Diddy's absolute worst match-up.

[Remo]

I am going to be attending a local tournament here and one of my buddies plays a Diddy Kong. Well kind of. All he does is banana and run away. He won't approach and only does three attacks. Dash Attack, that Jump Grab and Peanuts. He combo's with the Jump-Grab and my DI doesn't seem to matter on that part. I can't clash with his dash attack (Roy) my counter (Down B) is lackluster and for some reason Diddy is behind him when the hit goes off and that leads to another Dash-Attack or Grab. The Dash Attack seems to shield poke at any shield strength on Roy.

I've got ~2-3 months to get a character that he's not going to be able to deal with. My Roy just doesn't get the job done. Any advice Diddy players?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Pluid]

One goal to beating a Diddy player is to be as comfortable with using bananas as he is. Also, I've been told by TKBreezy and Boss himself that Meta Knight, Mewtwo, and spacies are tough for Diddy.

 

[Remo]

One goal to beating a Diddy player is to be as comfortable with using bananas as he is. Also, I've been told by TKBreezy and Boss himself that Meta Knight, Mewtwo, and spacies are tough for Diddy.

Thank you for your reply. As a player opposing Diddy what is the easiest way to pick the Bananas up? I feel comfortable with Mewtwo so I think I will pick him up.

 

[Soft Serve]

Read up in the MU thread, thats definetly the best place because we're been talking about it for quite some time.

Your best bet to pick up a character to solely counter Diddy is going Marth or Shiek and just playing smart/safe. Stay grounded and you'll win the neutral game once you learn to deal with bananas. Maximize your punish game because Diddy is combo food. Learn to intercept Diddy's up-b.

To pick up the bananas, the easist way is to wavedash.

 

[Remo]

Read up in the MU thread, thats definetly the best place because we're been talking about it for quite some time.

Your best bet to pick up a character to solely counter Diddy is going Marth or Shiek and just playing smart/safe. Stay grounded and you'll win the neutral game once you learn to deal with bananas. Maximize your punish game because Diddy is combo food. Learn to intercept Diddy's up-b.

To pick up the bananas, the easist way is to wavedash.

Diddy's Up-B is easy for me. I just can't get around his Dash Attack.
Thank you for your reply as well. And the kindness in the reply.
I will try Marth and see. I can't play Sheik to save my life!

 

[Soft Serve]

For the DA, either be ready to expect it and Dash-dance away, then back in and grab, Or react quicky if you get hit by it so you can DI/SDI behind him. If you do it correctly, you should fall out the back because the repeating hitboxes on his hands and feet always hit outwards, so If you're in front of him you keep going with him but if you're behind him you fall out.

You only get like 9 or so frames to SDI behind him so its safest to just not get hit. If he whiffs, you have 22-27 frames to punish, depending on if he acts out of the IASA frames at the end.

22 frames is enough that you can shield it and still punish.
If you go for a wd grab OoS, assuming average jumpsquat 5 frames, its 5 frames for jumpsquat, 1 airborne, 1 Airdodge frame, 10 frames of landfallingspecial (wd lag) then 7 frames for most grabs to come out. Its roughly a 24 frame action, give or take a few frames (not sure I did it perfectly) If you WD grab OoS perfectly, You'll get him if he does anything other than dash/side-step out of his IASA.

 

[Remo]

For the DA, either be ready to expect it and Dash-dance away, then back in and grab, Or react quicky if you get hit by it so you can DI/SDI behind him. If you do it correctly, you should fall out the back because the repeating hitboxes on his hands and feet always hit outwards, so If you're in front of him you keep going with him but if you're behind him you fall out.

You only get like 9 or so frames to SDI behind him so its safest to just not get hit. If he whiffs, you have 22-27 frames to punish, depending on if he acts out of the IASA frames at the end.

Wow thank you for all this information! My DI/SDI is weak and I seriously need to improve on it. I will keep this in mind. Thank you so much!

