Did Nintendo make bad choices for newcomers?

[DraginHikari]

Not to mention the term all star is a pretty vague term with a meaning that is difficult to define in the context we often use it in.

 

[egaddmario]

>implying Pichu, Dr. Mario, and Roy are "All Stars"

 

[fogbadge]

I take it seriously when one is missing

who counts as a nintendo all star is a matter of opinion

 

[ErenJager]

All newcomer choices so far have been great in my opinion with the exception of Wii Fit Trainer, Mii's and possibly Chorus Men. No one would have cared if they never existed, far more other popular characters that won't make it in, and these ones did. Now they will be an expected staple in every incarnation after this one, and people will cry if they're ever removed.

 

[Tshockz]

I thought miis would be a really stupid addition but with how they are presented and how they have 3 types of playstyles I actually like them now. Only newcomer I really do not like is wii fit trainer.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Now they will be an expected staple in every incarnation after this one, and people will cry if they're ever removed.

Isn't that a good thing?

Establishing a fanbase thanks to Smash is one of the better aspects of Smash. There wouldn't be any Captain Falcon or Ness if there weren't any characters that nobody asked for; that's the beauty of the series.

 

[Marakatu]

Question to Rhythm Heanven fans: do you think that Chorus Men are a bad choice? I mean, I've never played Rhythm Heaven, but the monkey, the girl and the wrestler look more popular to me.

 

[8-peacock-8]

EDIT: The All-Star argument holds no weight. It never did. All it does is add a positive to the game.

Question to Rhythm Heanven fans: do you think that Chorus Men are a bad choice? I mean, I've never played Rhythm Heaven, but the monkey, the girl and the wrestler look more popular to me.

Not really. There isn't a specific character to truly represent that series in all honesty. But there are characters that are fighting types that would've been perfect. (Karate Joe and Wrestler)

But you could say that the Chorus Men offer more by being a clean slate.

 

[silvR1995]

Personally I think that all of the newcomers are the best they picked so far in any smash.

This is the order of my most hyped newcomers are
1st-
2nd-
3rd-
4th-
5th-
6th-
7th-
8th-
9th-

For me, it's like this:

1. 
   
2. 
   
3. 
   
4. 
   
5. 
   
6. 
   
7. 
   
8. 
   
9. 

Also, that is probably the cutest sig I've seen

 

[pupNapoleon]

Question to Rhythm Heanven fans: do you think that Chorus Men are a bad choice? I mean, I've never played Rhythm Heaven, but the monkey, the girl and the wrestler look more popular to me.

I'm not a RH player, but I LOVE the Chorus Men already.

who counts as a nintendo all star is a matter of opinion

Well, to a certain extent. Some are arguable, and some are not really arguable.

 

[UnicornDemon]

I am very happy with all of the newcomer choices thus far, with one three exceptions. are the only newcomers so far that have been bad. They are a disaster, though. They look to be as bland as possible, particularly that sword fighter one (really?). I'm also disappointed with the disproportionately large development time they seem to have gotten i.e. 3 movesets and differing hitboxes based on size. I would have been happy if we just got one, though, like only the brawler version.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Question to Rhythm Heanven fans: do you think that Chorus Men are a bad choice? I mean, I've never played Rhythm Heaven, but the monkey, the girl and the wrestler look more popular to me.

I don't think they're inherently more popular moreso as they're just suggested more. I mean, at first I thought Karate Joe was the only feasible choice but as more characters get suggested the more I think about their possibilities so I end up being behind their chances.

