• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

Status
Not open for further replies.

Shroob

Sup?
Joined
Sep 26, 2013
Messages
40,570
Location
Washington
what Joker styled presentation are you talking about?



again where are the links?
It's the literal first few seconds of the "Mr.Sakurai Presents: Hero"


He says that "Usually, we prepare a script, but this time, I'd like to take a more livestream approach... we don't have much of a budget*Laughs*"



Something close to that.
 
Last edited:

The Stoopid Unikorn

Spiciest of Guacamoles
Joined
Sep 8, 2014
Messages
77,270
Location
somewhere in Canada
Switch FC
SW-4202-4979-0504
Of course we have to finish this trailer so of course Mario (Nintendo basically) wakes up to this desperate situation to find said single flame. The uneasiness of Mario approaching the flame could represent Nintendo's overall uneasy relationship with their creation but I don't know about that and it's just something I felt like I read between the lines there.
Could be Nintendo being well aware of how daunting it would be to negotiate with Disney and having second thoughts, only to regain confidence because they know it's the right move.
 

Hadokeyblade

Smash Legend
Joined
Dec 5, 2018
Messages
10,618
When it comes to cuts for the next game, we can't really make any guesses for who it Will be.

But if I'm being honest i dont think Sora Will be one of them, for the next game at least, i feel like every party involved understands the significance of His inclusión and it would be ****ing stupid to get Rid of him after just one smash game with him in it. He Is basically the most requested character in smash history after all.
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

Spiciest of Guacamoles
Joined
Sep 8, 2014
Messages
77,270
Location
somewhere in Canada
Switch FC
SW-4202-4979-0504
When it comes to cuts for the next game, we can't really make any guesses for who it Will be.

But if I'm being honest i dont think Sora Will be one of them, for the next game at least, i feel like every party involved understands the significance of His inclusión and it would be ****ing stupid to get Rid of him after just one smash game with him in it. He Is basically the most requested character in smash history after all.
I bet Mario will be cut. Such an irrelevant character :4pacman:
 

DanganZilla5

Smash Champion
Writing Team
Joined
Mar 5, 2019
Messages
2,370
I would love an Ultimate DX but realistically I think it's a long shot. The third party characters in the second pass alone must have been uber expensive, and that's not counting all of the third party spirit events and costumes. Combine that with all of the licenses that they have to regain and it's just a major headache. People will say "If they did it once, they can do it again." but even if they just ported everything over it would still be expensive as **** and time consuming, to the point where it might not even be worth it to try. I know Sakurai is a madman and an utter champ when it comes to getting rights to stuff but at what point do you start to question if it's worth it? Because if they wanted to add more third party characters that is more money needed. And even then a DX version should be more than just new characters. I'd expect a couple new/returning modes and a few other features.

I'm not saying it can't happen, but I am skeptical since Ultimate's existence in itself is a miracle and already a herculean task. I'd expect them to either soft reboot the series or do something drastic for the next game like doing a Subspace 2.
 

JarBear

It's not Tuesday John
Joined
Jan 23, 2014
Messages
1,351
Location
Internet
Although back in the day I didn’t care as much about the “melee” mechanics for Project M, I appreciated the “merge” of Dr. Mario and Mario. Dang, how long ago was that?
 

Hadokeyblade

Smash Legend
Joined
Dec 5, 2018
Messages
10,618
Lol I literally did. Totally never mind. He could get the axe.
It's possible but i doubt it
I'm pretty sure Dr Mario was supposed to be in Brawl but was cut for Time contrainsts.

Nowadays That isn't really an issue because even if he misses the boat for base game there's always DLC.
 

MooMew64

sometimes here, sometimes there
Joined
Nov 4, 2019
Messages
15,575
Location
up and down and all around
It's kinda interesting to imagine what Brawl would have been like



If a certain blue hedgehog hadn't screwed up development time.
TBH best case scenario is the Doc woulda probably stayed as he's easy filler and Mewtwo might have stayed, as correct me if I'm wrong, I think it had the most dev time out of the F7.
 

Idon

Smash Legend
Joined
May 24, 2018
Messages
17,622
Location
Waxing Moon Ritual
NNID
Miyamoto Iori
Switch FC
SW-4826-9581-3305
It's possible but i doubt it
I'm pretty sure Dr Mario was supposed to be in Brawl but was cut for Time contrainsts.

Nowadays That isn't really an issue because even if he misses the boat for base game there's always DLC.
Sincerely doubt Nintendo or Sakurai believes in the power of Mario in a doctor costume to sell DLC.
 

