Anyone find Ike's moveset a little bit uninspired ?

[ReroRero]

Ike is basically, the "heavy swordman" in the roster, he's the heavyweight character with more range and that's it, compared to Marth's tipper mechanics and Shulk monado arts, he seems a little bit bland. I'm not talking about how good he is in Smash 4 but more about his uncreative playstyle.

In Fire Emblem Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn, Ike fighting style is considered a little bit more original than in Smash. He's both fast and also powerful and he fights more "wildly" than most of Fire Emblem protagonists (there are even some characters that admire his fighting style). Yeah, if he hitted hard and was as fast as Sheik, that would make him broken but there are also some others things that makes him more unique than he is in Smash :

- He can launch a energy wave with his sword, I don't even understand why it isn't one of his special moves, a projectile fore Ike would be absolutely great since he is a slow character in smash. A missed opportunity IMO.
- Aether steals some HP and divide enemy's defense by 2 on the finsihing move. Imagine how it could work in Smash, the first hits heals Ike and the last one can break shields.
- Ragnell gives Ike a defense boost, in Smash it could mean that some of his moves can give him super armor...
- SPOILER : The Fire Emblem in Path of Radiance makes anyone who touch it both mad and powerful, it can be a special move than makes Ike more powerful but also more vulnerable like Shulk's monado arts.

There is more potential than just turning Ike in a heavy swordguy, I know it's more complicated than this to make a moveset but when you see others characters, I just feel a little bit disappointed

 

[Diddy Kong]

I actually think they translated most of Ike's animations from Path of Radiance well in his moveset. Quick Draw is literally one of Ike's critical hit animations, Forward Air is used in one of the cinematics where Ike fights the Black Knight, Ragnell giving a Defense boost could be a translation of Ike being a heavy weight fighter, Aether translating literally to Smash would be OP as **** to as well as him being both strong and fast. Also, one of Ike's custom moves for Aether lets him shoot a energy wave from his sword, similary to Kirby's Up B.

Ike is likely slow and strong to make him standout from Marth more, cause face it, both are Blue Haired Sword Lords. Ike being slower, stronger and rougher compared to Marth fits... Somewhat. Ideally though, Marth should be more of a Jack-of-All-Trades instead of what he is now. However, if they made Ike much like how he is in FE, he'd be clearly overpowered in Smash. Same with the likes of Ganondorf and Mewtwo, who are also obviously stronger than 90% of the roster but have obvious flaws in their characters one wouldn't expect to balance them out (Ganondorf cannot recover, no projectile, and Mewtwo dying insanely fast and having no safe options, but extremely lol-worthy if you think about it).

So yeah, I still think Ike is well represented. Especially compared to the characters I mentoined before, Mewtwo and Ganondorf.

 

[Deathcarter]

Ike has one of the cooler and more accurate movesets honestly. Anything that goes against how Ike was in the game has more to do with balance reasons than anything else. The only thing I would change is to has his sword beam replace counter.

 

[Renegade TX2000]

If anyone needs a new moveset it's ganondorf.

 

[ReroRero]

Ganondorf is obviously the priority but I think Ike is one of the characters that needs really some changes

Diddy Kong, you're right about Ganondorf, Mewtwo and Ike, they can't be as strong as their original games. What I say, is that some of these characters have lost a bit of their identity in the process. Aether could be OP but in the other hand, it's very slow so it can be predictable. The sword beam as a custom move is a little bit weak for me, when I got Ragnell in Fire Emblem, the first thing that I noticed is that it can launch ranged attack and I was completely amazed when I saw the attack animation, imagine my disappointment when Ike cannot do any ranged attack in Brawl / Smash 4. I excepted some changes in Smash 4 like Ganondorf in Brawl or Zero Suit Samus in Smash 4 and there were almost nothing :/

 

[Arrei]

It really is funny that Ganon, the guy who pretty much invented the concept of tennis bosses, has no projectile.

But yeah, Ike really should have gotten a projectile move. I like his moveset well enough, though what really vexed me since Brawl is the fact that Aether has no second strike. The entire point of the skill was hitting twice!

 

[Naf2pro]

I think it's okay because mainly, like IMO, pretty much like the general opinion of everyone in the world and my mother, is that he fights for his friends

 

[Diddy Kong]

Ganondorf is obviously the priority but I think Ike is one of the characters that needs really some changes

Diddy Kong, you're right about Ganondorf, Mewtwo and Ike, they can't be as strong as their original games. What I say, is that some of these characters have lost a bit of their identity in the process. Aether could be OP but in the other hand, it's very slow so it can be predictable. The sword beam as a custom move is a little bit weak for me, when I got Ragnell in Fire Emblem, the first thing that I noticed is that it can launch ranged attack and I was completely amazed when I saw the attack animation, imagine my disappointment when Ike cannot do any ranged attack in Brawl / Smash 4. I excepted some changes in Smash 4 like Ganondorf in Brawl or Zero Suit Samus in Smash 4 and there were almost nothing :/

To be honest I agree with you.

