How to play Pichu?

[Octorockandroll]

I mean, you can just use both, depending on the situation. CPU never seems to di on the up throw, but it'd be good to practice against people that di to test how to go about using the thunder.

Haven't tried it on all 70+ characters but I can confirm that uthrow thunder is true on most and has a wider percent window and is more precise than the dair setup. So far I only really recommend using dair onstage as a mixup.

 

[Teeb147]

Haven't tried it on all 70+ characters but I can confirm that uthrow thunder is true on most and has a wider percent window and is more precise than the dair setup. So far I only really recommend using dair onstage as a mixup.

That'd be more than amazing, but if it's like it was for pikachu the opponent has to di at the start of it.
I need to see if it really is true, or what the di window is. Im really curious now.

Also, the advantage with dair is that you can sweep by someone and keep running after landing, and if they spotdodge expecting a grab, you can get still get them with it, either on the second hit of the dair by fast falling, or proper landing and following up. Still needs to be tested, but to me dair has its use for sure.

 

[Grump]

Pichu has brought my love for Smash back.
Do we have a thread yet to post all of our findings? I've been playing a bit, but would like to do some serious testing with you guys and find out some good stuff.

 

[Octorockandroll]

Pichu has brought my love for Smash back.
Do we have a thread yet to post all of our findings? I've been playing a bit, but would like to do some serious testing with you guys and find out some good stuff.

I think we're posting all our general findings here. There's also a stage discussion thread up if that's what you want to talk about. We don't have a MU thread yet but that'll probably be coming once some of us get more knowledge on counterplay. Glad to have you here.

 

[Grump]

Here's a little bit. I have a TL;DR at the bottom.

As example: It would appear his Neutral B has some dropoff given certain ranges.
Reference Points (Training Mode): Mario on Spawn, Pichu's front toe on +X, facing Mario

Spawn -> 4.3 Map Units
Neutral B does 8.4 damage
4.3u -> 7.8u
Neutral B does 7.2 damage
7.8u -> 15.5u
Neutral B does 6 damage.
Knockback (while negligible anyways) does not seem to be affected by distance.
Hitstun does not appear to be affected by distance.

Neutral-B Aerial Projectile
Knockback is still slight, but significant at higher percents
Stunned until frame 28
Deals 12 damage, does not appear to be affected by distance (not thorough)
Travel distance of arcing jolt begins at aerial ball's point of impact with the ground.

Aerial Neutral B is better in every way, while still dealing the same amount of damage to Pichu.

Side-B has no damage or knockback fall-off.

Down-B
There's a hitbox near the thunder-cloud that deals 7.2 damage and spikes (apparently for a direct follow-up with the thunderbolt-pichu collision).
The bolt itself only deals 4.8, but direct hits knock the opponent upward. Opponents are not left in stun long-enough to follow-up with another cloud hit. (To test, Mario at 167%. Down-B to hit Mario at his 1st full-jump's apex. He can jump out of a follow-up Down-B).
Distance traveled does not seem to affect Thunder bolt strength.

Up-B
Cannot travel through projectiles.
Cannot travel through hit-boxes.
Interesting to note that his Up-B does alter his hurt-box size. Up-B'ing straight through Mario, Pichu was able to go under multiple stages of Mario's Up-Smash. Not his Side Smash though.

Pichu's small size lets him bypass some projectiles. Of particular note (and no particular order):
Mario's B: Technically crouched under, requires too much precise precision to be practical though.

Robin's B (No Charge): Crouched, dashed under.
Robin's B (Stage 1 Charge): Crouched, not dashed.
Robin's B (Stage 2 Charge): Cannot be crouched, cannot be dashed. CAN BE CRAWLED!!!
Robin's B (Fully Charged): Can be crouched under. Can be dashed under(!). Be careful of lingering hitbox.
Robin's Side-B: Can be dashed under, from as far as 5u away on activation.