Rie Sonomura

fly octo fly
Joined
Jul 14, 2014
Messages
19,698
NNID
RieSonomura
Switch FC
SW-4976-7649-4666
I would love an Ultimate DX but realistically I think it's a long shot. The third party characters in the second pass alone must have been uber expensive, and that's not counting all of the third party spirit events and costumes. Combine that with all of the licenses that they have to regain and it's just a major headache. People will say "If they did it once, they can do it again." but even if they just ported everything over it would still be expensive as **** and time consuming, to the point where it might not even be worth it to try. I know Sakurai is a madman and an utter champ when it comes to getting rights to stuff but at what point do you start to question if it's worth it? Because if they wanted to add more third party characters that is more money needed. And even then a DX version should be more than just new characters. I'd expect a couple new/returning modes and a few other features.

I'm not saying it can't happen, but I am skeptical since Ultimate's existence in itself is a miracle and already a herculean task. I'd expect them to either soft reboot the series or do something drastic for the next game like doing a Subspace 2.
I definitely agree with the bolded; it’s what I’m pushing for for an Ult DX as well. Not just more characters, but also a few tweaked existing ones, tweaks to modes, minor features here and there, returning modes, AND I STILL SAY TO YEET THAT TRASH ASS VR MODE.

I love Ultimate, but even I can see room for improvement and not just character wise
 

7NATOR

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
4,085
Personally, I'll be honest, I'm like 99.99 Sure every character is Coming back in the Next Smash...Granted there's a good chance it might not happen in Base roster, and there will need to be DLC to cover it

But especially if they are once again gonna build of the Previous game's Assets, there really isn't any reason to not return every character in Smash 6 at some point. The Assets for the characters are already made after all. And unless any relationships sour, if we're talking 3rd party, I would imagine they would all be down for re-appearing again in Smash 6, even if some would only do it through DLC Perhaps
 

Rie Sonomura

fly octo fly
Joined
Jul 14, 2014
Messages
19,698
NNID
RieSonomura
Switch FC
SW-4976-7649-4666
I guess I’m also imagining both OG dissidia and 012 when imagining an Ult DX. Play both games and you’ll see the difference despite having the same characters (012 adds a handful) but other things are tweaked

I guess my overall vision is similar?
 

MooMew64

sometimes here, sometimes there
Joined
Nov 4, 2019
Messages
15,575
Location
up and down and all around
For real though

They wouldn't make the Doc DLC IMO.

Dr. Mario is only a thing still thanks to him being easy filler, and Ultimate brought him back 'cause it brought everyone back. TBF, there are a lot of characters that are probably only here because of "Everyone is Here!" that wouldn't be otherwise, especially not for DLC.
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

Spiciest of Guacamoles
Joined
Sep 8, 2014
Messages
77,270
Location
somewhere in Canada
Switch FC
SW-4202-4979-0504
So


Assuming they do sell the 10th Kingdom Heart track separately, how much do you think it'll cost?



The Mii costumes with music tracks cost 75 cents, but I could see them sell it for anywhere between 1-5 bucks cause lolDisney.
They're not gonna do that because more money for Disney :4pacman:
 

DaybreakHorizon

The guy who predicted Sora as Fighter 11
Joined
Jul 28, 2013
Messages
9,604
Location
The Shadow World
NNID
tehponycorn
3DS FC
4253-3486-4603
Now that DLC is finished, I went over all the trailers and ranked them based on my own thoughts on each trailer. For old time's sake, I'll be presenting similar to a good ol' tehponycorn long form speculation piece. I present:

DaybreakHorizon's Smash Ultimate Trailer Tier List

I don't have much to say in the form of acknowledgements, but I suppose I'll acknowledge everyone who sent their congratulations upon Sora's reveal–whether that be here or on Discord. I genuinely appreciate all of y'all'ses thoughts, as well as the opportunity to reconnect with y'all. It's certainly been a triumphant ending to be sure. I won't be reflecting too much on speculation itself, since that'll be another piece.

You could say that this piece is the first in a three-essay series where I'll be reflecting on Smash Ultimate Speculation. In this piece, as the name implies, I'll be ranking all of the Smash Ultimate Trailers (including World of Light, the Launch Trailer, and Mii Costume reveals). I've sorted the trailers into 6 tiers based on my thoughts on each trailer. The tiers go from Ultimate Tier to Echo/Mii Costume Tier, with the tiers in-between going from S to B, because no Smash trailer is actually bad. There's clearly a lot of thought and care put into all of them, which should be valued and appreciated regardless of your own thoughts about the character.

