Official Dededestruction: D3 Research and Tech Thread

[Girthquake]

oh really? Well that even takes care of the hold shield option! Very interesting. If I were to lab this though and make videos and all that I would have to wait until like 2 weeks from now since I have AP testing going on for the next 2 weeks, and I will be very busy.

Next time Soul and I lab we'll check it out. We did sour nair stuff earlier but what you're talking about is def worth checking out.

 

[Flawed]

I found out the closest hitbox of jab one make the opponent fall from the battlefield platforms making them in a position where they have to tech

I mentioned that I'd try this out, and I really did. I REALLY did. I'm considering this 50% tested by me, I'll post more results, when I have another 2 players to try on. So lets start:

-I tested getting the jab on the platform on mario- simple, just be a little close to him and it works
-I moved on to a light character - jigglypuff- again simple, be a little close to him(her? jiggly is a girl i think)
-I moved to a heavy character - DK- harder to get it here, have to be closer than both mario and jiggs because he will just be hit by the normal hitbox.
-This is all pleasing information but now I had a pressing question: If this indeed works on everyone , what character specific traits would let them ignore it? Fall speed.
-I tested getting the jab on platform on fox, and again, simple just be close to him and it works, but I noticed that he falls far too fast to even attempt anything.
-So I then moved to D3 to try it on him, even harder to get than D3 and he once again falls far to fast to attempt anything.

Now that I have mastered the amazing DEX_ jab technology, I moved on to catching them with Dsmash.

-provided you are lightning fast, you can land + and hold dsmash for a little bit and catch both rolls because they are cornered and cannot roll offstage.
-This confirmed my thinking that this is similar to an oldschool brawl technique called the Buuman trap. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6o4v7-r10C8&ab_channel=JosephScola 1:03 for the example. Note that he gets it i basically the same spot on battlefield.
-So started practicing this and telling my training partner to roll at times he felt like rolling. Now heres the cool part. I hit with Dsmash 98 times out of 125 times. When I missed it was because I chose to release early because I felt like he would roll.
-I immediately claim technique as useful and continue researching.

Now it covers the rolls, but what about the neutral get up?

-Now as far as I know, back when I data mined and dug up frame data for my own knowledge that neutral getup was invincible
frame 1- 22 and lasted till frame 30. and thats the entire cast. I dont think kuroga has that data up yet anyhow.
- This immediately made it look challenging.
-We went for the same 125 tries
-Heres the issue. neutral get up is pretty good. mistime it for a bit and they perfect shield. too much of a guessing game for me.
59 out of 125 success.
- That doesn't mean its not useful- I'll take it as I'm not good enough- So i put on my headphones and put on my king d3 playlist of curbstomp music.

So what about getup attack?
-We had been doing this for a while now, and my partner was getting burned out.
-Agreed to call it quits for the day.


This setback didnt stop me, the quest for D3's food never ends

-Thus I went onto Facebook, and to the smash bros groups there, asked them " Who wants to body a admin"?
-Fought some players. I'll start with Pit. I know the matchup well, and I've just been practicing a new tech for a lot of hours, what could possibly go wrong?

1. It is EXTREMELY hard to get an opponent in that position.

a. Standing on the platform doesn't bait the opponent, it just makes them attack your shield repeatedly from underneath
b. Jumping on the platform while they are on there makes them shield, and thus jab becomes bad, regardless of position
c. Landing on the platform while they are there ensures that they can fall through and up air you . This doesnt sound too bad, D3 lives forever, but then t got me thinking, if that was ZSS who hit that up air, I would have lost that stock or took 60%+​

2. It is hard to do period- let alone under pressure- or on wifi

a. I played 9 people for a total of 5 hours. I am vastly more skilled that most of those players. I got on the platform 5 times successfully in multiple battlefield matches. 5 for 5 hours? not too awful

i. I messed up the jab got the good hit
ii. I froze up and ended up holding shield
iii. I got the jab. but didnt do anything afterword
iv. I got the jab. landed released a lucky dsmash, caught the roll out ( SUCCESS)
v. I got the jab. landed. got hit by getup attack.​

If another D3 player is available Eastern time, you should help me lab this more thoroughly.

 

[DEX_]

Woah, that's some serious talk there

I got that getting an opponent in that position was hard, and 5 times in 5 hours seems really difficult. Anyway i suppose it means that it is situational but not impossible... we should try to find good ways to create the opportunity for the setup

as i said on discord I was thinking about grounded fgordo when they are high in the air and waiting on the platform, but i suppose it wouldn't work, maybe we should try to do some kind of conditioning in order to make them stay on the platform...

