Characters that are a pain to deal with and solutions?

[WolfieXVII ❂]

oh yes link his projectiles go through practically everything :/.
@ WolfieXVII ❂ little mac and yoshi always gave me a hard time but i thought it was me , now i know its not!

As a Link main it always feels great to hear that people have trouble with him. TOP TIER CITY HERE WE COME.
Yeah but, for Pit you just have to bait and outcome Link.

 

[IzunaDroppuh]

Against a lil mac I just arrow until they come and try to punish their dashes. Ive never had a problem with link, just learned the yoshi matchup. But I for some reason cannot beat a villager. Sonic can be tricky too.

 

[LancerStaff]

For Mac, I switch to DP so I can Electroshock him. A successful hit offstage finishes him, and the faster arrows hit him quicker, meaning you have more time to react to his next move. I feel Pit's arrows are a waste of time in the matchup.

For Yoshi... Dunno. He's a good character, but a basic design. I fight him like I would most characters.

Oh, and for both Links, Upperdash out-and-out reflects the boomerang and maybe the bombs. Gale boomerang shoves Link across the stage, and TL's bombs thrown down are launched back up, unsure about a standard throw or Link's bombs.

 

[Strider_123]

duck hunt is hard too because all of his projectiles beat over mine.

 

[LancerStaff]

DH is a character you just need to practice against. I fought a ton of them early on and now the occasional one isn't too big a deal for me.

 

[ShadowSlashX]

I guess the characters I have most trouble with are Rosaluma, Shiek, and I guess Little Mac. This was in 1.0.3, though. I've only played Little Mac out of those 3 so far in 1.0.4 but it was easy enough to gimp him when recovering horizontally with the tip of a Fair or a couple arrows. On stage he is a hassle, but I try to wait till I can get an easy grab off him.

Rosaluma pre-patch was just difficult to predict for me and the invisible roll/spot dodge/air dodge just made it harder. I didn't know how to approach. I try getting rid of Luma then going in for grab follow ups and getting her into the air/offstage. Didn't really face many Rosalumas online fortunately...

Sheik idk... I only faced a couple of Shieks online and all of them were pretty good. I'd say I won maybe 1/3 of the Shiek matches I had simply by not knowing how to deal with her.

 

[Blazin']

I have problems with facing Shulk. I just can't get around his crazy range and his monado arts. Any tips for taking him down?

 

[Strider_123]

@ Blazin' oh man shulk, yes hes got range but get extremely close up because most of his moves got startup lag. Also because i don't see a lot of shulks (UNTILL now!) you just might need more experience dealing with him.

 

[Claxus]

I have problems with facing Shulk. I just can't get around his crazy range and his monado arts. Any tips for taking him down?

Almost anything he lands with is punishable with Pit's dash attack. N-air is probably going to be unpunishable though, depending on how well they space with it. If you see they like to abuse N-air (good Shulk players use it a lot because it's pretty amazing), Pit can rush in with F-air as N-air takes some time to swing.

Basically Pit's advantage is that he has medium range with superb speed. Shulk has superb range and is somewhat slow. In neutral Pit has the advantage of being able to attack and hit first, so push through their spacing with F-airs. Just be careful of Vision. Though if they counter in the air, most times you can escape it by fast-falling while attacking. Pit also has a projectile that can gimp Shulk pretty bad as his recovery is purely vertical. Also use it to force him to approach and not give him breathing room.

 

[Deleted member]

I wanna see what a good dark pit player can do.

I'm very good my self. We can exchange advice

 

[Deleted member]

Wow slow day

 

[Deleted member]

will post again tomorrow PM me if interested

 

[Eji1700]

Little Mac of course and Yoshi

Really? I've destroyed even the rare "good mac" i've seen. What specifically is the issue? We almost auto kill him if we get him in the air or off the stage.

 

[Deleted member]

Anybody down to play

 

[ShadowSlashX]

Sure, why not...

FC: 0216-0883-7959

I'm average at best, but that's what practice is for.

 

[Strider_123]

just vs a great samus player and i was awful. samus's rolls are hard for me to counter for some reason. also it seems like samus's range is better.

