Build a counter strategy!

Rapid_Assassin · Apr 6, 2008

Here's what other boards are saying about Olimar. Use it to come up with a counter strategy.

cHiCkEN_TeNdErS · Apr 6, 2008

where is the metaknight!
him and good wolfs are the only toons I have real trouble with

Rapid_Assassin · Apr 6, 2008

Those are the threads someone else already started that I managed to dig up on other boards.

Blade Knight · Apr 6, 2008

Yup thanks Rapid I needed the TL one now if only a Pit one was up I wouldn't have anymore close calls but still I just grab through their Side-B to stop their combos so yeah not realy needed but I digress, thanks.

Fino · Apr 6, 2008

Thanks for pulling those up rapid... I'll be sure to take a look at them

~Fino

Rapid_Assassin · Apr 7, 2008

Dug up another thread.

Lucas and Sheik this time.

scalpel · Apr 7, 2008

Rocketface Normus said:
your best bet would be to SPAM bombs when at a distance.

eMORAY21 said:
Yeah I second rocetface ... A bomb throw down then a f or b air works better.

Very interesting.

On the Toon Link forum, it looks like everyone's strategy against Olimar is to SPAM projectiles, especially bombs. I find it interesting because here on the Olimar forums, we have already established the idea that Olimar is better at camping than Toon Link is. Olimar can throw Pikmin faster, and his Pikmin absorb all of Toon Link's projectiles. Plus, latched Pikmin cause the bombs to explode directly on Toon Link if he tries to throw them. So, no worries there, mate.

I actually WANT Toon Link to throw a lot of bombs during the battle.

Take a look at this great video: http://youtube.com/watch?v=BsLEf8H5Ouw. It's the winners final round of a particular tournament. I think this video is a great example of how Olimar is superior to Toon Link's camping. Also, I like this video because it shows how Olimar can protect himself against Toon Link's lethal down-air, simply by using Olimar's up-smash.

Fino · Apr 7, 2008

Muahahahaha, yes yes Gazelle... they've fallen for our traps..... bahahaha.
With people like that on the forums it makes things SO much easier for us. lol

~Fino

Fino · Apr 7, 2008

EDIT: sorry... triple post... odd... sorry for wasted space

Fino · Apr 7, 2008

EDIT: sorry... triple post... odd... sorry for wasted space

Rapid_Assassin · Apr 8, 2008

That was another example of people who have no real experience in the matchup trying to give advice.

Blade Knight · Apr 8, 2008

Exactly man are they stupid the throw a bomb we Up smash the pikmin survives the bomb doesn't hurt us we punish them simple as that.

scalpel · Apr 9, 2008

everlasting yayuhzz said:
I **** Lolimar players with Wolf. He is so easy to gimp and beat it's silly.

Bocks said:
oh and btw the main reason wolf ***** olimar is laser / fsmash, it's range is about the same as pikmin throw + goes right through em killin em and hitting olimar, he moves well enough to keep olimar close, his ground dodge > olimar downsmash, his bair > olimars recovery and his deflector > olimar

Bocks said:
oh yeah watch a yellow pikmin go through a SH fair (actually dont because it doesnt) wolfs Sh aerials > olimars pikmin, wolfs laser > olimars pikmin (with the exception of one GET OVER IT), wolfs fsmash > olimars pikmin, wolfs Bair > Olimars recovery > Wolfs dsmash works after grounddodging olimars dsmash without olimar having time to shield, probly more reasons but i dont feel like thinking right now, mainly its all about the sh Fair tho

It looks like on the Wolf forum, everyone is very fat and happy about spamming Wolf's laser and forward smashes. Actually, they think it is the ULTIMATE counter to Olimar. And, you know what, I think that's true right now.

Wolf's laser and forward smash forces Olimar to do something out of the ordinary. In other words, if you follow this VERY comprehensive guide on Olimar: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=161029, against Wolf, you're setting yourself up to lose. Fortunately, we've found a few good counters to both Wolf's laser and forward smash attacks.