 

[Pluid]

With the Diddy you're describing, a Zelda might also be a good counter. Zelda can outcamp that Diddy and out-prioritize dash attack with neutral B. I know that I have a problem with Zelda's personally. (also neutral B good for reflecting nanners and peanuts.)
Edit: Also, if you have a good Mario and you're on a bigger stage, he stuffs campy Diddy's with Fireballs/Pills and easily gimps with Diddy's predictable recovery with cape and other tools. I'm not exactly a pro, so my advice might not be as valid, but I think for our level of play I'm making sense, it'd be different on a professional level of play.

 

[Remo]

With the Diddy you're describing, a Zelda might also be a good counter. Zelda can outcamp that Diddy and out-prioritize dash attack with neutral B. I know that I have a problem with Zelda's personally. (also neutral B good for reflecting nanners and peanuts.)
Edit: Also, if you have a good Mario and you're on a bigger stage, he stuffs campy Diddy's with Fireballs/Pills and easily gimps with Diddy's predictable recovery with cape and other tools. I'm not exactly a pro, so my advice might not be as valid, but I think for our level of play I'm making sense, it'd be different on a professional level of play.

I do like Zelda as a choice and I wouldn't say you're wrong! Thanks for the advice!

 

[Praxis]

Zelda only does well vs Diddy if you master banana techs- like Teledash naner pickups and teledash AGT, or at low levels. Otherwise, Diddy can bait and punish Zelda hard for neutral B counter.

I'd actually suggest against counterpicking though. It sounds like you're losing to what are actually very poor Diddy techniques, and some improvements with your existing character will fix the problem.

Seriously, this isn't an offense or an attack, but you're playing from a low enough level that the character isn't the problem.

You said:

Dash Attack, that Jump Grab and Peanuts. He combo's with the Jump-Grab and my DI doesn't seem to matter on that part. I can't clash with his dash attack (Roy) my counter (Down B) is lackluster and for some reason Diddy is behind him when the hit goes off and that leads to another Dash-Attack or Grab. The Dash Attack seems to shield poke at any shield strength on Roy.

Dash attack is actually a fairly bad move with Diddy at higher levels. If it hits you, you can often SDI out, and if you can't, if you DI it right, you can tech out of it and avoid guaranteed followups (just techchase). If you shield it, Diddy crosses through you and is often in a bad position (offstage or behind you with frame disadvantage) and you can position yourself better.

You said you're using Roy's counter- even Marth's counter is a terrible move against Diddy. You should be smacking Diddy down with fair or nair when he does side-B grab, or wavedashing backwards to fsmash when he does the side-B kick. Actually, wavedash back to fsmash beats both options.

As I have a crewmate with an amazing Roy, I can guarantee that Diddy's dash attack does not shieldpoke at any percentage. Maybe you're angling your shield poorly?

As to peanuts, bat them out of the sky with your fair or avoid them.

 

[Remo]

Zelda only does well vs Diddy if you master banana techs- like Teledash naner pickups and teledash AGT, or at low levels. Otherwise, Diddy can bait and punish Zelda hard for neutral B counter.

I'd actually suggest against counterpicking though. It sounds like you're losing to what are actually very poor Diddy techniques, and some improvements with your existing character will fix the problem.

Seriously, this isn't an offense or an attack, but you're playing from a low enough level that the character isn't the problem.

You said:



Dash attack is actually a fairly bad move with Diddy at higher levels. If it hits you, you can often SDI out, and if you can't, if you DI it right, you can tech out of it and avoid guaranteed followups (just techchase). If you shield it, Diddy crosses through you and is often in a bad position (offstage or behind you with frame disadvantage) and you can position yourself better.

You said you're using Roy's counter- even Marth's counter is a terrible move against Diddy. You should be smacking Diddy down with fair or nair when he does side-B grab, or wavedashing backwards to fsmash when he does the side-B kick. Actually, wavedash back to fsmash beats both options.

As I have a crewmate with an amazing Roy, I can guarantee that Diddy's dash attack does not shieldpoke at any percentage. Maybe you're angling your shield poorly?

As to peanuts, bat them out of the sky with your fair or avoid them.

