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Critique my scrubby up-and-coming Fox pretty pls?

JNova

Smash Rookie
Joined
Oct 27, 2014
Messages
16
Location
Fox
Yo, sup
I'm a pretty bad Fox aswell, so I try my best, from what I can see.

To the peach video, I saw that you nair peach at low% and was already done with that. Basically shine, run-up shine, drill shine or grabs is what you want to do mostly in this match-up. If Peach is in the the air, harass her with bairs or uairs. Try to dash dance her to bair her float-approaches or dash-attack. (you can greatly combinate this with your decent laser game )If you see yourself in the corner doing that, you can Full-Hop around and regain Center Stage or get to the Top Platform. Peach has a hard time gaining height.


As for me, I was more interested in how you approached the Fox Ditto.

Basically, Punish Game.
If you grab the Fox, he should die. That's basically the rule. Of course it's rough keeping the flow-chart and control doing those combos and tech-chase if you are still in this, what I call Neutral-Game nervousness. You get the grab and get like all excited and your thoughts are all clouded, not focusing what you should do.
I'm pretty sure, you know what to do from a grab.

If you look at the match, you can see, that you get him a couple of times and mess up, whereas your opponent gets nice dmg+good positioning for possible follow-ups+edgeguard situation from his combos. That's how I would sum-up this set all together: His punish game was better.

What I try to do is everytime I get the grab, I pummel him at least 1 time and look at the percentage(sometimes the color of the %number already helps) and the positioning.
If you have done that you would be like "hm he is at 15%, maybe I shouldn't up-tilt him. Ok! rather go for up-smash or chaingrab"

Covering Ledge-Options
Another part of the Punish Game is, how to cover ledge-options of your opponent.
When your opponent is at the ledge you start to dash-dance around even up to the point where you are at the Center Stage, where you shouldn't be.
If your opponent is at the ledge, you want to position yourself to roughly one wavedash-length away from the ledge and facing your back to the opponent.
This position alone covers so many options your opponent can do. Furthermore, you can react on everything he can do and punish accordlingy.

If you already know that, try practicing to position yourself as fast as possible.

If you want, I can go to more detail on how to cover ledge-options.


Few notes to the Neutral Game
Your neutral game was solid. Dash Dance, Nair, Shieldpressure, not too much Full Hoping alround. That all was alright.

Try to do run-up shine. This **** works wonders and is easily one of Fox's best tool in the neutral game. Especially in those cases where both Foxes are dashdancing around. If you get Fox with run-up shine near the ledge, he is either at the ledge or just falls from the stage (DI dependent).
From what I noticed, you DON'T want to nair Fox at low%. Never works on good Foxes. Especially if both are Dash-Dancing around. The good opponent will always wait longer than you, and then grab your out of your Nair, if not just Crouch Cancel Shine your at low%.

A better approach to this dash-dancing problem is to force him to the ledge and Nair only, so you land at the end of the ledge. If you feel pressured, camp on platform or do run-up shield (look at what he does) and wavedash back OoS.

Of course you can start SHDL if both are dash dancing, force him to come to you and counter his approaches. It depends on how you want to play: Active or Passiv
_________________________________________________________

I hope this is kinda helpful. I'm sry, if I am not clear enough on some things, but I don't want to write a whole essay about this. I could probably write so much more stuff about the neutral game, but getting your punish game down, gets you way more confidence in Neutral than any advice can imo.

And of course, why not ask your opponent for advice. These guys know you better than we do and can help you improve much better, by showing stuff in the game itself. The brain remembers pictures better than some written text can do.
 
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Heero Yuy

#sweg
Joined
Jan 27, 2013
Messages
945
Location
In your closet
Yo, sup
I hope this is kinda helpful. I'm sry, if I am not clear enough on some things, but I don't want to write a whole essay about this. I could probably write so much more stuff about the neutral game, but getting your punish game down, gets you way more confidence in Neutral than any advice can imo.

And of course, why not ask your opponent for advice. These guys know you better than we do and can help you improve much better, by showing stuff in the game itself. The brain remembers pictures better than some written text can do.
Nah, you did fine. Thanks so much man!

Fortune did give me a little advice that I commit too much, which is true tbh. He was winning his neutral a lot as a result of my whiffed Bairs/Nairs and I would get pummeled. I'll study my videos again later with your notes on the side.
 
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JNova

Smash Rookie
Joined
Oct 27, 2014
Messages
16
Location
Fox
Nah, you did fine. Thanks so much man!

Fortune did give me a little advice that I commit too much, which is true tbh. He was winning his neutral a lot as a result of my whiffed Bairs/Nairs and I would get pummeled. I'll study my videos again later with your notes on the side.
Sure thing.
Pls post on what you think you could improve on or general ideas on how to approach this Match-Up. Hopefully I can learn something aswell. Would be really helpful :)
 
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Jim Morrison

Smash Authority
Joined
Aug 28, 2008
Messages
15,287
Location
The Netherlands
I'll point out some more specific situations and hope you will REALLY think about what actually happened there and why it was bad.