To counter the laser: worm under it using Olimar's down-tilt. When you are close to Wolf, grab him, or

To counter the forward smash: use Olimar's up-tilt.

I'm not very happy about these counters, though, because like I said before, it's very unusual for Olimar players to have to resort to these tactics. We have to approach the opponent to counter them? What? That sounds very silly for Olimar players, but I don't know any other effective way to counter Wolf BUT to approach him.

shanus · Apr 9, 2008

the main thing we need is to uhh.. build counter strats for good MKs. I don't like that I have to use a secondary for him, but I do enjoy playing as him haha

SKEET SHADY · Apr 9, 2008

shanus said:
the main thing we need is to uhh.. build counter strats for good MKs. I don't like that I have to use a secondary for him, but I do enjoy playing as him haha

agreed. metaknight is easily the hardest opponent for olimar. go lookup gimpyfish vs dsf, or vidjo vs ANYONE on youtube

Dr. Hyde · Apr 9, 2008

Gazelle said:
I'm not very happy about these counters, though, because like I said before, it's very unusual for Olimar players to have to resort to these tactics. We have to approach the opponent to counter them? What? That sounds very silly for Olimar players, but I don't know any other effective way to counter Wolf BUT to approach him.

The way I approach Wolf, well on Battlefield anyway, is to stay on the platform when he starts lasers. When he goes up, i.e. he does his Forward + B for this example, I drop down and U air, or shield and Down Smash.

The thing is if Wolf gets to lasers you need to be able to make sure he missed and have a way to take a small advantage of it.

Three scenarios and how to counter them, all starting with you and wolf on opposite sides on the bottom of Battlefield. He is Lasering and you just jumped onto the platform above you.

1) Wolf Forward + B's
2) Jumps and lasers onto the opposite platform
3) starts to move toward you

Note: Either way, Wolf is at a disadvantage when he is not able to keep pressure on you.
1) already mentioned up top, so do whatever else you feel best follows the situation.
2) This is the best scenario, for me it seems. This is where you would want to drop down and latch a pikmin on him. I say latch over grab and attack because the pikmin take the hit for you. Once they take the hit, rush in and smash, grab whatever. Also to preserve this power longer, I recommend a Yellow fellow for the wolf.
3) Worst situation because there are two possible outcomes from this outside of a empty air dodge to fake you out.
3a) He just runs under you and tries to smash. This is the best situation but also is the least likely to happen. Just run forward and back air Wolf and take advantage of the center and edge if he flies off.
3b) If wolf attacks toward you from the air, this is when you have to choose and I tend to be bias in this choice. First you can stay on the top and shield and if he lands you have the advantage. The downside to this is if he goes beneath the platform. The better outcome in my mind is a drop down, WAC or air dodge and counter attack. The reason I prefer this is you can have the chance of Wolf landing on top in the glory of all his lag and this gives you a free Up smash or if he does fall you have a chance of retaliation so either way I prefer dropping down.

If you feel this was helpful tell me I'll add it to my page on how to get by what, from who section, counter characters page I guess its called

Rapid_Assassin · Apr 10, 2008

The Yoshi boards make me laugh:

Gindler said:
Yeah, yoshi's easiest match up is easily olimar. His egg roll just completely negates and pikmin attacks, his Bair also destroys them. And if you're above them be sure to Dair, the first kick cancels whatever he throws at you and the other 20 go right into his face.

It'd be funny if it worked this way. If what he says is true (Yoshi counters Olimar), it's not for these reasons. Seeing as this doesn't even work on the lv. 1 cpu.

scalpel · Apr 18, 2008

How come I am the only one looking at these threads?

Kabuto Mushi · Apr 18, 2008

Gazelle said:
How come I am the only one looking at these threads?

I'm a secret reader.. >.>

I find them quite helpful, although.
:laugh:

DanGR · Apr 19, 2008

Hey, btw, nice idea for a thread

.

Hey Gaz, u mean? all the threads that Rapid put up about countering olimar? i read them all.

ChromePirate said:
I don't have the game, but can sheik's chain being used noobishly prevent all of olimar's pikmin throws and ways of approaching?

