Brawl lacks :ohwell:

[Caracappa16]

Super Smash Brothers Brawl lacks any and all competitive edge. People who are robotically flaming others who have formed similar opinions lack some of the concepts that are pretty simple to understand. Super Smash Brothers Melee has lasted almost 7 years. I predict Brawl will have no more than a year and a half to two years before it is forgotten and abandoned. It came out at the wrong time and is deficient of aspects that keep a game competitive and going for years on end.

Melee was the sort of game where you could play for a month, even a year, and still have techs and combos one could not produce or perform. Falco’s drill shines, foxes wave shines, mew two’s double jump canceled moves to name a small small few.

So to all those people who say, it just came out yesterday? We have had the Japanese version for over a month and have played it almost every day. This game is fun but that is as far as it goes. If you want competitive play that builds on skill and technique go play some melee, or one of the first person shooters at a tournament. This game was built around a “party games” mechanics and was made for the casual gamer. This is evident based on many things with one major one being ink drops.

Anyways I doubt I will find anyone competent enough to pose some sort of relevant argument and rebuttle so I might not rutinly check up on this thread. I can already see all the 14 year old kittys with there OMFG I PWNZORS YOU !!!one11!!!1!! YOU SUCK AT THE LEET BRAWLZ LIKE EVERYONE ELSE AND IT WILL GET BETTER.

Oh and one more thing, this game is FARRRR from balanced in any way. The priority of some characters is just plane bull**** and the recovery of characters is as far from balanced as a game could possibly achieve.

 

[kr3wman]

The official complaint thread is that way : --->

 

[boxelder]

I know your oh so competent *** isn't going to "rutinly" check this thread, but I'll respond none the less that if hitting six buttons a second is what makes a game fun then I'll just stop playing now. Brawl incorperated things like l-canceling into it without forcing you to hit L every **** time you jump. It's an improvement. I think it's funny that you reference a fox move, as i have a feeling most of these posts come from frustrated fox glitchers. You still have your precious drill shine, by the way.

 

[Killer Tree]

Because SSBM 1 month after the Japanese release had wavedashing and all that stuff right? Anyway, techniques don't have to mean advanced button presses. Sniping in Halo 3 takes skill and you don't need to do advanced button presses like wavedashing. It's just a different style of advanced play.

 

[bovineblitzkrieg]

Correction: precisely hitting six buttons a second. And oftentimes it's more than six, if you count directions.

Brawl didn't incorporate L-cancelling, it took it out and equalized the lag. and drill shine isn't the same at ALL.

I agree with the OP, it's a casual game, not meant for us searching for that harder competitive edge.

I'd be so happy if they put Melee online, too bad they never will.

 

[Pink Reaper]

I know your oh so competent *** isn't going to "rutinly" check this thread, but I'll respond none the less that if hitting six buttons a second is what makes a game fun then I'll just stop playing now. Brawl incorperated things like l-canceling into it without forcing you to hit L every **** time you jump. It's an improvement. I think it's funny that you reference a fox move, as i have a feeling most of these posts come from frustrated fox glitchers. You still have your precious drill shine, by the way.

He never said that's what makes the game fun, he said thats what makes the game competitive. Face, Brawl will never be as competitive as Brawl just due to the fact that there really isn't any lag cancel(some aerials have little lag, but you can't use them too much or they become weak and useless) the new physics make it nearly impossible to combo well, and even if you could, the new air dodge system allows you to escape anything without any restraint. And before you jump on me for being a "Fox glitcher," Im a Kirby main

 

[xl Lan lx]

Competitivity? The truth to it would be no "uber" techniques or anything. Just playing the game it was supposed to be played. Personally, I would love to play Brawl like that. Unfortunately for me, I know some great techniques will come out eventually. It's unavoidable after all.

 

[Fonz]

Brawl didn't incorporate L-cancelling, it took it out and equalized the lag. and drill shine isn't the same at ALL.

You think l-canceling gave equalized lag? Try l-canceling link's dair and then fox's nair. L-canceling just halves landing lag. Drill shine is pretty much the same really, you just can't combo from the shine like you could.

Brawl is competitive. I played melee for ages, and I'll be doing the same with brawl.

 

[BlackFoxPariah]

It's not a surprise that Nintendo did this. It's the direction they took with the Wii. They went casual and are doing pretty darn well. It's still reasonably hard to get a Wii in some places. They went this direction to appeal to a lot of people. Nintendo has more customers now then it ever did because they make games appeal to more people than just the hardcore competitive people. I do agree this game at the moment lacks depth and complexity. However, Nintendo is a business, and which their goal is to make money. So if they remove the competitiveness and bring in a more friendly feel, the success of Brawl is worth it for them.