Samus's B: Can be ducked and dashed under only if not charged. A couple frames of charging are okay, but anymore than that and you will get hit.
Samus's Side-Smash B: Can be ducked, not dashed under.

Link's B: Can be ducked, but arcs heavily if quick-fired.
Young Link's B: Can be ducked, but arcs heavily if quick-fired.
Link's Side-B: Cannot be ducked.
Young Link's Side-B: Cannot be ducked
Young Link's Bomb-Throw: Can be ducked (even at low-strength throw) but arcs heavily.

Fox's B: Can be ducked somewhat reliably (spam will still hit you). Can be less-reliably dashed under.
Can be completely crawled under.
Falco's B: Cannot be ducked under. Can be crawled under with moderate success (about 80 percent)
Note: There is very very occasional grazing, where the hit-spark animation shows but no hit-stun happens. This may be the lowest ranged projectile that we can dodge through crawling. I suspect this means Pichu's hurt-box moves with his animation.
Falco's Down-B: Can be ducked under. Cannot be dashed under.
Wolf's B: Can be crawled under. Cannot be crouched under.

Zero-Suit Samus's B: Can be crouched under somewhat reliably (variable spots will hit you). Can be reliably crawled under though?
(At this point I did a quick test. Crawling (both forward and backward) does reduce the vertical size of pichu's hurtbox compared to stationary crouching. To test, have Zero Suit Samus repeat her jab. She will occasionally hit a crouched pichu, but never a crawling one. I then went back and repeated all tests withc crawling where applicable, and updated the results).

Richter: His side-tilt can be crawled under. Not crouched.

TL;DR: Pichu's neutral B does more damage, knockback and deals more hit-stun if the mid-air execution's thunder-ball makes contact, rather than the arcing jolt. The arcing jolt deals less damage as it travels farther. You can extend the reach of the arcing jolt by launching his special from the air, as the distance traveled doesn't begin counting until it begins bouncing. Pichu's Down-B sweet-spots at the cloud, knocking the opponent downward, while the bolt itself knocks the opponent upward. It cannot true-combo into itself. Pichu's Up-B does not travel through any type of hit-box, though it does drastically reduce the size of his own hurt-box. Tested against Mario's Up-Smash, Pichu was able to travel "through" (really it was under) Mario's attack without being injured.

Pichu's crouching, crawling, and dashing hurtboxes are very odd. Dashing appears to be the tallest of the three, but can still slip under some major projectiles (mainly Robin's fully-charged and 0-charged Neutral B, and Samus's 0-charged Neutral-B). Past that, simple crouching seems to have the middle height of the three. Crawling (both forwards and backwards) seems to keep Pichu's hurtbox at it's lowest point.
So you should either dash or crawl under certain projectiles. Learning which projectiles need which approach should keep them on their toes). Down-smashing can accomplish a similar goal (v Zero-Suit's Neutral-B), but I'm not sure how this would be practical.

Edit: Found out through play.
Foot-stool appears to true-combo into dair (on Bowser)

A shielded side-tilt can be followed up with a jab, on cast with slower grabs. The jab possibly comes out after the shield comes down, but before the grab connects, and before they can OoS-hop out of range.
Works on Luigi, Yoshi, potentially other cast with slower grabs.
Does not work on Mario, Bowser.
Will need to test more thoroughly.

 

[Octorockandroll]

Here's a little bit. I have a TL;DR at the bottom.

As example: It would appear his Neutral B has some dropoff given certain ranges.
Reference Points (Training Mode): Mario on Spawn, Pichu's front toe on +X, facing Mario

Spawn -> 4.3 Map Units
Neutral B does 8.4 damage
4.3u -> 7.8u
Neutral B does 7.2 damage
7.8u -> 15.5u
Neutral B does 6 damage.
Knockback (while negligible anyways) does not seem to be affected by distance.
Hitstun does not appear to be affected by distance.

