Yeah, for me, PK Flash is seriously a very viable option in a lot of situations. I love the move, and will always love it. Especially with the extra dramatic hit-lag when a fully charged PK Flash makes contact with someone.

Hell, another trick I love to do is charging a PK Flash onto Ness, himself as the opponent recovers back onto the stage. If the game is heated, they might charge at you to get a free hit. But if you time it right, you can release the PK Flash early and with it's deceptively large hitbox and the delay between releasing the B button and the explosion, they'll hit Ness, but instead of being safe, the PK Flash explodes a half a second after Ness is already sent flying. Almost looking like you did the impossible: Release the PK Flash after Ness was interrupted.

So satisfying. So very, very satisfying. (And a little degrading for them he he.)

 

[EdreesesPieces]

Can PK Flash hit a metaknight that's in his UP B?

 

[eHerbieInReverse]

Can PK Flash hit a metaknight that's in his UP B?

Umm, I don't see why not. I don't think he has Super-Armor during his Up B?