To my surprise, I actually thought of the Chorus Kids (right down to the name despite only appearing in the credits lol) as a possible candidate when I was looking at my post history lol. Don't know why I didn't think much about them beyond that. Either way, I don't think they're a bad choice. Popularity is debatable, but they are the closest thing to a mascot to the best selling game in the series, as they were prominent in promotions (even by a celebrity on TV) and were on the boxart, so they're at least recognizable in some regards. As a representative for the series as a whole? Definitely, moreso than any other suggested character in retrospect. They actually have something to do with rhythm, being a choir, and Rhythm Heaven has a lot of minigames that consists of following a group. Their simplistic design also means Sakurai can be really imaginative with them without being limited to what they do, and it wouldn't look completely out of place for them to borrow moves from other Rhythm Heaven minigames. In all honesty I'd be happy with any RH character, so the Chorus Kids are completely fine with me.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I am very happy with all of the newcomer choices thus far, with one three exceptions. are the only newcomers so far that have been bad. They are a disaster, though. They look to be as bland as possible, particularly that sword fighter one (really?). I'm also disappointed with the disproportionately large development time they seem to have gotten i.e. 3 movesets and differing hitboxes based on size. I would have been happy if we just got one, though, like only the brawler version.

But... they aren't a character! They are character builder with the heading of Mii! That is like calling stage builder a stage. They are a feature/ a mode.

 

[TheRandomCities4]

I feel the choices are good, so long as they include a few really hype characters as DLC. The newcomers chosen aren't underwhelming themselves, but the fact that there doesn't seem to be any newcomers remaining for the other big franchises that have been allowed to expand since Smash's beginning is underwhelming. From a marketing standpoint, I can understand reserving hype characters for paid DLC (created after the game has been released, of course; I feel including characters as paid DLC, if they have been ready before the game releases, is unjust).

A quick hypothetical question:

Which character has more selling potential as DLC, Wii Fit Trainer or King K. Rool (assuming these characters were never leaked, and not extensively debated through said leaks)?

EDIT: I'm not saying that including characters from outside the franchises that have been expanded upon since Smash's first iteration is bad, because it's good. It's fresh. However, when it becomes the focus of newcomers, it becomes underwhelming.

 

[HipsandChips]

I like all the choices, and it's a dumb complaint, but I wish there was an animal or two to break up all the humans.

 

[fogbadge]

But... they aren't a character! They are character builder with the heading of Mii! That is like calling stage builder a stage. They are a feature/ a mode.

You can make them their own character

 

[pupNapoleon]

You can make them their own character

They are either zero characters or they are an infinite number of characters, but certainly, they are not one character.
It is a create a character option, and by damnit it will not be a character space but a separate button.
Think logically through it for a second, and obviously it cannot even be a regular space, it would need to be in a different area where you select it, and then say 'create new, or choose from one already saved.'
Not to mention,the entire character cannot be used online.

It has too many specifications. It isnt a character.

 

[fogbadge]

They are either zero characters or they are an infinite number of characters, but certainly, they are not one character.
It is a create a character option, and by damnit it will not be a character space but a separate button.
Think logically through it for a second, and obviously it cannot even be a regular space, it would need to be in a different area where you select it, and then say 'create new, or choose from one already saved.'
Not to mention,the entire character cannot be used online.

It has too many specifications. It isnt a character.

from the way your wording it, it sounds like you think they wont be on the roster with all the other characters, which is ridculas cause they will be, i believe most of the customizing will take place in options and i dont where you got the idea that youd be able to make more mii in smash itself

 

[DJ3DS]

I think the choices have been decent so far. Probably in order from worst to best for me would be:

Mii: Not a particular fan of using them in any game, but was not surprised at all by their appearance.
WFT: I get it, it's the unexpected character, but this one is more objectionable to me than R.O.B. ever was for some reason. This said, I don't dislike her, but I certainly won't miss her if she does not return in the future.
Palutena: I am ambivalent on the character as I have not played Uprising. More than anything I dislike her implementation regarding custom moves.
Villager: Nothing against the character, but he is not one which generates any hype for me and he doesn't seem to be a character I'd enjoy playing as.
Little Mac: Honestly for me this was one of the more surprising reveals, Punch Out doesn't seem to be anywhere near as big in the UK as it apparently is in the US. A cool character though who seems to be enjoyable to play as.
Greninja: This is where the hype starts. It was an unexpected addition but a great one in my opinion, and (even though it wasn't intended to be) is nice for the competitive Pokemon community, where it is very popular.
Rosalina & Luma: Personally a big fan of both the characters and their implementation/gameplay style. Likely to be one of the characters I use the most when the game releases.
Pac-Man & Mega-Man: These two are together because a lot of the hype is them being together along with Sonic and Mario. In my opinion they are easily the best 3rd party choices for the game, and I'm glad they're in. If I had to choose between the two though, I would probably choose Mega Man as the most hype-worthy, because of a few reasons: he was not as predictable as Pac Man (With Bamco helping develop, it seemed inevitable anyway), his moveset is pretty much perfect in my opinion and I also get the impression that Mega Man as a character seems targeted more towards core Smash players, whereas Pac-Man has substantially more appeal to a more general crowd.