This piece, alongside the two that'll follow it, is somewhat of a departure from my previous pieces. I hope believe I've made a reputation for myself based on the quality of my research and my attempts to remain objective. This piece is obviously painted by my own biases, though I've made as much effort as I can to rank the trailers based on my thoughts on their quality rather than my own thoughts about the characters revealed (though obviously my thoughts on the characters paints my thoughts on their quality–though I've tried to reduce this as much as possible).

There's only really one rule for the tier list itself, being that trailers are ranked chronologically within their tiers, so there's no ranking within tiers. That being said, let's get into it!
my-image(5).png
These trailers are the best of the best, and have exceptional qualities that set them apart from other trailers.

Everyone is Here!
As far as I'm concerned, this is the Smash Ultimate trailer. This trailer boldly introduced Smash Ultimate to the world (it was previously just Super Smash Bros. for Switch) and set the pace for this crazy speculation cycle. Speculation on cut and returning veteran characters, which was a hallmark of previous Smash Speculation cycles, was completely thrown out the window, and from the introduction of third parties in Smash 4 (and their triumphant return) it seemed as if the sky was the limit for speculation. This isn't mentioning the monumental achievement of bringing back every. single. character. That is such a significant achievement that, while universally celebrated at the time, I think has somewhat been taken for granted three years later. The sheer amount of negotiations required to do so, as well as bringing Konami back into the fold, is by no means a small accomplishment, and spoke to the strength of Sakurai and Nintendo's business acumen as well as how far they were willing to go to make this Smash game the best one yet.

The World of Light Cinematic
Essentially the only time we see the cast interact with one another, and what a way to do so. This trailer is both hype-inducing and absolutely heartwrenching with all of the character moments contained within it. The way Galeem is surrounded by Master Hands before they dissolve and are absorbed into Galeem. The sheer number of light beams shot out, completely overwhelming the cast. Shulk seeing Galeem's attack and being unable to warn everyone. Sonic slowing down to reach out to Pikachu. The Inklings diving into their ink to hide. Link, Samus, Pokémon Trainer, and Bowser all trying to fight back only for it to be in vain. Wii Fit Trainer doing the sun pose to try and get i-frames, and the Duck Duck stopping to try and carry the Dog with him. Falco, Mewtwo, Bayonetta, Greninja, and Lucario's attempts to evade only to get caught. How Palutena attempts to save Pit and Dark Pit, only for them to be unable to fly when she's gone. Kirby ****ING BOLTING (the look on his face is great) and barely escaping. These small moments, condensed into around 2 minutes, show the best of Smash Bros., being the interactions between these seemingly disparate characters.
But we don't stop there. Galeem's light envelops the entire universe, turning it to a barren wasteland where everyone is reduced to spirits and concluding the display of its sheer power. And then we cut to Kirby crash landing as Lifelight begins playing and we dive into gameplay. It's an amazing trailer that sells World of Light perfectly (in fact, you could say it oversells the game mode), and is one of Smash Ultimate's best trailers by a long shot.

The One Winged Angel!
One of the most surprising trailers by far. It takes the original World of Light trailer and completely subverts it by introducing Sephiroth in extravagant fashion–he ****ing destroys Galeem as One-Winged Angel starts playing. It's not Galeem, but Sephiroth who completely tears through the entire cast. The trailer subverts other Smash trailers again when Sephiroth fights Mario. For one moment it looks like Mario is ****ing dead (again) before it's revealed Sephiroth caught him on his overalls. The sheer amount of power this shows is stellar, as he's not just beating the **** out of everyone, he's toying with them. His confrontation with Cloud is essentially Advent Children condensed into 3 minutes and actually good, and perfectly showcases Sephiroth's character. All in all, this trailer has it all: surprise, wit via its subversion of previous Smash trailers, and hype via Sephiroth's sheer power being put on display.

