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I find talking about theoretical gameplay pretty hard to judge. If I'm disappointed by characters not being included, I'd be even more disappointed that my super cool and unique moveset idea didn't come into fruition even if the character did.
I'd speculate on the various game modes, that may or may not be included in the Wii U version but I know I'll be satisfied with the gameplay and the majority of game modes no matter what.
Except Masterpiece in Brawl. Still feel that was a wasted opportunity.
It isn't bizarre. He's not simply a gamer, he's a game developer, so it makes sense that he would check out games from other regions. Even Miyamoto is a known Call of Duty player.
And yeah, "we currently have no plans" is simply stating "currently". I don't know why you are hanging to this false assumption that he doesn't like DLC at all, because he's fine with it. He'd just rather finish the vanilla game before he thinks about adding anything on to it, that's all he is saying. Many developers do this (and I'd rather DLC be thought of like that, unless you want Nintendo to become Capcom). Heck, to bring in an often compared game, PS-All Stars had character and stage DLC, but it was developed after the game came out.
He's outright called it the bane of the industry. That doesn't sound like something he'd suddenly change his mind on to me. He's said DLC is off the table in the very interview you quoted. Does that sound like it will still happen to you?
He's outright called it the bane of the industry. That doesn't sound like something he'd suddenly change his mind on to me. He's said DLC is off the table in the very interview you quoted. Does that sound like it will still happen to you?
He was likely referring to the Shady Way of doing DLC, not DLC in and of itself.
He also never said it was off the table, he said that they were going to finish the games before even considering it.
Sakurai is also a man known to change his mind often.
Honestly, at any given time on any Smash board anywhere (not just here), all I see are topics about the characters and the roster. How many character slots will be on the select screen? Which character should be cut? What character will be revealed next? Come rate my roster...
Do people actually like playing the game? Or do they just want to marvel at the character select screen, and nothing more? Some even say they won't buy the game if a specific character isn't playable. Game modes, stages, items, ATs, enemies...It's like none of these even matter.
Do these people care about anything aside from the roster? Granted, the Nintendo crossover thing IS part of Smash's appeal, but there's a lot more to the game than just the characters.
In a sense I can see where they're coming from. We've had three prequels to Smash 4, thus we know how the game should roughly play. Granted while we can sit here and discuss mechanics, I think most would rather discuss the content that the game is going to have.
I do agree that both is what make the games, but with the previous three iterations I believe most will say that even with Brawl's gameplay it is still fun and we trust Sakurai to make a good game gameplay wise. All that is really left to discuss is the content.
He was likely referring to the Shady Way of doing DLC, not DLC in and of itself.
He also never said it was off the table, he said that they were going to finish the games before even considering it.
Sakurai is also a man known to change his mind often.
Pretty sure it was DLC in general, since he was saying something about Nintendo not really supporting it.
He said, and I quote, "You could consider DLC as not being in the cards.” DLC isn't something you can just add in, you need to plan for it. You need "slots." You need to allow the game to accept it.
No, not really. The one thing he changed his mind on was a highly requested character.
Pretty sure it was DLC in general, since he was saying something about Nintendo not really supporting it.
He said, and I quote, "You could consider DLC as not being in the cards.” DLC isn't something you can just add in, you need to plan for it. You need "slots." You need to allow the game to accept it.
No, not really. The one thing he changed his mind on was a highly requested character.
I still doubt it. When was that said? Back during Brawl or recently, because Nintendo has been supporting DLC alot recently and will likely continue to do so.
From what I've read, all Sakurai has said in regards to Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS and Wii U was that DLC wasn't something they were thinking about yet.
Yes, you need to have 'hooks' in the game for it to allow DLC to work, but just because they aren't deciding on they'll have DLC or not doesn't mean they can't put the Hooks in just in case they do decide to have DLC at a later date. Its a common practice in modern Game Development. Even games that don't actually have DLC could have the Hooks there as a just-in-case measure.
I still doubt it. When was that said? Back during Brawl or recently, because Nintendo has been supporting DLC alot recently and will likely continue to do so.
From what I've read, all Sakurai has said in regards to Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS and Wii U was that DLC wasn't something they were thinking about yet.