 

[Arcadenik]

I like all the choices, and it's a dumb complaint, but I wish there was an animal or two to break up all the humans.

Pac-Man and Greninja are not human-like. There, you got two!

 

[FalKoopa]

Pac-Man and Greninja are not human-like. There, you got two!

I think he wants someone Ivysaur-like. Maybe.

 

[Arcadenik]

I feel the choices are good, so long as they include a few really hype characters as DLC. The newcomers chosen aren't underwhelming themselves, but the fact that there doesn't seem to be any newcomers remaining for the other big franchises that have been allowed to expand since Smash's beginning is underwhelming. From a marketing standpoint, I can understand reserving hype characters for paid DLC (created after the game has been released, of course; I feel including characters as paid DLC, if they have been ready before the game releases, is unjust).

A quick hypothetical question:

Which character has more selling potential as DLC, Wii Fit Trainer or King K. Rool (assuming these characters were never leaked, and not extensively debated through said leaks)?

EDIT: I'm not saying that including characters from outside the franchises that have been expanded upon since Smash's first iteration is bad, because it's good. It's fresh. However, when it becomes the focus of newcomers, it becomes underwhelming.

Underwhelming? Of course they are because they are not characters from the franchises that were introduced in 64 and Melee. Yeah, those franchises were the focus in Melee and especially Brawl. And now it is the new franchises' turn to have the focus.

This is similar to how people would complain that Nintendo doesn't make new IP's and always makes sequels and remakes of Mario, Zelda, and other popular franchises... and then when Nintendo makes new IP's, people moan and whine that Nintendo is ignoring the fans of Mario, Zelda, and other popular franchises.

 

[Deleted member]

Underwhelming? Of course they are because they are not characters from the franchises that were introduced in 64 and Melee. Yeah, those franchises were the focus in Melee and especially Brawl. And now it is the new franchises' turn to have the focus.

This is similar to how people would complain that Nintendo doesn't make new IP's and always makes sequels and remakes of Mario, Zelda, and other popular franchises... and then when Nintendo makes new IP's, people moan and whine that Nintendo is ignoring the fans of Mario, Zelda, and other popular franchises.

I know this is probably the Smashboards equivalent of suicide, but I actually agree 100%. Even though I would like to see King K. Rool, I think it is better to add representatives of new franchises to introduce people who might not have heard of said franchise before, and possibly get them interested in playing it, than it is to add more characters to franchises that already have characters.

 

[DMurr]

I feel like everyday I see a new article about how one of the newcomers was scrapped or considered for Brawl, or at least suggested by Miyamoto or offered by their creator.

I wish they would stop saying these things.. it's kinda killing my hype. I guess I shouldn't be surprised though, as Sakurai has a tendency to go back and revisit old ideas for later ideas (Pokemon Trainer, King Dedede, and Lucas, to name a few). I'm surprised to have not seen one of the "Forbidden 7" yet, or at least Dixie Kong or Mewtwo.

That said, the only characters I've found to be unexpected are Wii Fit Trainer, Rosalina and Greninja. Assuming Gematsu -- Shulk and Chorus Men are surprising too. I like every character though, and do not think they are bad choices. I'm still hoping for the unconfirmed characters in my signature, though.

 

[Deleted member]

I feel like everyday I see a new article about how one of the newcomers was scrapped or considered for Brawl, or at least suggested by Miyamoto or offered by their creator.

