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Egg Lay Chasing

nicalobe

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 26, 2007
Messages
230
Location
Ohio
So I was at a tournament this past weekend and I might have discovered something. If it has already been known, tell me politely(e.g. Nicalobe, you ****ing idiot, this is the oldest thing in Yoshi player history you stoopid n00b!!11!) that it has been known for some time and I will equally apologize for being uninformed and gladly lock the post.

Anyways, I was fighting a Lucario who was for some reason resisting my bair advances. I'm not sure why, but instead of taking the damage like I was hoping he would, he put up a shield instead to block it all, then he would shield grab me. Well, this became very impolite, and so I did a bair approach but then used a reverse egg lay to get him out of his shield.

It was about this time that I noticed, "Wow, he pops out really high as an egg. And when he breaks out of the egg, he pops up a little bit higher." It was then I figured out that as soon as I laid him as an egg, I could immediatly short hop, then at the height of the short hop, follow up with a double jump. This would cause me to be right on top of him as he broke out of my very well crafted egg I made for him. With a simple uair, he was sent flying for a pretty effortless kill.

And so I bring this list to the Yoshi boards of all the characters who had the same reaction to the egg lay that Lucario has. PLEASE NOTE, THESE WERE ALL TESTED ON A COMPUTER PLAYER, WHICH REALLY SHOULDN'T MATTER SINCE THEY GET OUT OF THE EGG AS FAST POSSIBLE.

Now, your opponent might start to get wise to your tricks and try different ideas. If they stay in the egg for longer before breaking out, then we can, by anticipating their actions, use your dair on them while they are in the egg to rack up 30+ damage. If they attack straight out of the egg, our heavy armor from our double jump will absorb the knockback, which allows our uair to come out without a hitch. If they decide to airdodge out of the shield, it doesn't really matter since our uair ends before their airdodge ends and we will (usually) still be right on top of them when they are vulnerable for another uair.

Without further delay, here is a list of the characters that I was able to do this technique on:

Samus
Kirby
Marth
G&W
Luigi
Zelda
Pit
Ivysaur
Charizard
Ike
Peach
Yoshi
IC's
Kind DDD
Lucario
Ness
Sonic
Toon Link
ROB
Olimar
Jigglypuff

Pit, Ivysaur, Yoshi, Sonic, and Olimar all have aerials that last for quite some time. The heavy armor was able to absorb the knockback, but if you start the uair too soon, you will get hit and the combo will not work. Please remember that the heavy armor doesn't work as well at high percentages.

Ike, I was unable to test whether or not Ike's up special would save him and hurt Yoshi. I will test for this in the future when I find someone to play with.

IC's are possible to do this on, but Nana makes it a lot harder than it has to be.

Jigglypuff and Olimar pop up a lot higher than other characters. You can still do the combo, but you will need to do a full jump instead of a short hop followed by a double jump, especially for Jigglypuff.

Luigi is always green.

Note, you don't have to use uair to end it on most characters, you could probably use a nair or bair or whatever. However, some of the characters listed go too high to be hit with anything but an uair.
 

Airborne

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 17, 2007
Messages
1,411
Location
YO MARVEL Lexington, Kentucky
nicalobe.... this might actually be very helpful... o.O
at least, knowing the height they pop out is goot to know. =D
i wanna know why wolf usually gets screwed over by the egg lay offstage though... o.O

EDIT: i have a video of me randomly 3 stocking some terra-bad ike where i gimp him twice with egg lay offstage.... i can upload it if it will help with the ike part... ^.^
 

illinialex24

Smash Hero
Joined
May 23, 2008
Messages
7,489
Location
Discovered: Sending Napalm
Umm computers don't mash buttons perfectly. Like for sing, which depends on button mashing for your sleep time, they were at a frame disadvantage at like 120%, while on a human, you can still keep a frame advantage at 200%.
 

Psymon

Smash Sweetheart
Joined
Aug 19, 2007
Messages
502
Location
Wales
Very nice thread. DO NOT CLOSE THIS! We will discuss this a lot =)

I agree with airborne that knowing the height of an average Egg Lay break-out could prove very useful.

Clever use of yoshi's Super Armour as well ;) like it.

Psy.
 

Chaco

Never Logs In
Joined
May 21, 2008
Messages
12,136
Location
NC
We discussed this before, and you can manuever the egg and escape getting Uair'd. It's not a given, you have to judge where they will come out at.
 

Ryusuta

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 4, 2005
Messages
3,959
Location
Washington
3DS FC
5000-3249-3643
Yeah, Chaco raised the point I was thinking about. You can change your aerial movement direction significantly in an Egg Lay (for instance, if Yoshi's back is to the edge of a stage and he Egg Lays an opponent, the opponent and turn the egg around in mid-air and bring it back over the stage), so it's a little hard to predict which direction you should go to. That, and if I'm not mistaken (and I could very well be mistaken), there's absolutely no helpless frames on breakout, so they should always be able to dodge instantly and reliably.

Just the same, any option is still helpful, and there's always a chance you could throw someone's timing off or catch them off-guard.
 

Slice~

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 16, 2008
Messages
408
Location
Austria
NNID
risuno
the first frames after breaking the egg are invincibility frames (the same like catching the edge)
so its really hard to get your enemy after the breakout
i´ve tried it alot, but the most of my opponents are coming out with a nair, so it´s not possible to get them immediately =/

and as Chaco and Sir Orian said, it´s really hard to get the right position after the egg lay
but if you know your enemy, it´s possible to get him
i do always make an uair after laying the egg, because it´s not really dangerous^^
 

nicalobe

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 26, 2007
Messages
230
Location
Ohio
Right, just throwing it out there. As I said, it worked well for me against a Lucario, I figured anything helped. As far as the invincibilties frames go, I haven't had any problem with them. I guess I'll put more testing into that aspect. For the whole moving the egg thing, I don't think that is too hard to keep yourself on top of, but maybe it's just my competition. i'll update again once I get some human testing in.
 

Gindler

Smash Champion
Joined
Feb 26, 2008
Messages
2,442
Location
Orlando (UCF)
All I know is that I would link egg lays (DJ egg lay them right when their invinc frames wear off once breaking out).......of course, smart players started to mash buttons slower or faster or sometimes not mashing them at all so they'd break out at different times therefore throwing me off, so it's not really predictable....of course to be fair once someone's encased in an egg they usually go panic mode and mash as fast as they can
 
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