Neutral-B Aerial Projectile
Knockback is still slight, but significant at higher percents
Stunned until frame 28
Deals 12 damage, does not appear to be affected by distance (not thorough)
Travel distance of arcing jolt begins at aerial ball's point of impact with the ground.

Aerial Neutral B is better in every way, while still dealing the same amount of damage to Pichu.

Side-B has no damage or knockback fall-off.

Down-B
There's a hitbox near the thunder-cloud that deals 7.2 damage and spikes (apparently for a direct follow-up with the thunderbolt-pichu collision).
The bolt itself only deals 4.8, but direct hits knock the opponent upward. Opponents are not left in stun long-enough to follow-up with another cloud hit. (To test, Mario at 167%. Down-B to hit Mario at his 1st full-jump's apex. He can jump out of a follow-up Down-B).
Distance traveled does not seem to affect Thunder bolt strength.

Up-B
Cannot travel through projectiles.
Cannot travel through hit-boxes.
Interesting to note that his Up-B does alter his hurt-box size. Up-B'ing straight through Mario, Pichu was able to go under multiple stages of Mario's Up-Smash. Not his Side Smash though.

Pichu's small size lets him bypass some projectiles. Of particular note (and no particular order):
Mario's B: Technically crouched under, requires too much precise precision to be practical though.

Robin's B (No Charge): Crouched, dashed under.
Robin's B (Stage 1 Charge): Crouched, not dashed.
Robin's B (Stage 2 Charge): Cannot be crouched, cannot be dashed. CAN BE CRAWLED!!!
Robin's B (Fully Charged): Can be crouched under. Can be dashed under(!). Be careful of lingering hitbox.
Robin's Side-B: Can be dashed under, from as far as 5u away on activation.

Samus's B: Can be ducked and dashed under only if not charged. A couple frames of charging are okay, but anymore than that and you will get hit.
Samus's Side-Smash B: Can be ducked, not dashed under.

Link's B: Can be ducked, but arcs heavily if quick-fired.
Young Link's B: Can be ducked, but arcs heavily if quick-fired.
Link's Side-B: Cannot be ducked.
Young Link's Side-B: Cannot be ducked
Young Link's Bomb-Throw: Can be ducked (even at low-strength throw) but arcs heavily.

Fox's B: Can be ducked somewhat reliably (spam will still hit you). Can be less-reliably dashed under.
Can be completely crawled under.
Falco's B: Cannot be ducked under. Can be crawled under with moderate success (about 80 percent)
Note: There is very very occasional grazing, where the hit-spark animation shows but no hit-stun happens. This may be the lowest ranged projectile that we can dodge through crawling. I suspect this means Pichu's hurt-box moves with his animation.
Falco's Down-B: Can be ducked under. Cannot be dashed under.
Wolf's B: Can be crawled under. Cannot be crouched under.

Zero-Suit Samus's B: Can be crouched under somewhat reliably (variable spots will hit you). Can be reliably crawled under though?
(At this point I did a quick test. Crawling (both forward and backward) does reduce the vertical size of pichu's hurtbox compared to stationary crouching. To test, have Zero Suit Samus repeat her jab. She will occasionally hit a crouched pichu, but never a crawling one. I then went back and repeated all tests withc crawling where applicable, and updated the results).

Richter: His side-tilt can be crawled under. Not crouched.

TL;DR: Pichu's neutral B does more damage, knockback and deals more hit-stun if the mid-air execution's thunder-ball makes contact, rather than the arcing jolt. The arcing jolt deals less damage as it travels farther. You can extend the reach of the arcing jolt by launching his special from the air, as the distance traveled doesn't begin counting until it begins bouncing. Pichu's Down-B sweet-spots at the cloud, knocking the opponent downward, while the bolt itself knocks the opponent upward. It cannot true-combo into itself. Pichu's Up-B does not travel through any type of hit-box, though it does drastically reduce the size of his own hurt-box. Tested against Mario's Up-Smash, Pichu was able to travel "through" (really it was under) Mario's attack without being injured.