I laughed at this one. I could come up w/ better strategies against oli w/sheik. In fact, my best friend mains zelda/sheik :O. If u just stand in front of the chain and spam fsmash, you'll hit her after about the 4th one on average. I don't recommend doing this though unless it would kill her b/c it lowers your fsmash damage/knockback(is there a common word for this that i'm not aware of yet?) and it raises the damge/knock of shiek's other moves. On the other hand, u could always jump over it and attack from behind him while she takes back her chain. lol

Edit: Gaz, i totally agree about olimar being a better camper, but in tink's defense(lol, tink, is that not awkward?) the tink didn't do a good job w/his range job.

Puddin · Apr 19, 2008

Haha, I really like what the Yoshi boards said about Olimar. "Plus , well, the olimars I played online have problems when trying to attack the egg roll" I find this funny because I have a friend who mains Yoshi, it's fairly predictable when Yoshi is going to use Egg Roll, and with Olimar if you can get distance between you and the egg roll, simply timing a grab will break it, also it takes about three Pikmin side Smash Attacks to break an egg roll, depending on the damage of the opponent I suppose, and a grab is extremely effective, especially if you can get a blue or white in the front which makes the timing a lot easier.

Rapid_Assassin · Apr 22, 2008

Yeah they say that as if online play is a good indication of offline play..

EDIT: Found an even better Yoshi thread. :lick:

T-REX! · Apr 24, 2008

Probably bombs, cus fire'll kill them. But I don't know about any more strategies except to gimp his recovery?

Zacke · Apr 24, 2008

Since I'm having huge problems with Wario, I went looking for threads about Olimar (in the Wario section).
I managed to find this: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=154310
You could add it, since it's a pain in the *ss for me when i certain Wario-player always approach from above, with D-air.

Rapid_Assassin · Apr 25, 2008

Thank you.

I don't always find things in other boards...

Zacke · Apr 25, 2008

^^
After reading that thread, it seems to me that I'll have to space alot (wich I always do, though) but he just keep getting close by either jumping in and d-iaring or jumping in and dodging, that will give him an opportunity.
His d-air overprioritizes any attack from Olimar (except Olimar's U-air, but there is no way I could have the time to do that move).

I seriously need help >_>

apmpnmdslkbk · Apr 25, 2008

When facing olimer my favorite strategy is to use the ice climbers. when he starts to use his side special just short hop and use down special (witch will create a blockade and kill all pikmin he throws unless at an angle). Other than that I try not to be above his head, in the air, at any time because that leads to getting punished by his uair or even his fair/bair. And when It comes to gimping his recovery their neutral special works wonders.

OlimarFan · Apr 25, 2008

Wow nice stuff-I find this incredibly useful. I think that MK, R.O.B, Squirtle and Marth are the tough opponents for Olimar.

DanGR · Apr 25, 2008

OlimarFan said:
I think that MK, R.O.B, Squirtle and Marth are the tough opponents for Olimar.

= top tier

Rapid_Assassin · Apr 29, 2008

They're tough opponents for a lot of characters.

Odlanier · Apr 30, 2008

Don't try to shield grab Marth when he's charging up his B. I tried it- turns out it's called Shield Breaker for a reason.

OlimarFan · Apr 30, 2008

SKEET SHADY said:
agreed. metaknight is easily the hardest opponent for olimar. go lookup gimpyfish vs dsf, or vidjo vs ANYONE on youtube

I agree, but don't you think Marth or Pit would be some trouble also?

DanGR · Apr 30, 2008

Can someone help me against sheik? I play against my friend (a pretty good sheik) that'll give me no space to work with. something he does that i still havn't found a counter to is the following:

SH-nair-jab like heck-ftilt-uptilt, shield, dodge, or jab.(repeat)

I can't DI out of it, or if I get close to getting out, he'll start his tilts to get me back into it.

when it's pulled off correctly, he can do up to about 60%!!! I think the key to the counter is to just shieldgrab correctly, but it's just too hard to time. He'll nair, i'll try to SG and he'll hit with the insane jabs. He's too close and when he hits olimar, it cancels the grab. He spams it WAY too much and I've no way to counter it as of now.