 

[Lavani]

heya dededes

Still not entirely sure what determines whether or not Gordos stick to walls, but I do believe I've found where that information would be stored, along with some other Gordo info. I'll look into specifics more when I have time, but until then I'll drop the data and what I've figured out so far if anyone can expand on it in the interim.

This seems to mostly deal with the actual sideB input rather than being direct Gordo properties for the most part, but is still info people may be interested in:

 

[Flawed]

heya dededes

Still not entirely sure what determines whether or not Gordos stick to walls,/QUOTE]

this is apparently random

major bummer

 

[Girthquake]

heya dededes

Still not entirely sure what determines whether or not Gordos stick to walls, but I do believe I've found where that information would be stored, along with some other Gordo info. I'll look into specifics more when I have time, but until then I'll drop the data and what I've figured out so far if anyone can expand on it in the interim.

This seems to mostly deal with the actual sideB input rather than being direct Gordo properties for the most part, but is still info people may be interested in:

Bless your soul please keep this coming and keep translating for us. What we've learned from testing or at least what we've settled on is that the Gordo stick can only happen on a wall when you can wall jump off of it. Omega pacland you never get a stick ever but every where else it's about a 50/50 chance of getting the stick.

Would love to see this proven wrong though tbh

 

[Lavani]

Changed a bunch of parameters to 1, then changed a bunch of parameters to 0.

Line 0 is active frames.

One of the 3s (not line 4) is max number of bounces

Line 6 is gravity.

Line 8 is a horizontal speed multiplier applied after bounces. Line 9 is a vertical one.

Gordos always stuck to walls when I set things to 0 but never when I set things to 1. I reverted some of the 0 changes and sticking started to seem to be position dependent. Unsure what to make of this, can only confidently rule out lines 25/26 as unrelated.

 

[Girthquake]

Changed a bunch of parameters to 1, then changed a bunch of parameters to 0.

Line 0 is active frames.

Line 4 is max number of bounces

Line 6 is gravity.

Gordos always stuck to walls when I set things to 0 but never when I set things to 1. I reverted some of the 0 changes and sticking started to seem to be position dependent. Unsure what to make of this, can only confidently rule out lines 25/26 as unrelated.

edit: One or both of lines 8/9 are related to bounce height

I hate to ask stupid questions but what exactly do you mean by changing the parameters to 0?

 

[Lavani]

Setting lines 14, 17, and 29 to 0 with no other edits makes Gordos vanish instead of clinging to walls. Still capable of bouncing off walls, but they just disappear if they would've stuck instead. One of those must be a timer for how long Gordos will stay stuck to walls.

I hate to ask stupid questions but what exactly do you mean by changing the parameters to 0?

I mean actually editing the values for the lines and trying them in-game. For example, I know line 6 is gravity because editing it from 0.02 to 0 results in Gordos that don't fall.

 

[Girthquake]

Setting lines 14, 17, and 29 to 0 with no other edits makes Gordos vanish instead of clinging to walls. Still capable of bouncing off walls, but they just disappear if they would've stuck instead. One of those must be a timer for how long Gordos will stay stuck to walls.


I mean actually editing the values for the lines and trying them in-game. For example, I know line 6 is gravity because editing it from 0.02 to 0 results in Gordos that don't fall.

In our testing we found that once stuck the Gordo stays stuck for approx 3.5 seconds. Line 14 is most likely the line that determines the time that the Gordo stays stuck since 200 frames at 60 fps is just under 3.5 seconds

Edit: Something else to look into would be the Bouncing Gordo Custom the electric one since it seems to stick 100% of the time. Comparing data from that might give you a better idea on which lines are related to sticks. Just an idea.

 

[LoveSanctuary]

Yeah I've actually been practicing Extended dash dancing with DDD as well as Perfect Pivot. I was really bad at PP but dash dancing I can't quite get with DDD. I can do it with Lil mac and C.Falcon (I personally think it easy to do on them) but DDD its really hard to get the rhythm. Not sure if extended dash will help him but I wanna at least try to learn it. As for PP I can do it in one direction lol. I'm still trying to work the muscle memory into doing combos with it. So far just by the look of it PP might help DDD a little.

Also I've been playing around with Nair and some other stuff and found some interesting things. I'll post a video soon. I finally got my capture card! Also even though I don't think online is the best option to test is anyone here willing to help me lab? I feel kinda useless trying this stuff in Training mode (I mean as far as confirmation) and no follow DDD to help me out.