Yes, you need to have 'hooks' in the game for it to allow DLC to work, but just because they aren't deciding on they'll have DLC or not doesn't mean they can't put the Hooks in just in case they do decide to have DLC at a later date. Its a common practice in modern Game Development. Even games that don't actually have DLC could have the Hooks there as a just-in-case measure.
Nintendo, has been supporting DLC. Sakurai, will not. The interview was from some time during Brawl, but it's hard to find it since the internet is buried under SSB4 interviews. I wouldn't be surprised if Sakurai "forgets" to put in these hooks. Sakurai has nearly complete control over SSB. Nintendo doesn't have any leverage, because A: Sakurai probably doesn't care about a paycheck at this point, and B: Sakurai leaving SSB because of it would be incredibly out of character for Nintendo, and Sakurai can pretty much say whatever he wants since Sora isn't a part of Nintendo. If Nintendo ever decides to go all Capcom on one of his games, he'll win in an instant.
This question is equivalent to walking into a doctor who convention and asking people if their doctor who fans.
This is smashboards OF COURSE people love smash bros. In fact I would argue the reason people speculate like crazy over little details is because they love the series so much and want to see their favorite characters get in.
No; fun gives me hives, uncontrollable gas, vertigo, dyslexia, and osteoporosis. It also distracts me from my constant fedora tipping, which I'm pretty sure regulates my heart beat at this point. Anyone who plays video games for fun instead of indepth, critical analysis is a filthy casual.
Nintendo, has been supporting DLC. Sakurai, will not. The interview was from some time during Brawl, but it's hard to find it since the internet is buried under SSB4 interviews. I wouldn't be surprised if Sakurai "forgets" to put in these hooks. Sakurai has nearly complete control over SSB. Nintendo doesn't have any leverage, because A: Sakurai probably doesn't care about a paycheck at this point, and B: Sakurai leaving SSB because of it would be incredibly out of character for Nintendo, and Sakurai can pretty much say whatever he wants since Sora isn't a part of Nintendo. If Nintendo ever decides to go all Capcom on one of his games, he'll win in an instant.
You can't say that for sure. Sakurai also said that he didn't want to make Super Smash Bros. into a competitive game and yet he's clearly trying to add competitive elements to these entries by taking away random elements from Characters, creating 'For Glory', giving every stage a 'Final Destination' form (he may be working under the assumption that FD is still the Competitive standard and not knowing about Battlefield-style stages being the new standard), and more.
He also could NOT put DLC in Super Smash Bros. Brawl because the Wii was not made to work with DLC, with all games that had it actually having it as Unlock Codes or Re-Using already on-disc available content, since the Wii did not have the memory to support large DLC.
That was also when DLC was fairly new, so things could be different now with how he feels...and I doubt Nintendo would ever go "all Capcom" as you put it, since they don't seem the type to have DLC on-disc, only having it as after the game is complete as extras.
In regards to these new Super Smash Bros. titles, the fact remains that Sakurai has only ever said that its not being thought about until after the games are completed. If he was completely opposed to it, he would just say that there was not going to be DLC in the game. If he says he's just not considering it yet, that means he believes he might decide to later, but hasn't decided yet since he's focusing on completing the games first.
You can't say that for sure. Sakurai also said that he didn't want to make Super Smash Bros. into a competitive game and yet he's clearly trying to add competitive elements to these entries by taking away random elements from Characters, creating 'For Glory', giving every stage a 'Final Destination' form (he may be working under the assumption that FD is still the Competitive standard and not knowing about Battlefield-style stages being the new standard), and more.
He also could NOT put DLC in Super Smash Bros. Brawl because the Wii was not made to work with DLC, with all games that had it actually having it as Unlock Codes or Re-Using already on-disc available content, since the Wii did not have the memory to support large DLC.
That was also when DLC was fairly new, so things could be different now with how he feels...and I doubt Nintendo would ever go "all Capcom" as you put it, since they don't seem the type to have DLC on-disc, only having it as after the game is complete as extras.
In regards to these new Super Smash Bros. titles, the fact remains that Sakurai has only ever said that its not being thought about until after the games are completed. If he was completely opposed to it, he would just say that there was not going to be DLC in the game. If he says he's just not considering it yet, that means he believes he might decide to later, but hasn't decided yet since he's focusing on completing the games first.