 

[pirkid]

You think 1 month is long enough?

1 month into Melee, we thought Roy was top tier.

Duur.

Stop trying to act like Brawl is an abomination just because it's not Melee 2.0 or that it's not perfect. You aren't giving this game a chance.

 

[Razorsaw]

It's not how you define "competitive" that factors into what makes a game a success. The meta-game does not turn a game into a hit. It doesn't give it any sense of perpetuality. It's defined this community, but it doesn't define a franchise.

 

[p00pd0g]

O ya, wen i had melle for 1month i was sooo pro and was liek wavedashin n' ding, n liek totly! I wuld have pwnd u!!!11! =p

 

[Doctor T]

Super Smash Brothers Brawl lacks any and all competitive edge.

Just plain not true at all. Any multiplayer game can be competitive no matter how crappy it is. But Brawl is far from crappy.

I predict Brawl will have no more than a year and a half to two years before it is forgotten and abandoned. It came out at the wrong time and is deficient of aspects that keep a game competitive and going for years on end.

Melee was the sort of game where you could play for a month, even a year, and still have techs and combos one could not produce or perform. Falco’s drill shines, foxes wave shines, mew two’s double jump canceled moves to name a small small few.

It is possible that Brawl won't match up to the greatness of Melee over time, but there is no way to know that now. There very well may be many advanced techniques developed over the next few months. How can you know there won't?!

So to all those people who say, it just came out yesterday? We have had the Japanese version for over a month and have played it almost every day.

Who cares? Just because a small handful of people have had a chance to play the game for about a month, that means the limits were all reached? Very few people have been able to play the game until this week. You think advanced techniques like Wavedashing and L-Canceling were developed by a couple handfuls of people in a months time? Get a grip.

If you want competitive play that builds on skill and technique go play some melee, or one of the first person shooters at a tournament. This game was built around a “party games” mechanics and was made for the casual gamer. This is evident based on many things with one major one being ink drops.

Sure the game seems to be designed more to be a "party game" than a competitive game. But the system of Smash Bros by itself has so much depth to it, and there are so many new aspects of the Brawl system that are still mostly unknown.

Oh and one more thing, this game is FARRRR from balanced in any way. The priority of some characters is just plane bull**** and the recovery of characters is as far from balanced as a game could possibly achieve.

I see where you're coming from, but there's really no way to know how balanced the game is at this point. Most people have only begun to play. In my opinion (looking at things logically mind you, sorry if it confuses you), the game is much more balanced than Melee. Honestly, Melee was not very balanced at all.

I really think overall the game has improved, but its just going to take some time to adjust. This is not Melee, it is a new game that is very different. If you don't like it, don't play it. Otherwise, get over it, and try to develop new strategies using the new system.

 

[Frames]

Brawl may not seem competitive right now, but I think it could have the potential to become a real success. Maybe it doesn't have the technical skill, but what will really make this game stand out is the potential for strategy. Coming up with new ways to attack and defend as well as developing plans of attack are going to be critical for upper level play. The people who do it well will be much more better than people who just try and attack recklessly. Even though we've been playing this game heavily for a whole month, that still isn't enough time to guess the life of the game. We could end up playing this game for years to come for all we know. As for the balancing issues, the over exaggerated up-b's ARE a problem, but most characters have improved recoveries in general, and the characters as a whole seem more balanced. I think that when tier lists are eventually made (and yes, they WILL be made), that the gaps between tiers will be smaller than they were in melee.

 

[p00pd0g]

I see where you're coming from, but there's really no way to know how balanced the game is at this point. Most people have only begun to play. In my opinion (looking at things logically mind you, sorry if it confuses you), the game is much more balanced than Melee. Honestly, Melee was not very balanced at all.

I completely agree...Playing with a variety of characters against a variety of characters, I have found it is balanced, and dare I say thoroughly balanced game. The mechanics of each returning character is refined very well and it really reminds me how unbalanced Melee was.

And ya, you confused him

 

[gunterrsmash01]

I predict

I stopped reading there.

 

[Dogenzaka]

Super Smash Brothers Brawl lacks any and all competitive edge. People who are robotically flaming others who have formed similar opinions lack some of the concepts that are pretty simple to understand. Super Smash Brothers Melee has lasted almost 7 years. I predict Brawl will have no more than a year and a half to two years before it is forgotten and abandoned. It came out at the wrong time and is deficient of aspects that keep a game competitive and going for years on end.

Thank goodness it lacks the aspects Melee did in some way.
Melee was the worst out of the three.

