Gimping Ike's Aether

[Surgo]

I've been having a good deal of problems gimping Ike's Aether as Marth, and I'm looking for a few tips and/or strategies to do this better.

I'm generally of the theory that, if Ike gets hit off the stage, he should be as good as dead, especially with his crap recovery. I tend to have issues gimping specifically when he's directly below the ledge, so that Aether either comes up and straight-up sweetspots it or goes slightly above the ledge. I can't seem to hit him when he goes slightly above the ledge without getting hit first, and straight-up sweetspotting is its own issue.

I also have trouble actually going to grab the ledge and be hanging on as he falls while I'm still in invincibility, mostly because I can't get past the annoying floating sword. If I'm already there, I can usually drop down and jump back up well enough to re-grab the ledge as he's using Aether (thus causing him to fall to his doom). Unless I push him a decent distance off the stage in the first place, though, I generally won't be able to be there at the ledge fast enough (before Aether starts).

So, any tips here for gimping Ike out of his Aether?

edit: One idea I just finished testing out that worked pretty well (against the CPU I was using specifically to test this) was, if they were recovering low enough, jump off the ledge and fastfall and when they started Aether, do a [reverse] dolphin slash. Invincibility in the first 5 frames means I won't take a hit at all, Ike has no super armor while he's rising, and it will spike them against the stage (if there's one to spike them against) while I grab the ledge. Dolphin Slash generally happens so fast that there's no way to tech it either.

 

[blueGhost]

why not counter and then gimp?

 

[jngshin]

your edit is a great idea, thank you!

i think ive used counter successfully against aether

 

[Nozra]

just to chime in:
i use counter all the time on an ike-maining friend of mine, its ... foolproof lol they Hate it so much (ike mains)

just time the counter right before the ragnell comes up, or if hes not perfectly sweet spotted, time it as hes coming down; the guy will get launched way the **** back out.

the best part about it is the look of panic in the eyes of the ike player lol its always something like: WHAT?THATSNOTFAIRUCANTDOTHAT

thats not to say its impossible to get back, but seriously - if u can time it, ike will never recover from directly underneath u

 

[NoVaLombardia]

doesn't countering the aether just hit before they come up, therefore swinging at nothing?

scenario: B=Ike *=the sword before Ike jumps to grab it, during his aether (A)= Marth's counter attack


__A
----|
----| B
----|


_(A) *
-----|B
-----|
-----|


__A B
----|
----|
----|

 

[Zankoku]

If they go barely above the stage, just fsmash Ike. Your tipper range extends beyond his spinning sword range. That ought to "gimp" him pretty effectively.

 

[Surgo]

I hadn't realized tipper range went beyond sword range (it must be very slight and delicate positioning, as I tried and failed a number of times). Thanks!

 

[DuB 22]

It's kind of hard to use Counter on Ike's Aether, you have to hit it while the sword is rising or else he will fall to the ledge and your coutner will miss.

 

[Nozra]

maybe i just play against a predictable ike - but to the poster who said u swing at nothing, no. the game, for whatever reason, virtually ensures that u hit ike in the counter.

its almost like it was its own in-game-mechanism

 

[SENG]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=_D2gfwqT2uw

fast forward to 3:35 on the vid above if u jus wanna c the counter. The counter doesnt gimp ike's up B but it jus punishes it for some damage. Honestly theres not much u can do to his up B cuz of the superman frames.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=j6wuxsqN5-I

On this vid @ 1:03 marth's UP B does go through Ike's but yea tats kinda hard to land too and it wasnt even on purpose

 

[Surgo]

That vid at 1:03 is basically what I was talking about, minus him getting hit out of the first dolphin slash. It looked like the Marth in that video panicked right about there.

 

[Cero]

brilliant strats
for those that don't want to make risk a factor-just wait and punish, you don't have to go out for the edge guard
shield grabs and proper spacing are key, just keep cool and collective
eventually a well-timed tippered f-smash will be the decisive blow to end the match (due to Ike's poor recovery)

 

[Solaris1110]

I usually try to ledge spike the Ike by jumping under him before he uses his aether.

 

[SENG]

That vid at 1:03 is basically what I was talking about, minus him getting hit out of the first dolphin slash. It looked like the Marth in that video panicked right about there.

rofl well if i didnt "panic" and up B the second time i wouldve gone straight down

 

[MyRevenge.]

Hey, I've seen those videos before.. hehe I'm subscribed
But those are some great ways to stop Ike's up-b...
But I also find that if you wait near the edge with your shield.... and Ike lands ON the stage, you will be pushed back far enough, and Ike will have enough lag, to pull off a fsmash tipper...
BTW Seng did you go to any SoCal tournies this weekend?

 

[SENG]

Hey, I've seen those videos before.. hehe I'm subscribed
But those are some great ways to stop Ike's up-b...
But I also find that if you wait near the edge with your shield.... and Ike lands ON the stage, you will be pushed back far enough, and Ike will have enough lag, to pull off a fsmash tipper...
BTW Seng did you go to any SoCal tournies this weekend?

lol yep i did. i went to the aznforce tourney , and s&c the week before that, and devry before that, and i think SD before that. lol ima take a break this weekend tho despite tournies being the most fun thing ever.

 

[MysticalBanana]

Nice Counters... I didn't know it could hit Ike when he's doing Aether. Finally something I can do other than waiting to punish him when he lands. Also, SENG, you're probably one of the few Marths that spams nair more than fairs. May I ask why?

 

[SENG]

well i dont main marth, but im trying to get better with him. yea I honestly dont think fairs are that great unless your good at spacing them since they can be punished if they arent used right. Alot of people jus wait for the first fair and attack when ur trying to hit the second one in the air especially snake with his gay up tilt. Back then in the video i jus tried to fast fall nair cuz it has no lag when it lands so yea, but yea it isnt tat great either. But this weekend i realized that learning to space with the fairs is a must if you want a good marth.

 

[xandeR-]

It's all about the counter.

It doesn't work EVERY time but nearly always.


If you want it to work everytime, then you need to counter and then quickly edgeguard.


The counter sometimes places Ike in perfect line with the edge for a quick draw recovery.

Edgeguard it and he's done.

 

[Doodx]

wow im definitely trying the dolphin slash one because i love that move and it seems imposible to stop it because ike is already doin aether and cant do anything else
i can see now why people are gonna stop using aether for recovery

 

[uremog]

well, i looked at the updated super armor list today and it says that ike only has SA on aether until he jumps up to grab his sword which means he can be hit out of it any time after he starts jumping. i don't know if i'm reading it right, but that gives a whole lot more room to gimp than i previously thought there was.

 

[Grand_Shadow]

well, i looked at the updated super armor list today and it says that ike only has SA on aether until he jumps up to grab his sword which means he can be hit out of it any time after he starts jumping. i don't know if i'm reading it right, but that gives a whole lot more room to gimp than i previously thought there was.

To my knowledge (And tested through experience, but I'm not that great so I could be wrong)
Ike's Super Armor lasts until after he grabs the sword. Problem is by then he is attacking, so Marth's counter works wonders against him there.

 

[Lord Aether]

The Super Armor ends before then. I think it's a bit into when he jumps that it ends.

 

[JesiahTEG]

Morgan...Marth ***** Ike due to how bad his recovery gets ***** by Marth...

If he Aethers, you counter...over and over until he dies. It's the easiest **** in the world.

If he quick draws, you ledgehog.

GG.