I think anything is worth trying for dah DDD

 

[ExiaPilotDedede]

Hey guys, two interesting things that I've found in the past week of playing:
1. Gordo shielding for ledge recovery.
This one is pretty simple, and it's a good mix up for high recoveries when you are high on the %. Simply drop a U-Godro, then DI into it, or just behind it. I'm not sure if this makes you any safer against long range attacks since if they hit the gordo, you are boned, but I find that it helps keep characters like fox off of me since their moves require them to be too close. It also works a bit with intimidation to keep some less experienced players away.

2. Jump to cancel some hitsun.
One of Dedede's main issues is his terrible ending lag, which is twice as bad if you land in hitstun, I've recently found myself mashing jump when I'm hit horizontally, and it SEEMS like the landing lag is lessened. This might be placebo, but I believe you can get out of hitstun faster by jumping.

I haven't labbed either of these yet, but I might try to this weekend, if anyone else has some time and wants to play around with these ideas, let me know what you find

 

[Muskrat Catcher]

Hey guys, two interesting things that I've found in the past week of playing:
1. Gordo shielding for ledge recovery.
This one is pretty simple, and it's a good mix up for high recoveries when you are high on the %. Simply drop a U-Godro, then DI into it, or just behind it. I'm not sure if this makes you any safer against long range attacks since if they hit the gordo, you are boned, but I find that it helps keep characters like fox off of me since their moves require them to be too close. It also works a bit with intimidation to keep some less experienced players away.

2. Jump to cancel some hitsun.
One of Dedede's main issues is his terrible ending lag, which is twice as bad if you land in hitstun, I've recently found myself mashing jump when I'm hit horizontally, and it SEEMS like the landing lag is lessened. This might be placebo, but I believe you can get out of hitstun faster by jumping.

I haven't labbed either of these yet, but I might try to this weekend, if anyone else has some time and wants to play around with these ideas, let me know what you find

For the first idea, I do frequently do that, but I don't like to stay right next to it unless I am landing from above the stage, but when I am offstage I like to hit a gordo directly at the ledge, so that it can either distract the opponent from edgeguarding, stick to the ledge for better protection, or directly hit the opponent. Sometimes, the opponent is even hit towards you, in which case a Bair to catch them can kill REALLY early and turn entire games immediately. I wouldn't recommend being right next to it when offstage though.

As for the second, no, jumping does not cancel hitstun, you can do any other action by the time you can jump. In fact, jumping out of hitstun is not recommended since it actually causes Dedede to die earlier since his hitbox expands greatly, and can touch the blastzone earlier than if you simply do nothing and DI towards the stage. We are the only character in the game that dies earlier when jumping out of hitstun than when doing nothing.

 

[ExiaPilotDedede]

As for the second, no, jumping does not cancel hitstun, you can do any other action by the time you can jump. In fact, jumping out of hitstun is not recommended since it actually causes Dedede to die earlier since his hitbox expands greatly, and can touch the blastzone earlier than if you simply do nothing and DI towards the stage. We are the only character in the game that dies earlier when jumping out of hitstun than when doing nothing.

I'm only talking about doing this at low percent when Dedede is still over the stage. If you take no action the hitstun still ends, but you are still in the "hit" animation which seems to have more landing lag than a normal landing (could just be placebo for me), so taking an action just before landing is beneficial. Since none of our moves really auto cancel well, the best option is to go for a jump which will reset your state so you can land normally. I'll see if I can grab a video of what I'm talking about tonight.

 

[The Royal Gardener]

Hi, guys! This thread hasn't seen much action in a while, so I thought I would come up with something to talk about. It's nothing too special, but worth noting. So recently, I found that we can make some good use of the ducks on the Duck Hunt stage! More specifically, we can use them as a change-up for our Gordo Toss. Essentially, hitting a duck may catch the opponent off-guard, as well as buys a little more time to close in on them.

Additionally, you can make good use of the Duck Hunt Dog when he pops up out of the grass, since the top of his head is a platform. All you need to do here is hit all the ducks on the stage and stand under the last one to fall. Have your timing and positioning right, and you can avoid a good number of attacks. Or, for example, let's say that your opponent is descending towards you just after you hit the last duck. The dog pops up, closing distance between you and them fast while you have an up-smash or up-tilt prepared to get that easy fatal blow.

I have no means of recording this, but I encourage you to give it a try for yourselves. It makes things more interesting during your fights on this stage. Let me know what you think of this! I hope you find it helpful!