He said he didn't want it to be something only competitive players can enjoy, and that competitive play shouldn't be so distanced from casual play. He never said SSB shouldn't be competitive. Brawl was the way it was because he didn't work for it to be competitive, and it was inadvertently less workable then Melee. This time around he's making sure competitive SSB4 is better then Brawl, but not so far distanced from casual play like Melee. He's taking out parts casuals didn't care for, (random aspects, transformations) to assist the competitive side.
I already knew that Wii era DLC was impossible.
When I was saying "going all Capcom," I was talking about their history of hijacking series for profit. Capcom has:
Turned down publishing Megaman 2 multiple times, only publishing the complete game after Inafune and the team agreed to work on multiple, unrelated, projects.
Wouldn't localize Megaman 6 because the NES was supposedly done, when it still had a good year left.
Making Megaman X6, X7, and X8 even though X was over.
Completely reversing Zero 1's big plot twist.
Forcing Inti to leave Zero 3's villain undefeated and for pushing the Zero series' ending back another game.
Splitting the Battle Network games into two versions.
Making Battle Network 4, 5, and 6 even though that had ended.
Ending both the Maverick Hunter X and the Megaman Powered Up "series," even though they were both released on a flop of a handheld.
Not doing any voice acting for ZX's localization.
Doing voice acting badly for ZXA's localization.
Canning ZX3 for no apparent reason.
Making the aforementioned "DLC" for Megaman 9 & 10.
Making Megaman 10 even though Keji didn't want it made.
Disallowing Inti from making any real changes to Zero collection, namely allowing use of the rest of the screen. (Which was halfway added, by the way. When the game crashes the parts "offscreen" show.)
And finally, canceling Megaman Legends 3 after Keji left, to spite him.
And that's just Megaman.
Nintendo's businessmen are just telling him to say that. Almost every developer, movie star, or otherwise famous person has businessmen telling them what and what not to say.
I am in the minority here I guess. I've actually hated playing Smash since the day I received it as a Christmas gift in 1999. I was so excited to play the game, until I saw that it had all of my favorite Nintendo characters in it beating each other up.
I told my Mom that I didn't want to play it anymore and that I wanted to return it. But she was very disappointed in me and took my entire N64 away. Thinking this was punishment, I actually loved this, knowing I would have the chance to play outside again with my friends.
Until one day...the year was 2001. My mom came home on the day of my birthday with a Gamecube and Super Smash Brothers Melee. I saw a picture of Mario, Peach, and Bowser on the cover, so I knew it must be a platformer. I started adventure mode and picked Mario, and I was thrilled. Until of course, I had to fight Mario again with my Mario. This blasphemous experiment in physics shook me to the core, so I immediately turned off the game and went outside to play basketball.
Weeks later, my mom was cleaning my room for me while I was out of town. She noticed that everything was dusty and that I hadn't dusted in ages. When I returned from my vacation with my father, she scolded me and grounded me. My punishment? To sit in front of Melee for the next 6 hours and play it. She even made me unlock all of the characters (although she allowed me to leave the console on overnight to unlock Mewtwo. But she still made me play it again the next day!).
My punishment? To sit in front of Melee for the next 6 hours and play it. She even made me unlock all of the characters (although she allowed me to leave the console on overnight to unlock Mewtwo. But she still made me play it again the next day!).
I am in the minority here I guess. I've actually hated playing Smash since the day I received it as a Christmas gift in 1999. I was so excited to play the game, until I saw that it had all of my favorite Nintendo characters in it beating each other up.
I told my Mom that I didn't want to play it anymore and that I wanted to return it. But she was very disappointed in me and took my entire N64 away. Thinking this was punishment, I actually loved this, knowing I would have the chance to play outside again with my friends.
Until one day...the year was 2001. My mom came home on the day of my birthday with a Gamecube and Super Smash Brothers Melee. I saw a picture of Mario, Peach, and Bowser on the cover, so I knew it must be a platformer. I started adventure mode and picked Mario, and I was thrilled. Until of course, I had to fight Mario again with my Mario. This blasphemous experiment in physics shook me to the core, so I immediately turned off the game and went outside to play basketball.