Pichu's crouching, crawling, and dashing hurtboxes are very odd. Dashing appears to be the tallest of the three, but can still slip under some major projectiles (mainly Robin's fully-charged and 0-charged Neutral B, and Samus's 0-charged Neutral-B). Past that, simple crouching seems to have the middle height of the three. Crawling (both forwards and backwards) seems to keep Pichu's hurtbox at it's lowest point.
So you should either dash or crawl under certain projectiles. Learning which projectiles need which approach should keep them on their toes). Down-smashing can accomplish a similar goal (v Zero-Suit's Neutral-B), but I'm not sure how this would be practical.

Edit: Found out through play.
Foot-stool appears to true-combo into dair (on Bowser)

A shielded side-tilt can be followed up with a jab, on cast with slower grabs. The jab possibly comes out after the shield comes down, but before the grab connects, and before they can OoS-hop out of range.
Works on Luigi, Yoshi, potentially other cast with slower grabs.
Does not work on Mario, Bowser.
Will need to test more thoroughly.

Thanks for the info

Also, Pichu can crouch and crawl beneath hadokens from Ryu and Ken, bt not if he's close enough to make contact with the startup animation as that has a bigger vertical hitbox

 

[ShiroTpoison]

Honestly mate, you're better off just doing uthrow to thunder. Just saying.

Very true, it might help with di mix ups tho. I have been playing against my brother during the whole weekend and he knew I was looking for grabs. It might help in some situations. It works pretty well against get up attacks or ledge get up attacks.

 

[Teeb147]

I've tested for up-throw, di'ing with a second player, and it's like it was for pikachu, you can di especially if you press a direction early enough. so the up-throw to thunder combos are not 'true', but you can still get a lot of people if you do it quick enough and they dont react fast enough. Can make for some early (70%+) ko's

 

[MachuPichu]

ZeRo uploaded a nice overview of Pichu a couple of days ago. Not sure if it's been posted here yet.

How to Play Pichu in Smash Bros Ultimate

He mentions that he thinks Pichu has potential, moreso if Pikachu sees changes later in the games lifecycle.

 

[Scuzzy]

Main things I've noticed in beginning my journey as a Pichu main:

Usmash has a sick hitbox that gets the area behind Pichu which is great for mixing up when running under your enemy or catching them when they roll under you, and additionally it doesn't cause self-harm.

Nair is basically the bread and butter move. It doesn't cause self harm, it has a long activity window, and it's fast. I sometimes jump all over the stage doing this, acting as sort of flying wrecking ball. It does wonders for gimping but it does seem to get out-priotized against most up-bs so you have to watch out when edge guarding.

I'm so happy Pichu's Usmash is still strong, it's seems like a pretty safe kill option.

Because Pichu has no range I recommend only going for serious edgeguards when your opponent is in a position where their up b would be wasted. Of course what you can do once you're in that position is amazing so don't be shy about going offstage once your opponent can't recover easily.

As for using dair spike in combos like I was theory crafting earlier, I've tested it out and sadly there don't seem to be any true combos with it. You can use it to effectively extend combos if you connect it after a dtilt or dthrow at around 65% to 80% but if your opponent DI's even a little bit you'll hit with the wrong part of the hit box and send them far off instead of getting a floor bounce. Still, it could probably be useful near the ledge, since you can more easily predict the opponent will DI in to avoid a potential offstage hit and if they dont well you may just spike them off the stage in which case you're at a big advantage. I've also been looking into Pichu's neutral, but I don't want to get into that right now because I'm not good at neutral yet so I wanna be absolutely certain before I say anything on it other than stay in opponents' faces, remember that you can now use tilts and smash attacks out of a dash which will get you some really early kills if you have good stage control, always nair oos like zipzo said and be sure to stay creative with your movement. I'm really looking forward to experiencing the Pichu meta along with you guys.

