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How to play against Link ?

Usopp

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 30, 2014
Messages
123
Location
EnWhySee
Hi, so I've been playing project m since April. And i went to local tournaments all summer. Ive played and learned almost all of the cast and can play against them as well. Ive practiced a lot and can tech, wavedash and wave land with a lot of characters. I haven't decided on a main yet but right now my characters from best to worst are Ness, Wario, Ganon/Luigi, Wolf. Most of the summer Link gave me a lot of problems and i didn't think about it at all. Until i started to repeatedly get knocked out of my local due to a player who is pretty good with Link. For some reason i just couldn't figure it out the MU with any of my characters (i was mostly playing as wario). Then i was knocked out at Zenith by a Link player named Wolf who was crazy good lol. Even my roomate plays a decent Link and completely destroys me. For some reason i cant figure out how to get around the projectiles. Maybe i just suck lol but i was wondering if anyone here has advice for someone who consistently loses to decent Link players.

Projectiles too strong. :link2:
 

ITALIAN N1NJA

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 30, 2013
Messages
533
Location
Oakbrook Terrace, IL
NNID
ITALIAN_N1NJA
3DS FC
3368-3413-2021
Hi, so I've been playing project m since April. And i went to local tournaments all summer. Ive played and learned almost all of the cast and can play against them as well. Ive practiced a lot and can tech, wavedash and wave land with a lot of characters. I haven't decided on a main yet but right now my characters from best to worst are Ness, Wario, Ganon/Luigi, Wolf. Most of the summer Link gave me a lot of problems and i didn't think about it at all. Until i started to repeatedly get knocked out of my local due to a player who is pretty good with Link. For some reason i just couldn't figure it out the MU with any of my characters (i was mostly playing as wario). Then i was knocked out at Zenith by a Link player named Wolf who was crazy good lol. Even my roomate plays a decent Link and completely destroys me. For some reason i cant figure out how to get around the projectiles. Maybe i just suck lol but i was wondering if anyone here has advice for someone who consistently loses to decent Link players.

Projectiles too strong. :link2:
Against Link you need to weave through the projectiles and stay on him. Link doesn't handle pressure well. He's the perfect weight for being comboed. Wario struggles to get in due to the projectiles and Link being a character centered around zoning usually can do a good job of keeping Wario out. Your job is to get in. If you allow him to get his wall of projectiles up, you're going to struggle to get in especially as Wario. Remember that Nair clanks with Boomerang(but you go through) and Shoulder Bash clanks the boomerang but stops you due to the clank. Technical skill is nothing if you don't have your fundamentals in tact. Practice against players who play Link and learn the match up. Never get discouraged. You'll understand eventually.
 

Vorde

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 9, 2009
Messages
258
Location
Ontario
NNID
Vorde
3DS FC
4613-7807-1976
Any ideas about how Fox or Peach getting in on Link? I struggle with Up-B near ledge with Fox, and also with general matchup against him. Only have issues with two characters right now, and Link is one of them. I can play fairly well, as I've been playing since Dec but the Link MU against Fox and Peach I cannot seem to understand. Any tips?
 

ITALIAN N1NJA

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 30, 2013
Messages
533
Location
Oakbrook Terrace, IL
NNID
ITALIAN_N1NJA
3DS FC
3368-3413-2021
Any ideas about how Fox or Peach getting in on Link? I struggle with Up-B near ledge with Fox, and also with general matchup against him. Only have issues with two characters right now, and Link is one of them. I can play fairly well, as I've been playing since Dec but the Link MU against Fox and Peach I cannot seem to understand. Any tips?
A large issue with Peach is that she had a great edgegaurd game in Melee and still does in Project M. But in Project M recoveries go above and beyond making it difficult to edgeguard. Focus on getting Link offstage and eating his tethers and jumps. Remember you can float close to the ground and Fair which has a large hit box which usually covers the ledge sweetspot if done correctly.

