Best chargeable neutral b (ball) projectile?

[MERPIS]

This is something I've been wondering for a while now..Who has the best chargeable orb projectile (sun salutation, shadow ball, etc, not things like needles).

 

[Lola Luftnagle]

Master 's since this does unreal damage when he's, like, two or three points (not stocks mind you) behind. I remember testing the aura sphere in Brawl where it did around 35% when he was five points behind the leader.

Yeah, I'd also wanna say 's is a close second since it heals her/him though not by much. Augmented with Deep Breathing, y'all have a recipe for pain.

 

[theMichael]

No thoron? Robin's charge has great, multipurpose use depending on how much you charge it.

 

[MERPIS]

No thoron? Robin's charge has great, multipurpose use depending on how much you charge it.

ORB, thoron, is a deadly lazer.

 

[theMichael]

ORB, thoron, is a deadly lazer.

Fine. Shadow ball is great. It has a lot of priority, speed and damage. It actually eats lucario's charge shot.

 

[MarioManTAW]

Unless you're only talking about storable ones, you forgot and potentially .

 

[MERPIS]

Unless you're only talking about storable ones, you forgot and potentially .

Is terrible in every way
Has next to no priority over attacks.
Too slow to be useful in a faster battle.

 

[Rran]

What about needle?

 

[MERPIS]

What about needle?

Needles aren't SPHERICAL

 

[Rran]

Oh hahha I skipped over that bit of criteria lol


(voted Shadow Ball)

 

[Smashifer]

Shadow Ball, definitely. Large and fast enough to be a major threat, can kill, eradicates shields, the whole 9.

 

[|RK|]

Shadow Ball, with Aura Sphere as a close second, and Charge Shot in third.

Shadow Ball's versatility is unreal, as is it's cooldown time. After that, Aura Sphere gets the nod for raw power, ledge traps, and kill confirms...

Huh. Actually, it might be tied. I can't see Mewtwo being upset about having Aura Sphere over Shadow Ball. But I can see Lucario missing quite a bit with Shadow Ball over Aura Sphere. On one hand, crazy aura-less power and versatility... on the other, there goes his insane kill confirm.

Yeah, I already voted, but I may have to give the nod to Aura Sphere. I can imagine Mewtwo doing something like ASC, jump cancel b-ball disable into charged usmash. Hrm.

Both moves round out each characters kits so incredibly well.

 

[Mini_Mac]

Needles aren't SPHERICAL

The Game Sphere is objectively the best chargable neutral-B. If you disagree, I mock you. Also, ZeRo said so.

I mean come on. Josh Nicoles is the best character in the game anyways so I'm not surprised that he has the best neutral special in general. His crazy hug-me-brothah grab to down-throw leads into so much like the Game Sphere even at kill percents. Also, he is a floaty-heavyweight making him hard to kill and hard to combo. Even Sheik can't handle it. And the range from his smash attacks when he whips out his foam finger is BEYOND UNFAIR!!! Fully charged kills at 10%!?!? Bull crap!! And those crazy projectiles where he throws the really-big-shrimp? I swear they go farther than Sheik's neutral special! They even go farther than Sheik's needles before 1.1.5. There is literally no escaping him...

 

[Routa]

I would personally say that best one is M2's followed by Gunner's and Lucario's

I do think that Gunner's CB is heavily underrated. It might not have the power of Samus' CS, but what it has is very low lag. If I remember correctly releasing the charge takes about 16 frames (M2's for example takes 23 once fully charged) and has a faf of 39 which is lowest from the chargeable ball projectiles. Thanks to it quick speed and low faf it is safest ball projectile to throw out even when not fully charged.

 

[Luigi player]

Aura Sphere with enough Aura.. doesn't have to be max.
Overall Shadow Ball, though.

Lucario can hit you while charging and confirm that into killmoves, which gives it a very special additional use and bumps it up a lot. Aura Sphere is definitely the most scary and best imo with a lot of Aura.
But since Lucario won't always be in such a state Shadow Ball should be better overall.
Shadow Ball is consistently strong, travels such a long distance to help approaching or camping from far away and is also not too laggy, so much more spamable/safe.

 

[Masonomace]

Solely based on the thread OP, my voting is limited to my lack of full-knowledge:

.

The movement you apply with Aura Sphere throughout Brawl & Smash 4 is what defines Lucario's meta heavily. Pivots, Br, rBr, the applications no less. . .the move having a hitbox & shieldlocking, true kill confirms into Usmash, that alone puts the spam-ability sky high. I would of said WFT for the spam-factor to play zoning & heal as well as the low cooldown on it being less than a second if you account for only the projectile fired. The full animation to fully charge it to get all those rewards like heal is 102 - 103 frames which is definitely not bad in comparison too. Although, you have to have the full charge to get the heal & it doesn't apply as much dangerous shield pressure as the others I feel.