Yeah I've noticed edgeguards close to the stage are pretty dangerous. I went out to nair Chrom off stage earlier, got Up-B'd and taken down to end the match. I have had a couple successful edgeguards from running offstage and using bair, but that seemed pretty risky so I don't know how safe/reliable it really is. Pichu has a good recovery, so going deep to gimp with a nair before you opponent is even considering an Up-B has so far seemed safest to me.

Has anyone found a consistent use for dair yet though? So far I've really been using it as a mix up, and even going for the spike offstage hasn't been consistent. I'm thinking there could be a use for not hitting the spike box, similar to how a weak hit fair can sometimes follow into a grab, but I haven't found anything like that yet.

 

[zipzo]

ZeRo uploaded a nice overview of Pichu a couple of days ago. Not sure if it's been posted here yet.

How to Play Pichu in Smash Bros Ultimate

He mentions that he thinks Pichu has potential, moreso if Pikachu sees changes later in the games lifecycle.

I respect Zero but he says literally everything is either broken or has potential lol.

 

[Octorockandroll]

I'm so happy Pichu's Usmash is still strong, it's seems like a pretty safe kill option.

Yeah I've noticed edgeguards close to the stage are pretty dangerous. I went out to nair Chrom off stage earlier, got Up-B'd and taken down to end the match. I have had a couple successful edgeguards from running offstage and using bair, but that seemed pretty risky so I don't know how safe/reliable it really is. Pichu has a good recovery, so going deep to gimp with a nair before you opponent is even considering an Up-B has so far seemed safest to me.

Has anyone found a consistent use for dair yet though? So far I've really been using it as a mix up, and even going for the spike offstage hasn't been consistent. I'm thinking there could be a use for not hitting the spike box, similar to how a weak hit fair can sometimes follow into a grab, but I haven't found anything like that yet.

For offstage gimping you would ideally want to carry them offstage in a combo at which point you could (depending on the character) react to their recovery option. I was playing a villager player today, right? And I get a dtilt into fair into another fair carrying him off the level, but once thats done he DI's down and towards the stage out of my range, so I wait for him to bring his balloons put and double jump back towards the stage and dair spike him as he's about to reach the ledge. Dair is a punish tool, basically.

Speaking of punish tools, I recommend not using upsmash that much, since downsmash is better in most situations. It's pretty much just as fast, has better damage and knockback, a bigger horizontal hitbox and it shrinks the **** out of Pichu's hurtbox. I've been able to get several kills off of just run up crouch canel dsmash

I respect Zero but he says literally everything is either broken or has potential lol.

The game just came out, of course almost every character has potential, it would be stupid to dismiss characters right away unless they're really really bad.

 

[Teeb147]

I'm so happy Pichu's Usmash is still strong, it's seems like a pretty safe kill option.

Yeah I've noticed edgeguards close to the stage are pretty dangerous. I went out to nair Chrom off stage earlier, got Up-B'd and taken down to end the match. I have had a couple successful edgeguards from running offstage and using bair, but that seemed pretty risky so I don't know how safe/reliable it really is. Pichu has a good recovery, so going deep to gimp with a nair before you opponent is even considering an Up-B has so far seemed safest to me.

Has anyone found a consistent use for dair yet though? So far I've really been using it as a mix up, and even going for the spike offstage hasn't been consistent. I'm thinking there could be a use for not hitting the spike box, similar to how a weak hit fair can sometimes follow into a grab, but I haven't found anything like that yet.

Yeh dont try to edgeguard chrom close up. his recovery sucks, but it can take down people with him.

dair is pretty good, it's like pikachu's where if you dont fast fall it it'll autocancel before landing. It's a pretty good hit and run tool that can lead to others things. (besides gimping off stage)
There's lower percentages where it's possible to combo into it, so that's cool, though it depends on how they di, i think.

