having a problem againt falco

[Mr.Saturn12]

So its like this. When i don't approach falco he fires lazers and i try to jump over them. As i go for fair he uses his reflector. Also how can I mess up his side b recovery?

 

[Steel]

If he's using SHDL just walk under the high one, perfect shield the low one. Rinse, repeat.

If he's getting you with a reflector every time you approach your approach may be getting predictable. Once you are too close for him to shoot any lasers at you make sure you are still outside his reflector range. If he uses it and it doesn't hit you he is wide open.

For the side b recovery you just have to predict when he will use it, wait for him in the middle of the stage and punish him in his landing lag.

 

[IDK]

the no lag laser allows falco to do a close range laser for a free chain grab or fsmash. oh... and you can SHAD roll for the lasers if far enough.

 

[Mr.Saturn12]

thanks for the help. I curious about chain grabbing? Is falco's chain grab inescapable?

 

[ixdnL]

Marth outranges pretty much everything Falco can dish out (Besides lasers of course) Use that to your advantage. Missed phantasms and shines are both incredibly punishable.

Waiting in the middle to punish the phantasm is a good idea but Falco also has his canceled phantasm to keep you guessing.

Edit: For chaingrabs, up-b after a certain percentage I believe.

 

[Steel]

thanks for the help. I curious about chain grabbing? Is falco's chain grab inescapable?

If you know he is going to try and grab again just spam up-b as he does his down throw. Don't get predictable with it though, the falco will recognize this and do something different after the down throw.

 

[Mr.Saturn12]

thanks for all the help. I've heard a rumor that you can grab falco while he is doing his side b. Is it true?

 

[Steel]

Maybe shield grabbing as the animation ends or grabbing at his start-up lag, but i think that's it.

 

[TKD+ITA+Mar=]

I have heard at low percents you can do fthrow -> fthrow -> repeat until the end of the stage -> dair.

 

[Mr.Saturn12]

the forward throw spike technique works pretty good but i think it is becoming predictable. So is a footstool jump leading into a dair good? Also is an up tilts middle part of the blade a reliable spike if hitting with the back of the blade?

 

[TKD+ITA+Mar=]

It can be hard, but it is viable, also a fair -> double jump -> nair off the edge will put Falco very low, forcing him to use his up-b.

 

[ixdnL]

And we all know Falco's up-b is disturbingly terrible

 

[Mr.Saturn12]

K thanks for all the help!

 

[Mr.Saturn12]

If you guys can share your stratagies that would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Pierce7d]

So its like this. When i don't approach falco he fires lazers and i try to jump over them. As i go for fair he uses his reflector. Also how can I mess up his side b recovery?

If he's using SHDL just walk under the high one, perfect shield the low one. Rinse, repeat.

If he's getting you with a reflector every time you approach your approach may be getting predictable. Once you are too close for him to shoot any lasers at you make sure you are still outside his reflector range. If he uses it and it doesn't hit you he is wide open.

For the side b recovery you just have to predict when he will use it, wait for him in the middle of the stage and punish him in his landing lag.

Exactly. If he's shooting repeated grounded lazers, jump over, and swing with shield breaker. He's GOING to expect a Fair so, he'll stop lasering and shield. When he gets owned, pause the game, stand up, and yell "MY B IS BETTAH THAN URS YAH DAM SPAMMA!!!!"

the no lag laser allows falco to do a close range laser for a free chain grab or fsmash. oh... and you can SHAD roll for the lasers if far enough.

This can be fixed with shielding, or if the Falco likes to grab, any dodge. Just be attentive and ready for the combo.

Marth outranges pretty much everything Falco can dish out (Besides lasers of course) Use that to your advantage. Missed phantasms and shines are both incredibly punishable.

Waiting in the middle to punish the phantasm is a good idea but Falco also has his canceled phantasm to keep you guessing.

Edit: For chaingrabs, up-b after a certain percentage I believe.

You should be able to UpB outta the chaingrab VERY early. Furthermore standing halfway between the edge and the max range where Falco can phantasm is a good idea. If he drops low, rush into edgeguard. If goes for you, shield and reverse Fsmash.

Or, if you have good timing like me, and you're gutsy like me, do what I do and Dolphin Slash. Dolphin Slash >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Phantasm. If you're awesome and you sweet spot it, it's a K.O. at moderate percentages.

If you know he is going to try and grab again just spam up-b as he does his down throw. Don't get predictable with it though, the falco will recognize this and do something different after the down throw.

Correct. Don't spam the DS, learn to time it, because a good opponent will notice you hitting away at the B button, and just throw you and watch you fly into the air, and fall helplessly into his charged smash attack.

thanks for all the help. I've heard a rumor that you can grab falco while he is doing his side b. Is it true?

No, I tested this a while ago. You might've been able to in Melee, but this cannot be done. Don't try.

I have heard at low percents you can do fthrow -> fthrow -> repeat until the end of the stage -> dair.

Eventually the Falco will catch onto it and DI away, but a tipper Nair or Fair at the edge is good too. Fthrow chainthrow does work.

It can be hard, but it is viable, also a fair -> double jump -> nair off the edge will put Falco very low, forcing him to use his up-b.

That's if the Falco doesn't DI appropriately and recover high, which most Falco's don't. However, if you force a Falco to UpB, drop and Dolphin Slash for a relatively easy stage spike once practiced.

EDIT: PROTIP: If Falco is trying to jump back onto the stage with his second jump, and you manage to grab him at the edge, just jab him but don't throw him, When he breaks low, you'll be able to own him, because he won't get his jumps back, and you can easily stage spike him or hog him due to his garbage UpB. Scrubier Falcos won't even realize they lost their jump till it's too late, and they'll get edgehogged easily. Otherwise you drop down and use your UpB own his.

 

[OmegaXF]

thanks for the help. I curious about chain grabbing? Is falco's chain grab inescapable?

You can upb out of it and fair out of it also.

 

[Pierce7d]

You can upb out of it and fair out of it also.

You can't Fair out of it. By the time you can hit Falco with a Fair before he regrabs you, that means you're at too high % to be chaingrabbed (I could be mistaken though)

 

[OmegaXF]

^Yes you can fair out of it. when he grabs you DI backwards while using the cstick to fair him. If you think you upb out of his grab to much then this is the next best option.

 

[Pierce7d]

^Yes you can fair out of it. when he grabs you DI backwards while using the cstick to fair him. If you think you upb out of his grab to much then this is the next best option.

I'll try that out later, and get back to you.

 

[takeurlife2]

the fthrow--dair chain only works 100% for 2 throws(from 0)

you have to fthrow->fthrow->dair

sometimes your opponent cant DI well so you can pull off fthrowX3->dair

in other words, if falco isnt over the edge by the second throw, the best choice is a craqFsmash(where you nudge forward a little in positioning with the fsmash). Fthrow->fthrow->Cfsmash is a free tipper.

Demonstrated by first stock: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlUchSSCyK4
Demonstrated by last stock: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eh04n8RF-uk&feature=related

 

[Shök]

Everyone's said everything you need, but just keep Fairing him off te ledge and finish him with a Nari, reverse up-B to grab the edge and screw his recovery.

 

[Mr.Saturn12]

thanks for all the help. I have a thead about hit hitstun lag and marth being able to react fast enough to get a full dancing blade in. Check it out if you like. Its in the Marth section.