Mewtwo takes the longest to charge seems like, but has neat airjump cancel physics with the move & hits hard. On top of being a large projectile rivaling Charge Shot and or Charge Blast, it also weaves & has you respect Mewtwo more with the full package he carries.

I'd rate Shadow Ball higher than Aura Sphere if I was really dead-set on Aura Sphere's endlag being so awful when fired full-charged, but the amount of things I can do with AS is far beyond what I would do with SB, that's just me.

 

[JagerCry]

It depends on how much % dmg Lucario has but I'd say overall it's prob Shadow Ball then Aura Sphere. I play Mewtwo vs my friend's Lucario a lot so I have quite a big of experience between the two. At low and mid percents I'll always allow us both to charge up but at high percents I'll approach and not let him charge aura sphere.

 

[Rizen]

Aura sphere due to the charging hitbox. It makes Lucario a monster to return from the ledge against and combos into Usmash.

 

[Mini_Mac]

I personally don't have a whole ton of experience playing any of these characters but from experience in fighting them, I actually would say Samus' charge shot is the best chargable neutral special.

My reasons (my personal opinion):

- It kills on a more consistent basis.
- Start-up lag on it is very small and the shot doesn't show up during that start-up to let the opponent know she is going to blast it (unlike the aura sphere and the shadow ball).
- It has crazy fast sideways mobility leaving her opponent with little time to react.

 

[MERPIS]

I personally don't have a whole ton of experience playing any of these characters but from experience in fighting them, I actually would say Samus' charge shot is the best chargable neutral special.

My reasons (my personal opinion):

- It kills on a more consistent basis.
- Start-up lag on it is very small and the shot doesn't show up during that start-up to let the opponent know she is going to blast it (unlike the aura sphere and the shadow ball).
- It has crazy fast sideways mobility leaving her opponent with little time to react.

Charge shot cannot be B reversed or charged in the air, this really limited opportunities when it can be charged.

 

[MarioMeteor]

What version of Aura Sphere exactly? I'd give it to Shadow Ball unless Lucario is at Max Aura, when Aura Sphere officially becomes ridiculous,

I'd say Dragon Fang Shot deserves honorable mention due to its stunning properties and the immense strength of the bite.

 

[MERPIS]

What version of Aura Sphere exactly? I'd give it to Shadow Ball unless Lucario is at Max Aura, when Aura Sphere officially becomes ridiculous,

I'd say Dragon Fang Shot deserves honorable mention due to its stunning properties and the immense strength of the bite.

It has no priority what so ever

 

[MarioMeteor]

It has no priority what so ever

Ok. And?

 

[MERPIS]

Ok. And?

That makes it bad

 

[MarioMeteor]

That makes it bad

It doesn't, but I suppose if you don't know how to use it you may think that.

 

[MERPIS]

It doesn't, but I suppose if you don't know how to use it you may think that.

No, it is bad, it clanks with hitboxes and goes through other projectiles, its terrible also due to the fact that Corrin is left wide open while using it.

Also what do you know about using it, you main Mario and Jiggs, not corrin lmao

 

[MarioMeteor]

No, it is bad, it clanks with hitboxes and goes through other projectiles, its terrible also due to the fact that Corrin is left wide open while using it.

Also what do you know about using it, you main Mario and Jiggs, not corrin lmao

Evidently more than you, because I do play Corrin on the side. I'm not going to waste time trying to educate you, though, it's clear that it'd be a pointless effort.

 

[MERPIS]

Evidently more than you, because I do play Corrin on the side. I'm not going to waste time trying to educate you, though, it's clear that it'd be a pointless effort.

Well if you have no evidence that fang shot is actually good, other than "It's gud because of bite hurr durr I'm correct", then you lose, sir.

 

[MarioMeteor]

Well if you have no evidence that fang shot is actually good, other than "It's gud because of bite hurr durr I'm correct", then you lose, sir.

Right. And tell me how "It's bad because it clanks" is any better an argument? It sounds to me like you throw out the move recklessly and write it off when it doesn't work.

 

[MERPIS]

Right. And tell me how "It's bad because it clanks" is any better an argument? It sounds to me like you throw out the move recklessly and write it off when it doesn't work.