Sakurai took out all those unnecessary exploits to make the community grow, and help that division between casual and competitive decrease, therefore increasing the fanbase, profit, and industry by allowing anyone to play against another FAIRLY. Good players will still win, bad players will still lose. But this way, there's more unity, and Sakurai could hardly care how much you whine because your little "techniques" are gone, because frankly, the whiny-arse competitive community is a very small percentage of the gaming industry, and the total population. He's not going to cater to your every whim, he's going to cater to what's best for profits, and the general demographic of gaming, and increasing it.

Whining won't help. We don't care. He doesn't care.
Go back to playing your inferior prequel of Melee, and we will have fun with the enormous depth that is Brawl.

Good day to you, sir.

 

[CivicSmash]

I would rather take a crap on my copy of Brawl than play it.

Melee was the worst out of the three????

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH ............NOOBS ARE FUNNY.

 

[Demontree]

I dont care really. The only advanced techs I could do in melee were teching (sometimes) and a random wavedash by trying to do it but not that I could actually incorporate into a fight. Me and my friends are casual but as soon as I got on the boards I got all the advanced techs and ideas and owned.

 

[DalzK]

Your arguement is pointless. Melee had no wavedashing in its first month, or in fact first year, so why is it you wont give Brawl some time?

 

[xS A M U R A Ix]

You people really need to just die. If you don't like it, don't play it, but quit clogging the boards with this crap. You can change, and enjoy the fresh new experience, or you an keep playing melee. Plenty of people are going to play Brawl competitively regardless of what you whiners say and love it though, so seriously, just stop the QQing.

 

[dustyjuicebox]

think about it long and hard. Now that others who cant play video games like some of us do or what you call casual gamers are in we might actually be getting more competition. and before you start cursing me think.


more gamers= more competition


so there your whole speech brought down in a few sentences

 

[CivicSmash]

You people really need to just die. If you don't like it, don't play it, but quit clogging the boards with this crap. You can change, and enjoy the fresh new experience, or you an keep playing melee. Plenty of people are going to play Brawl competitively regardless of what you whiners say and love it though, so seriously, just stop the QQing.

.............Okay mom.

 

[Dogenzaka]

I would rather take a crap on my copy of Brawl than play it.

Melee was the worst out of the three????

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH ............NOOBS ARE FUNNY.

Um no, sorry. Out of Melee and SSB64, SSB64 was much better in terms of actual gameplay. Sorry nub.

 

[Serendipity]

Sigh...we went out saturday night and got the game (midnight release) and played it till like 6 am. i was moping for all of sunday because i felt that it lacks competitive nuances that kept my passion for melee going and going and going...... I HAVE nothing now.... i really really really miss melee. U guys are right....brawl is kinda more of a game for like casual type gamers...nintendo did a good job of making it a game for everyone. no complaints there. Im a little whiner. I like KNOCKBACK....>.>

there is nothing *AWESOME* about running off stage with captain falcon and spiking sumone anymore...and things like that( fox's insane upsmash, the rest, the KNEE that came from across town cause no one saw it coming! (Silent Spectre[love u jeff]). Just payofffs... "ohhh this and that got nerfed" ummmm THE WHOLE GAME got nerfed...

I've been playing melee for like everyday since christmas of 2005.... i love melee. went to tournies, biweekly at san jose state and played at school inbetween classes. The funny stuff david would do to us...(i used to cut class just to play)

When i first started playing melee...IT was FUN right AWAY!!! i didnt know anyhting about advanced tactics and techniques...mindgames and alll...it was helllaaa fun and i sorta already had my own style....and when i started playing competitively it was a blast!

I DONT KNOW if it will ever be that way with brawl. I'm hoping. I'm willing to give it a chance. I'm scared that it will let me down though.

 

[GreenKirby]

Did anyone notice that the OP didn't come back to refute? lol

And if people are this impatient to see if Brawl is competitive or not, I would hate to them in real life where they complain they're not growing up fast enough. O_o

 

[J18]

heh i'm 14 and i'm a casual player.
i guess this game is perfect for me

 

[WR3K]

i invite al brawl haters to provide counter points against this perspective:

competitive games adding to their game library has ALWAYS had strife

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=151309

 

[NDUDE]

I can already see all the 14 year old kittys with there OMFG I PWNZORS YOU !!!one11!!!1!! YOU SUCK AT THE LEET BRAWLZ LIKE EVERYONE ELSE AND IT WILL GET BETTER.

