Degrees of Metaknight Gameplay

[l3lue2ain]

This question is that has been plaguing me what separates the skill level of one metaknight player from the next. We know that all metaknights have the same moveset and that the moveset is not somehow evolving based on skill level. So there a set moves that "pro" mk users are using more or certain mk skills that people are using less. For example there was a time when I did not think the tornado was that good. With all of mk's move s I did not think it was necessary to be spamming it. But as it turns out your suppose to use it as a mixup , some times stage recovery . I see people use the forward tilt all the time but maybe its just the players I have been facing with people short hopping and shooting double lazers with falco and pichaku's extremely gay down a or even yet olimar camping. I don't see myself getting close enough to do it. The down tilt is by far the least used move. Well actually 2nd to the blair. Its like my whole strategy of beating people consists of fair mixups with tournado. Fair , nair mixups tornado. If a person gets to close down smash usually stops people form rolling towards me entering to close to me. eventually if I get them off the stage. I usually chase and dair to stage spike them. sometimes if they are way out I just fair to keep them out. I know that there is more depth to this character. lol I don't want this to suddenly turn in to melee and people are like your not wavedashing... when I could be doing that now to improve my game. (Also for the record I could wavedash and L cancel and all of that in melee ).

Match up Issues.
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olimar that camping is rediclous its like olimar is suppose to be an easy match up staright forward knock him off grab the ledge or kill him fast. seems to work well except this one olimar I know P~S lol he refuses to die. one of two things happen "hehehe down smash he's off" either he grabs the ledge so super fast that I can't lame him. Or he gets on the stage super fast and super armor pickman defense you shall not come near. "oh look a purple pikman your dead somehow at 80.

Falco the lazer spamage hurts it depends on how they recover if they recover with up b. HAHA hes dead. but he recovers with forward b I am not sure how to properly edgeguard that you just up there trying to fair next thing you know you just got spiked.

Game and Watch the guy just looks werid his dodging just seems werid I don't think I have ever gimped him.

Pickachu - another really weird match up for me. With him moving several directions when he recovers and can go through me. I don't know how to properly approach him although I have been doing ok versus them its mostly me just having a better mixup haha or moveset. But down A spamage and quick attack dashing ( not sure what its called but it looks like a fast wave dash when pikachu uses his/hers up+b to get across the stage). very trouble some I feel slower than the pickachu when this happens.

Donkey Kong - I feel that this is a easy match up for since I win most of them but sometimes my fair knocks the donkey Kong away like its suppose to and other times it just fails and I get hit for like 10% + when I am trying to escape the recovery. Sometimes makes me not want to go out there.

Peach - She does not die... I can not stand that float canceling dair nonsense she does when she steps on metaknights head then hits you with the fair of death if you jump. I don't play peaches often but I often have some degree of trouble when I play the olimar's friend. I don't know if its because the olimar player spoon feeds insight into my gameplay and play style since we play so much during matches!!!! Or if its because I don't know the match up as well as I should because of the lack of game play versus.

People with the same amout of jumps very anoying. i.e kirby the more I hit them out the more they just jump back with me. Or one less jump.

-------------Something my friend said.
My friend the olimar player told me this and I don't know if its true. He says " People that don't know how to deal with an aggressive mk player will lose to you". But anyone that can observe your movements and dodge accordingly beats you easy because you get too predictable. Sometimes you beat peopple only because you played more games than the person your playing and know the match up better but someone with equal knowledge and who is observant swats you like a fly".

So I am asking the community for advice . I want to improve in some situations I think that if I just grabbed the ledge stead of trying to take the person out into the darkness I would do better instead of laming them off. For example usually when I play mario's I just push them out two far but some times they suddenly up and I get staged spiked some how which is really annoying but then sometimes I fake like I am going to hit them again and grab the ledge and they just drop. I am looking more into it.

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Last big question should I be trying to use the dimensional cape to ledge grab / edguard people off. When they are trying to recover. LOL I did it one time successfully out of trying 5 in a game. haha It was priceless but every time I missed i usually went right off the stage. I usually just run forward and back to grab the ledge.

 

[brinboy789]

@ last question: the dimensional cape isnt necessary except for the sexy kill. for that, it is ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY

check the stickies, especially the guides

 

[l3lue2ain]

I have read alot of guides they feel like I am reading movesets but not actually how to improve my gameplay.

 

[8AngeL8]

Before you can be a good aggressive meta-knight, I think you should learn to be a good defensive meta-knight. Intentionally slow your play down and concentrate on exactly what moves you can do to counter various approaches. As you start to grow accustomed to the proper responses, speed your game up and start to take the game you your opponent. Eventually, spacing and proper countering will be second nature.

Olimar: You shouldn't really be getting hit by his smashes. You're way faster, and you can spot dodge any of his grounded smashes. You can use the tornado to approach, or short hop a Dair that comes at him diagonally, because he has good attacks horizontally and vertically. If he short hops back at you, switch it to a nair. Once he's off stage, don't try to edge hog, you should actually follow him and knock him away with fair/nair/dair, THEN go up to the ledge and hog it.