 

[MT Williams]

I can't seem to keep up with these two. Any tips?

 

[-Se7en-]

You used Nair way too much and you began to get predictable with it, the Fox player capitalized. Around the 0:50 mark I saw you do reverse Nairs all the way across Battlefield.

Just mix it up a bit more, and be more careful with your recovery.

 

[Claxus]

I would try to play a bit more defensive and outrange them. Pit's F-tilt and D-tilt should do wonders on the ground, and F-airs should beat out their aerials.

More specifically, ZSS is really easy to deal with in the air, if you stay wary of her whip. So play it conservative and do what you can to launch her, then start pressuring with aerials.

Sheik is harder to keep up with, but if you throw out attacks first, she should get beat out, since she usually has to get in your attack range to hit. Just be sure it's more defensively than offensive since she can punish easily. If they spam needles, you can jump and curve arrows down.

Both of them are a bit hard to edgeguard, but can be gimped pretty nicely if you pull it off, since their recoveries really need a double jump.

 

[Chaleb]

I've found that Pit does pretty well vs ZSS, since you don't have to play her game like you do with other characters.

Arrows outrange her Plasma Shots which is huge and forces her to come to you, not to mention you can slip in and reflect with Down-B for a solid mix-up. Force her to approach you in the air with Arrows, and come up to her with Shield Grabs for the follow-ups and putting her at a disadvantage by being in the air. Side-B's also very useful for mix-ups and kills past 100%, and it's very easy to get in thanks to the super-armor and reflective properties. If you get paralyzed by her neutral B, roll back because 90% of the time they'll dash Grab or dash attack you. ZSS has quite a few laggy moves so Dash Attacks are also a nice mix-up. Switch your C-Stick to Attack mode also, since it makes it much easier to do FTilt, which has surprisingly good range and power.

I haven't played much Shiek but I cannot imagine it being too terrible. Just having good fundamentals for Pit should do the trick.

 

[LancerStaff]

Vid isn't working on my phone, but I assume this is a friend? Use Amplifing Orbitars if you're not already. He can't be as reckless with his blaster because he'll be taking alot more damage.

If he's knocked low enough offstage to where he has to use his Uspecial, spam normal arrows as fast as you can. You can fire faster then he can get his Uspecial off, and he's as good as done if you hit him enough.

Foxs I fight typically like to juggle me, so try to make use of Amplifing Orbs' counter-like properties to slip by, but don't make it obvious you can't use then for ten seconds.

Also, try messing around with DP, namely Electroshock gimping. And try out gimping his recovery with DP's guiding bow if you get the chance.

 

[Sykofantia]

I am having a problem against good Pikachu players and I really have no clue what to do because it's a little tricky hitting the tiny bro
I didn't notice a match-up thread that explained anything but if information about this match-up exist don't be afraid to let me know i don't want to create a useless thread

 

[CHOMPY]

First off, are you rusing into Pikachu? If so, that is why your losing. When playing against small characters, like Pikachu, Villager, Kirby, etc., let them approach to your because they have zero range. If you rush into them, their attacks are so quick that it doesn't matter how much range Pikachu has when he's upclose. If Pikachu spams the thunder jolt, jump over it and hit him with the arrows. Moves like dtilt and ftilt should shut Pikachu down. Jabs can also shut Pika down if he tries to roll into you.

Take it slow and steady and you should be alright.

I didn't know your from the same state as me! :D

 

[Sykofantia]

First off, are you rusing into Pikachu? If so, that is why your losing. When playing against small characters, like Pikachu, Villager, Kirby, etc., let them approach to your because they have zero range. If you rush into them, their attacks are so quick that it doesn't matter how much range Pikachu has when he's upclose. If Pikachu spams the thunder jolt, jump over it and hit him with the arrows. Moves like dtilt and ftilt should shut Pikachu down. Jabs can also shut Pika down if he tries to roll into you.

Take it slow and steady and you should be alright.