A lot of these characters indeed lose some of their identity when translated to Smash, especially compared to characters who have next to nothing to work with and their excistance in Smash adds to the characters. Prime examples being: Fox, Captain Falcon, Sheik. Notice how all these characters are very popular in Smash to.

When I supported Ike getting into Brawl, I was expecting him to be a middle weight fighter who's primary strenght would be having a weapon but with a ranged attack to differenciate him from Marth. I expected him to be faster instead of being much stronger. Afterall, Speed was his best assest in Path of Radiance, but Radiant Dawn turned that around a little. I do think that Radiant Dawn Ike fits the slow powerhouse playstyle better. But what bothered me most was Eruption. I mean... What was that attack about? It's better now that it has blue fire, but I still do not like Ike having that attack.

Aether also should have been far more powerful. The only satisfaction I get from this move is when I kill floaty characters extremely early with it's early hitbox when Ike has rage effect on him... And I agree that the second hit on Aether should've been far stronger, and I think Ike could benefit a lot if the multi hits on the first attack would heal him. But make it a gimmick like, it would only heal if all hits connect, or something. And then of course, the Luna part hits and does a whopping extra 15~19%?

If Neutral B was just exactly the energy wave from Aether Wave but chargeable I'd be very content with his moveset actually. But other than that, I have little to complain about with Ike. I like Ike. And I think other characters have it far worse.

: Doesn't even use his own PSI attacks, and he's even more famous for PK Fire and PK Thunder than anything else.
: Screw Attack always being so weak is as laughable as Aether being so weak, cannot charge her beam when running, jumping or anything, shoots considerably slower, some of her normal attacks do more damage than her missiles, no Speed Booster, no Morph Ball. Always worse than Zero Suit Samus to
: His main gimmick is basically based on statistical weakness... That as a Legendary Pokémon. Also doesn't use his strongest moves outside of Final Smash...
: Everything about this guy's moveset is absolutely facepalm worthy.
: Only based on Wario Ware, removed his trademark shoulder barge attack for F Smash to.

Am pretty sure that doesn't have it as bad as these characters.

 

[dahuterschuter]

Meh, he's a big-ass sword dude who swings around a big-ass sword.

Good enough for me.

 

[Arrei]

I just remembered some stuff I did dislike about Ike's moves: some attacks make no sense! It's like in the interest of making him a slower fighter but also needing to give him faster moves in his arsenal to make him viable, they failed to make his moves feel coherent with each other.

FSmash and Fair are both heavy vertical swings that involve him bringing his sword over his head and slashing downward. Why, then, does FSmash involve him hefting Ragnell up as if he has to struggle to do so, making it one of, if not the slowest FSmash in the game?

Ftilt and Bair are pretty much the same move as well, doing the same damage with the same sword arc with comparable knockback, but Bair is extremely quick while he has to pause to prepare Ragnell before swinging for Ftilt. What purpose does that serve?

Utilt, just... what is Utilt? The man's carrying a massive sword and his Utilt is to... punch the air and do a little hop? With that motion, actually hitting anything with the blade would just be an unintended side effect!

On the same note, why is Uair a helicopter motion?

 

[Diddy Kong]

I just remembered some stuff I did dislike about Ike's moves: some attacks make no sense! It's like in the interest of making him a slower fighter but also needing to give him faster moves in his arsenal to make him viable, they failed to make his moves feel coherent with each other.

FSmash and Fair are both heavy vertical swings that involve him bringing his sword over his head and slashing downward. Why, then, does FSmash involve him hefting Ragnell up as if he has to struggle to do so, making it one of, if not the slowest FSmash in the game?

Ftilt and Bair are pretty much the same move as well, doing the same damage with the same sword arc with comparable knockback, but Bair is extremely quick while he has to pause to prepare Ragnell before swinging for Ftilt. What purpose does that serve?

Utilt, just... what is Utilt? The man's carrying a massive sword and his Utilt is to... punch the air and do a little hop? With that motion, actually hitting anything with the blade would just be an unintended side effect!

On the same note, why is Uair a helicopter motion?

Thanks, now I can't unsee

 

[TurboLink]

I agree. Sakurai could've done a lot better.

 

[Mario766]

If Ike was kept like PoR/RD, Ike would be something like this:

Fast Swordsman with strong range with good damage on hit. He'd do more than Marth on hit and would have similar running speed to Roy in Smash 4, as his speed stat is much better than Roy's or Marth.