Thanks for you input, and while you said no offense I don't really see the point in telling someone what level of play they are at. It isn't necessary to the thread. I know I am not great at this game. No-one can be after only playing two months. I never said I was nor do I go about expressing myself an expert player. I don't know the match-ups yet and I am still teaching my fingers the tech. I asked for a character/advice against Diddy rather than "Am I a bad player." That's all I am going to say.

Thanks for your advice anyway.

 

[Praxis]

Thanks for you input, and while you said no offense I don't really see the point in telling someone what level of play they are at. It isn't necessary to the thread. I know I am not great at this game. No-one can be after only playing two months. I never said I was nor do I go about expressing myself an expert player. I don't know the match-ups yet and I am still teaching my fingers the tech. I asked for a character/advice against Diddy rather than "Am I a bad player." That's all I am going to say.

Thanks for your advice anyway.

Well, the point is that it's not your character that's holding you back in the matchup. Your opponent is doing things that Roy has perfectly legitimate ways of handling, so what I'm saying is that you might be better served by continuing on your path to improving your main rather than starting over with a new character just to beat a sub-par Diddy tactic.

That's why I brought up play level. Does that make sense? I'm not saying that you should be an expert after two months of play, but rather that you can improve to beat these weak tactics without needing to switch.

 

[Remo]

Well, the point is that it's not your character that's holding you back in the matchup. Your opponent is doing things that Roy has perfectly legitimate ways of handling, so what I'm saying is that you might be better served by continuing on your path to improving your main rather than starting over with a new character just to beat a sub-par Diddy tactic.

That's why I brought up play level. Does that make sense? I'm not saying that you should be an expert after two months of play, but rather that you can improve to beat these weak tactics without needing to switch.

I appreciate the words of wisdom and perhaps I am sour. I've got another two months to prepare and using Roy is my best bet. I find myself unconfident in my abilities with Roy. I'm playing this Diddy tonight and I will for sure Wavdash Fmash more. Really it's just irritating getting beat by weak **** when I'm expecting such a higher level of play. That in its own right is my own fault lol.

Thank you for clarifying. And sorry for getting hostile.

 

[Spice]

One goal to beating a Diddy player is to be as comfortable with using bananas as he is. Also, I've been told by TKBreezy and Boss himself that Meta Knight, Mewtwo, and spacies are tough for Diddy.

Personally I don't feel like Meta Knight is a bad matchup. I think it's 50/50, they are both heavily dependent on controlling the match so it really comes down to who can keep momentum. I played against a MK player who was definitely an overall better player than I was but I was able to keep the match even the entire game.

 

[Dopplegamer]

From my experience as a Diddy main, I've come across 2 threats: Ivysaur and Yoshi. Ivysaur is just impossible for me to approach, and Yoshi's super armor jump makes him nearly un-gimpable. But it sounds like the Diddy you have trouble with would require a different strategy, that's just my two cents.

 

[Praxis]

From my experience as a Diddy main, I've come across 2 threats: Ivysaur and Yoshi. Ivysaur is just impossible for me to approach, and Yoshi's super armor jump makes him nearly un-gimpable. But it sounds like the Diddy you have trouble with would require a different strategy, that's just my two cents.

Diddy edgeguards Yoshi extremely well, actually. If he double jumps to the stage, just footstool him. If he tries to throw out an aerial, back up and hit him in a moment as he's stuck with that aerial out now. If he tries to go up around you when you jump out there, great, start charging up-B and angling it to cut Yoshi off.

http://gfycat.com/WellgroomedElectricBeagle

http://gfycat.com/DangerousSorrowfulFlies

Footstool + up-B give Diddy the tools he needs.

I haven't had any issues with Ivysaur, I simply just don't approach him. I throw crap at him and keep a banana on hand so I can banana OOS if he hits my shield. He has a rough time with that. If you get him offstage, Diddy basically edgeguards him for free by charging up-B offstage in the tether swing region.

 

[Praxis]

Personally I don't feel like Meta Knight is a bad matchup. I think it's 50/50, they are both heavily dependent on controlling the match so it really comes down to who can keep momentum. I played against a MK player who was definitely an overall better player than I was but I was able to keep the match even the entire game.

I've beaten the same MK player you're referring to several times. You could say he was toast. (ba-dum-pish)

The matchup is even IMO. Diddy messes up MK's entire dash dance ground game with good peanut placement.