I didn't know your from the same state as me! :D

thanks i just always have had a problem with small characters like hitting with arrows proves annoying... my problem probably is not using tilts enough it's a little tricky i don't play against pikachu often its like one of those characters that's like surprise owned
thanks for replying it's surprisingly hard to find somebody to talk to that plays dark pit because I know a lot of people play him it's just the threads are almost always dead :/

 

[ReRaze]

King Dedede is not that hard to fight but he's so damn hard to kill. I always outdamage them but once they get into rage percent I can't kill them but they can kill me. I oncefought this dedede where I meteor smashed him at 100% used upperdash, at 150+% and he lived all that (wasnt stale). He then proceeded to kill me at 50% -.-.

 

[Sora66]

I no we have one over at the dark pit forum, but I just needed help in this MU.

 

[Wintropy]

Honestly? It's tough.

I've been wondering the same thing, and while most of what applies for the Dark Pit matchup applies, there are a few difference that need to be taken into account.

Arrows become practically useless since she'll either absorb them with Luma or suck them in with her down-b.

Upperdash Arm can be good for knocking Luma out of the way, but then you've still got an aggressive Rosie to deal with; Luma makes for a convenient meat shield for the Arm as well, so it's not all that useful in the first instance.

You can reflect her Luma Shot or Star Bits with your Orbies, but while the former can be useful in certain circumstances, the latter does such negligible damage and comes out so quickly that it doesn't justify the startup and endlag of the Orbies.

Rosie is fast and can intercept with her dash attack, not to mention her u-air and d-air have little to no lag on them and can juggle or spike you practically endlessly. Her jab is quick and can be a pain in the posterior when it catches you in its flurry and, while she's a large target and is relatively light for her size, Pit's perennial quest for catching the kill is all too apparent here. Add into that Rosie's ineffable recovery and ability to hold her own even without Luma and she becomes a nightmarish opponent.

So she's difficult to space, negates projectiles, intercepts our best attacks and, even without her Luma to back her up, can hold her own anyway.

Unless I'm missing something, this is easily one of our toughest matchups, so any and all advice would be much appreciated.

 

[Sora66]

Yea I was also thinking the same thing. Her nair seems to just out prioritize any of my options in the air. When trying to space with ftilt and dtilt on the ground, luma is just in the way. Before I would just throw out the arm, but that just gives rosalina a free punish of whatever she likes. And she is also one of the only characters that can gimp pit. So does anyone have any advice on this MU. She is one of the hardest if not the hardest character I have played.

 

[waddicto]

A lot of people seem to say that Pit has a decent matchup against DDD. Well then, I must be terrible then.
I can't seem to handle DDD. He can always get an fsmash on me, even when I side B into him during the animation. Gordos are hard to reflect because Pit doesn't exactly have any moves with great range that come out quickly on land. Anyways, how do I deal with DDD?

 

[SoulRed12]

Gordos can be reflected with an arrow from Palutena's Bow. It has nasty end lag so it's a risk but if DDD is across the stage and you're good at aiming you should be able to pull out an arrow in time. The best use is by predicting when he will use a Gordo and charging an arrow in preparation, that way too you can surprise him with the deflection giving him little to no time to shield. But, keep in mind you don't always have to reflect it, they disappear on contact with shield.

I would never side+B through fsmash. You are much better off avoiding and punishing or even just resetting. If you screw up with the super armor frames the risk is just so huge and the payoff if you do is so mediocre especially since you still take the damage from the attack.

I think the two biggest problems Pit has with DDD are 1) you just can't gimp the ******* (too much maneuverability in the air and spacing with aerials), and 2) whereas Pit is used to having these advantages, DDD can actually outrange YOU and outmaneuver YOU in the air.

In general I'd make sure to count his jumps. DDDs love to fake you out with all those FF nairs as they fly around above your head, you really need to play defensively. That said, I also have more trouble with the fat penguin than I'd like, so I'm curious to see others' recommendations!

 

[Yong Dekonk]

Last night I kept losing to a really strong Captain Falcon. I'm so used to playing scrubs that I think I was trying to play too aggressively against cap. He baited me very successfully by jumping unpredictably and always punishing me with multiple up airs after grabbing me. Any tips or videos to help me defeat tough captain Falcons? I've realized I do really well against aggressive characters but defensive ones I struggle with.