The Last Key
Perhaps this is a biased choice, but I think this trailer stands alongside the best, not only in its surprise, but in its triumphant tone and as wrap-up to Smash Ultimate. The way it starts by immediately referencing the first trailer with the flaming Smash logo, with everyone standing in front of it. The fire dies out, and a single flame drops representing the final fighter and the last three years of Smash Ultimate coming to an end. The way the cast turns to trophies, showing that its all over, before Mario frees himself to approach the lone flame. A sinister tone plays as he hesitates, before his face shows determination and reaches into the flame–regardless of what may come. He reaches into the flame and pulls out a lone sword, that he throws. The Keyblade's silhouette is shown in flames before it cuts to the Mickey keychain. I appreciate this moment for so many reasons, but I'll specifically mention the flex on Nintendo's part. Years of speculation over the Mickey keychain and whether Nintendo could even get it, silenced by a resounding "Ladies and Gentlemen, we got it." And then comes Sora. Simple and Clean begins playing as he falls out, calling back to the first Kingdom Hearts. The orchestra swells as he flies about in an incredibly triumphant moment. The true ballot winner, always thought to be impossible, all leading to his card: Sora is finally here. Cut to gameplay, and then we end on a shot of Sora and Mario shaking hands, wrapping up what is probably one of Smash Ultimates highest moments and cementing that this is real and not some weird fever dream that you're about to wake up from to find out that it was actually Flame Chungus or something. This trailer has a power and energy that I don't think any other trailer has, and it's surely one of the best.
These trailers are just great. Like, some of the best ones. They undoubtedly stand at the top, though they're not the absolute best.

Super Smash Bros. is coming to Nintendo Switch!
The first Smash Ultimate trailer. When I watched it again, the first thing that stuck out to me was how good the animation for the Inklings was. They really captured the fast-paced, frenetic energy of Splatoon perfectly, and you could call it the first "twist" trailer in how it opens similar to a Splatoon trailer before the lights dim and the action slows. A fire appears in the distance, reflected in Inkling's eye...the Smash logo. In the flames stand the core cast of Smash, and the picture speaks louder than any words. This is simultaneously an invitation and challenge. The next Smash Brothers is coming, and it's time to get ready. All in all it's a haunting trailer that both introduced and set the tone for this entry in the series.

The Rivals
I kind of surprised myself with this placement since I never cared much for K. Rool, but this trailer is good. The way it begins by priming viewers to be prepared for K. Rool by showing iconic rivalries in Smash before cutting to Donkey Kong and Diddy Kong...vibing. They do be a couple of monkeys vibing. They're drawn to the window by some rumbling, and the silhouette of King K. Rool appears. It's him!...except it isn't. It's King Dedede and he's doing a little bit of trollin'. The subversion is amazing, but then, of course, comes King K. Rool. From here, the energy completely skyrockets. It's a ceremonious showing that after years of requests K. Rool is finally here, and he's here in full force. The ending with Donkey Kong and Diddy Kong and K. Rool facing off ties together the trailer perfectly by calling back to the very beginning and cementing the fact that Donkey Kong has finally met his match.

The Masked Rebel (The Game Awards version)
The first Smash Ultimate DLC Trailer, the Masked Rebel is, in my opinion, the most effective twist trailer. For one, it was the second trailer (though I wouldn't count the first) to use the style of the game its based on. It further lacked the iconic Smash "swoop" as I'll call it (where the Smash logo cuts in from black), which made it a genuine surprise when the "invitation" the Phantom Thieves received was truly for Super Smash Brothers Ultimate, especially if you didn't catch the "Not real gameplay footage" disclaimer shown at the very beginning. Even if you did, it was certainly feasible for the announcement to be for Persona 5 Arena, Persona 5 Royal (not yet detailed), or Persona 5 Strikers (not yet announced), Persona Kart, Atlus milks the **** out of Persona 5 so take your pick. I think the context behind this trailer is also relevant, as no one was expecting a Smash Ultimate reveal at the event due to the interference of clout-chasing "insiders" (who I'll write more detailing thoughts on in a later piece in the series). Instead, everyone was expecting the oft-rumored Metroid Prime Trilogy. I wrote about the sequence of events in one of my earliest Speculation pieces, The Games Awards as a Case Study for Doubt if you're interested in knowing the specific chain of events. Back to the trailer, the fake leaks only amplified the surprise factor and, in my opinion, cemented this trailer as one of the most shocking–especially given that prior to his reveal only a handful of people (myself included) thought Joker was even possible. All-in-all an incredible trailer and part of one of the most interesting periods of Smash Speculation.

Bonus points for the later, gameplay version of the trailer having Makoto, when asked by Yusuke if Joker will be okay, saying "he's got a knife and a gun, I'm sure he'll be fine" as if those aren't two of the deadliest weapons to be brought to Smash at any point. Joker won't just be fine, he's going to ****ing kill Mario in cold blood and no one can stop him.

Sans Mii Costume Reveal
I know I made a tier specifically for Mii Costumes and Echoes, but as far as I'm concerned the Sans Mii Costume (and its reveal) transcends Mii Costumes. This was the first premium Mii Costume, and the way Megalovania just starts playing and Sans is just standing there is so hilarious. The cut is so abrupt and then BOOM it's Sans and he's in Smash Bros. It's a ****post, except it's real and Megalovania is in Smash Bros. One of the most surprising and exciting reveals by far.