Weeks later, my mom was cleaning my room for me while I was out of town. She noticed that everything was dusty and that I hadn't dusted in ages. When I returned from my vacation with my father, she scolded me and grounded me. My punishment? To sit in front of Melee for the next 6 hours and play it. She even made me unlock all of the characters (although she allowed me to leave the console on overnight to unlock Mewtwo. But she still made me play it again the next day!).
He said he didn't want it to be something only competitive players can enjoy, and that competitive play shouldn't be so distanced from casual play. He never said SSB shouldn't be competitive. Brawl was the way it was because he didn't work for it to be competitive, and it was inadvertently less workable then Melee. This time around he's making sure competitive SSB4 is better then Brawl, but not so far distanced from casual play like Melee. He's taking out parts casuals didn't care for, (random aspects, transformations) to assist the competitive side.
I already knew that Wii era DLC was impossible.
When I was saying "going all Capcom," I was talking about their history of hijacking series for profit. Capcom has:
Turned down publishing Megaman 2 multiple times, only publishing the complete game after Inafune and the team agreed to work on multiple, unrelated, projects.
Wouldn't localize Megaman 6 because the NES was supposedly done, when it still had a good year left.
Making Megaman X6, X7, and X8 even though X was over.
Completely reversing Zero 1's big plot twist.
Forcing Inti to leave Zero 3's villain undefeated and for pushing the Zero series' ending back another game.
Splitting the Battle Network games into two versions.
Making Battle Network 4, 5, and 6 even though that had ended.
Ending both the Maverick Hunter X and the Megaman Powered Up "series," even though they were both released on a flop of a handheld.
Not doing any voice acting for ZX's localization.
Doing voice acting badly for ZXA's localization.
Canning ZX3 for no apparent reason.
Making the aforementioned "DLC" for Megaman 9 & 10.
Making Megaman 10 even though Keji didn't want it made.
Disallowing Inti from making any real changes to Zero collection, namely allowing use of the rest of the screen. (Which was halfway added, by the way. When the game crashes the parts "offscreen" show.)
And finally, canceling Megaman Legends 3 after Keji left, to spite him.
And that's just Megaman.
Nintendo's businessmen are just telling him to say that. Almost every developer, movie star, or otherwise famous person has businessmen telling them what and what not to say.
Trust me, I know ALL about what Capcom has done, I'm a Moderator on their Forums, I have to hear about it all the time...and about how I'm horrible because of it (they seem to think I actually work for the company when I don't)
Though I wouldn't say Inafune is exactly innocent either, he was the one who pushed for more Westernization and was the one who decided that Ninja Theory should make Dante look as far different as possible for DmC..and finalized the decision for Bad Box Art MegaMan in SFxTK...as for most of that, I hadn't heard of some of it, namely the stuff back in the 80s and early 90s..though I did like the later BNs more then the earlier ones and I don't recall the game officially ending with BN3..though I hadn't really played that much, and there's no real proof MML3 was cancelled to spite Inafune..since that would literally just be stupid from all angles..and honestly, I hated that both BN and my fav series, MMZ were ended in the first place and that he had wanted to end MMX..I don't agree with just up and ending series. ZX3 wasn't started because of poor sales of the other two games (Capcom really does need to stop with the cliff-hanger endings..since now we have to wait for both ZX3 and MML3 so they can at least have satisfying ends if they have to end).
I agree that its a shame both MHX and MMPU ended since both games were great..and especially since Inafune had MegaMan X4 completely re-voice acted for the MegaMan X Collection but decided not to use it so he could save it for Maverick Hunter X4..which never came to be as you know..
Funniest thing I have to say is that I never expected the first Peach upskirt of Super Smash Bros. for the Nintendo 3DS and Wii U to be of an Amiibo figure..but lo' and behold, someone actually took a shot up her skirt at E3 and posted it online to show she's fully sculpted under her skirt just like in Smash Bros..I'd link the photo, but I don't know if its against the rules.
Just like people have said before, it's all just speculation hype and a lot of it is over exaggerated in my opinion. Personally, I don't care about the characters at all, I care about how they play.