 

[SwoodGrommet]

I find the Captain Falcon match up to be difficult myself, but something I've learned to do is try and pick and long stage like Final Destination or Town and City. Falcon struggles with range, so you can outzone him on these stages and see his Falcon Kicks coming from a mile away. Falcon also relies on grabs a lot, so be aware that he'll have that on his mind. Being able to spotdodge well helps.

 

[Chaleb]

If he's Down Throw to Up Air-ing you, make you sure mash jump and hold away so you can escape.

And at that point, it sounds simple but you should've just laid back and played defensively. If he's just jumping around, you can easily start to pressure him with Arrows. This'll force a reaction on his part and from there you can go on to play Falcon like you normally do. Always try to predict what he's going to do, Pit overall has much better tools than Falcon does so there's an appropriate response to everything.

 

[O1DsLeNdYwHiTe]

Captain Falcon is an extremely aggressive and physical character, mostly relying on Cqc and timed aerials to overwhelm opponents. There are considerably intelligent Falcon players out there who will take note of any defensive or campy style of play, and will provide you with no room to breath. It's considrably difficult to space out Falcon with Pit, due to his impressive running speed and sliding grapple range, making it rather frustrating to deal with.

Against Falcon space and distance is your best friend. Make good use of those arrows. Upon reaction Falcons will typically shield ounce one it is lashed out, giving you time to reset. Watch the Falcon's movements, analyze them. Also try and space with a short hop retreating fair because Falcons love that fast dash attack.

Platforms are also your bestest friend In this fight. Take note of that next time you're counter-picking a stage against an aggressive falcon player.

 

[bur]

I always seem to lose against him.
It's like he was designed to destroy pit. You can't really pressure him with your arrows because of his down+b and it seems like all of his aerials are far superior !

 

[SoulRed12]

Hmm. I find the matchup is about even. I have trouble with some Ness's, but not too much. To avoid his main combo (dthrow-->fair-->double jump-->fair) people say you want to DI toward him, but then you get hit with an up air, so you might try randomly alternating between toward and away. Either way, mash the jump button.

Keep in mind you still want to use arrows against him, just as Samus would still use projectiles against a Fox. You just have to shoot them when Ness isn't prepared to absorb them. Also, if you shoot it at him and you see him start to set up PK Magnet, you can angle the arrow away from him.

The thing with Ness is that it's tough to properly space/outrange any of his attacks that have the PSI sparks, but in all other cases you have the spacing advantage especially with fair but also your grounded attacks. Another cool thing about the matchup is that you also have orbitars to reflect those annoying PK Thunders that Ness's like to send after you offstage.

Here is a great tournament set with Ness vs. (Dark) Pit. It is really early in the meta (it's a 3ds tournament) but there's some really good stuff there. You even get some nice little treats with the orbitars...won't spoil it though.

 

[Wintropy]

Short answer: yes.

Long answer: yes, but it's manageable. Ness loves to pressure with PK Fire and juggle with PK Thunder, yet he'll seldom, if ever, use PK Flash and may use PSI Magnet to nullify our arrows. What's really dangerous about the PSI Prodigy are his standard attacks, particularly the following few.

- F-smash - THIS CAN REFLECT. If timed correctly, he'll smack our arrows right back at us. This isn't all that useful against Pit, since our arrows are fast and easily spammed, but it's good to know regardless. It's also a pretty strong f-smash as standard.

- D-smash - Ness's unsung hero of his diverse and creative moveset. What's so interesting about this move is that it goes backwards: whereas most d-smashes go forward -> back, Ness's goes back -> forward, which can and will catch you off-guard if you aren't watching what he's doing. Even if he whiffs the first hit, chances are the second hit will sweep up under your feet and catch you for a clean hit. Be sure to shield / spotdodge the second hit, if nothing else.

- Dash - Simple but effective, it's a multi-hit attack and comes out quickly. You can just shield it, but it strings together with ease and can rack up damage if you're not savvy.

- U-tilt - Juggling tool. Doesn't do much damage and won't launch, but it can do to keep you in the air so he can follow up with PK Thunder or f-air.

- F-air - We all know this one. Can be comboed into out of d-throw multiple times and can push you off-stage if you're too close to the blastzone.