 

[ThePounder]

Not really sure where to put it, but I discovered a new combo today for Dedede, it's pretty much the culmination and best version thus far of all my work regarding the character, it's just difficult to pull off.
It's one of the most damaging, near inescapable (When done quickly and correctly) combo strings I've ever come across. As most higher level Dedede players know, you can grab your opponent the moment a tossed Gordo contacts (and damages) them, that much works at ALL percentages for easy damage, which you can then throw the opponent into for extra damage. This combo works off of that.

The process:
1. Finding yourself in any situation where you find yourself close enough or in a position to drop the up variation Gordo onto the opponent. (Others are untested for this, but probably work to the same extent, the up variation is the easiest to land.)
2. Dash in and grab your opponent on Gordo contact, it's hit or miss and difficult to time properly until versed.
3. If done at the fastest speed possible, this will set the rebounding Gordo in the perfect position for a forward throw, with no time for a pummel, not that it's necessary damage anyway. If done correctly, the second Gordo hit will knock your opponent above Dedede, into shorthop territory.
4. The final step is to shorthop IMMEDIATELY into up air, given proper timing, it will land every single hit and you'll end up with 45% of practically inescapable damage that you can then follow up with whatever you want, as the opponent will always end up behind Dedede.
(EDIT: FOUND A BETTER OF DOING IT. BACK AIR WORKS MORE OFTEN AND IS A FAR EASIER HIT ON SMALLER CHARACTERS, LEADING TO 49%, Sakurai why. )

It's not a kill combo, but puts them a hit or two away from killing range for the penguin, which I find amazing.This is my favorite string for Dedede so far as, EVEN IF YOU MESS UP, you're still getting 22-33% or so. I love sharing combos for the big guy, and have been working on several different versions of this particular one for the longest while now, I really wanna get this one out there as it's both a show of skill and timing instead of demonstration of one's ability to spam aerials, up tilts, or side b's, as well as an intimidation tactic. Feedback, variations, and others combos are welcome in replies.
All hail Dedede.

 

[The Royal Gardener]

Not really sure where to put it, but I discovered a new combo today for Dedede, it's pretty much the culmination and best version thus far of all my work regarding the character, it's just difficult to pull off.
It's one of the most damaging, near inescapable (When done quickly and correctly) combo strings I've ever come across. As most higher level Dedede players know, you can grab your opponent the moment a tossed Gordo contacts (and damages) them, that much works at ALL percentages for easy damage, which you can then throw the opponent into for extra damage. This combo works off of that.

The process:
1. Finding yourself in any situation where you find yourself close enough or in a position to drop the up variation Gordo onto the opponent. (Others are untested for this, but probably work to the same extent, the up variation is the easiest to land.)
2. Dash in and grab your opponent on Gordo contact, it's hit or miss and difficult to time properly until versed.
3. If done at the fastest speed possible, this will set the rebounding Gordo in the perfect position for a forward throw, with no time for a pummel, not that it's necessary damage anyway. If done correctly, the second Gordo hit will knock your opponent above Dedede, into shorthop territory.
4. The final step is to shorthop IMMEDIATELY into up air, given proper timing, it will land every single hit and you'll end up with 45% of practically inescapable damage that you can then follow up with whatever you want, as the opponent will always end up behind Dedede.

It's not a kill combo, but puts them a hit or two away from killing range for the penguin, which I find amazing. I love sharing combos for the big guy, and have been working on several different versions of this particular one for the longest while now, I really wanna get this one out there as it's both a show of skill and timing instead of demonstration of one's ability to spam aerials, up tilts, or side b's, as well as an intimidation tactic. Feedback and others combos are welcome in replies.
All hail Dedede.

Awesome! I'll have to try that one out. I've been meaning to work on my Gordo grabs anyway, so this will be a nice addition to that. Thanks for the advice!

 

[ThePounder]

Awesome! I'll have to try that one out. I've been meaning to work on my Gordo grabs anyway, so this will be a nice addition to that. Thanks for the advice!

It's a beast of a combo, the proper timing will take a bit getting used to, but as far as I can tell, the opponent can't really DI to save themselves, also, if you didn't see my most recent edit to the first post, exchanging the up air for a back air nets you 49% and is even easier to land... Can you believe that people have said Dedede has no combos? I still don't understand how he's so low on the tierlists, I know his flaws, as does everyone, but he's just a monster and deserves well higher. I honestly think him and DK are the best heavyweights.