I wish they would stop saying these things.. it's kinda killing my hype. I guess I shouldn't be surprised though, as Sakurai has a tendency to go back and revisit old ideas for later ideas (Pokemon Trainer, King Dedede, and Lucas, to name a few). I'm surprised to have not seen one of the "Forbidden 7" yet, or at least Dixie Kong or Mewtwo.

That said, the only characters I've found to be unexpected are Wii Fit Trainer, Rosalina and Greninja. Assuming Gematsu -- Shulk and Chorus Men are surprising too. I like every character though, and do not think they are bad choices. I'm still hoping for the unconfirmed characters in my signature, though.

That is true; while it is kinda nice to know these kinds of things, it gets rather annoying when every other week, you have Sakurai saying "X character was supposed to be in Brawl!"

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I know this is probably the Smashboards equivalent of suicide, but I actually agree 100%. Even though I would like to see King K. Rool, I think it is better to add representatives of new franchises to introduce people who might not have heard of said franchise before, and possibly get them interested in playing it, than it is to add more characters to franchises that already have characters.

How do you feel about Isaac?

 

[Deleted member]

How do you feel about Isaac?

I have never played Golden Sun (through I probably should) so I don't have a strong opinion either way. From what I can tell though, he could be quite unique, in addition to representing a fairly obscure IP. I'd rather have Isaac than say, Ridley, but I wouldn't lose sleep over not having him.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Isaac is one of my most wanted newcomers....
I agree on hearing 'he was going to be in brawl, but instead I added Toon Link because I wanted to.' It just adds unnecessary anger towards a decision he made in a prior game, and makes me question what decisions he is making now.

 

[TheRandomCities4]

Underwhelming? Of course they are because they are not characters from the franchises that were introduced in 64 and Melee. Yeah, those franchises were the focus in Melee and especially Brawl. And now it is the new franchises' turn to have the focus.

This is similar to how people would complain that Nintendo doesn't make new IP's and always makes sequels and remakes of Mario, Zelda, and other popular franchises... and then when Nintendo makes new IP's, people moan and whine that Nintendo is ignoring the fans of Mario, Zelda, and other popular franchises.

That's why I brought up DLC. These newcomers, as mentioned in my edit, are nice. I like that they're bringing characters from outside the franchises allowed to expand since the first iteration of Smash. Having these newcomers as the focus prior to the game's launch works. It's fresh. After the game's release, they could focus on certain top fan-favorite newcomers for DLC; it makes since to me, business-wise.

As for the "similar" argument you brought up, it's not so similar in this case. I was not complaining about them simply adding newcomers from outside the franchises allowed to expand since the first iteration of Smash. I like what they're doing. I wouldn't like it if it was only what they were doing. In the other argument's sense, that would mean I wouldn't like it if Nintendo only made new IP's. They can find ways to include both, and they already have (Rosalina, Greninja).

Apologies if there were sentences that were easily misconstrued.

 

[im just peachy]

For me, it's like this:

1. 
   
2. 
   
3. 
   
4. 
   
5. 
   
6. 
   
7. 
   
8. 
   
9. 

Also, that is probably the cutest sig I've seen

how dare you put the goddess of tight all the way at the bottom !!
that doesn't make any sense.. please explain your reasoning behind this
kid icarus was GOING to get another rep, sakurai worked on kid icarus uprising,
what did you expect exactly? plus, the franchise is full of really nice and cool characters
So another rep was bound to happen.

 

[im just peachy]

I thought miis would be a really stupid addition but with how they are presented and how they have 3 types of playstyles I actually like them now. Only newcomer I really do not like is wii fit trainer.

You should like wii fit trainer !!! She's really cool and it looks like it's going to be fun playing as her in my opinion.
I'm in the same boat with the mii fighters, I'm just worried about their voices when they attack lol

 

[silvR1995]

how dare you put the goddess of tight all the way at the bottom !!
that doesn't make any sense.. please explain your reasoning behind this
kid icarus was GOING to get another rep, sakurai worked on kid icarus uprising,
what did you expect exactly? plus, the franchise is full of really nice and cool characters
So another rep was bound to happen.