Falco: This match will be entirely about spacing. If you let Falco have it, you'll lose. Screw the lasers, get in his face and don't leave his side. Be so aggressive he won't be able to laser without getting punished. Tornado is less useful here because laser and reflector cancel it. Approach with dashgrabs or short hopped aerials, making sure you land behind him if he shields, because a grab will be painful. Do everything you can to force Falco to recover with his Up-B, because it's extremely gimpable.

Game and Watch requires a much more careful and defensive MK style. He's one of the few opponents that can wreck you in close combat, so you need to be slower and use appropriate counters. The turtle can get cancelled by either the tornado or a properly timed shuttle loop. His Up-B -> Down B combo can be tornado'd, or you can shield at the bottom and dsmash out of shield. Make sure you tech his grab, because you can't get out of the grab -> dsmash combo. Also, you won't be able to gimp GaW in the traditional sense. His recovery is just too good. The best thing to do is grab the edge, then let go and go below the stage, then use a shuttle loop to knock GaW away. You can also grab the edge so as to force GaW above the stage, then quickly drop down and shuttle loop up to hit him during his parachute.

Donkey Kong: Just be patient. If you charge in mindlessly, you'll get punished by his ridiculous range and grabs. Approach with tornado, and time your dsmash and aerials in the lag between DK's moves. With a bit of practice to familiarize yourself with DK's moves, this isn't a hard matchup.

Peach: I've yet to face a really, really good peach, so I can't speak much to this. I've always countered her floating attacks with a shuttle loop or tornado. Surprisingly, she can actually beat out your aerials sometimes, so use the superior range on your sword rather than getting in close and relying on your speed like you normally can.

 

[l3lue2ain]

Its crazy I was doing that today there is a mario player that I always usually two to three stock him easy. Its like I chase him almost cut off his air with just down right spamaging and out prioritizing him. When I slowed down to try to read him more deeply. the only thing that was consitant was me reading his rolls. He started to punish me for mistakes that I tihnk would have been covered by another quick attack. The end result was it was a close battle with us both being past 120%. I was forced to revert back to a spammers dream I guess to down right rush him to win. I felt highly unskilled.

Another thing about playing a defensive metaknight is I feel open. Ohh I forgot to say sometihng about the olimar that guy camps like a pro. This is exactly what happends its like he destroys my approach. We start off on oppisites sides of FD "Ready set Go!" ok so we are moving he has very good spacing he throws pickmin at me and keeps his distances if I try to approach with the dair I get chaingrabed really bad. Its like how did I just get 45 damage. there was one instance he took basically two damage and I was just being shocked and stunned and went straight to 85 damage. I was getting hit with all these rediclous up air crazy combos. if I grab the ledge he has the percsion down to spike me easily. one time I was approaching the ledge about to touch it and I still was spiked. He is not a regular olimar player. some say he is best olimar player in md but that is another story. but yea like i was saying its very hard to approach him because if I attack with a arial attack he chain grabs me or just grabs me. Its hard to approach him horizontally because of his spacing of the pikmin and grabs.

Falco - I find some of the things you say very diffrent way of looking at it . I am not sure how to properly tech the throw. It seems werid.

I beat crapy peaches but I did not know how much priority that fair peach had until I played a decent one .

 

[brinboy789]

Its crazy I was doing that today there is a mario player that I always usually two to three stock him easy. Its like I chase him almost cut off his air with just down right spamaging and out prioritizing him. When I slowed down to try to read him more deeply. the only thing that was consitant was me reading his rolls. He started to punish me for mistakes that I tihnk would have been covered by another quick attack. The end result was it was a close battle with us both being past 120%. I was forced to revert back to a spammers dream I guess to down right rush him to win. I felt highly unskilled.

Another thing about playing a defensive metaknight is I feel open. Ohh I forgot to say sometihng about the olimar that guy camps like a pro. This is exactly what happends its like he destroys my approach. We start off on oppisites sides of FD "Ready set Go!" ok so we are moving he has very good spacing he throws pickmin at me and keeps his distances if I try to approach with the dair I get chaingrabed really bad. Its like how did I just get 45 damage. there was one instance he took basically two damage and I was just being shocked and stunned and went straight to 85 damage. I was getting hit with all these rediclous up air crazy combos. if I grab the ledge he has the percsion down to spike me easily. one time I was approaching the ledge about to touch it and I still was spiked. He is not a regular olimar player. some say he is best olimar player in md but that is another story. but yea like i was saying its very hard to approach him because if I attack with a arial attack he chain grabs me or just grabs me. Its hard to approach him horizontally because of his spacing of the pikmin and grabs.

Falco - I find some of the things you say very diffrent way of looking at it . I am not sure how to properly tech the throw. It seems werid.

I beat crapy peaches but I did not know how much priority that fair peach had until I played a decent one .

MK's playstyle is generally offensive. you'll probably lose if you play defensely

 

[Skyflyer]

MK's playstyle is generally offensive. you'll probably lose if you play defensely

Against DK and Diddy playing offensively will get you *****.

Diddy can stop your approaches with banana spamming, and all of DK's moves have more range.

Other than that, offense is the best choice.

 

[8AngeL8]

I didn't mean always play defensively, I mean learn your spacing and counters by playing defensively, then speed it up and play aggressively once you've got it down.

 

[l3lue2ain]

Lol those bananas are a problem Its like when play campers that brings out problems to because defense gets owned and offense gets punished.