help vs falco

[Niko45]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8sN1w0sRu0

I need tips on fighting falco. I get wrecked by lasers and just don't really know what to do that works consistently. This is a repetitive and seemingly basic falco approach that keeps wrecking me over and over. Try to ignore the accidental upsmashes and what not. Lasers and approach is what I really need help with. Thanks.

 

[Havokbringer]

Use the platforms more when hes Lasering and if you get a grab at low percentages chain grab him more or if he lands on the platform u tilt to f-smash.

If hes pressuring your shield you could spot dodge before he shines, dodge away, grab right after his shine or jump out of shield with nothing or a rising Fair.

and when your in too close for Falco and he starts to do retreating laser you could dash towards him and either grab him or running attack(make sure you space it).

I didn't see too much else except for more practice and consistency. Also one of the reason Marth is good against spacies is because he has very simple and easy to execute combos on them. So for now try to keep things simple until you become better with Marths play style.

 

[otg]

How I fight falco:

Get him the **** off the stage. To get around lasers powershield, mix up your approach, Dash attack goes under lasers, spotdodge if Falco gets too close while lasering and punish. CG him, Utilt **** -> fsmash.

GET HIM THE **** OFF THE STAGE, Fthrow him off if you have to. The matchup is in Falco's advantage if you let him play center stage and just laser camp (which is what I try to do against you a lot lol), so your best bet is to just put pressure on him where he falters the most, OFF THE STAGE.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Y'know there's a thread on getting around lasers...

 

[Niko45]

Word I never thought about spot dodging, gonna have to work on that timing. Thanks havok/otg those are interesting ideas.

Elven I'm sorry but can you please stay out of any thread I make you give no/generic/bad advice in ur posts and are really annoying. Thanks for the link to that laser guide btw (which I've already read). Turns out the game is a little more complicated than just reading a guide and lasers suddenly are no longer a problem.

 

[SHDW23]

for lasers, wavedashing out of shield might help. i would say you should abandon the powershielding attempts, not even pros using the power shield that much, it's just too hard to do consistently. even if you do land a power shield and falco gets hit, he'll just go back to lasering before you can do much of anything. and in general you need to stay closer to falco. there were quite a few time when falco approached and you rolled away and he started lasering again. once you're in, don't back off unless you absolutely have to, because as soon as you do he'll go back to lasering and all your hard work is nullified.

 

[Niko45]

Yea the rolling is ********. Accomplishes nothing but resetting his laser approach. I'm also skeptical about platforms. Falco kinda destroys with platforms in general and marth is pretty ****ty at approaching from platforms. Would wavedash back out of shield get me an fsmash or would I be out of range I wonder. Doesn't matter tho as long as he whiffs the dair/reflect approach I can probably put pressure on him before I start getting lasered again. I tried to sneak counters in and then apply heavy pressure but as you can see that wasn't very reliable and if he techs away the counter doesn't really give me a pressure advantage.

I was also thinking maybe up B out of shield situationally? Like when he's at higher percents it could maybe get him off stage or catch him off guard. Is there enough time to get it out between the dair/nair and reflect?

 

[otg]

lol niko your funny. Up B outta the shield is pretty useful sometimes for exactly the reason's you posted, but very situational as it can be punished like NUTS if someone sees it coming.

As for using platforms to escape laser spam, I think this is actually one of his best options. When you're above Falco he really doesn't have many useful KO moves or anything, the best he could do is jump up for a Dair or Bair (maybe lasers if he's feeling risky), but for the most part Falco will want to stay on the ground and laser spam to beat out Marth. Thus, taking the high road is a good route to get above lasers, and on platforms Marth has quite a few options:

- Fall through with Fair/Dair/Uair (if he jumps up towards you)/hell even his ****ing counter
- Waveland off the platform in either direction with an aerial.
- Try to bait him coming up there too and punish with your superior range.

You have a lot of options. Try getting more comfy with using platforms and it'll be a lot easier for you. Just think about Falco on FD.... not too fun.

 

[Havokbringer]

Yeah FD is a ***** but if any Falco counter picks that then just chain grab him to death.

Don't be nice because he won't be either.

Also it will make him mad and annoyed which in turn will make him play worse.

About the power shield thing, there is a way to get it out more consistantly but it requires you to run towards him if hes close enough and shield in front of his face then grabbing him.

It doesn't always work but its pretty reliable if you see them trying to start lasering again.

 

[ArcNatural]

lol niko your funny. Up B outta the shield is pretty useful sometimes for exactly the reason's you posted, but very situational as it can be punished like NUTS if someone sees it coming.

As for using platforms to escape laser spam, I think this is actually one of his best options. When you're above Falco he really doesn't have many useful KO moves or anything, the best he could do is jump up for a Dair or Bair (maybe lasers if he's feeling risky), but for the most part Falco will want to stay on the ground and laser spam to beat out Marth. Thus, taking the high road is a good route to get above lasers, and on platforms Marth has quite a few options:

- Fall through with Fair/Dair/Uair (if he jumps up towards you)/hell even his ****ing counter
- Waveland off the platform in either direction with an aerial.
- Try to bait him coming up there too and punish with your superior range.

You have a lot of options. Try getting more comfy with using platforms and it'll be a lot easier for you. Just think about Falco on FD.... not too fun.

They can also shine waveland onto platforms (basically shining where Marth's feet are on a platform) and that's really annoying.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

What did I do to be annoying in any thread you made? You ask broad, vague questions that're really hard to answer and I try to offer tidbits. I'm not a mindreader, sorry.

Whatever. If you don't want me to help, that's fine.

 

[HiIH]

The advice to get him off the stage was awesome.

Seriously. Get him off.

 

[Panix]

Chain grab low percents, use Utilt and your fair abusingly.
Edge guard.

Game.

 

[Niko45]

What did I do to be annoying in any thread you made? You ask broad, vague questions that're really hard to answer and I try to offer tidbits. I'm not a mindreader, sorry.

Whatever. If you don't want me to help, that's fine.

What are you talking about? Shield breaker from the ledge, DIing fox up throw, and falco's laser approach are not specific enough for you? Look around nobody else is having trouble with my broad vague-ness.

Idk I'm not feeling the platform approach. From above his opponent Marth is outprioritized and his moves/vertical speed are slower. It just isn't a good idea. Only real option would be a FF fair/bair/uair off the side of the platform but there's no reason falco would be in range for those when he could either be underneath you completely or on the other side of the stage laser camping.

Grab after the reflect seems to be no good. JC double shine or even dair out of the shine are going to beat that out. Looks to me like those tight fairs out of shield and the WD out of shield are the only semi-reliable options. Awesome.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

I'm pretty sure I gave you advice on all those and you chose to ignore them. Whatever, suit yourself.

 

[otg]

WD out the shield is your best friend. And HiIH lol yeah, I try to give the best advice possible. Let's just be honest, on stage Falco might be the best character on the game, so why even try and fight him where he is strongest? GET HIM THE **** OFF.

Niko smash this weekend/sunday?