Do we really need nerfs in the current metagame?

[Baby_Sneak]

I'm...not sold on this yet.

I can see it being the case but I think there is a strong case of her losing to someone else. She did lose to Diddy before he got nerfed, though admittingly because he himself was too strong.

She could use another knock of the nerf bat while Nintendo buffing all character people preserve as weak.

If they keep nerfing her kill power, someone will be able to deal with her more effectively eventually along with tweaking her frame data.

Can we just tweak her? Make needles slower on startup and endlag, make fair slower on startup, but much stronger, take away her invincibility on up-b, make bouncing fish slower on startup but stronger, and make her do 1% more damage on her throws? Because constantly nerfing her kill power will make her balanced, but horribly and absolutely disgustingly designed.

 

[Hippieslayer]

I'm...not sold on this yet.

I can see it being the case but I think there is a strong case of her losing to someone else. She did lose to Diddy before he got nerfed, though admittingly because he himself was too strong.

She could use another knock of the nerf bat while Nintendo buffing all character people preserve as weak.

If they keep nerfing her kill power, someone will be able to deal with her more effectively eventually along with tweaking her frame data.

I'm not 100% either, but it does kinda seem that with the way she works -being able to both camp and go in- she's diverse enough to win any matchup.Nerfing her kill power more doesn't seem like the right to do to me. She'd turn into a boring character to watch (since she'd need to wear her opponents down carefully and slowly, even mores than now) and a frustrating one to play (you wouldn't be able to afford to make mistakes and if you did you have to camp to make up for it); it'd just enhance everything that's already bad about her as a character (not talking in terms of viability but in terms of her role as a competitive character).

I think her character design is just flawed, she relies on solid execution, and is rewarded massively for it - if she's played right she's nigh untouchable: she needs more weaknesses apart from her lack of killpower, and probably more strengths as well. I'd like to see her needles nerfed for starters, but that's the easy part, the hard part is her character design kinda needs to change and that's gonna take both buffs and nerfs imo.There are other characters which are also just inherently flawed in their design because, Little Mac for instance, the game would be better of without him atm.

 

[FLYING 7UR7LE]

I'm not 100% either, but it does kinda seem that with the way she works -being able to both camp and go in- she's diverse enough to win any matchup.Nerfing her kill power more doesn't seem like the right to do to me. She'd turn into a boring character to watch (since she'd need to wear her opponents down carefully and slowly, even mores than now) and a frustrating one to play (you wouldn't be able to afford to make mistakes and if you did you have to camp to make up for it); it'd just enhance everything that's already bad about her as a character (not talking in terms of viability but in terms of her role as a competitive character).

I think her character design is just flawed, she relies on solid execution, and is rewarded massively for it - if she's played right she's nigh untouchable: she needs more weaknesses apart from her lack of killpower, and probably more strengths as well. I'd like to see her needles nerfed for starters, but that's the easy part, the hard part is her character design kinda needs to change and that's gonna take both buffs and nerfs imo.There are other characters which are also just inherently flawed in their design because, Little Mac for instance, the game would be better of without him atm.

I hate little Mac with a passion, he has the dumbest and gimmicky design in the game. His K.O uppercut is even more gimmicky then shulks Monado arts, and the idea of a character who is really good on the ground and trash in the air is just plain dumb considering smash bros is a game where everyone can double jump and the majority of the cast is atleast decent in the air. The armor on his smashes makes Mac extremely boring to fight and the only enjoyment I get out of fighting little Mac is picking ness up throw read macs decent, regrab up throw repeat.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I'm not 100% either, but it does kinda seem that with the way she works -being able to both camp and go in- she's diverse enough to win any matchup.Nerfing her kill power more doesn't seem like the right to do to me. She'd turn into a boring character to watch (since she'd need to wear her opponents down carefully and slowly, even mores than now) and a frustrating one to play (you wouldn't be able to afford to make mistakes and if you did you have to camp to make up for it); it'd just enhance everything that's already bad about her as a character (not talking in terms of viability but in terms of her role as a competitive character).

I think her character design is just flawed, she relies on solid execution, and is rewarded massively for it - if she's played right she's nigh untouchable: she needs more weaknesses apart from her lack of killpower, and probably more strengths as well. I'd like to see her needles nerfed for starters, but that's the easy part, the hard part is her character design kinda needs to change and that's gonna take both buffs and nerfs imo.There are other characters which are also just inherently flawed in their design because, Little Mac for instance, the game would be better of without him atm.

I can agree with a lot of this, she needs something, like vanish being more punishable IMO.

 

[ParanoidDrone]

I can agree with a lot of this, she needs something, like vanish being more punishable IMO.

I was thinking nerf her camping game (Needles mostly? "How" is still an open question.) and remove the invulnerability on Vanish before she...well, vanishes.