As for Fox, the spacies in general have a hard time offstage because they have such an outstanding on stage game. Try to mix up your recoveries.
-Sweetspot the ledge more. If the stage has vertical walls, try to ride up the wall to sweetspot diagonally with FireFox(Up-b). If the stage is a triangle platform stage, and you see the Link attempting to stay on the ground attempting to get a Spin Attack gimp, use FireFox diagonally up and go for the platform, in that situation it's usually best to go for the platform. It's much better to take an Up Air or a Nair in comparison to a Spin Attack.
-The matchup of Link v Fox is actually in Fox's favor due to his ability to constantly pressure Link and stay in his face which is exactly where you want to be as a Fox. Staying in Links' face means he can't get projectiles out. Fox's attacks come out so fast that they beat many of Links' options.
-Remember that the Spin Attack IS punishable. If one were to block the initial hit, the rest of the hit box is gone, which gives an opportunity for a large punish.
-When Link recovers using his tether(Hookshot/Clawshot), it's pretty telegraphed unless the Link tether cancels into Up-b. What this means is the move is telegraphed allowing for a shine gimp situationoff stage. Once this happens the Link will be forced to Up-b early to avoid being KOed. The Link is then forced to Up-b land on-stage (which has a good amount of lag) and this allows for Foc to come in for a free Up Smash punish.
-One should keep in mind that Fox is a fast faller, and so is Link. This means they can get comboed harshly. If Link gets a grab, up throw can lead to a chained up tilt, dash attack combination. Down throw into Spin Attack is guaranteed at mid/mid-high percents. This is bad for Fox because Downthrow>Spin Attack sends spacies directly offstage which is right where Link wants them. Remember that many of Links options are centered around him being a zoning character who's heavier attacks are high risk for high reward. Links' tether, as all tethers act, CANNOT grab opponents out of the air. Try to Nair plane in situations where the Link is constantly fishing for grabs. Once Link gets a grab on Fox prepare to hold on for dear life because Link has an incredible punish game.
-Lastly, I would test this, but I believe that the Nair(as most Nairs do) clank with Boomerang. That's VERY important to note.

My apologies for not knowing much about Peach. I play Fox mains in Project M all the time though. I rarely play Peach players in Project M. I do however have a feeling that in 3.5 Peach will flourish once more due to how much she excels in the edgeguard department.
 

Vorde

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 9, 2009
Messages
258
Location
Ontario
NNID
Vorde
3DS FC
4613-7807-1976
Thank you very much for your reply, that's some of the most helpful info I've ever read for PM :)
 

menotyou135

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 22, 2013
Messages
313
Location
Tampa FL
How do you play against link with:

Marth/Roy
Jiggz
Ness
Squirtle
C. Falcon
Falco
Charizard

I have a friend who I can beat easily in every matchup except when he is playing link. Link is literally his only good character. However, when he plays link, he usually wins. I would say he wins 7-8 out of 10 games against me regardless of who I play against him with. I have found the most success with Falcon/Squirtle despite neither being my mains. I can sometimes win with Marth/Roy only because they are my mains. I have no idea how to approach with jiggz despite jiggz being my secondary. I have yet to try Ness against him as I just recently picked up ness. And my Falco/Zard usually get 2 or 3-stocked despite both being some of my best characters.

He usually walls me out with projectiles and when I can get close he uses his spin attack, nair, or Up smash to cancel out my approach. I've tried approaching both on the ground with dash dancing/wavedashing/wavesmashing, yet he cancels this out easily with boomerang/arrows and when I do succeed in getting close on the ground he just shields and up bs or nairs out of shield.

I have better success approaching in the air because it dodges the projectiles, but when I get close enough, he can easily up smash, up tilt, f tilt, or shield me and if I do get a hit off, the boomerang hits me on the way back.

I have tried swatting the boomerang while approaching but I have limited success with this and he almost always has an arrow followup or sometimes a bomb followup.

My most success has come from approaching with squirtle's side B or short hop bubble (since it comes out at an angle), and C. Falcon's Falcon Kick. However, all he has to do for squirtle is down tilt the shell or shield the bubble into Spin attack. With falcon if I only approach with Falcon kick it gets predictable and he can punish me in multiple ways so I have to do arial approaches as well which has the problem from above involved.

It seems like he has an answer to everything I can dish out at him. I am a better overall player with the rest of the cast than him and he doesn't utilize any of the ATs in the game like glide tossing, wave dashing, L canceling, ect... so it is very frustrating to consistently lose against just his link. I just don't know how to deal with his link. Literally no other matchup against him is a problem so I think I just have trouble vs link.
 

ITALIAN N1NJA

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 30, 2013
Messages
533
Location
Oakbrook Terrace, IL
NNID
ITALIAN_N1NJA
3DS FC
3368-3413-2021
How do you play against link with:

Marth/Roy
Jiggz
Ness
Squirtle
C. Falcon
Falco
Charizard

I have a friend who I can beat easily in every matchup except when he is playing link. Link is literally his only good character. However, when he plays link, he usually wins. I would say he wins 7-8 out of 10 games against me regardless of who I play against him with. I have found the most success with Falcon/Squirtle despite neither being my mains. I can sometimes win with Marth/Roy only because they are my mains. I have no idea how to approach with jiggz despite jiggz being my secondary. I have yet to try Ness against him as I just recently picked up ness. And my Falco/Zard usually get 2 or 3-stocked despite both being some of my best characters.

He usually walls me out with projectiles and when I can get close he uses his spin attack, nair, or Up smash to cancel out my approach. I've tried approaching both on the ground with dash dancing/wavedashing/wavesmashing, yet he cancels this out easily with boomerang/arrows and when I do succeed in getting close on the ground he just shields and up bs or nairs out of shield.