 

[ThePounder]

I'm devoting a lot of time to that combo and its variations. The working percentage for it until where opponent DI makes it possible to escape and not hope for the followup aerial is about 30%. Past 35% and the knockback is too strong to guarantee the final hit regardless of what you do. A Fair is possible, but unlikely and not worth the effort. The first three steps of the combo work at all percentages thankfully, still netting 33% damage so long as done properly. The highest damage output depends on which side of your opponent that you drop the Gordo, it HAS to be on their back or back-middle, essentially, because if in the front-middle or front, the Gordo deflection is different, bouncing towards Dedede instead of away or staying in place, but how it deflects after damaging is the same at all percentages in each of the ways that you do it.

Dropping one on the front to front-middle of the opponent sets it up for a back throw, but the second Gordo hit knocks them in the starting direction, making followups difficult but guaranteeing 28%. All ways set up good damage amounts, but the best so far is still the back-middle, back parts of your opponents hurtbox.

 

[Girthquake]

Not really sure where to put it, but I discovered a new combo today for Dedede, it's pretty much the culmination and best version thus far of all my work regarding the character, it's just difficult to pull off.
It's one of the most damaging, near inescapable (When done quickly and correctly) combo strings I've ever come across. As most higher level Dedede players know, you can grab your opponent the moment a tossed Gordo contacts (and damages) them, that much works at ALL percentages for easy damage, which you can then throw the opponent into for extra damage. This combo works off of that.

The process:
1. Finding yourself in any situation where you find yourself close enough or in a position to drop the up variation Gordo onto the opponent. (Others are untested for this, but probably work to the same extent, the up variation is the easiest to land.)
2. Dash in and grab your opponent on Gordo contact, it's hit or miss and difficult to time properly until versed.
3. If done at the fastest speed possible, this will set the rebounding Gordo in the perfect position for a forward throw, with no time for a pummel, not that it's necessary damage anyway. If done correctly, the second Gordo hit will knock your opponent above Dedede, into shorthop territory.
4. The final step is to shorthop IMMEDIATELY into up air, given proper timing, it will land every single hit and you'll end up with 45% of practically inescapable damage that you can then follow up with whatever you want, as the opponent will always end up behind Dedede.
(EDIT: FOUND A BETTER OF DOING IT. BACK AIR WORKS MORE OFTEN AND IS A FAR EASIER HIT ON SMALLER CHARACTERS, LEADING TO 49%, Sakurai why. )

It's not a kill combo, but puts them a hit or two away from killing range for the penguin, which I find amazing.This is my favorite string for Dedede so far as, EVEN IF YOU MESS UP, you're still getting 22-33% or so. I love sharing combos for the big guy, and have been working on several different versions of this particular one for the longest while now, I really wanna get this one out there as it's both a show of skill and timing instead of demonstration of one's ability to spam aerials, up tilts, or side b's, as well as an intimidation tactic. Feedback, variations, and others combos are welcome in replies.
All hail Dedede.

You didn't discover this this was discussed in one of the first large posts in this thread.

 

[ThePounder]

You didn't discover this this was discussed in one of the first large posts in this thread.

Was it? I've never come onto here before, thought it was a good thing to share. Just wanted to be helpful.

 

[Girthquake]

Was it? I've never come onto here before, thought it was a good thing to share. Just wanted to be helpful.

We appreciate your enthusiasm and attitude towards trying to help in anyway, but before posting read what's already been posted.

 

[ThePounder]

So much for that then. Spent months working on it only to discover sharing it here was pointless. I mean, woo for others figuring stuff like that out, I just haven't seen anyone do stuff like it before.

 

[Flawed]

Eh, D3's have been doing that since week 2 of the game. Gordo toss into grab into second bounce gordo etc.

multiple variations (gordo upthrow, bair etc), possible to DI yes, problem is its a situational mess. but keep trying to find new stuff

 

[Eddie The Pacifist]

Not really sure where to put it, but I discovered a new combo today for Dedede, it's pretty much the culmination and best version thus far of all my work regarding the character, it's just difficult to pull off.
It's one of the most damaging, near inescapable (When done quickly and correctly) combo strings I've ever come across. As most higher level Dedede players know, you can grab your opponent the moment a tossed Gordo contacts (and damages) them, that much works at ALL percentages for easy damage, which you can then throw the opponent into for extra damage. This combo works off of that.