 

[Scuzzy]

For offstage gimping you would ideally want to carry them offstage in a combo at which point you could (depending on the character) react to their recovery option. I was playing a villager player today, right? And I get a dtilt into fair into another fair carrying him off the level, but once thats done he DI's down and towards the stage out of my range, so I wait for him to bring his balloons put and double jump back towards the stage and dair spike him as he's about to reach the ledge. Dair is a punish tool, basically.

Speaking of punish tools, I recommend not using upsmash that much, since downsmash is better in most situations. It's pretty much just as fast, has better damage and knockback, a bigger horizontal hitbox and it shrinks the **** out of Pichu's hurtbox. I've been able to get several kills off of just run up crouch canel dsmash

You're right, I'm experimenting more with dsmash and it seems a much better kill tool than usmash. Also been using it a punish option. Seems like an all around good smash attack. The hurtbox is also really interesting, never realized that.

Yeh dont try to edgeguard chrom close up. his recovery sucks, but it can take down people with him.

dair is pretty good, it's like pikachu's where if you dont fast fall it it'll autocancel before landing. It's a pretty good hit and run tool that can lead to others things. (besides gimping off stage)
There's lower percentages where it's possible to combo into it, so that's cool, though it depends on how they di, i think.

Yeah I've also noticed (though been playing mostly against CPU so far, so keep that in mind for DI and general tech purposes) that on some characters at mid percents dthrow or dtilt can combo in dair. Have to test this more and in matches against human opponents, but it could be a good mix up game for throws, and open up some more options.

 

[Octorockandroll]

So I think we've got advatnage and offstage covered pretty but I feel as though we still havent covered neutral as deep as we should. We've talked about Pichu's speed and low hurtbox and how that can get him but if we just always approach with Pichu we're going to get predictable and our oponents will be able to punish us for it. So I think we need to think about how we can bait unsafe approaches from them instead. We can't use neutral b too much because that hurts us and even if we can play keepaway alright, thats not going to work unless we have the lead.

 

[Teeb147]

So I think we've got advatnage and offstage covered pretty but I feel as though we still havent covered neutral as deep as we should. We've talked about Pichu's speed and low hurtbox and how that can get him but if we just always approach with Pichu we're going to get predictable and our oponents will be able to punish us for it. So I think we need to think about how we can bait unsafe approaches from them instead. We can't use neutral b too much because that hurts us and even if we can play keepaway alright, thats not going to work unless we have the lead.

I think we already talked about that a bit. Pichu doesnt have the range, so it comes down to dash dancing, and neutral b can be alright, but not using it to camp, but as a mix up.
I guess someone could also mix up some full hop attacks to land, not just always short hopping. Cant think of anything else. Besdies ducking and down tilting for quick pokes that can lead into combos

 

[rat.jpg]

Thank you everyone for sharing these combos and information, it's very helpful

 

[zipzo]

So I think we've got advatnage and offstage covered pretty but I feel as though we still havent covered neutral as deep as we should. We've talked about Pichu's speed and low hurtbox and how that can get him but if we just always approach with Pichu we're going to get predictable and our oponents will be able to punish us for it. So I think we need to think about how we can bait unsafe approaches from them instead. We can't use neutral b too much because that hurts us and even if we can play keepaway alright, thats not going to work unless we have the lead.

I've had a lot of success with jolt approaches. Like where you use momentum to jump while pressing b, and then mix them up using the awesome ground speed of ultimate when they try to block or Dodge the jolt. They either take the dmg from the jolt, which hurts, or block/jump/Dodge the jolt leaving themselves unsuspecting for your approach.

It honestly works a vast majority of the time. It creates so much pressure I actually find people playing hyper defensively all the time with me, because jolt racks up dmg like crazy if they don't have a constant answer for it, but they are going to be pressured to approach lest they want to sit there and soak up damage. They always either put themselves in a vulnerable place because of attempting to avoid getting hit, or they approach really sloppily to try and break the chain.

