Hyrus
Smash Journeyman
Firstly, I want to just come out and state that this is just for fun. I love thinking about games and imagining what they could be like, so this is where I get off. Some people may not appreciate the ideas I throw out in this thread and that's ok; i'm not forcing my opinions on anyone and I hope that posters will show me the same courtesy. It's fine to disagree, but giving off an attitude isn't.
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I love games. But i'm not a narrow minded thinker - when I try to think up ideas, it isn't always in the scope of a single character, unit, or obstacle, but how those ideas will interact with the rest of the game. It's the entirety of a character that needs to be looked at for balance, not necessarily individual moves.
That said, Ganon hasn't evolved much within the 7 years they've had to come up with some new ideas. Many of his moves (B moves), despite tweaking, are relatively similar to Falcon's and I wanted to change them up a bit.
It should be noted that I don't regular Ganon. Theme wise, i've never enjoyed the character that much. So I don't have a bias for Ganon and coming up with ideas for characters that I like, only. Fyi.
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Hovering
Check out all that majesty!
Like Peach, i'd like to suggest that Ganon would be able to hover while holding the jump button. I mean, how evil-badass is that? In gameplay, this effect would prove immensely useful for Ganon's air game, which suffers greatly because of his landing lag. It would also help with his soso-recovery skills, in addition to his edgeguarding. We'd have to keep an eye out for "thunder stomping" in place, as that could prove problematic and require some tweaking.
The addition wouldn't hurt Ganon in any way, other than making players reckless because they're freaking awesome with the cape flapping and the air stomping...
Ganon's Down B
Spared no expense on the animation.
This mechanic works similarly to Snake's C4, but has an entirely different application.
When Ganon uses his Down B (must be grounded), Ganon plants his sword into the ground. Once placed, Ganon can go about the fight and the sword cannot be interacted with by anyone. Pressing Down B a second time (can be airborne) to snap his fingers, the sword would uproot itself and return to its master. The sword twirls and returns to Ganon with the physics and scale of an enlarged Boomerang, potentially doing some nice damage (it can't be spammed) and launching an opponent upward.
What's really cool about this idea is that the sword can be called back to Ganon from off screen. The victim player knows what's up - they'll see and hear Ganon snap his fingers, and know the sword is coming their way back to Ganon, which will force them to get out of the way or shield the attack.
This also has some combo potential, as i'll discuss in the next section.
Recalling the sword while floating? Yes!
Ganon's Side B
GET OVER HERE!
Ganon's Side B takes a bit of a different direction. Kind of like a reverse F.L.U.D.D, this effect would have little to no ending lag, creating an effect where enemies a good distance from Ganon get sucked in towards him.
The big advantage here is that Ganon has the range to abuse this move more than most opponents. With the right spacing, the effect will suck an opponent to Ganon and give them the least amount of time to react.
It isn't to say that this move is outstanding, though. The victim player can full hop (not short) or shield roll to escape the pull effects, and the startup lag on the move will prevent it from being spammed too quickly. Of course, the victim player could "ride" the suction effect and rush Ganon with an attack if Ganon becomes to predictable with the move.
BUT, what's really nice is that Ganon could use his Down B to recall his sword just before doing a Side B. This means that a player could potentially have to dodge the sword coming from behind, and Ganon in the front.
<insert redundant sparta joke>
Ganon's Neutral B
Finally, we have Ganon's Neutral B. What i've done here, essentially, is merged the Warlock Punch and Flame Choke into one move. The idea is that Ganon pulls back during the startup and gets some nice range during the attack, similar to the Warlock Punch. Instead of doing massive damage/knockback, Ganon will Flame Choke his victim. Naturally, this move comes out a lot faster than the Warlock Punch prior, but what really makes this effect cool is it's new property.
For anyone familiar with RPGs, this is known as a lifestealing effect. The idea is that the choke effect (still flagged as a grab) will cause damage, and for every point of damage caused to the player, Ganon will have his own damage reduced. It just doesn't get more evil than that. Effectively, with some well placed Neutral B's, Ganon has the potential to recover some of his damage through the course of a stock. That just sounds awesome.
Ganon's Other Moves
The only real problem I see with Ganon's A moves are that many of them have more ending lag than they really need. Ganon's Up Tilt can substitute for the lost Warlock Punch, although I think it'd reassign the move to a down tilt and move things around a bit to compensate. A moves and Up B moves are pretty general and follow a formula across all characters, so I don't see them taking any drastic revisions.
Preemptive Responses
-Ganon should have an orb attack, like from the Zelda games!
Personally, I like the fact that Ganon is a close quarters character. Giving him a ranged attack, while it crossed my mind several times, simply doesn't seem necessary, especially since so many characters already have projectiles in the game.
-Ganon should use his sword to attack!
There are way too many characters with swords already in the game. In Ganon's case, i've devised a way for him to use a sword in a rather unorthodox and supernatural manner, which I think is pretty cool.
-How many frames of startup does X move have? How much damage does Y move do?
Numbers really aren't all that important for these general concepts. The fact is, a proper game would have to be tested and several figures would likely be changed around in the process. For our purposes, "minor, decent and a lot" are satisfactory.
-Your drawings suck!
I drew those things up in Flash, the only program i've ever really used to doodle stuff. I hope that they help facilitate the ideas, rather than distract people as to how lowsy of an artist I am, heh.
-Your thread is pointless!
I realize that there aren't a whole lot of places this thread can go from here. Still, I like games and like thinking up ideas for them, regardless of how spectacular or lousy my ideas are.