The process:
1. Finding yourself in any situation where you find yourself close enough or in a position to drop the up variation Gordo onto the opponent. (Others are untested for this, but probably work to the same extent, the up variation is the easiest to land.)
2. Dash in and grab your opponent on Gordo contact, it's hit or miss and difficult to time properly until versed.
3. If done at the fastest speed possible, this will set the rebounding Gordo in the perfect position for a forward throw, with no time for a pummel, not that it's necessary damage anyway. If done correctly, the second Gordo hit will knock your opponent above Dedede, into shorthop territory.
4. The final step is to shorthop IMMEDIATELY into up air, given proper timing, it will land every single hit and you'll end up with 45% of practically inescapable damage that you can then follow up with whatever you want, as the opponent will always end up behind Dedede.
(EDIT: FOUND A BETTER OF DOING IT. BACK AIR WORKS MORE OFTEN AND IS A FAR EASIER HIT ON SMALLER CHARACTERS, LEADING TO 49%, Sakurai why. )

It's not a kill combo, but puts them a hit or two away from killing range for the penguin, which I find amazing.This is my favorite string for Dedede so far as, EVEN IF YOU MESS UP, you're still getting 22-33% or so. I love sharing combos for the big guy, and have been working on several different versions of this particular one for the longest while now, I really wanna get this one out there as it's both a show of skill and timing instead of demonstration of one's ability to spam aerials, up tilts, or side b's, as well as an intimidation tactic. Feedback, variations, and others combos are welcome in replies.
All hail Dedede.

Stuff like this explains why Gordo isn't bad.
Unfortunately as stated, this was posted before. If you aren't intrigued to read, I'll tell you that Down Tilt is as good as Forward Throw, sometimes better

 

[GuardianOfTheLedge]

Hi, I think I finally might have something for the D3 meta. Please forgive me if this has already been mentioned as I haven't been following this thread until now.

Here is a clip of a set I had a few days ago at my nearest weekly: https://youtu.be/Ej6_q2N4-ik?t=1m10s (Starts at 1:10 and there is no need to watch past 1:20).

So what I want to bring attention to is the gordo that killed fox while I was recovering. I'm sure that almost all of us have caused or fallen victim to to that at least once in the past. But has anyone ever labbed this? Now after that set I am curious to see if anyone can do this with consistancy. Also, what does it take to make this consistant? Is it just the timing? Or is there something to make this more complicated than that?

And here's everything I think I know about this:
1- I think that was a F-smashed gordo.
2- The first hit appeared to be just the hammer and not gordo.
3- This shouldn't work vs characters with good horizontal range on their arials like Samus or Cloud.
4- If it doesn't kill It would likely set up for a good edge guard.

Disclaimer: I am aware that in Soul Train's awesome Dedede guide (found here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnqJZdIjGsk). He demonstrates how to use side-b to hit shield with the hammer so the opponent gets hit by gordo. Though the differences are slight. I am focusing on doing this in the air to catch an opponents approach and take their stock. I feel as though since the setup and end results are different, this tech is different too.

 

[Soul Train]

But has anyone ever labbed this? Now after that set I am curious to see if anyone can do this with consistancy. Also, what does it take to make this consistant? Is it just the timing? Or is there something to make this more complicated than that?

Thanks for the post! Good to have people thinking. To answer your questions: yep, I actually spent some hours labbing exactly this, just never got around to officially posting it. So the question is: when does the hammer impact hit true combo into Gordo?

The hammer hit is on frame 29. That's crazy slow; for timing's sake keep that in mind. On the ground, you can usually get a Uair followup, sometimes a Bair. Here are the %s it works by Gordo throw type.

• 23-48%: Dtilt Gordo (bounces off far side after 49-55%)
• 41-60%: Dsmash Gordo
• Utilt Gordo: everything past 26% (no triangle)
• Usmash Gordo: like, never
• Ftilt Gordo: 52-68% (harder to get last few %s)
• Fsmash Gordo: 81%-82% (true kill combo with UAir lol)

This does NOT account for DI, and these %s are only from the ground. The big tldr; use Dgordo if you want to actually go for the two hits, on ground or air.

 

[GuardianOfTheLedge]

Thanks for the post! Good to have people thinking. To answer your questions: yep, I actually spent some hours labbing exactly this, just never got around to officially posting it. So the question is: when does the hammer impact hit true combo into Gordo?

The hammer hit is on frame 29. That's crazy slow; for timing's sake keep that in mind. On the ground, you can usually get a Uair followup, sometimes a Bair. Here are the %s it works by Gordo throw type.