 

[Scuzzy]

I've had a lot of success with jolt approaches. Like where you use momentum to jump while pressing b, and then mix them up using the awesome ground speed of ultimate when they try to block or Dodge the jolt. They either take the dmg from the jolt, which hurts, or block/jump/Dodge the jolt leaving themselves unsuspecting for your approach.

I've noticed the biggest thing for neutral is really being patient. It can get frustrating sending out jolts which slowly damage you, but it seems the best option. If it connects it stuns for about 16 frames so if it hits you've got time to work with and if it doesn't you can pressure shield/dodge or jump. Plus yeah, the dash speed is unreal in this game so being able to run in and be able to grab, or even tilt to combos out of that it leaves you with a lot of options.

On that topic of tilt combos btw i finally had time to check d/utilt into dair, and without di here's what I found (tested on Marth):
50 % - 70% utilt combos to short hop dair hitting the spike. Higher %s seem pretty DIable.
50 - 90 or 100% dtilt to short hop dair spike box, low %s seems suspect.
90 to just over 100 % utilt full hop to dair spike.

 

[Grump]

There’re two different hit boxes for his Dtilt. It appears hitting the opponent while grounded will the opponent toward Pichu. Hitting them while they are aerial or too close will hit them away.

 

[Bellsprout]

I've noticed the biggest thing for neutral is really being patient. It can get frustrating sending out jolts which slowly damage you, but it seems the best option. If it connects it stuns for about 16 frames so if it hits you've got time to work with and if it doesn't you can pressure shield/dodge or jump. Plus yeah, the dash speed is unreal in this game so being able to run in and be able to grab, or even tilt to combos out of that it leaves you with a lot of options.

On that topic of tilt combos btw i finally had time to check d/utilt into dair, and without di here's what I found (tested on Marth):
50 % - 70% utilt combos to short hop dair hitting the spike. Higher %s seem pretty DIable.
50 - 90 or 100% dtilt to short hop dair spike box, low %s seems suspect.
90 to just over 100 % utilt full hop to dair spike.

Is d/utilt to spike worth it compared to the dtilt, utilt, uair, fair/nair?

 

[Octorockandroll]

Is d/utilt to spike worth it compared to the dtilt, utilt, uair, fair/nair?

Wouldnt recommend the spike unless the enemy is at a percent where it can combo into thunder. The second combo can carry off the level, which is where Pichu is in his element.

 

[Kel]

Is anyone else having difficulties with Incineroar online? His Over B kills us particularly early and he out ranges us close both on the ground and in the air. I tend to bob and weave as much as possible in the air, but he can throw out Nair for free and out prioritize us it seems.

 

[zipzo]

Is anyone else having difficulties with Incineroar online? His Over B kills us particularly early and he out ranges us close both on the ground and in the air. I tend to bob and weave as much as possible in the air, but he can throw out Nair for free and out prioritize us it seems.

I think heavy characters in general are extremely lacking in leniency for Pichu players because one single stray hit from them could mean sending us flying off the stage in to a position where we are already on the back foot with their opportunity to edge guard. Being the lightest character in the game definitely becomes apparent when going up against enemies like Charizard, Ridley, or Dedede.

 

[J.Noble]

Yeh dont try to edgeguard chrom close up. his recovery sucks, but it can take down people with him.

dair is pretty good, it's like pikachu's where if you dont fast fall it it'll autocancel before landing. It's a pretty good hit and run tool that can lead to others things. (besides gimping off stage)
There's lower percentages where it's possible to combo into it, so that's cool, though it depends on how they di, i think.

I've been experimenting against chrom. In most situations, you are actually fast enough to get under him and nair before he gets to the right spot to up-b. Or you can just surprise fast fall nair. Most Chroms right now aren't used to being challenged down there.

 

[Blackwolf666]

I'm dropping Pikachu now that I've seen the light... and that light is our lord and savior Pichu!