The Legendary Wolf
I wouldn't call many trailers a celebration in of themselves, but this trailer is a wonderful celebration of SNK and the legacy of the King of Fighters series. The way that they highlight the Neo Geo system where King of Fighters started. The way that iconic characters like Geese Howard, Nakoruru, and Iori Yagami each get little scenes with each showing an iconic moment or trait of theirs (Geese falling to his death, Nakoruru's bird, and the famous Iori laugh) before it fades to Terry's hand grabbing the invitation. The way that Terry holds the invitation up triumphantly, silhouetted in white before the art style changes to the Smash engine and Terry's card appears (even referencing the Fatal Fury series). You can tell there's a lot of love put into Terry in Smash, at least above some other fighters, and it's clear Sakurai and co. enjoyed working on him a lot just from his trailer alone.

A New Seed!
I think this trailer is, surprisingly, one of the most expressive trailers of the bunch. It begins similar to other in-game trailers, with a standard duel of the characters. Nothing noteworthy, until...
minecraft.jpg
Mario crashes through a wall into pure darkness. From here the surprise is dropped as the Minecraft mob and cave noises play and Mario looks around nervously. Digging is heard and from the wall, straight out of Minecraft, Steve emerges. The standoff between Steve and Mario (who looks as shocked as viewers probably did) is amazing, and sets the tone for the trailer that Steve is just...there. Yeah, he's in the game and he's going to eat meat in front of Mario before literally leaving him for dead (what is it with Smash trailers and killing Mario?). From there the gameplay portion begins, showcasing just how faithful to Minecraft Steve is. The dude's essentially a near faithful recreation, and he's brought with him Alex, Zombie, and Enderman (who has one of my favorite shots from a trailer). It's another triumphant trailer that celebrates the best of Minecraft as its integrated into Smash, and doesn't fail to have the necessary surprise and hype energy that makes a great trailer.
The trailers are really good. They check off all the boxes of a good Smash trailer, though they don't stand out for any reason other than the characters revealed in them.

A Piercing Screech
The first newcomer trailer for Smash Ultimate, immediately following up Everyone is Here! if I recall correctly. Along with Everyone is Here! this trailer set the tone for Smash Ultimate speculation going forward, and what a way to do so. People don't talk about Ridley very much nowadays, but anyone who was here during Smash 4 speculation can tell you that he was by far one of the largest character requests, even going back to the Brawl and Melee eras. In the past he'd been shot down for, quite literally, being too big. So, while going into Smash for Switch Ridley fans were as passionate as ever, to say Ridley was fighting an uphill battle for inclusion would be an understatement.

And then comes his trailer. Sakurai mentioned later that the concept behind Ridley was "pure evil" and this trailer pulls this off incredibly well through its tone. Mega Man, Mario, and Samus walk down a dark, futuristic walkway. Ridley swoops in, fast and silent, actually murdering Mega Man and Mario before they can so much as make a sound. Samus turns around to find them both missing, before Ridley appears, taunting Samus by twirling Mario's cap. This trailer is incredibly effective at showing Ridley for what he is, and what I think fans always wanted him to be when they imagined him in the game. The English tagline Ridley hits the big time! is a nice bit of meta-humor as well, poking fun at previous statements to his detriment.

Between Everyone is Here! and Ridley's announcement, the message was clear that Nintendo was listening to fans with this entry and fulfilling popular requests within the fandom. It felt like the sky was the limit, and popular fan requests like K. Rool and Geno actually felt possible where they hadn't in the past. It was truly a special time within the fandom, and I don't think any other character besides Ridley could've pulled that off (maybe K. Rool, but Ridley kind of stood on his own in terms of being a popular legacy request that just. wouldn't. die.).

Can I also comment that like, Samus kinda lets Mega Man and Mario die. She doesn't think to look behind her until after they're both dead? Also when she does it's with gun pointed so like, did she know they were dead already and that someone was there? If so that's kinda ****ed up because she didn't act until after they were gone. You'd think as an intergalactic bounty hunter of wide renown and based on her previous feats she'd have god-like reflexes, but either she doesn't, or she let Mega Man and Mario die for whatever reason. Maybe Ridley isn't the true villain of this trailer...