I have better success approaching in the air because it dodges the projectiles, but when I get close enough, he can easily up smash, up tilt, f tilt, or shield me and if I do get a hit off, the boomerang hits me on the way back.

I have tried swatting the boomerang while approaching but I have limited success with this and he almost always has an arrow followup or sometimes a bomb followup.

My most success has come from approaching with squirtle's side B or short hop bubble (since it comes out at an angle), and C. Falcon's Falcon Kick. However, all he has to do for squirtle is down tilt the shell or shield the bubble into Spin attack. With falcon if I only approach with Falcon kick it gets predictable and he can punish me in multiple ways so I have to do arial approaches as well which has the problem from above involved.

It seems like he has an answer to everything I can dish out at him. I am a better overall player with the rest of the cast than him and he doesn't utilize any of the ATs in the game like glide tossing, wave dashing, L canceling, ect... so it is very frustrating to consistently lose against just his link. I just don't know how to deal with his link. Literally no other matchup against him is a problem so I think I just have trouble vs link.
You need to learn. Pay close attention to what he keeps doing when you do something, and then punish him for it. Bait moves out. Link is a very risk for reward character. That means that if he throws out something like the spin attack and you block it or it misses, you have an opportunity for a large punish.

With Marth, he has an extremely good Fair which is extremely good for swatting Link's projectiles away. Keep your proper spacing and Fair away. Keep in mind the Marth has a down tilt that can actually poke through Link's up b when he is using it to recover. This sets up for a cleaner edgeguard. You can rising Dair punish a Zair tether attempt as well.

Roy is similar to Marth, juggle Link in the air and stay on him. Edge guards are crucial as Roy. Also remember not to use your jump right away and side b to stall first to gain horizontal distance. Roy has a bad recovery so be careful. Spacing is done carefully and keep in mind that all his sweetspots are in the center of the sword unlike Marth who has a sweetspot at the tip.

Falcon is good if you stay in Link's face. Link is the perfect weight to get combo'd. He's actually the same exact weight as Captain Falcon. Stay on him and work off of hard punishes. Falcon Kick is extremely good. Nair beats projectiles if spaced correctly.

Squirtle is good because he has super armor until he is at high percents when he is shell shifting(side special). He just goes through whatever hits him for the most part because of his super armor on the move. Squirtle is also small and quick. This makes it far easier to weave through Link's projectiles and hit him before he can get any more projectiles.

Falco is literally Link's worst match up. His lasers cannot be clank shielded by Link while in his fast walk animation by the Hylian shield. Falco is good because he is incredibly fast and is good with applying pressure. Link struggles against pressure. If you have a tight pillar combo on Link he'll have a tough time moving. He can only Grab, Spin Attack, or Wavedash out of shield. These options when compared to Falco are extremely slow. If you are pillaring and he attempts to spin attack, you'll be above him where there is no hitbox for the attack so you can continue pillaring. Falco shuts down Link's projectiles due to how fast his moves are. Short hop laser approach stuns Link or forces shield which allows Falco to shield pressure him like crazy. Be warned that if you get grabbed by Link, say goodbye to your stock. Link has incredible punishes on spacies if he takes their jumps and they're in the air. Down throw>spin attack is guaranteed on fast fallers which all of the spacies are. This sends them off stage and Falco basically has no recovery. It's awful. So offstage Link can edgeguard Falco quite easily.

Jigglypuff struggles in Project M in general due to how ridiculous the recoveries are in the game. In Melee Jiggs could edge guard opponents because they didn't have outrageous recoveries. In Project M it's insanely difficult to edgeguard with Jigglypuff unless it's on a spacie or Roy In my opinion.

Ness struggles against Link. PK fire is good for combo start up with Ness. Especially of the Link doesn't smash DI. If you hit PK fire you have a guaranteed combo follow up if the Link doesn't smash DI. Ness gets Down throw Down Air killed quite easily. Boomerang also destroys him.

Charizard is pretty solid in Project M. In order to optimize him you want to he sure to sweetspot ALL of your moves. This means hitting them with the fire ember on the tail for most of the moves. His Nair goes through platforms and the stage near the ledge. This makes for great edge guarding against tether characters. Nair is amazing. Seismic toss(up throw) is very good on stages with low ceilings and platforms. Hit them on the platform at high percents with up throw and you have a guaranteed kill. He can also mess up Link from below with tilts and smashes. Down smash as a tech read on platforms is amazing for combo potential. Charizard has a difficult time getting down if he is in the air above Link especially. Link can Up air Charizard pretty hard. Basically try and maintain center stage and get Link above you.

If you want my advice, instead of constantly changing characters, stick to one or two. Learn the ins and outs of them. Learn the match up. Ask your friend what he's constantly doing that you don't notice. If you want to improve you must try. Don't constantly switch characters.

Also, Link is an incredibly strong character in Project M. Don't be down on yourself if you're losing to him. Learn his bread and butter combos and how to avoid them! I hope some of this helped you!
 
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