I didn't even really follow coverage of the game all that extensively and loyally until E3 when Clash Tournaments uploaded all those 1v1 battles to their channel tbh, that got me super hyped though. That might just be me though.
Funniest thing I have to say is that I never expected the first Peach upskirt of Super Smash Bros. for the Nintendo 3DS and Wii U to be of an Amiibo figure..but lo' and behold, someone actually took a shot up her skirt at E3 and posted it online to show she's fully sculpted under her skirt just like in Smash Bros..I'd link the photo, but I don't know if its against the rules.
Trust me, I know ALL about what Capcom has done, I'm a Moderator on their Forums, I have to hear about it all the time...and about how I'm horrible because of it (they seem to think I actually work for the company when I don't)
Though I wouldn't say Inafune is exactly innocent either, he was the one who pushed for more Westernization and was the one who decided that Ninja Theory should make Dante look as far different as possible for DmC..and finalized the decision for Bad Box Art MegaMan in SFxTK...as for most of that, I hadn't heard of some of it, namely the stuff back in the 80s and early 90s..though I did like the later BNs more then the earlier ones and I don't recall the game officially ending with BN3..though I hadn't really played that much, and there's no real proof MML3 was cancelled to spite Inafune..since that would literally just be stupid from all angles..and honestly, I hated that both BN and my fav series, MMZ were ended in the first place and that he had wanted to end MMX..I don't agree with just up and ending series. ZX3 wasn't started because of poor sales of the other two games (Capcom really does need to stop with the cliff-hanger endings..since now we have to wait for both ZX3 and MML3 so they can at least have satisfying ends if they have to end).
I agree that its a shame both MHX and MMPU ended since both games were great..and especially since Inafune had MegaMan X4 completely re-voice acted for the MegaMan X Collection but decided not to use it so he could save it for Maverick Hunter X4..which never came to be as you know..
BBA Megaman would of been pretty funny any time beforehand, but the fans saw it as disrespecting Megaman after what happened. Can't really say much about Dante since I don't care for DMC.
BN3 was supposed to be the end, from what I recall. Haven't really gotten into it until the Wii U VC came around, but I remember hearing that 4 was horrible and it killed the series, in spite of it being the best selling game.
The MML3 site said something along the lines of "the game will be completed with or without fan support/imput, so no pressure in joining." Then when Capcom came up and cancelled the game they said it was because of lack of fan support. Yeah, it's pretty obvious they were trying to spite somebody, be it Keji or the fans. The only other option is that the remaining developers gave up, but somebody had to make up that cockamany excuse. If it was something like "Since Keji left, we haven't been very motivated or happy with the project, so we're ending it here. Fans, we're sorry." people wouldn't be so upset.
I would of rather had MMZ, also my favorite series, end when it was intended to. It's pretty obvious Z4 wasn't supposed to be the finale just looking at it. Z3 had pretty much had everything the last entry would have, just short of the complete ending. The developers should have complete control over the franchise, and they should be able to end it when they're done. I find it to be quite selfish to want something to continue past it's intended end, and I hope Gunvolt ends on it's own accord, be it one game or more.
BBA Megaman would of been pretty funny any time beforehand, but the fans saw it as disrespecting Megaman after what happened. Can't really say much about Dante since I don't care for DMC.
BN3 was supposed to be the end, from what I recall. Haven't really gotten into it until the Wii U VC came around, but I remember hearing that 4 was horrible and it killed the series, in spite of it being the best selling game.
The MML3 site said something along the lines of "the game will be completed with or without fan support/imput, so no pressure in joining." Then when Capcom came up and cancelled the game they said it was because of lack of fan support. Yeah, it's pretty obvious they were trying to spite somebody, be it Keji or the fans. The only other option is that the remaining developers gave up, but somebody had to make up that cockamany excuse. If it was something like "Since Keji left, we haven't been very motivated or happy with the project, so we're ending it here. Fans, we're sorry." people wouldn't be so upset.