• 23-48%: Dtilt Gordo (bounces off far side after 49-55%)
• 41-60%: Dsmash Gordo
• Utilt Gordo: everything past 26% (no triangle)
• Usmash Gordo: like, never
• Ftilt Gordo: 52-68% (harder to get last few %s)
• Fsmash Gordo: 81%-82% (true kill combo with UAir lol)

This does NOT account for DI, and these %s are only from the ground. The big tldr; use Dgordo if you want to actually go for the two hits, on ground or air.

Cool, sorry I took so long to respond. This is really cool stuff. I have tried to work it into my play and I have been able to take a few stocks from it. But That 29 frame startup on the hammer makes that pretty inconsistant; I have to really luck out to land it. I'll keep those numbers in mind. And thanks for all that info.

 

[Grandpoobah]

I believe that Dedede still has his jab infinite. It might no longer be an infinite, but it still works for me when I do it 3-5 times in a row.

 

[ExiaPilotDedede]

I believe that Dedede still has his jab infinite. It might no longer be an infinite, but it still works for me when I do it 3-5 times in a row.

Only if the other player makes no other inputs. It can be shielded, dodged out of or just DIed out of. It's easy to do on people who don't know, but I think any move that is <4 frames beats it. Mario can even stick a jab in there.

 

[Grandpoobah]

But it still can work.

 

[brostulip]

Not really sure where to put it, but I discovered a new combo today for Dedede, it's pretty much the culmination and best version thus far of all my work regarding the character, it's just difficult to pull off.
It's one of the most damaging, near inescapable (When done quickly and correctly) combo strings I've ever come across. As most higher level Dedede players know, you can grab your opponent the moment a tossed Gordo contacts (and damages) them, that much works at ALL percentages for easy damage, which you can then throw the opponent into for extra damage. This combo works off of that.

The process:
1. Finding yourself in any situation where you find yourself close enough or in a position to drop the up variation Gordo onto the opponent. (Others are untested for this, but probably work to the same extent, the up variation is the easiest to land.)
2. Dash in and grab your opponent on Gordo contact, it's hit or miss and difficult to time properly until versed.
3. If done at the fastest speed possible, this will set the rebounding Gordo in the perfect position for a forward throw, with no time for a pummel, not that it's necessary damage anyway. If done correctly, the second Gordo hit will knock your opponent above Dedede, into shorthop territory.
4. The final step is to shorthop IMMEDIATELY into up air, given proper timing, it will land every single hit and you'll end up with 45% of practically inescapable damage that you can then follow up with whatever you want, as the opponent will always end up behind Dedede.
(EDIT: FOUND A BETTER OF DOING IT. BACK AIR WORKS MORE OFTEN AND IS A FAR EASIER HIT ON SMALLER CHARACTERS, LEADING TO 49%, Sakurai why. )

It's not a kill combo, but puts them a hit or two away from killing range for the penguin, which I find amazing.This is my favorite string for Dedede so far as, EVEN IF YOU MESS UP, you're still getting 22-33% or so. I love sharing combos for the big guy, and have been working on several different versions of this particular one for the longest while now, I really wanna get this one out there as it's both a show of skill and timing instead of demonstration of one's ability to spam aerials, up tilts, or side b's, as well as an intimidation tactic. Feedback, variations, and others combos are welcome in replies.
All hail Dedede.

Good to know! Will be trying this out.

 

[Soul Train]

But it still can work.

No. "It can work" is exactly the mentality we strive to avoid here. Many of us have put immense amounts of time and effort testing all kinds of ideas, to be 100% they work or are competitively usable. I know it's not intended this way, but in light of that timeinvestment, "facts" like the above can feel like a slap in the face. Of course, it's great if you want to play casually and have fun. But spreading untested and non-competitive advice in the research thread? That's just not considerate. We'd love to have more people contributing here, but please just do so understanding the standard and effort in the previous work done.

Good to know! Will be trying this out.

Please at least check out the documented walkthroughs/research we have on this, on the very first page of this thread. As several others have said, Gordo ricochets are nothing new, we've been doing them since 3DS days.
Here I'll be nice and give the link.

https://smashboards.com/threads/dededestruction-d3-research-and-tech-thread.427058/

I love that new people are finding this thread - but for the love of all that is holy, please go through that master compilation post before typing out your revolutionary new tech. I keep it updated for a reason.

 

[Grandpoobah]

Thank you Soul Train, for helping me realize my mistake. I will do my best to try to not do this again. Although I am new, I wanted to help out the best I can, and I am sorry for wasting your time.