His B move would change from Eruption to a beam style projectile where he slashes vertical and produces a shockwave that reaches somewhat up and hits towards the ground. It'd be something that isn't spammable but could force recoveries. He could also use it to edgeguard linear recoveries. This would be better in Brawl but Smash 4 has a really good use for Eruption so who knows what would happen because of it.

Up-B would give slight health back like WFT, but only on hit and not just on release. This would make Aether scarier to challenge because any mistake gives Ike health back.

Ike's smash attacks would be faster, with his F-Smash being noticeably faster but doing slightly less damage.

Ike is meant to be an unconventional sword user who wields a huge blade effortlessly with one arm, so his hitboxes should stay wonky as they are. They just gutted his speed to balance him because if he had good speed and his power he'd be honestly broke.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Ike fights more like Marth then Marth in his own game. haha.

Elegant graceful sword master with insane speed and precision.

 

[Space Stranger]

Uninspired? I know for a fact that his Up B is also based on the Mercenary crits from the GBA Fire Emblem games.

Even though Ike is definitely not as fast as his canonical appearance in FE, the "wild" factor is retained through the elaborate swings of the Ragnell in his aerials.

 

[Ryuki of Spiral Rhapsody]

I wish they could think of a way to make Aether more like original Aether.

It's so dumb to think, but it'd be fun.

I wanna split defense and gain health.

 

[Arrei]

In terms of staying faithful to the games, I'd just want Aether to have the option of using the second strike with the backflip if the attack connects, but not on whiff. If they implemented a heal, it'd probably have to be something like a 1% heal on the first hit of the throw hitbox to be balanced, nothing that really makes much of a difference, but just to be there. The splitting defense could simply be handwaved as the fact that the move deals so much damage if all hitboxes connect.

 

[ChaikaBestGirl]

As a guy who has never played a Fire Emblem game ever, i dont have an opinion of how well it translated, but i feel all his moves are just as flashy as everyone elses special. Aether is like the coolest up b ever, dude throws a spinning sword in the air, jumps up, grabs it, does like a billion flips and then slams into the ground with it.

 

[FieryRebirth]

Ike's moveset seems to be based more than whatever was translated from his games. If you imagine yourself wielding a really heavy two-handed sword with one hand then some of the moves you see from him start to make sense.

 

[Arrei]

Yeah, but on the other hand they specifically describe him as wielding that sword with ease. He holds that sword at chest height with one hand, and is capable of making very fast swipes with it. But then at the same time he's loaded up with several slow swings where you really feel the sword's girth in the swing.



And then there's that goddamn Utilt fistpump.

 

[Turrin]

...I think Robin is the only Fire Emblem character whose moveset is highly representative of the game he's from. Marth literally just has sword moves that do not correlate to his game at all. The closest thing I can think of is that shield breaker looks like his attack animation, that's it. Roy just has fire on his sword, which only ever happened during a crit in the game anyway. Where's Roy's ranged fire attack like in Sealed Sword? Sakurai? Pls? Lucina's just a copy of Marth's moveset with no references to Awakening whatsoever besides, like what, her down taunt? So, yeah. Ike definitely isn't alone in this department.

 

[Mario766]

Ike's animations actually come from his games at least.

 

[NerfAkira]

...I think Robin is the only Fire Emblem character whose moveset is highly representative of the game he's from. Marth literally just has sword moves that do not correlate to his game at all. The closest thing I can think of is that shield breaker looks like his attack animation, that's it. Roy just has fire on his sword, which only ever happened during a crit in the game anyway. Where's Roy's ranged fire attack like in Sealed Sword? Sakurai? Pls? Lucina's just a copy of Marth's moveset with no references to Awakening whatsoever besides, like what, her down taunt? So, yeah. Ike definitely isn't alone in this department.

i mean, to be fair, its hard to translate things like that into the game, every fire emblem character is capable of doing ranged attacks with certain weapons, so thats not respective of their character, the only real thing they can do is use the basic character design, take some moves inspired by them, and base a style off it. if you are going off any fire emblem game, all characters have like 3 usable moves to translate in smash, and they got most of them for ike.

i mean look at robin, hes the avatar character, who could be literally everything, yet hes stuck as a tactician, literally the class no one kept him as.

and Lucina impersonated marth, and they both wield the falcion (even though they kinda wildly changed the design of the sword, so its alot more "legendary" looking) so i get why they'd copy marth so closely.

Roy is pretty unacceptable, but they did alot to make him his own character, but with a wildly different take on marth's attack style that feels like a completely different character, in alot of respects, he feels more like his own character than shulk does (to ike)