 

[Swag Apocalypse]

DA definitely shield pokes small/low shields. It has multiple hitboxes that travel through you, so it can hit spots behind you at the end of it. Locals refer to me as "The God of the Dash Attack" because I abuse the **** out of it. As Roy, you can CC it up until 40~? percent, then punish with an fsmash. If the fsmash is close enough, the sweet spot should deal about 20% so you'll win the trade and probably knock the Diddy offstage and set up an edgeguard. The better option for dealing with DA is good spacing and movement. Space yourself barely outside the dash attack range near the ledge so you can bait it out. When the DA comes out, WD backwards and dash towards the ledge, then pivot grab or pivot smash. That's the stuff that screws me when I play the higher level players near me. If the Diddy is going for a DA that carries you off the ledge and commits heavily into it, just full hop over and let him go off the stage. Set up to punish the recovery. DA is a good combo set up, but you can easily dodge it and punish hard with decent mobility. What you should really be worried about are banana setups into dash attacks.

 

[Shin_Mazinkaiser]

Read up in the MU thread, thats definetly the best place because we're been talking about it for quite some time.

Your best bet to pick up a character to solely counter Diddy is going Marth or Shiek and just playing smart/safe. Stay grounded and you'll win the neutral game once you learn to deal with bananas. Maximize your punish game because Diddy is combo food. Learn to intercept Diddy's up-b.

To pick up the bananas, the easist way is to wavedash.

Dat Sagequoia doe.

 

[Chesstiger2612]

For the DA, either be ready to expect it and Dash-dance away, then back in and grab, Or react quicky if you get hit by it so you can DI/SDI behind him. If you do it correctly, you should fall out the back because the repeating hitboxes on his hands and feet always hit outwards, so If you're in front of him you keep going with him but if you're behind him you fall out.

You only get like 9 or so frames to SDI behind him so its safest to just not get hit. If he whiffs, you have 22-27 frames to punish, depending on if he acts out of the IASA frames at the end.

22 frames is enough that you can shield it and still punish.
If you go for a wd grab OoS, assuming average jumpsquat 5 frames, its 5 frames for jumpsquat, 1 airborne, 1 Airdodge frame, 10 frames of landfallingspecial (wd lag) then 7 frames for most grabs to come out. Its roughly a 24 frame action, give or take a few frames (not sure I did it perfectly) If you WD grab OoS perfectly, You'll get him if he does anything other than dash/side-step out of his IASA.

Just as addition, all hits but the last have 0.5x SDI multiplier, so SDI is hard unless you can get to the left side where the move hits you out of the range of the next hitbox

 

[Soft Serve]

Yeah, aim to just beat the DA out with a disjoint or dash dance/jump to avoid it.

 

[Spice]

From my experience as a Diddy main, I've come across 2 threats: Ivysaur and Yoshi. Ivysaur is just impossible for me to approach, and Yoshi's super armor jump makes him nearly un-gimpable. But it sounds like the Diddy you have trouble with would require a different strategy, that's just my two cents.

In my personal experience Ivysaur is among my easiest matchups. I used to get really excited when a new opponent picked him because I felt so comfortable with the matchup. If you can get a bit of shield pressure to lower his shields and then start a dash attack, it will almost always shield poke in my experience. Ivysaur REALLY can't get out of those combos if you don't give him the chance to hit you with Uair or Dair.

And as Praxis said, really easy to edgeguard. If you get him above the level of the stage he really doesn't have anything he can do. Just be very careful of Bairs and you will be in good shape.

 

[act9]

One goal to beating a Diddy player is to be as comfortable with using bananas as he is. Also, I've been told by TKBreezy and Boss himself that Meta Knight, Mewtwo, and spacies are tough for Diddy.

Spacies are a pretty good matchup IMO. Chain some usmashes, nairs, and a fair, bair, up-b, or some kill move to finish it off.

 

[Recess]

I think its just comes to MU knowledge and how well your opponent can adapt to the banana game. Except for a really good mewtwo I played once I haven't had consistent problems with any other character tbh.