I just don't really see anything going for Palutena. At least, not as much as the others that were revealed at E3 (the Miis look like they'll be a blast to use.)

Then again, I don't recall seeing anything regarding her to begin with SINCE E3, so I'll still keep my eyes peeled. And maybe I'll have a change of heart, who knows?

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I like Palutena, and I supported her, but I thought her trailer was probably the worst on the gameplay front.

It just felt really disjointed to me.

ANYWAY, because Gematsu's leak is more than likely outdated, I don't know FOR SURE that Chorus Men are the Rhythm Heaven rep. After all, Marshall looks a bit like a Chorus Man, and considering Sakurai said the Ice Climbers gave the 3DS version problems for a bit, I doubt a trio of characters would be any easier to work with.

So I have a feeling that the Rhythm Heaven character is either a single Chorus Man or Marshall as a character sort of like Game and Watch, using things from all of the various minigames throughout Rhythm Heaven history.

And by the way, the newcomers this game have been great. And if you're going to support a character from pretty much nothing but the spin-offs, why Daisy instead of Waluigi who could offer more than Daisy?

Just my two cents.

 

[im just peachy]

I like Palutena, and I supported her, but I thought her trailer was probably the worst on the gameplay front.

It just felt really disjointed to me.

ANYWAY, because Gematsu's leak is more than likely outdated, I don't know FOR SURE that Chorus Men are the Rhythm Heaven rep. After all, Marshall looks a bit like a Chorus Man, and considering Sakurai said the Ice Climbers gave the 3DS version problems for a bit, I doubt a trio of characters would be any easier to work with.

So I have a feeling that the Rhythm Heaven character is either a single Chorus Man or Marshall as a character sort of like Game and Watch, using things from all of the various minigames throughout Rhythm Heaven history.

And by the way, the newcomers this game have been great. And if you're going to support a character from pretty much nothing but the spin-offs, why Daisy instead of Waluigi who could offer more than Daisy?

Just my two cents.

So you disapprove of palutena : goddess of light with a scepter and shield, with an anime introduction
And you ALSO think waluigi is a better choice than daisy, which has been an alternate costume since melee.
you didn't have to attack daisy at all, you could have just stated how you thought waluigi deserves to be in this game

 

[Two Big Guys For You]

For the most part yeah.

I feel though that if Sakurai was gonna make a FE clone from Awakening, it should have been Chrom. I'm gonna be salty about that one for a LONG time.

But the ones I didn't care for when announced, like Palutena, are growing on me.

 

[pupNapoleon]

So you disapprove of palutena : goddess of light with a scepter and shield, with an anime introduction
And you ALSO think waluigi is a better choice than daisy, which has been an alternate costume since melee.
you didn't have to attack daisy at all, you could have just stated how you thought waluigi deserves to be in this game

And your response is to, in turn, post solely attack him?

edit: and then I post!

edit edit: and then he posts -__-

 

[im just peachy]

And your response is to, in turn, post solely attack him?

edit: and then I post!

edit edit: and then he posts -__-

my post didn't have any negative points directed to waluigi.

 

[Stompu]

I love the Megaman/Pacman addition, and don't mind the Palutena and FE addtions (although I just hope Lucina doesn't end up being a direct upgrade to Marth). Love the addition of Rosalina and she seems like a really great and strong new character too. The villager is alright, never played AC but I probably should (he's probably the one I'm least hyped to play but I still appreciate his addition. Mii Fighters are kind of meh, not a huge fan of their inclusion. Greninja I'm pretty stoked for, Little Mac looks like a cool, unique character and Wii Fit Trainer is just hilarious to me as an addition but might make a cool character anyway

 

[IronFish]

With Chrom being deconfirmed, and Robin and Lucina getting in over him, I would have to say yes, very good choices.

 

[IceColdSoda]

The newcomers are alright, you gotta also take in consideration that almost everyone that needs to be in smash is already in there. Nintendo should make some new major ip's.