I would of rather had MMZ, also my favorite series, end when it was intended to. It's pretty obvious Z4 wasn't supposed to be the finale just looking at it. Z3 had pretty much had everything the last entry would have, just short of the complete ending. The developers should have complete control over the franchise, and they should be able to end it when they're done. I find it to be quite selfish to want something to continue past it's intended end, and I hope Gunvolt ends on it's own accord, be it one game or more.
Honestly, I loved the 6th Entry of MegaMan Battle Network the most.
I keep hearing that when I'm Moderating the Capcom Forums and I keep having to correct it..that was the Capcom Europe Twitter that said that very stupid line about 'lack of Fan Support'..that was just what whoever was in charge of the Capcom Europe Twitter thought was the reason, fact is he was wrong and it was actually a collection of things. Mostly, from what I've been told by the Capcom Employees who supervise us, it was more that they don't know where to take the MegaMan series, mostly due to it having so many different sub-series to the point where its hard to tell what most people would 'want' from a new MegaMan, like MMX fans may not like Classic, Classic may not like BN-style, BN style may not like Legends, etc, etc. I was assured they are constantly talking about the series though and I know my supervisors in general are HUGE MegaMan fans, even before they joined (one was actually brought into the company purely for translating MegaMan Legends 3 stuff)
Also, anyone familiar with Capcom Europe (except Capcom themselves) will tell you that Capcom Europe is HORRIBLE, even the European Mods have told me this. They seem to hate MegaMan ever since the early Gamecube days, even refusing to localize the collections there because they felt 'he wasn't popular' despite games selling..
I've never heard anything about Inafune not having almost full control over MegaMan Zero 1-4..and I'm honestly more disappointed it ended as definitively as it did..
It's a sad state of affairs when the core fanbase of a franchise continuously predicts, expects, or even hopes an upcoming sequel fails; especially in light of all the (I'm pretty damn sure, anyway) glowing praise Smash 4 is bound to receive from publications and press.
Right, right, I am aware GameSpot or IGN praising a game as a collection of its part really isn't what pertains to Smash in this respect, right?
Well, whatever.
Smash is notorious for this.
I look at the main board for this game and the majority of threads are complaints, worries, nitpicks.. is there any other fanbase so cynical and paranoid?
It's a sad state of affairs when the core fanbase of a franchise continuously predicts, expects, or even hopes an upcoming sequel fails; especially in light of all the (I'm pretty damn sure, anyway) glowing praise Smash 4 is bound to receive from publications and press.
Right, right, I am aware GameSpot or IGN praising a game as a collection of its part really isn't what pertains to Smash in this respect, right?
Well, whatever.
Smash is notorious for this.
I look at the main board for this game and the majority of threads are complaints, worries, nitpicks.. is there any other fanbase so cynical and paranoid?
Don't worry, we're not alone, Fans of More Traditional Fighters are the same way, you wouldn't believe how many people were and still are complaining that Marvel vs Capcom 3 is 'worse' then the severely unbalanced Marvel vs Capcom 2 before the former game even released.
The Final Fantasy fanbase is pretty similar as well.
Don't worry, we're not alone, Fans of More Traditional Fighters are the same way, you wouldn't believe how many people were and still are complaining that Marvel vs Capcom 3 is 'worse' then the severely unbalanced Marvel vs Capcom 2 before the former game even released.
The Final Fantasy fanbase is pretty similar as well.
I would totally play a "Smash" game with original characters only. As long as the gameplay is up to par with the series I would enjoy it, even though the franchise crossover aspect is cool and it allows people to have a chance to speculate on who's getting included in the roster and how he's gonna play like.
The roster is a huge deal pre-release because it's who we are playing as.
The whole reason people bought SSB in 1999 was because it had all their favorite Nintendo mascots fighting each other.
Melee and Brawl expanded into lesser known franchises and sub-characters. SSB4 continues this.
People want to play their favorite characters, either because they like the series they're from, or because they like the way they play.
Who you play shapes how you play, and this leads to your enjoyment of the game. For the most part, people who won't buy if a character isn't in are stupid, but some people don't find a reason to buy a new game if they ONLY play fights (not minigames) and don't like the new characters.
When the game comes out, all of the discussioon will revert to gameplay. But for now, it's just about what characters are or aren't in. It's part of the fun of speculation and getting excited.
I'm not surprised about these, though.