 

[Soul Train]

Thank you Soul Train, for helping me realize my mistake. I will do my best to try to not do this again. Although I am new, I wanted to help out the best I can, and I am sorry for wasting your time.

Hah it's never a waste of time to help people get into the King! Apologies if anything seemed harsh, we very much welcome you here

Also I've been hanging onto some data, for no real reason. ExiaPilotDedede was right to tell me to drop this here, because no it's not easily found and it should be.

King Dedede Kill %s: (all done on Mario from the center of FD, with no DI)

Normals:

• Jab Finisher: 165%
• Ftilt: 204%
• Dtilt: 196%
• Utilt: 151%
• Dash Attack: 93%

Aerials

• Nair: 147%
• Fair: 172%
• Bair: 118%
• Uair: 124% (mario at fullhop height)
• Dair: 117%

Smashes

• Fsmash: 68%
• Dsmash: 118%
• Usmash: 110%

Throws

• Fthrow: 266%
• Bthrow: 194%
• Dthrow: 220%
• Uthrow: 246%

Specials

• Gordo: 154% (no bounce)
• Jet Hammer: 151%-67%, non-to-fully charged. If you hit JUST before full charge, kills sooner. Needs further testing.
• UpB: both bury and landing hits ~160%, landing hit only ~130%, spike hit only ~140%
• Inhale: can’t kill lol

Fun notes: Dair is our strongest aerial, our throws REALLY suck for a heavy, and I will continually work to find applications for Jet Hammer. Currently using it as a jumpoff edgeguard, airdodge bait punish is the fav.

 

[Melon launcher]

Hey! New to smash boards but I think I have a frame perfect tech for dedede. I call it a gordo counter. If you get close to an opponent and throw a gordo at just the right time, if your opponent attacks gordo, it will take the hit and then fly into your foes face. More testing needed. Only works if attack hits gordo on the half facing away from dedede. Any closer and the attack plus gordo hits u. Any farther and only gordo hits u. Again, this requires frame perfection but if it can be performed comsistently... I shudder at the thought. Practice in 1/4 time in training mode in order to get the timing down. Mario is best to practice against. Apologies for any grammatical errors or I'm breaking any rules with this post but I think people need to know.
Edit!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_BToDkGJg28
First 10 seconds of this montage, where both Gordos fly at villager is exactly what I'm talking about.
He even does it a SECOND time against Samus' missile.

The practical application for this would probably be against projectile users such as link or Samus since you would have more time to react than to a normal attack. Gordo actualy moves extremely fast after the counter and could be an excellent tool for long range sniping.

 

[Soul Train]

Hey! New to smash boards but I think I have a frame perfect tech for dedede. I call it a gordo counter. If you get close to an opponent and throw a gordo at just the right time, if your opponent attacks gordo, it will take the hit and then fly into your foes face. More testing needed. Only works if attack hits gordo on the half facing away from dedede. Any closer and the attack plus gordo hits u. Any farther and only gordo hits u. Again, this requires frame perfection but if it can be performed comsistently... I shudder at the thought. Practice in 1/4 time in training mode in order to get the timing down. Mario is best to practice against. Apologies for any grammatical errors or I'm breaking any rules with this post but I think people need to know.
Edit!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_BToDkGJg28
First 10 seconds of this montage, where both Gordos fly at villager is exactly what I'm talking about.
He even does it a SECOND time against Samus' missile.

The practical application for this would probably be against projectile users such as link or Samus since you would have more time to react than to a normal attack. Gordo actualy moves extremely fast after the counter and could be an excellent tool for long range sniping.

Welcome to the boards! And thanks for the effort to push the King, we always appreciate it. However this "tech" was known almost day 1, when the game came out. It's a thing, but definitely not as practical in competitive play; more often than not it just costs you stage placement and 10-14%. If you haven't already, watch some of the Gordo videos posted on page 1 of this thread, they might help!

Also, you should join us on the group Discord, you can access almost any of the main D3 player live there.

 

[Melon launcher]

Aww. Oh well, thanx for the info man. Hope to keep trying for something new. Will definetly join discord.

 

[Eddie The Pacifist]

This is an interesting mechanic.
I wonder why it was programmed to make a character unable to fall through platforms in their 2nd, 3rd 4th jump etc

 

[GolbezD3]

Hi everyone! I´m new here. I was practicing dance dashing and instant edge-grab with D3 and I realized how difficult it is to input but I want to know if you know some combos using one or both of these techniques.