If you think that's a cover up and says "I'm right, you're wrong and should shut up," then you're ****ing stupid. Seriously, Brawl's been out for 2 days, and you're complaining about it without knowing well enough how to play. Maybe you should play something simpler that you could get the hang of without *****ing about it, like Wii Sports...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH ............NOOBS ARE FUNNY.

I know, right? That being said, GTFO.

 

[Razorsaw]

I would rather take a crap on my copy of Brawl than play it.

Melee was the worst out of the three????

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH ............NOOBS ARE FUNNY.

Yet another example of "if it doesn't fit with the competitive mindset", it's not worthwhile.

 

[Tomato Kirby]

There should be a notice somewhere saying, "If SSBB is pitiful, keep it to yourself and post somewhere else. We heard enough a long time ago."

Just post this in the "Official Complaints Thread." If I come here, I want to read about SSBB. If I want to read complaints, I will look for that thread.

Go debate the "No tactics in SSBB" in the Brawl Tactical Discussion Forums.

...I think I should make part of this post a "Copy and Paste" response...

 

[Shadow Calibur]

Rome wasn't built in a day. Neither was Melee's competitive scene. From my understanding, techniques such as wavedashing, L-cancelling, and all that jazz weren't discovered during the first month of its release, were they not? We discovered those things over time, playing the game until we found a glitch, exploit, or technique, and then implementing it in some way.

The problem with some of the people hating on Brawl because it "lacks the competitiveness of Melee" is because they're not giving enough time for the metagame to blossom. These things take TIME, people. We'll discover these things months, even years after Brawl's release.

But what else their anger stems from, I don't know.

 

[Serendipity]

Rome wasn't built in a day. Neither was Melee's competitive scene. From my understanding, techniques such as wavedashing, L-cancelling, and all that jazz weren't discovered during the first month of its release, were they not? We discovered those things over time, playing the game until we found a glitch, exploit, or technique, and then implementing it in some way.

The problem with some of the people hating on Brawl because it "lacks the competitiveness of Melee" is because they're not giving enough time for the metagame to blossom. These things take TIME, people. We'll discover these things months, even years after Brawl's release.

But what else their anger stems from, I don't know.

I have hope

 

[mark.]

qq

half right and half wrong

 

[samspot]

I find this complaining about the 'casualization' of brawl rather ironic since smash 64 and melee are casual fighting games designed for the casual market. Why do you think your special moves only require a direction and a button? Difficult techniques were removed because they are not in the spirit of the game. This simplification allows a focus on real strategy and tactics rather than mindless repetition of difficult techniques at the beginning of a smasher's career.

 

[ItAllGoesWhite]

I find this complaining about the 'casualization' of brawl rather ironic since smash 64 and melee are casual fighting games designed for the casual market. Why do you think your special moves only require a direction and a button? Difficult techniques were removed because they are not in the spirit of the game. This simplification allows a focus on real strategy and tactics rather than mindless repetition of difficult techniques at the beginning of a smasher's career.

THIS.

We're talking Nintendo post-SNES era, here: Mario Kart, Mario Party, Super Monkey Ball, etc.--- Super Smash Brothers was never designed to be a competitive game--in any incarnation. It has always been advertised as a party game.

With that said, I have to take the optimistic stance on all this. Does anyone here honestly think that Brawl is as good as it's going to get after such a short time? That the top players out there have already reached their final plateau?

I'm not saying everyone disappointed is wrong, of course. For all I know this game could fizzle out within 6 months or so. Maybe it is as good as it gets. However, that wasn't the case with SSB64, or SSBM--so why not give this game a slight chance before you dismiss it?

 

[LdrofLostSouls]

this dude is just mad that he can't wavedash or l-cancel in brawl there are better features, not to forget that 1P features and 4 player brawling/melee/w/e u wanna call it, ACTUALLY STILL EXIST if u havent noticed yet. so all u “MLG”ers, quit complaining and deal with it

 

[LdrofLostSouls]

I would rather take a crap on my copy of Brawl than play it.

Melee was the worst out of the three????

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH ............NOOBS ARE FUNNY.

hahahahahahaha MLL [Major League Loser]

 

[Gkryptonite]

To all the people dissing this guy, just remember that a whole range of advanced techniques will soon start to spawn. Advanced techniques will soon become numerous and will be as difficult as it gets. Brawl may "seem" like a part game, but in any game, if there's a winner and a loser it will become competitive, and with such a high population of competitive tourney players it will advance soon.

 

[smasher99]

lame. people seem to forget that everyone has changed, people complain that the game is slow but it is aculy faster than mellee without wave dashing and L canceling, in my opinion brawl = tons of new fetures, a much better thought-out game than mellee was, more charecters and a refreshing new phisics change.