Vampire Killer
Admittedly, this trailer was somewhat undermined by the numerous credible leaks of Simon Belmont in the game. That being said, it's still a high quality trailer. This time it's not Mario who dies, but Luigi as his soul is quite literally torn out of his body after he goes toe to toe with multiple Castlevania enemies and bosses. Simon's revealed as he saves(?) Luigi by beating the **** out of Death. The gameplay portion of this trailer is actually significant, as besides showcasing Simon (and later Richter's) movesets, it also shows off wider Castlevania representation in Smash through the Dracula boss in World of Light and the Alucard assist trophy. This trailer is also notable for being the first double-reveal trailer, announcing both Simon and Richter. Both are given ceremonious reveals, with Simon being foreshadowed and Richter appearing in the nick of time to save Simon (even saying his famous line against Dracula). All-in-all, this is just a great trailer, especially in how it showed how on-board Konami was with including Castlevania in Smash (Konami had–and still has–a reputation of not caring about their video game IPs, so seeing so much love given to Castlevania was a welcome surprise to many).

Heroic Encounter
Again, just another really good trailer. The beginning's somewhat standard, with Dharkon influenced fighters bodying Link (another influential NES-era fantasy character–referenced by name in Dragon Quest 3) before Hero comes in and bodies them in return. The animation of the fight is stellar (but then again so is like all the animation in these trailers lol), but once Hero shows up the trailer really takes off. It's another one of those triumphant trailers that displays a series meeting Smash is stellar fashion. The scene where Four, Eight, and Erdrick show up is especially noteworthy, as the camerawork and lighting reinforce how big of a moment this is for gaming. Remember, before Smash, Dragon Quest Heroes never appeared together in anything, so when Four and Eight both appear with pure white behind them, only to be followed by the camera zooming and focusing on Erdrick, the quintessential Dragon Quest protagonist, it's a huge moment! The composition of this trailer in regard to its music is also amazing, if not for the composer Sugimiya being a homophobic war crime denier (rest in hell *******). Still, I'd say this trailer is carried by the strength of its mechanics, and gives Dragon Quest the due respect it deserves.

Best Friends
I've spoken about subversive trailers previously, and this trailer's another one of those, this time riffing on...King K. Rool's Smash trailer?

We've reached the point where we're subverting Smash trailers in Smash trailers. Something something Darkness within Darkness.

I personally enjoy the interactions between Donkey Kong, Diddy Kong, and King K. Rool because they do be vibin' together. I think it helps reinforce the whole "Best Friends" theme that former enemies are hanging out together before Banjo's reveal, and K. Rool's addition in parallel to some scenes from his own trailer (like him running up to the window and vying for space with DK and Diddy before they break it) is a funny touch. Duck Hunt Dog doing some trollin' is also kind offunny, but the repetition of the joke from K. Rool's trailer makes it a bit stale in my opinion. Banjo's introduction is a huge moment given his legacy popularity among fans, and they play it up to great effect in this trailer (with the trio of DK, Diddy, and K. Rool celebrating along with viewers at home). The ending where Banjo and Kazooie beat up (kill?) K. Rool is full of energy and live, and the ending shot of them celebrating with all the other Nintendo characters pins the trailer together perfectly as it's essentially a "welcome home" to these two lost Nintendo idols.

The Ashen Demon
I know this one's an unpopular opinion (since I shared this tier list on Discord before/while writing this), but hear me out here:

I just think this trailer is REALLY funny. There's so many dimensions of meta-humor to this trailer, especially when considering the wider context of the trailer within Speculation as a whole.

To start, this is the least surprising trailer because it shows Byleth within the first 10 seconds. This wouldn't mean much on its own, if not for the fact that this trailer premiered in an announced Smash Ultimate event, so everyone immediately knew it was Byleth (though someone thought it was...Kylo Ren?). The trailer starts as a pretty straight adaptation of the scene from Fire Emblem three Houses, except instead of being freed by merging with Sothis, Byleth is freed by Sothis flashing a Smash invitation, leading to Solon saying "So joining Smash consumes even the darkness itself?!" Cut to gameplay. Byleth is a fairly standard swordsman by the look of things. Then some other swordies beat him up, so he returns to Sothis tired and beat up. Sothis' clear irritation of the "too many swordsmen" remark feels almost reflective of the devs knowing of this criticism and just...not caring about it, but the challenge is presented regardless: if there are too many swordsmen in Smash, how does Byleth differentiate himself?

Become a woman. That's how.

oh and I guess he also gets the hero relics but the introduction of female Byleth halfway through the trailer is genius, and leads to two great moments:
Screen Shot 2021-10-06 at 4.36.08 PM.png
Solon looks so sad to be upstaged and completely ignored, which is also pretty funny considering how serious the trailer starts. This is by far the most self-aware Smash Ultimate trailer, completely lampooning the common "too many swordsmen" criticism of Smash and telling fans a resounding "we don't care we're going to add who we want lmao" and I love it.

