Down air is not a bad move

[LanceStern]

I've seen a lot of people say dair from Pac Man was a bad move or useless.

• I've found it as an amazing out of shield option.
• It punishes rolls, spot-dodges and shields sometimes.
• The last hit pops them up perfectly for bair follow ups, or bait their air dodge and punish harder.

Embrace the down air. Anyone else find uses for it?

 

[Firedemon0]

The issue with down air is not the attack (though I wish it was awesome as fox's or Kirby's) It is the stupendous landing lag. It is very unsafe on shield to apply pressure, which most multi-hit dairs are used for.

 

[CMRaptor]

But i guess if you are using the move out of shield the move will be finished before you land ?

 

[dragontamer]

But i guess if you are using the move out of shield the move will be finished before you land ?

The autocancel window doesn't occur in a short-hop.

EDIT: More precisely... it "didn't" occur. I haven't tested anything with the Mewtwo patch yet.

 

[BSP]

Dair final hit will send Luma into tumble regardless of its damage, meaning you can KO Luma with it pretty easily while still retaining some mobility. All of our other aerials take longer to do so, while smashes are slower and leave you immobile (but still effective).

 

[busken]

Most people use grab after launching hydrant via jab, but d-air is a superior option since your jump can evoke aerial pressure on their shield combined with hydrant shield stun. Even if they decided to full hop over hydrant your jump is lower so you will land first getting the opportunity to make a read and punish accordingly.

 

[Funkermonster]

Eh, the coolest thing about Dair is its animation, Pac-Man looks sooooooo funny the way he's stomping his feet like that. But that's kinda all its got going for it. Most situations where I can use Dair (out of shield, and roll punishes), I can also just use Nair or UpB for similar damage but with a bigger reward. I wouldn't even call it good shield pressure, its got too much landing lag and is soooo unsafe on shield.

If Dair could maybe meteor smash or combo into something it'd be cool. The animation is still hilarious though.

 

[Megamon]

I find myself using dair as a ledge get up option, just to mix it up. Works a good amount, though if they shield I'm kinda screwed. Definitely a situational move. Good for rollers. I agree with that.

 

[Megamon]

Most people use grab after launching hydrant via jab, but d-air is a superior option since your jump can evoke aerial pressure on their shield combined with hydrant shield stun. Even if they decided to full hop over hydrant your jump is lower so you will land first getting the opportunity to make a read and punish accordingly.

I've broken a shield in a similar way, though I threw a melon after jabbing hydrant, and then I did the dair. Great shield break, I tell you hwat.

 

[Teshie U]

Has anyone noticed when buffering Dair out of shield stun and some other actions, you can just jump, do one hit and then fast fall before you reach the apex of your jump?

Any use for these sort of strange attributes?

 

[fromundaman]

While it is less effective now than it was pre-purchase, DJ dair can still be used over an offstage trampoline to hit with a weak hit that sends the enemy back into the trampoline again.

 

[makemesmellbad]

Has anyone noticed when buffering Dair out of shield stun and some other actions, you can just jump, do one hit and then fast fall before you reach the apex of your jump?

Any use for these sort of strange attributes?

Since Pac's recovery is pretty outstanding, SH d-air FF is a great option to punish players who recover low, as it provides multiple gimpy hitboxes that can span quite a distance. The only problem with this is that stages with close floors (ie. Omega Galaxy, Smashville) have a greater risk involved with this technique. Of course, you could always provide a trampoline below for safety, but also keep in mind setups take a bit more time.

Best use is Hydrant drop for stage spike, and if they tech or wall jump, follow with d-air FF. If they sleep on it and their recovery isn't good, they can easily bite the dust as you double jump and pellet around them to make it back.

 

[LanceStern]

Can't tell you how many dairs I landed on opponents this past tournament. Really good out of shield option with decent reaction time

 

[deepseadiva]

@ LanceStern weren't you a Peach main before. You would make a thread like this: it's literally the exact same dair as Peach's haha.

kick kick kick

 

[fromundaman]

I cannot explain how good this move is on top of an offstage trampoline, either rising to only hit with the weak hit and drop them into a red trampoline, or fast falling it to drag them into a yellow/red trampoline and killing both of you (Good for when you either have a stock lead or the opponent has a strong % lead).

 

[LanceStern]

@ LanceStern weren't you a Peach main before. You would make a thread like this: it's literally the exact same dair as Peach's haha.

kick kick kick

Lol I was a Peach main in brawl

 

[LanceStern]

I cannot explain how good this move is on top of an offstage trampoline, either rising to only hit with the weak hit and drop them into a red trampoline, or fast falling it to drag them into a yellow/red trampoline and killing both of you (Good for when you either have a stock lead or the opponent has a strong % lead).

Can you get us a video of this?

 

[fromundaman]

The first one yes, as I did it in tournament the other day to end a stock at 30%. The latter, I'll try to do that when exams end.

 

[makemesmellbad]

Exams get us all behind...

Except for Pac. His d-air won't change unless Sakurai patches something about it, but he's probably studying for finals, too.

 

[fromundaman]

or fast falling it to drag them into a yellow/red trampoline and killing both of you (Good for when you either have a stock lead or the opponent has a strong % lead).

Bah I lied. While the first thing I'd posted did work (Rising Dair to make them fall into a red tramp), Fast falling with it over a yellow tramp makes you hit the trampoline first and just combos into the UpB hit. Not really a bad thing, but not as good as I was hoping.

 

[Nu~]

Recently I've found this move to be extremely useful out of shield

 

[LanceStern]

It's great right? Being a Peach player from Brawl, I find the dair out of shield my second nature

 

[makemesmellbad]

I find d-air is also very good for covering ledge options. Wait for invincibility frames to run low, then start a spaced short hop d-air. It can cover rolls, get ups, and get up attacks in some cases, and if the last hit clips them, the opponent is sent offstage again (albeit, high enough to land on-stage, but above Pac is a dangerous place with a Bell or z-drop-ready fruits).

 

[fromundaman]

Can you get us a video of this?

Sorry it took me a while, but you can see it around 2:53

https://youtu.be/wVaW415G3Gc?t=2m53s

By the way, the FS is NOT necessary to do this; it is just possible to do it that way and easy to do by accident. I prefer to go for the option select DJ/FS>Dair over gambling on just the FS though. While the FS alone can work, the timing is stricter and if they press an attack after hitting the trampoline you will lose, whereas Dair usually doesn't.

 

[LanceStern]

I find d-air is also very good for covering ledge options. Wait for invincibility frames to run low, then start a spaced short hop d-air. It can cover rolls, get ups, and get up attacks in some cases, and if the last hit clips them, the opponent is sent offstage again (albeit, high enough to land on-stage, but above Pac is a dangerous place with a Bell or z-drop-ready fruits).

yes!

 

[NouveauRétro]

Has anyone noticed when buffering Dair out of shield stun and some other actions, you can just jump, do one hit and then fast fall before you reach the apex of your jump?

Any use for these sort of strange attributes?

Hey, today I made a post exactly for that, with a possible explanation for why it happens, how to do it consistently, and possible uses. I call it the footdive. Here's the URL. http://smashboards.com/threads/the-fütdive-the-triangle-jump-what-is-this-tech.402210/
I really want to get a discussion going, but I'm afraid I messed up the title so that only a few people will bother to click on it.

 

[NouveauRétro]

Speaking of Dair, I'm drumming up hype for this weird trick with down air.
http://smashboards.com/threads/pacman-tech-in-depth-how-to-footdive-discuss-uses-below.403287/