And as far as i'm concerned, when Smash 4 comes around, i'll at least be able to cite this thread and demonstrate that there are plenty of ways for the passionate developer to build a smash bros character differently, and that for whatever reason, they simply chose not to. That, and I came up with these ideas over two lazy days, while they came up with nothing over, what'll likely be, several years.
======
Or something.
===
I love games. But i'm not a narrow minded thinker - when I try to think up ideas, it isn't always in the scope of a single character, unit, or obstacle, but how those ideas will interact with the rest of the game. It's the entirety of a character that needs to be looked at for balance, not necessarily individual moves.
That said, Ganon hasn't evolved much within the 7 years they've had to come up with some new ideas. Many of his moves (B moves), despite tweaking, are relatively similar to Falcon's and I wanted to change them up a bit.
It should be noted that I don't regular Ganon. Theme wise, i've never enjoyed the character that much. So I don't have a bias for Ganon and coming up with ideas for characters that I like, only. Fyi.
======
Hovering
Check out all that majesty!
Like Peach, i'd like to suggest that Ganon would be able to hover while holding the jump button. I mean, how evil-badass is that? In gameplay, this effect would prove immensely useful for Ganon's air game, which suffers greatly because of his landing lag. It would also help with his soso-recovery skills, in addition to his edgeguarding. We'd have to keep an eye out for "thunder stomping" in place, as that could prove problematic and require some tweaking.
The addition wouldn't hurt Ganon in any way, other than making players reckless because they're freaking awesome with the cape flapping and the air stomping...
Ganon's Down B
Spared no expense on the animation.
This mechanic works similarly to Snake's C4, but has an entirely different application.
When Ganon uses his Down B (must be grounded), Ganon plants his sword into the ground. Once placed, Ganon can go about the fight and the sword cannot be interacted with by anyone. Pressing Down B a second time (can be airborne) to snap his fingers, the sword would uproot itself and return to its master. The sword twirls and returns to Ganon with the physics and scale of an enlarged Boomerang, potentially doing some nice damage (it can't be spammed) and launching an opponent upward.
What's really cool about this idea is that the sword can be called back to Ganon from off screen. The victim player knows what's up - they'll see and hear Ganon snap his fingers, and know the sword is coming their way back to Ganon, which will force them to get out of the way or shield the attack.
This also has some combo potential, as i'll discuss in the next section.
Recalling the sword while floating? Yes!
Ganon's Side B
GET OVER HERE!
Ganon's Side B takes a bit of a different direction. Kind of like a reverse F.L.U.D.D, this effect would have little to no ending lag, creating an effect where enemies a good distance from Ganon get sucked in towards him.
The big advantage here is that Ganon has the range to abuse this move more than most opponents. With the right spacing, the effect will suck an opponent to Ganon and give them the least amount of time to react.
It isn't to say that this move is outstanding, though. The victim player can full hop (not short) or shield roll to escape the pull effects, and the startup lag on the move will prevent it from being spammed too quickly. Of course, the victim player could "ride" the suction effect and rush Ganon with an attack if Ganon becomes to predictable with the move.
BUT, what's really nice is that Ganon could use his Down B to recall his sword just before doing a Side B. This means that a player could potentially have to dodge the sword coming from behind, and Ganon in the front.
<insert redundant sparta joke>
Ganon's Neutral B
Finally, we have Ganon's Neutral B. What i've done here, essentially, is merged the Warlock Punch and Flame Choke into one move. The idea is that Ganon pulls back during the startup and gets some nice range during the attack, similar to the Warlock Punch. Instead of doing massive damage/knockback, Ganon will Flame Choke his victim. Naturally, this move comes out a lot faster than the Warlock Punch prior, but what really makes this effect cool is it's new property.
For anyone familiar with RPGs, this is known as a lifestealing effect. The idea is that the choke effect (still flagged as a grab) will cause damage, and for every point of damage caused to the player, Ganon will have his own damage reduced. It just doesn't get more evil than that. Effectively, with some well placed Neutral B's, Ganon has the potential to recover some of his damage through the course of a stock. That just sounds awesome.
Ganon's Other Moves
The only real problem I see with Ganon's A moves are that many of them have more ending lag than they really need. Ganon's Up Tilt can substitute for the lost Warlock Punch, although I think it'd reassign the move to a down tilt and move things around a bit to compensate. A moves and Up B moves are pretty general and follow a formula across all characters, so I don't see them taking any drastic revisions.
Preemptive Responses
-Ganon should have an orb attack, like from the Zelda games!
Personally, I like the fact that Ganon is a close quarters character. Giving him a ranged attack, while it crossed my mind several times, simply doesn't seem necessary, especially since so many characters already have projectiles in the game.
-Ganon should use his sword to attack!
There are way too many characters with swords already in the game. In Ganon's case, i've devised a way for him to use a sword in a rather unorthodox and supernatural manner, which I think is pretty cool.
-How many frames of startup does X move have? How much damage does Y move do?
Numbers really aren't all that important for these general concepts. The fact is, a proper game would have to be tested and several figures would likely be changed around in the process. For our purposes, "minor, decent and a lot" are satisfactory.
-Your drawings suck!
I drew those things up in Flash, the only program i've ever really used to doodle stuff. I hope that they help facilitate the ideas, rather than distract people as to how lowsy of an artist I am, heh.
-Your thread is pointless!
I realize that there aren't a whole lot of places this thread can go from here. Still, I like games and like thinking up ideas for them, regardless of how spectacular or lousy my ideas are.
And as far as i'm concerned, when Smash 4 comes around, i'll at least be able to cite this thread and demonstrate that there are plenty of ways for the passionate developer to build a smash bros character differently, and that for whatever reason, they simply chose not to. That, and I came up with these ideas over two lazy days, while they came up with nothing over, what'll likely be, several years.
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Or something.