Rapid_Assassin · May 4, 2008

I fixed the broken links, and added more characters.

The Sheik strategy of your friend is somewhat similar to fighting against Peach. Watch out for diagonal approaches and jabs.

Dr. Hyde · May 4, 2008

DanGR- I have a friend who does the exact same thing, making more sad about how less brawl is than melee but, the way I counter it is if it happens so what. It doesn't kill you. I try and avoid it and if I can he complains the entire match about me being defensive. And then I attack and get the KO.

Thanks again for the thread Rapid. I kinda like posting on the other threads to see if they move along or give better information.

The Fox thread seems fine but Diddy seems to have died or they just think they are that amazing.

DanGR · May 4, 2008

Dr. Hyde said:
DanGR- I have a friend who does the exact same thing, making more sad about how less brawl is than melee but, the way I counter it is if it happens so what. It doesn't kill you. I try and avoid it and if I can he complains the entire match about me being defensive. And then I attack and get the KO.

haha(friendly laugh), "it doesn't kill you". haha, though that's besides the point. He racks up damage like an MK on pills.

Rapid_Assassin · May 8, 2008

I'd keep my distance against guys like that... Or avoid FD like the plague.

shanus · May 8, 2008

Ive played against a lot of Sheiks. First importantly is DI'ing out of those tilts, you should be able to get out on the 3rd or so tilt. The main thing is that for sheik to have any chance against olimar, they try and keep the pressure on you (at least any good ones I've played so far in brawl). The benefit to this is our grab range is ridiculous. Take advantage of that in every way this fight. Your friend is gonan hate you, but retreating pivot grabs is ridiculously good against aggressive sheiks. You can do nice comboing from there.

SummaryL Good DI + pivot grabs against sheik

. Oh yeah, and falling nair to uptilt owns her sheik after a latch

Chipmunk · May 8, 2008

o.o?

Wolf - What good is his laser spam from a distance. Unlike your Pikmin, you can parry his lasers by guarding right before they hit you. Doesn't chip any guard. Just learn to parry projectiles like SF3. Dtilt seems to also be a very useful tool in this matchup. Just gotta try to dance around his FSmash.

Any Aerial Entries Against You - Why do people not use the UpB as much as I do? I know there's some lag, but that 45 is perfect at many people jumping in. Stuffs a REDICULOUS amount of stuff as well. Try it against characters you are having a hard time with that use SH or just jumping as an approach. Makes'em cry. =D

Chippy

DanGR · May 8, 2008

Rapid_Assassin said:
I'd keep my distance against guys like that...

that's the problem...he won't rest. he's aware of my pikmen throw, and he's good about rushing in. what I mentioned earlier is his ONLY approach. nothing else. i'm having trouble avoiding it and countering. Not necessarily getting out of it as much. I can't roll under it unless I anticipate his timing perfectly, and rolling backwards just gives him the opportunity to roll away and retry. I'm looking for more of a counter. something that'll make him rethink that option. I try to SHfair, but sheik is quicker than olimar by far and my friend always uses the nair at the same moment in the air(just enough air distance to gimp any SHattack) An upsmash doesn't have the priority to break the nair either. The repeated jabs push me back, and the cycle continues.

I've no real problem against his zelda though.

Build a counter strategy!

Smash Master

Smash Apprentice

Smash Master

Smash Ace

Smash Master

Smash Master

Smash Journeyman

Smash Master

Smash Master

Smash Master

Smash Master

Smash Ace

Smash Journeyman

Smash Hero

Smash Journeyman

Smash Ace

Smash Master

Smash Journeyman

Smash Journeyman

BRoomer

Smash Lord

Smash Master

Smash Apprentice

Smash Cadet

Smash Master

Smash Cadet

Smash Journeyman

Smash Ace

BRoomer

Smash Master

Smash Apprentice

Smash Ace

BRoomer

Smash Master

Smash Ace

BRoomer

Smash Master

Smash Hero

Smash Rookie

BRoomer

Information

Network