0:21 - You're sent WAY up high after the first U-air and manage to SDI the second and not die. What happens is you JUMP? There is literally no use in jumping since you only take that option away from yourself later. I understand it's most likely a missed input from the smash DI but this is a vital mistake, you'll see what happens after. The other Fox is now grounded and you're without a double jump weaving towards the platform doing a way way too early B-air. What happened here? Here's your answer: You most definitely weren't looking at your opponent. You were still looking at yourself after the U-air and didn't redirect your attention back to him. You just expect him to jump up but no way could he reach you. You do the way too early B-air, he sees this, punishes your landing lag, gets the edgeguard, kills you for it.

This is actually a situation that is a very telling difference between low level players and medium level players. Try to figure out what happened.


0:42 - A very bad N-air. This is the one you see getting punished, but since the beginning of the match, there have been 7 instances of bad N-airs that should have been punished, if your opponent were a bit better at dash dance spacing and pivot grab (0:02, 0:05, 0:10 even though it hit, 0:12, 0:17 (this is the biggest violator of a bad nair), 0:35, 0:42). Do you see how often you actually come in with a N-air that was bad. You really have to sit down with the game and a willing opponent and think about what Fox can do to approach his opponent. Your crutch has been N-airing in as soon as possible, no dashdancing, run up shine, wavedash back, etc. Watch high level Foxes and how they approach.

I actually want you to avoid N-airing as an approach in the coming few friendlies you play to see how reliant you are on it and what you can do as an alternative approach. Not to say you should never N-air, but break this habit NOW.


0:53 - You actually haven't hit a single tech and this dude has given you the BUSINESS for it. It's soooo important to learn how to tech especially as Fox, you really have to dedicate time to learning how to tech. You have to get a feeling for when you have to tech. It cost you a stock (actually the first one could also be avoided with teching).


Nothing to say about the third stock, it's basically just a tech skill execution error that got you bopped.


1:32 - An example of a good N-air and especially the buildup. Notice how he got impatient when you dash-danced, N-aired in and then just did a braindead shine after it for no reason? This is what happens everytime you get punished for it. Your N-air on it was a good, because it shows you have the awareness of your opponents doing this bad stuff, now you have to fix it yourself.


1:36 - This was just you being too slow and non-committal on your read. I'm pretty sure you knew he was just going to drill off the ledge, but you were too slow on punishing. What could you have done? Just a small sample: Instead of a wavedash a quick dash dance into grab, jump to platform, drop down with back-air, shield stop back, u-smash to trade it, wait for his spotdodge and punish that, etc.


Fourth stock, bad N-airs should have already costed you the stock since you did about 4 of them, but he didn't capitalize. Instead you just choke hard LOL


2:40 - After the down-tilt, this was a perfect opportunity to just respect their tech. Wait for it and see where he goes. If you just stand still here you can follow all his tech options on reaction and just punish it. Instead you commit to a run for no reason.


2:42 - What's even worse, is after you don't respect him teching, you still try to punish it. I know you know that it was too late to punish, but you still went for it. This is one of the worst rookie mistakes, going for punishes AFTER the fact. This is how spotdodge shine works, how people can roll out, how you get B-aired off-stage and die for it.


3:18 - Here it's your turn to just drill on the stage but he does the correct thing and punishes you with the u-tilt and should have killed you for it. Good on him, you should get out of the habit of drilling on-stage whenever he's just in the right position to maybe hit.


3:27 - This time a full-hop N-air, these can be equally bad, especially this one because it's easily shield grabbed. Dead.


3:35 - This missed edgeguard is really just your lack of expierence in edgeguarding. Try to work more on positioning when edgeguarding. My general rule of thumb for edgeguarding vs spacies - Never face towards them. You always want to have your back-air available.


3:49 - I'm not sure if this was messed up by you or very clever, but it was a good approach. It's you going in and weaving out while he's shielding, expecting you to hit him. He gets antsy and up-smashes.


This should definitely be enough for now.


Don't think of trying to improve everything at once. Your biggest crutch at the moment is the N-air approaching ****ing you up. Think of other ways to get in. You should first try to improve on that or teching correctly.


What a user above me said were mostly offensive options, like neutral and punish game and edgeguarding, but I think the most important thing for new players is to first learn the defensive options, because if you get completely destroyed when you get touched, it doesn't matter how good your tech skill is or how well you play your neutral. Offensive is easier to practice when you have more chances at survival.

Defensive options include DI, smash DI, teching, recovery, shield options. Take something and work on that specifically during a session.
 
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Heero Yuy

#sweg
Joined
Jan 27, 2013
Messages
945
Location
In your closet
Strong words, but thanks a lot Jim! I'll also take strong note of these situational errors when I review these later.

Edit: Whoa, why'd you delete those?
 
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