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Help aagainst Marth

yuki

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
195
Location
Rotterdam, The Netherlands
Ok I just picked up pichu but he is my second fav character already(after kirby) But my friend wich I always play against uses marth and horribly owns him due to a combination of me not really knowing how to play with pichu and him being pretty good(however im better with kirbs:3)Anyhoo back to the point... Help me please? How do I play with pichu in general? And what are good tactics against Marth? Thanks
*edit* I already noticed I spelled against wrong... Soz for that
 

Cereal Rabbit

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 13, 2007
Messages
1,536
Location
Davis, CA
I'm pretty good with Kirby. Pichu's just another fun addition to my mysterious field of smashing abilities.

Pichu might be weak, he might have low range, he might have a tendancy to get *****, but it's worth it. Pichu is too fun to pass up. I personally don't play Pichu as much, but I'll tell you some things I picked up playing as him.

=Approaching=
I usually run into a Full Jump, as I'm in midair I would use Neutral B. With the lightning attack rolling across the ground, I would chase that up towards my opponent. If I try to SHFFL, I won't get shield grabbed because the neutral B covered for me.

Otherwise, all you have are SHFFLs. Pichu's ground attack range are terrible so you won't really be approaching with that. Pichu doesn't have more than that. His grab is pretty short too. :(

=Positions=
Competetively one would trade hits. Pichu isn't one of those. Pichu has a more complex way of play where one has to play smart. You're constantly having to out smart your opponent for every move you make. For if you make a mistake, you're going to be punished terribly.

There is one type of positioning called camping. It is basically running away or keeping a distance from your opponent. Usually you're doing that to lure your opponents into your "Pichu Traps" thus again comes the idea of playing a smart Pichu. Ideas of these would be "dash dancing", ledge stalling or using projectiles. Once the trap is activated, the opponent is lured, the damage was taken on the opponent you repeat.

There's another position to go into taking is called spacing. This is similar to camping except you're in a more aggressive state. You would be dash dancing back and forth and there will be possibilities of you attacking anytime or your opponent attacking you every time. This is an effective position because you will be keeping a distance from attacking, but close enough to attack your opponent. It's basically trading hits without actually getting hit (or hit to smaller extent) your self. Don't forget, mistakes will always be made, so play smart. xD

=Edge Game=
There will be times when your opponent would be at a relatively high damage, and you just don't know how to KO them. You're in the situations where you need to find a way to get your opponent off the stage. Some options are "hitting your opponents off and KOing them" or "throw them off the stage, not KOing them, and then guard them from the ledge." Pichu has non more than his smashes to KO, so he usually is edgeguarding.

Some good attacks to use when you want to throw your opponent off the stage include: his down tilt, side tilt, back throw, front throw, forward smash, down smash etc.

But how? These attacks have so little range. I talked about spacing and waiting for the moment your opponent makes that mistake where you would charge in and punish them. With this technique, throw your opponents off, and it's just a matter of guarding the edge.

What're some good edge guarding technique? It's whatever your imagination wants it to be. Or at least anything that works. Apparently Pichu's ground attacks have little range, so I would recommend of stage edge guard.

Some edgeguarding techniques are:
Tap A
Down A
Forward Smash
Down B
Shooting a Neutral B out
Jumping off and using a down-air (or any other aerials)

=Off Topic=
My Pichu sucks, but I hope the information worked. :)

=EDIT=
I forgot you mentioned help on a Marth. I already basically explained it, but some things to watch out for. Remember, you're the one with the projectile, so he should be the one approaching. Lure him into your traps and don't make SHFFLing too occasional. His neutral B does 1 damage to himself, but it's for a great use. Watch out for that Tipper!!!
 

yuki

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
195
Location
Rotterdam, The Netherlands
I'm pretty good with Kirby. Pichu's just another fun addition to my mysterious field of smashing abilities.

Pichu might be weak, he might have low range, he might have a tendancy to get *****, but it's worth it. Pichu is too fun to pass up. I personally don't play Pichu as much, but I'll tell you some things I picked up playing as him.

=Approaching=
I usually run into a Full Jump, as I'm in midair I would use Neutral B. With the lightning attack rolling across the ground, I would chase that up towards my opponent. If I try to SHFFL, I won't get shield grabbed because the neutral B covered for me.

Otherwise, all you have are SHFFLs. Pichu's ground attack range are terrible so you won't really be approaching with that. Pichu doesn't have more than that. His grab is pretty short too. :(

=Positions=
Competetively one would trade hits. Pichu isn't one of those. Pichu has a more complex way of play where one has to play smart. You're constantly having to out smart your opponent for every move you make. For if you make a mistake, you're going to be punished terribly.

There is one type of positioning called camping. It is basically running away or keeping a distance from your opponent. Usually you're doing that to lure your opponents into your "Pichu Traps" thus again comes the idea of playing a smart Pichu. Ideas of these would be "dash dancing", ledge stalling or using projectiles. Once the trap is activated, the opponent is lured, the damage was taken on the opponent you repeat.

There's another position to go into taking is called spacing. This is similar to camping except you're in a more aggressive state. You would be dash dancing back and forth and there will be possibilities of you attacking anytime or your opponent attacking you every time. This is an effective position because you will be keeping a distance from attacking, but close enough to attack your opponent. It's basically trading hits without actually getting hit (or hit to smaller extent) your self. Don't forget, mistakes will always be made, so play smart. xD

=Edge Game=
There will be times when your opponent would be at a relatively high damage, and you just don't know how to KO them. You're in the situations where you need to find a way to get your opponent off the stage. Some options are "hitting your opponents off and KOing them" or "throw them off the stage, not KOing them, and then guard them from the ledge." Pichu has non more than his smashes to KO, so he usually is edgeguarding.