But then you have to consider the wider context of the trailer, being that it's the closer to Fighters Pass 1 and hype is flying high. A lot of people were expecting Dante, and then it's Byleth. By far one of the most underwhelming and predictable characters. The sheer amount of salt this trailer is generated is insane, with salt lasting to this day. It made PapaGenos go legitimately crazy because he drank too much Kool-Aid and took this game way too seriously (he later tried to do damage control by saying it was all acted but anyone with a brain knows it wasn't, and that he had a heated gamer moment over a character getting into a children's video game). This trailer so many dimensions of irony and humor that stretch both within and outside of the bounds of the trailer itself, and I think for that it's deserving of a spot in the A+ tier.
These trailers aren't bad. Maybe a bit underwhelming in some minor ways, but still hype-inducing and full of lovable moments.

Clash of Flames
This is definitely a trailer for Super Smash Brothers Ultimate on the Nintendo Switch(tm). Ken beats up Little, and then Incineroar beats up Ken. The only scene that really stood out to me was the post-logo scene where Villager, Bowser Jr., and King K. Rool are all squaring up to fight Incineroar and Incineroar looks so tired, but otherwise this trailer just doesn't do it for me.

Ramen time!
This is kinda just Terry's trailer, but with less fanfare because it's ARMS, and only two people played ARMS ever. The non-gameplay portion is incredibly expressive, making use of ARMS artstyle well, and Captain Falcon and Kirby eating Ramen is a major highlight, but otherwise it's a rather short trailer without much to it.

One Day, Pyra Just Disappeared
Screen Shot 2021-10-08 at 6.48.11 PM.png


Anyways, next trailer.

The Iron Fist of Darkness
Kazuya throws people in a volcano: the trailer. The references to Tekken are nice (especially when he faces off against Ryu and Terry), and the scenes of Kazuya throwing people in a volcano are pretty funny, but otherwise...he just throws people into a Volcano and that's kinda it.

More Fighters (Launch Trailer)
It's definitely got a lot of neat animation, and seeing all of the characters in action is cool! Almost scratches that characters interacting with one another itch, except it's nothing big or exceptional, and I legitimately forgot it existed until I saw it on the tier list maker I used, so yeah. Can't rank it too high if I couldn't even remember it.
These trailers are okay. They're definitely lacking in some significant regard, but honestly no Smash trailer is bad so you can't say they're bad.

All in a Day's Work
I appreciate what they were going for in replicating Animal Crossing's art style, but **** this trailer is boring. It was transparent that it was going to be Smash from the beginning of the trailer, so the Animal Crossing section a minute and a half of what's essentially dead air time before we get a short, not even 40 second gameplay segment to wrap it up. Isabelle is such a significant Nintendo character (she's practically the face of Animal Crossing for ****'s sake) and she really deserved better than this half-hearted trailer.

Piranha Plant joins the battle! (Nintendo Switch)
This is hardly even a trailer. It's completely in-engine, and only barely over a minute in length. That being said, it has its own video trailer, and it's pretty funny for what it's worth. For whatever reason Mario is PISSED, which is funny, and Piranha Plant came at a perfect moment in speculation to be a giant middle finger to Grinch "leak" supporters, which I appreciate because I'm a petty *****. On its own, however, the trailer's isn't really anything at all...
These dudes didn't even get trailers lmao. But they're still reveals so like...they're here too. I'm just gonna lump them all in one since if you've seen one, you've pretty much seen them all.

Echo Fighters (Daisy, Chrom & Dark Samus)
All the Echo Fighters really got were gameplay segments, which is half a trailer to me. All of these characters are significant and have lots of fans, but they didn't get nearly as much fanfare as other newcomers, so I really can't rank their reveals on the same tier as any other newcomer.

Premium Mii Costumes that aren't Sans (Cuphead, Vault Boy, Dragonborn, Doomslayer)
If the Echo Fighters didn't get a lot of fanfare, then the non-Sans Premium Mii Costumes got even less. They got trailers in the broadest sense, however, so I suppose they count too?