Mostly because clanking is a major factor that makes or breaks projectiles, compare hadouken to shadow ball, aura sphere, hell even lloyd or Lucas' Pk fire, hadouken clanks with anything that is disjointed or invincible, stopping it in its tracks, same happens for fang shot, it stops dead in its tracks if it collides with a disjoint or invincible limb, Shadow ball or aura sphere go right through those, and hit the opponent. Lloyd and PK Fire do clank, but the explosion done damages the opponent anyways. Dragon fang shot has no luxury of that, it gets nothing off of clanking.

 

[MarioMeteor]

Mostly because clanking is a major factor that makes or breaks projectiles, compare hadouken to shadow ball, aura sphere, hell even lloyd or Lucas' Pk fire, hadouken clanks with anything that is disjointed or invincible, stopping it in its tracks, same happens for fang shot, it stops dead in its tracks if it collides with a disjoint or invincible limb, Shadow ball or aura sphere go right through those, and hit the opponent. Lloyd and PK Fire do clank, but the explosion done damages the opponent anyways. Dragon fang shot has no luxury of that, it gets nothing off of clanking.

But is it going to magically clank with every move every time you use it? No. If you use it at a safe distance, you don't get punished for it clanking, assuming you don't do the bite, and if it hits you get either a very useful stun effect which can set up for a combo or a kill, or an extremely powerful bite which does a ****load of damage, hurts shields, and kills easily. It's not even a hard move to land.

And just so you know, it is possible for Aura Sphere to clank if Lucario is at a low Aura level. I've had Luigi completely cancel out a fully charged Aura Sphere on several occasions.

 

[MERPIS]

But is it going to magically clank with every move every time you use it? No. If you use it at a safe distance, you don't get punished for it clanking, assuming you don't do the bite, and if it hits you get either a very useful stun effect which can set up for a combo or a kill, or an extremely powerful bite which does a ****load of damage, hurts shields, and kills easily. It's not even a hard move to land.

And just so you know, it is possible for Aura Sphere to clank if Lucario is at a low Aura level. I've had Luigi completely cancel out a fully charged Aura Sphere on several occasions.

So you're just magically gonna use it at point blank range to get your silly little bite move? If you use any projectile at a safe distance, you don't get punished, that point is moot since they're projectiles, they're supposed to be safe. You also can't shield cancel it, so if you're using it, even at a "safe" distance, some one like Diddy or Sheik or Sonic or Pikachu can and will run up to you, jump over your horrible attempt, and punish you for free. Corrin can't even punish paralysis since he is so damn slow, it usually always wears off before he can combo. The bite is also super laggy, most top tiers can exploit this, since it is so damn laggy. You can also just flat out jump over the garbage projectile and hit corrin for free since you are above him and he is still charging his bite, eliminating most mind games that other projectiles have.

Also, just pointing out that Lucario's aura sphere clanks shows me you are defeated.

 

[Masonomace]

I mean sure, I wouldn't mind DFS being a candidate. But in comparison to what every other projectile listed does overall, I would say that DFS would be limited. Shadow Ball, CHarge Shot, & Sun Salutation all get the job done easily by punishing a landing from a huge distance should they mistech, have no more airjumps trying to land, or while recovering etc..

DFS doesn't kill with just the small - large stun orb that well especially in comparison to the candidates. However, the total usage Corrin can get out of DFS is greatly appreciated despite of the characters slow mobility to make it full-on. Projectiles can be mentioned at any distance, because afterall, charged resources used at point-blank range is usually unheard of or very shocking to say the least. Corrin can DFS into a finisher Pin tipper which is nuts. Other things aside though, I could see it getting a good mention but I wouldn't rank it past the big-hitters.

To note, Aura Sphere doesn't need Max Aura to be a threat. But the sound it makes when at around max Aura iirc, is a sound you will never forget.

 

[Rizen]

Judging moves in a vacuum is never great but it's even worse when Aura is involved. How I'm judging this is: suppose Aura sphere behaves like it does on Lucario, scaling with aura but only for that move. Now we give the move to other characters.
Is the character receiving it heavy enough to make the scaling work and has an OoS option fast and good enough to combo from it? If 'yes' Aura sphere's the best. If 'no' shadow ball's the best.
So Link for example would do well with aura sphere because his tankyness and frame 10 Usmash. Sheik would do better with shadowball.

 

[Nah]

hi I play Corrin

DFS's water ball definitely does not compare to the projectiles listed in the poll.

 

[MrGameguycolor]

Also what do you know about using it, you main Mario and Jiggs, not corrin lmao

This is like a group of kids playing kickball at recess discounting a new player because they prefer playing checkers...

 

[Rizen]

This is a good example of aurasphere>shadowball. Watch tsu's cqc with AS.