- D-throw - Does decent damage and, most dangerously, leads into a lot of combo possibilities. Try to keep him at bay so he doesn't grab you.

- B-throw - The infamous kill move itself. It's just a ridiculously strong launch, and because it's a grab, there's not much you can do to escape it. Just don't get caught in the first place. He can also follow up with PK Thunder and f-air from this if you aren't killed by it, so be prepared to mix-up your landings to keep him guessing and counter-strike the wee fella.

Ness has a varied toolkit and is great at pressuring and zoning. PK Fire in particular is dangerous, since even if you shield it, it leaves you open to be grabbed, and the Orbitars are too slow to be used against such a spammable move reliably. He can also hit you with PK Thunder from afar, though he is wide open when he uses it, and if you can get in quickly enough, that's a free hit or grab for you.

I'm honestly not too sure how to beat Ness either. I'm familiar enough with his moveset and his tricks - now I just need to learn how to counter his moves and catch him! >w<;;

 

[O1DsLeNdYwHiTe]

I've recently started taking in-depth notes in regards to Pit's play, and Ive come to a point where I'm going to analyze each individual match up In regards to best offensive tactics, defensive tactics, spacing options, and reactions that need to be utilized in response to the character's options.

After scrolling through the Pit boards, I haven't noticed any insight on the Mario match-up, and I desperately don't want to leave anything unanalyzed. Insight on the Mario match up would be well appreciated; what are the flightless warrior's options against him?

 

[Wintropy]

I'll keep this brief and share what insights I've got on this matchup.

PROS

- Range. Mario has one ranged move (fireball) that only travels so far for minimal damage. Arrows are faster, go further, can be controlled and do more damage when charged.
- Gimping. Mario's only stellar gimp is his f-air, which is very slow and predictable. We can hit him with arrows, f-air Wall of Pain, d-air spike or n-air.
- Recovery. Our beats his hands-down, simple as that.
- Neutral game. Mario can throw fireballs or move in for the hit, but he has little other options for neutral game, so we can read and punish appropriately without too much hassle.

CONS

- Reflect. Mario's cape has no lag and can knock our arrows right back at us, which can make zoning difficult.
- Kill potential. Mario's got his smashes, f-air and up-b at high percents, and he's fairly sturdy for a little guy, which makes our kills even more difficult for us.
- Speed. Not necessarily his movement speed, but the speed at which his smashes come out trump ours and makes it dangerous to get too close to him, and his moves are mostly lag-free and safe on shield.
- Combo potential. He can rack up damage quickly and KO without too much trouble, so we need to be on our toes at all times, he's got us on a perennial defensive position.

NEUTRAL

- Airgame. Both our airgames are pretty good: Mario's got his n-air, b-air and u-air, while we've got our n-air, b-a-r and u-air as well. I think our f-air is better for punishing and our b-air is better for KO than his are, but his f-air is much stronger and his n-air is much safer on shield.
- Throws. He can combo d-throw into u-tilt, we can combo d-throw into u-smash. His is better for damage, our is better for KO. Both of our f-throws can be decent KO moves at high percents.

VERDICT

This is a fairly even matchup for the most part, but I feel like our ability to zone him with arrows (just gotta be careful of his cape) and keep him at bay with our tilts and throws puts us slightly in the lead in terms of safety, and our superior off-stage capabilities and recovery mean we can kill him without too much hassle if we're clever. A slight lead in our favour but a decisive win nevertheless.

55:50

Pit wins this matchup!

 

[O1DsLeNdYwHiTe]

Thanks Wintropy. Simple and insightful, that's all I needed for my improvement notebook. At first glance I actually thought these two would be dead even in regards to the MU, but now that I look at it, our arrows seem to be way better camping / spacing / and zoning tools. Mario can typically approach with his projectiles as well by short hoping forward as he's firing them, but this becomes rather easy to deal with when it's constantly utilized.

My little brother Ethan, or DirtyDan?! actually mains Mario, and he's really got a grasp on the character as a whole. Our games are always pretty even, so I have somewhat of an understanding of the character. Hearing from another player's perspective will certainly assist me in mastering this MU.