Sans doesn't count because he's Sans. Next question.
That's the tier list. Don't really know what else to say. Bye?
Writing this piece was…a lot. I don’t know why, but it feels like it took a lot more effort than any of my previous pieces on their own (though my Second Ultimate Square Enid Character Argument probably took more effort between all of the essays I wrote). Maybe it’s because it’s been almost a year since the last time I wrote a long-form piece here. Maybe it’s because this piece is reflective instead of argumentative, so I couldn’t just simply follow an outline prepared in advance. Whatever the reason, I hope y’all appreciated a bit of my thoughts on each trailer. Smash reveals have been a hallmark of gaming events and Nintendo Directs for the past 3 years, so it’s an odd thought that we won’t be seeing them anymore for another 3-5 years.

I’ll be writing another two pieces…sometime in the future. Maybe it’ll take a month, or maybe it’ll take more like a year. I want to write about my in-depth thoughts on Sora and my support for him over the years as well as my experiences this speculation cycle, since I feel as if this is the first cycle I really participated in. However, based on my critical lack of free time and the effort with which it would take to make both of these pieces to the level of detail and quality that I desire, don't expect them any time soon. The best estimate I could give is December, since I'll be finished with my classes for the semester and recovering from jaw surgery, so it's not like I'll have much else to do besides lay around the house, play video games, and write essays for fun, but who knows what'll happen then so I make no promises.

I'll have more fluffy, nice reflections in the next two pieces, but I guess I'll just say that it's been nice to be back. Yeah. That's it. 'till next time!
 
Last edited:

DanganZilla5

Smash Champion
Writing Team
Joined
Mar 5, 2019
Messages
2,370
I definitely agree with the bolded; it’s what I’m pushing for for an Ult DX as well. Not just more characters, but also a few tweaked existing ones, tweaks to modes, minor features here and there, returning modes, AND I STILL SAY TO YEET THAT TRASH ASS VR MODE.

I love Ultimate, but even I can see room for improvement and not just character wise
Exactly. Like it's a shame that Squad Strike can't be played online. And speaking of online, that can be given a complete overhaul. And they can do other things like revamp older characters' movesets, not only bring back Break the Targets but give each character their own unique course, add more features to Stage Builder, Subspace 2, etc.
 

MooMew64

sometimes here, sometimes there
Joined
Nov 4, 2019
Messages
15,575
Location
up and down and all around
So


Assuming they do sell the 10th Kingdom Heart track separately, how much do you think it'll cost?



The Mii costumes with music tracks cost 75 cents, but I could see them sell it for anywhere between 1-5 bucks cause lolDisney.

I want them to sell it seperate so bad

But like

I also fully expect this to be held hostage behind MoM.

Which I was gonna buy and play at some point anyways, so I'll get a cool song whenever I get around to it, lol.
 

Shroob

Sup?
Joined
Sep 26, 2013
Messages
40,570
Location
Washington
They're not gonna do that because more money for Disney :4pacman:
I want them to sell it seperate so bad

But like

I also fully expect this to be held hostage behind MoM.

Which I was gonna buy and play at some point anyways, so I'll get a cool song whenever I get around to it, lol.
Ehhh

I mean, counter-point is they never said in the Direct that that'd be the only way to get it. They just mentioned that you'd get it for free upon purchase.


And, promo spirits aren't held hostage behind their games either.
 

Ivander

Smash Legend
Joined
Dec 1, 2014
Messages
10,326
Sincerely doubt Nintendo or Sakurai believes in the power of Mario in a doctor costume to sell DLC.
Gotta have them all, the completionist mindset.

That said, in general, probably not as a character. As an Alternate costume, quite probable, considering how many people over here want DLC Alternate costumes.
 
Last edited:

Rie Sonomura

fly octo fly
Joined
Jul 14, 2014
Messages
19,698
NNID
RieSonomura
Switch FC
SW-4976-7649-4666
Exactly. Like it's a shame that Squad Strike can't be played online. And speaking of online, that can be given a complete overhaul. And they can do other things like revamp older characters' movesets, not only bring back Break the Targets but give each character their own unique course, add more features to Stage Builder, Subspace 2, etc.
Bro

they showed the WoL effects in two trailers now

that should like be a toggleable effect in regular gameplay

also does stage builder have conveyor belts a la Brawl? If not they should bring it back
 

JarBear

It's not Tuesday John
Joined
Jan 23, 2014
Messages
1,351
Location
Internet
Gotta have them all, the completionist mindset.

That said, in general, probably not as a character. As an Alternate costume, quite probable, considering how many people over here want DLC Alternate costumes.
if there is another smash and “has“ to have a smaller roster, I wouldn’t mind if there are more alternate costumes that had more aesthetic changes like Mario and Dr. Mario as Alt with pills …Bowser with Dry Bowser that uses blue flames … etc. again, if the roster “has” to be smaller.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom