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I refuse to attack opponents when they trip!
- Thread starter Umm The Hobo
- Start date
this man speaks the truth.
RedMage8BT
Smash Lord
This is the most intelligent man I've seen on the internet in quite a while.
WoodyWiggins
Smash Journeyman
Sakurai, is that you?
AznHalfCaucasian
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2007
- Messages
- 261
hmmmmm.......interesting thread
indeed
indeed
Golem the Stern Father
Smash Champion
It's part of the game, whether it sucks or not. I will play noramally, even if they trip.
-=Untamed-Beast=-
Smash Journeyman
If I say no, will you recover?
Why I quoted you? well everybody was doing it, and I just want to be popular
(Futurama reference)BTW this topic may be calm down those people that dislike tripping, make them to realise tath their oponent can trip too
Fox Illusion
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Feb 28, 2008
- Messages
- 25
Of all the stuff I've read on the internet, this is the first time a post has actually made me LOL.
I actually cracked up after reading your post dude.
Vampire_Marth
Smash Cadet
why did Sakurai put tripping in the game. He already put in the banana peel and the pit fall. maybe u could call ur not attacking opponents who have tripped. naowht. like an acronymThe thing I hate most, about anything, is cheating and unfairness. I will not attack my opponent when they are on the ground after tripping, in fact, I will back away from them. I don't expect my opponents to not attack me when I trip. Even in money matches (if I am good enough to be in any
P.s. I can't think of anything good to call "not attacking opponents who have tripped"
EON_MagicMan
Smash Cadet
Why is everyone revering in this guy's post?
He's telling an anecdote about honor featuring 50 Cent!
-=Untamed-Beast=-
Smash Journeyman
Don't hate the game son, hate da playa... unless I'm the playa. O_o
In that case *looks for witty "Yo Homie You Gotta Recover!$!" joke*
--------
There are people that agree with my post, and basically I summed up some of their thoughts without actually having to type anything accept a nice thanks.
So what if it's about 50 Cent? It's an example I thought of from when I saw the video some months ago, oh well. The point is use tripping to your advantage, not an excuse for honor (no offense OP).
Thanks for the... concern?
WoodyWiggins
Smash Journeyman
I MUST RECOVER!!!
pirkid
Smash Lord
Why not?
It's not like the opponent is going to show mercy if I trip.
It's not like the opponent is going to show mercy if I trip.
-=Untamed-Beast=-
Smash Journeyman
...from a trip? Ok, recover from a trip...I MUST RECOVER!!!
But beware, your opponent might not hit you and LET YOU RECOVER!
Hydde
Smash Lord
I vote for smash in the face. Is not your fault, is not his either..... and if there are like 5000 dollars at stake and that smash will be the decisive.... im very sure no one will think about this thread in that moment :D
, if that happens.. blame sakurai
, if that happens.. blame sakurai
PiSToLZ
Smash Lord
If they trip its there problem. I will down smash them or something when they trip.Gonor is al right but when money is on the line its just not worth it
Lightning Ice
Smash Journeyman
I've died many times in Melee because a capsule spawned in front me. Getting hit because you had a random trip is the same thing and it isn't putting down the other player because it is random.
TC wont get far anywhere with that mindset.
Personally, i'll go all out, and let loose on them regardless of the situation, whether they trip or not. It only makes my job easier. I would expect the opponent to do the same to me if i was in that situation.
I gotta ask if TC is also one of those people who lets the enemy back onto the stage after knocking them off..
Personally, i'll go all out, and let loose on them regardless of the situation, whether they trip or not. It only makes my job easier. I would expect the opponent to do the same to me if i was in that situation.
I gotta ask if TC is also one of those people who lets the enemy back onto the stage after knocking them off..
WoodyWiggins
Smash Journeyman
I MUST RECOVERRRRRAAAAIII'M OVER 9000!...from a trip? Ok, recover from a trip...
But beware, your opponent might not hit you and LET YOU RECOVER!
How many Brawl money matches have you been in, honestly?
NOT ME! Honor doesn't exist, especially not in video game form.
Sir Bedevere
Smash Lord
You make a good point, but...Brawl isn't arm wrestling.
When you arm wrestle, victory depends on a host of factors, including strength, technique, stamina, and grip. If you don't have more of these factors then your opponent, you are going to lose. A 5 year old arm wrestling against 50 Cent will obviously lose, because they're outmatched in all aspects. It's a simple case of who has more skill than the other. But tripping in Brawl comprises almost solely of one thing: Lady Luck.
There is absolutely no way to predict when you will trip, nor is there a reasonable way to control it. Sure, you could walk or constantly jump, but this would limit you even more than what the OP is saying. You can train endlessly on Brawl, hours upon hours, but even the greatest of Smashers can trip in front of a complete noob and get F-Smashed to oblivion. I'm a mediocre Smash player, but even I could KO Ken if he tripped right in front of me.
Arm wrestling does not have much luck involved at all. It's all about brute strength and overpowering your opponent. This is why they differ, and why your example is not a good one. You're not saying "You're too weak, I'm not gonna hit you" when you don't hit a fallen opponent, you're saying "Bad luck, you shouldn't be punished for something you had no control over." One is based upon whether or not an opponent is skilled enough, while the other is simply about the opponent having rotten luck.
A better comparison of Smash to arm-wrestling is edge-hogging (and by this, I mean hanging onto the edge so the other player cannot grab onto it.) . A lot of casuals refuse to edge-hog because they believe it is dishonourable to do so. However, it takes skill to be able to get an opponent into a position in which they can be edge-hogged. It isn't some random 1% occurrence, you need to actually go out and hit your opponent to edge-hog them. In this sense, if you refuse to edge-hog someone, THEN you are saying "You're too weak, I'm not gonna edge-hog you and I'll still win.", which is just plain arrogance.
And don't get me wrong, I agree that the honour thing is a stupid. I was once one of those "NU C-STIK BIATCH, STOP SPAMINZ FOCKS LAZERZ" people, but I've seen the light and realized how foolish it really is. However, this tripping thing is a bit of an exception. The things I disliked before all involved the abuse of certain attacks and functions, but this is about (must I say it again?) luck. And isn't luck the thing competitives despise the most and want out of their tourneys? So, by stopping people from attacking downed opponents, would we not be preventing more luck from becoming a factor? In this way, if I do end up doing what the OP says, I'll be doing it for fairness and equality; not for honour. Meh, just some food for thought...
I'm going to use the exact same argument most competitives use when dealing with casuals who still think items should be in tourneys: it's an unfair advantage. If an item spawns next to an opponent as you are trying to recover, the opponent automatically gains an advantage over you. They didn't even need to work for it. In the same sense, if you trip in front of an opponent, your opponent suddenly gains an advantage over you without doing anything. You're in a perfect position to be attacked, and if they're smart, they WILL use the opportunity.
And you're using an example of something that can be controlled versus something that cant. That doesnt work. Items can be turned off, trips cant. Trip WILL happen, if you take advantage of the situation, you're the better player. Id rather be better than 'honorable' . You (not directed at you, you know what i mean
) can just go shove 'honor' where the sun dont shine, because it means nothing if you dont win.SiegKnight
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2008
- Messages
- 323
http://www.sirlin.net/Features/feature_PlayToWinPart1.htm
Theres a start to my post; next I'm going to say is that no one here is right or wrong. Though I advocate item use competetively and play to win in all aspects, items or no, I will personally change whether I attack a tripped guy or not depending on the circumstance. For one, it wasn't their fault; thats the first integar to what would usually be a stupid question; I'll of course do anything that puts me at an advantage.
If someone is blatantly intent on fighting me to win, prize on the line or no, whether they're the sorts to enjoy domesticated randomness competetively like I do or the no items sort who want to strangle sakurai for any luck based variables, then, I will give them the same back. But, if someone is clearly refraining from attacking me during a tripup, I will refrain from doing it back; its obvious they don't advocate even controlled randomness like I do and just want a fair fight.
Scrubby or not - since Sakurai's default seems to advocate luck, and thats the game you should play to win, not a set of rules you made up - I won't feel like I beaten them if I did it back. I don't disagree with anyone who would do it back anyway; its their duty to win the game. But if this person is a good fighter, or whether they're not, then taking shortcuts like that will just hurt my game in the long run anyway.
I'd refrain because I want myself to be as alert as possible. Its ironic, I really like items and believe them to make a different - but still skilled - game entirely that is indeed playable. But~! I'm a serious player. In the game most competetives play, its a no bull**** thing. This is why Starfox is their favourite stage alongside FD; this is why they hate items and especially despise tripping. Playing with what works and playing seriously is the only way to test your hand to hand skill. Now then, these players are unprepared for item use. If a smash ball appeared and I blown them away with it skillessly as they didn't know at all of its quirks, they got destroyed by something entirely outside the game they were playing.
Smacking a tripped person feels this way, and whats more theres no active prevention even if you did research it. Or else they'd be using it of course, its forced into their game much like FS's are into mine. Both examples = my game has been hurt. I've not been outwitting them, I've not predicted their moves, and I did not deserve to hit them there. They didn't want tripping to be in their/my/our Smash. Would I beating them on even ground if I used that oppurtunity?
If they did it to me or I feel they'd be the sort to, I'd do it. Yes. You have to survive of course. But~ If they refrained first, I'd respect that. At the least because it'd mean it prevented a possibly inaccurate victory and thus my game hasn't been hurt; at the most because its fair.
Man why can't Sakurai have just given us an option to turn it off anyway. I hope the AR monkeys come up with a way, whether tournament players would bother with it or not. For 1 v 1 no items at least I know I would.
Theres a start to my post; next I'm going to say is that no one here is right or wrong. Though I advocate item use competetively and play to win in all aspects, items or no, I will personally change whether I attack a tripped guy or not depending on the circumstance. For one, it wasn't their fault; thats the first integar to what would usually be a stupid question; I'll of course do anything that puts me at an advantage.
If someone is blatantly intent on fighting me to win, prize on the line or no, whether they're the sorts to enjoy domesticated randomness competetively like I do or the no items sort who want to strangle sakurai for any luck based variables, then, I will give them the same back. But, if someone is clearly refraining from attacking me during a tripup, I will refrain from doing it back; its obvious they don't advocate even controlled randomness like I do and just want a fair fight.
Scrubby or not - since Sakurai's default seems to advocate luck, and thats the game you should play to win, not a set of rules you made up - I won't feel like I beaten them if I did it back. I don't disagree with anyone who would do it back anyway; its their duty to win the game. But if this person is a good fighter, or whether they're not, then taking shortcuts like that will just hurt my game in the long run anyway.
I'd refrain because I want myself to be as alert as possible. Its ironic, I really like items and believe them to make a different - but still skilled - game entirely that is indeed playable. But~! I'm a serious player. In the game most competetives play, its a no bull**** thing. This is why Starfox is their favourite stage alongside FD; this is why they hate items and especially despise tripping. Playing with what works and playing seriously is the only way to test your hand to hand skill. Now then, these players are unprepared for item use. If a smash ball appeared and I blown them away with it skillessly as they didn't know at all of its quirks, they got destroyed by something entirely outside the game they were playing.
Smacking a tripped person feels this way, and whats more theres no active prevention even if you did research it. Or else they'd be using it of course, its forced into their game much like FS's are into mine. Both examples = my game has been hurt. I've not been outwitting them, I've not predicted their moves, and I did not deserve to hit them there. They didn't want tripping to be in their/my/our Smash. Would I beating them on even ground if I used that oppurtunity?
If they did it to me or I feel they'd be the sort to, I'd do it. Yes. You have to survive of course. But~ If they refrained first, I'd respect that. At the least because it'd mean it prevented a possibly inaccurate victory and thus my game hasn't been hurt; at the most because its fair.
Man why can't Sakurai have just given us an option to turn it off anyway. I hope the AR monkeys come up with a way, whether tournament players would bother with it or not. For 1 v 1 no items at least I know I would.
Sir Bedevere
Smash Lord
Yes, items can be turned off, but the argument that I'm using is used against casuals who think items should be used in tourneys. It's not a matter of what can and and can't be turned off or prevented, it's a matter of whether something should be in or out. I'm comparing whether items should be in or out to whether or not people shouldn't attack tripped opponents.
True, taking advantage makes you better, but for the wrong reasons. Just like items, there's no guarantee that your opponent and you will trip 3 times apiece in each match, which relates to the fact that there's no guarantee that the luck of the items will be equal in every match. You might trip 6 times in a match, while your opponent may trip only once. This means your opponent has 5 more advantages than you, 5 more chances to attack you. It all goes back to luck. However, if neither player attacked during the trips, there would be no difference in opportunities. It would almost be like they never tripped at all! And I'm sure nearly everyone in the forums would want that!
Indeed.Id rather be better than 'honorable' . You (not directed at you, you know what i mean
Necrochild313
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- May 30, 2006
- Messages
- 130
Fine by me, but don't expect the favor to be returned.
pesticide
Smash Lord
wow i posted the #2 post about 6 hrs ago and the thread is now 8 pages long....
no mods have locked this yet???
no mods have locked this yet???
-=Untamed-Beast=-
Smash Journeyman
Just noting this: I wasn't strategically comparing it to arm wrestling, it just so happened to be in the example; my focus was against the silly "honor/honour" (different English omg) argument. Still and basically, what you said makes sense. Even though I can't respond much to that directly because it's not what my post was really about, it still makes sense and everyone in this thread needs to read it.
Hehe ok, nice idea. The only thing is items have much more of a luck factor in them than items, and items will appear much more often than tripping. Items give a greater advantage, because one the trip happens, it's done. There was a small slip up, that's all. There is the chance that you're not open for a combo though, however the same combo could happen wether you tripped or not if you had move lag or something along the lines of that; the trip just slightly increases the chances.
Still, it's a good argument against items because great detail of luck factors in certain amounts on different items just to argue against.
Another thing is that tourney-goers (not f@gs) want as little luck as possible, but as of now you can't control tripping or eliminate, so you might as well take advantage of it. Make good from the bad, make their trash your treasure, and other random 'sayings'... lol...
You could also plan ways around tripping, strategies that involve a lesser chance of tripping, and be ready to try and roll out of a trip.
Golem the Stern Father
Smash Champion
You must be trippin' (pun intended).
I will attack then whenever I have a chance, and my opponent will do the same. Tripping will make no difference.
I will attack then whenever I have a chance, and my opponent will do the same. Tripping will make no difference.
Aaryk
Smash Journeyman
My game relies on momentum.
If someone trips and the momentum shifts, i will not hesitate to take advantage of that.
Absolutely. trips is all good.
If someone trips and the momentum shifts, i will not hesitate to take advantage of that.
Absolutely. trips is all good.
CommanderC00L
Smash Cadet
It's actually funny reading all the replies, its like you guys just got finished watching 300 or something and you're all honorable soldiers of sparta that fight in a video game.
The only honor i can remember having is not going to the safe spot in hyrule temple when you have high damage.
drama queens? =p
The only honor i can remember having is not going to the safe spot in hyrule temple when you have high damage.
drama queens? =p
-=Untamed-Beast=-
Smash Journeyman
Kuroneko
Smash Apprentice
Majority of these kids would probably go around a PVP server in WoW ganking every person of the other faction they see. I most likely won't punish someone because of something they cannot control, but if someone in the local area, or on wifi with same tag continues to attack me while I trip, I'll believe they'd want me to do the same back.
HenryMartinez
Smash Cadet
LOL KILL ALL UR FRIENDS.
but srsly, at the end of the day, it's a game, and that's coming from someone who plays pretty competitively.
Qlink
Smash Apprentice
You and your friend are playing and are on your last life on stock match
You manage to get a metal box and he attepmt to grab you at the ledge, He trips...and the metal box wears off...He gets back up and kills you...
Well it depends on the person you are if you do that i guess. I would let them live i guess
You manage to get a metal box and he attepmt to grab you at the ledge, He trips...and the metal box wears off...He gets back up and kills you...
Well it depends on the person you are if you do that i guess. I would let them live i guess
SinisterLizard
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Nov 21, 2007
- Messages
- 805
You're an idiot. What, and I suppose you think edge-hogging/guarding is cheap, too??
Sir Bedevere
Smash Lord
Heh, I had a bad feeling you would say that. I wasted a whole bunch of time typing the first 4 paragraphs when the last one was really all I needed to answer. V_V Always do unesseccary things.... And BTW, I'm Canadian, and here we use slightly different language usage than other countries. For example, we put a u after the o in certain words ( colour, favour, honour) and use serviette instead of napkin (it's French, I believe). There's probably others, but I can't think of em right now.
I'm not quite sure what you're saying; do you mean that because tripping is less of an occurence than items, less to do with luck than items, and leaves only a small window of opportunity to attack, that it isn't much of a problem? I won't argue the fact that they have less to do with luck than items, and certainly happens less even if items are turned to low, but tripping is still a big nusance to Brawl, even if it is not as big a one as items.(Least you can turn items off
) There are already videos and threads displaying the uselessness and horrid outcomes of tripping. You can ignore it, but it will still be there. Also, as one poster a while back sagely posted in this thread, "3 seconds is like an hour in the world of competitive smash", or something to that sentiment. Every little mistake can ruin a shot at victory, and one "small slip up" can cost a person an entire match, which would be devastating in tournament play. Though it may be rare, the fact that it is there would be enough to turn tripping off, had there been the option. I'm probably restating things you already know, so please clear up what you meant by your post. Oh, and I assume you meant "than tripping" when you said "The only thing is items have much more of a luck factor in them than items". Otherwise it doesn't make much sense.
Would that serve as a strategy around tripping?Me said:
A New England Winter
Smash Lord
Tripping can mean the difference between a well placed Hyphen, and utter Bowser F-Smash to Face humiliation, sure. However, it can also mean the difference between being caught in a chain, and throwing the Omega Mario Death Fire Ball Blast O' Doom right at their most weakest.
Do I support Trip-Stalking? Hell yeah. It may be a cheap-*** advantage, but it's an advantage all the same. I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep over it. In fact, I'd sleep better knowing that I won.
Do I wish to get Trip-Stalked? No, but who does? I won't b***h about it.
Do I support Trip-Stalking? Hell yeah. It may be a cheap-*** advantage, but it's an advantage all the same. I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep over it. In fact, I'd sleep better knowing that I won.
Do I wish to get Trip-Stalked? No, but who does? I won't b***h about it.
DrakeFreedom
Smash Cadet
Maybe attacking the oppenent is cheap/not honorable too, Now that i think about it any physical contact is totally cheap, omg those ppls have no honor!