Some good attacks to use when you want to throw your opponent off the stage include: his down tilt, side tilt, back throw, front throw, forward smash, down smash etc.

But how? These attacks have so little range. I talked about spacing and waiting for the moment your opponent makes that mistake where you would charge in and punish them. With this technique, throw your opponents off, and it's just a matter of guarding the edge.

What're some good edge guarding technique? It's whatever your imagination wants it to be. Or at least anything that works. Apparently Pichu's ground attacks have little range, so I would recommend of stage edge guard.

Some edgeguarding techniques are:
Tap A
Down A
Forward Smash
Down B
Shooting a Neutral B out
Jumping off and using a down-air (or any other aerials)

=Off Topic=
My Pichu sucks, but I hope the information worked. :)

=EDIT=
I forgot you mentioned help on a Marth. I already basically explained it, but some things to watch out for. Remember, you're the one with the projectile, so he should be the one approaching. Lure him into your traps and don't make SHFFLing too occasional. His neutral B does 1 damage to himself, but it's for a great use. Watch out for that Tipper!!!
Hoshi puri for president!!
This should get you like 20+ points for insightful comment or something.
You're comments always really seem to help out very well. Also were about the same age(offtopicXD) how many characters do you play? Kirbs Jiggs pichu...
 

Cereal Rabbit

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 13, 2007
Messages
1,536
Location
Davis, CA
=Off Topic=

Doc, Mario, Luigi, Peach, DK, Falcon, Ganondorf, Falco, Fox, Ness, Ice Climbers, Kirby, Samus, Sheik, Link, Young Link, Pichu, Pikachu, Jigglypuff, Mewtwo, G&W, Marth, Roy.

So basically all but Bowser, Yoshi, and Zelda....
I'm currently working on improving my Zelda without the technique called down B. My bowser needs terrible work. And I can Double Jump Cancel really effectivly with Yoshi, but I still can't use him..

Inspired by many professional players, especially Azen, because he's so diverse in characters. But indivisual pro's for indivisual characters.
 

yuki

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
195
Location
Rotterdam, The Netherlands
---off topic---
I play zelda shiek kirbs jiggs pichu pikachu DK and Dr. Mario I thought it'd be handy in the start to have multiple characters(cause it = more possibilities) but then I really started playing kirby and now I only play Kirby Jigglypuf Pichu and DK
 

Jace08

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,819
Location
Lawrence, KS
I guess I could use some advice that's partly on topic. With the whole "help against" thing.

Instead of Marth, though, I'm having trouble against fox. The ones I've played often end up easily KOing me by waiting until my Pichu takes around 75%-100% damage, then throwing me upwards and immediately following up with a quick jump and Up air. No matter how I try to DI, I can't seem to avoid that finishing kick, and my oppponents score repeated and easy KOs.

Does anyone know the best way to DI out of this?
 

kry

Smash Rookie
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Messages
10
Against Marth.

Pichu is a little rat. He's as tall as well.. he's like half the height of anything. He moves so **** fast.

Your best bet is "try not to make mistakes," jump around a lot, feint, dashdance, and hope your nair shffls go through. marth's speed is easily punishable by pichu.. depending on the attach.. the fsmash for sure.

A good way to win involves a good edgeguard game with pichu. pichu's recovery is somewhat godlike in its distance and flexibility soo anything goes. [especially vs marth's recovery] once he's off.. don't let him on! :D To be honest.. Marth isn't as bad as persay.. ice climbers.. now thats a tough matchup.

Jace. DI downward is still sadly.. game over [if you get hit by uair]. Fox's uair is too strong. Seeing as how pichu is one of the lightest characters. your best bet is not to get into that situation. On the other hand, you'll have a chance to live if you di randomly to the left or right while being thrown. :) Also. don't get caught by fox's dashing upsmash. :( That one hurts too.
 

ConeZone

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
619
Location
Salem
i dont understand why anyone would use pichu...use fox or shiek...or marth if your really cheap.
 

Ticonderoga

Smash Rookie
Joined
Sep 9, 2007
Messages
22
Location
Long Island, NY
Because some people like to try and prove that characters like pichu, bowser, ness, and mewtwo CAN compete. Ever hear of Taj? T0mmy? (heh hes right there..), simna? These are all great bottom-tier char players and they prove that these characters can compete. And we cant forget gimpyfish. I myself love playing as pichu, ness, and mewtwo more than fox, marth, and sheik.:p
 

T0MMY

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 20, 2005
Messages
3,345
Location
Oregon
Taj, t0mmy, Simna, and Gimpyfish all failed at showing bottom-tiers can compete well in tournaments.
Simna proably did the best out of all of them... oh wait, Ness isn't bottom tier, the 'cheater' haha X^)
You forgot to mention t1mmy's Kirby. He did best out of all Kirby players in the tournament scene.
 

Skyson

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 27, 2007
Messages
540
Location
Canton, OH
There are enough Sheiks, Foxes, Marths, etc in the smash scene, really. The people who play low tiers generally play them because they're fun to use. Some people just can't grasp the concept of playing a character that doesn't have an abusable, all-powerful playstyle that anyone can pick up with enough practice. These characters like Pichu and Kirby require strategy!

"WHAT!? I can't just swing my sword, bend gravity with my hands, or make myself shine blue and watch my opponent die? HOW DO I USE A CHARACTER THAT CAN'T DO THAT?!"

Some people never can answer that question. Pichu is massive fun.
 
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