Social 7th Heaven - Cloud Social Thread

[Stylo Ren]

Charge Time nerf is a nerf lol.

It's great to have a positive attitude about it, but the only benefits that come out of it is that you can do limit cancel stuff for longer; but that's already really situational.

Reports of Aerial FT are that it kills approx ~20% later. So setups into it dont lead to stocks out of the blue as early as they used to. It seems like you're just gonna end up fishing for FT kills in the air.

Limit cancel is great in neutral, though, and I find my neutral game becomes worse when I get in limit, which is why once I get in limit I try to never play in neutral, and try to take control of the stage when I get close to full bar.

We can force approaches for longer and play a patient punish game, matchup depending. While it is technically a nerf, I don't see it as one and am not bothered by it.

That really bites for FT though, dair hitconfirm was a monster.
Its still got airdodge punish potential, which is mostly what I use it for outside of the hitconfirm

 

[GHNeko]

If your neutral game is worse with limit, then that could be an indicator of an over-reliance on Cloud's specials in neutral. YOu should prob grind out being able to play a strong neutral with normals considering they're his best defensive tools when you force an opponent to approach.

The whole reason why Limit Charge forces an approach is not because of the charge itself, but because our opponents are terrified of dealing with L-Cloud. If we take longer to charge, they have more chances to deal with us.

I'm 100% sure the whole reason for the FT nerf is mostly because of Doubles. They've shown that they'll nerf characters due to double's tactics (which I personally find dumb as hell but...) so this is probably just another result of them dealing with an oversight for the competitive hemisphere.

That being said...

Stylo Ren, your font color is really harsh on the eyes for people using the project M them....

X_X

 

[Jp3]

So since FT was nerfed, is it still half decent for catching air dodges?

 

[GHNeko]

Yes it's still good, but you have to start doing it ~20% later.

It's still a before LCS starts killing outright so it's not useless. Just dont expect to kill off of Dair FT.

 

[HFlash]

TBF, Sonic got numerous -2 KBG reductions and his kill power is significantly lower, but I still think Cloud's Limit Cross Slash is much better than any of Sonic's kill moves.

And Bayonetta doesn't need a lot of things for the matchup being on her favor. She forces approaches with both Bullet Climax and Bullet arts, and only needs one well-placed Witch Time to finish a stock (0-to death's are difficult on Cloud, but still, she can kill starting 40 and has even weirder things with rage).

There is no reason for Cloud to have to approach. If Bayo uses her gun, charge shield charge shield, and if she continues to spam predictably, the cloud can just trade with LB BB and win out. The big reason Bayo is hard to deal with is because of how broken WT was (and perhaps still is). The nerf to WT more than anything favors Cloud post patch more so than all of the small kill potential nerfs cloud got.

As for Cloud without LB, I agree regular cloud is better out side of LB. You can use CS for punishes which is better for quick punishes than ftilt, CH OOS is great for punishing unsafe hits on shield, and BB is fine as the occasional mix up for a few percent. The nerf means that you have to be even more deliberate when choosing to throw out a LB move as a kill option at later percentages. That one second could be significant at really high percentage situations but other than that, I don't see the big deal.

 

[Fex13]

the cloud nerfs arent terrible. cloud is still a very very good character. it could have been MUCH worse (more lag, slower etc) he still funtions the same, that is important.

 

[TTTTTsd]

The biggest buff we got in relation to this game is the weakening of Sheik. That easily makes up for the nerfs that were dealt this patch (I call them wrist-slaps).

We are infinitely more viable than before solely on these grounds.

 

[Fex13]

The biggest buff we got in relation to this game is the weakening of Sheik. That easily makes up for the nerfs that were dealt this patch (I call them wrist-slaps).

We are infinitely more viable than before solely on these grounds.

i actually agree with this. sheiks fair nerf is a huuuuuuge plus for cloud.

 

[GHNeko]

Bayonetta's Skill TIme got a 5f endlag increase, meaning our baits and punishes are more effective.

ZSS got hurt too and we were arguably even with her before.

We're still viable as **** on an international level.

 

[HFlash]

Like I've already stated, there is not serious talk about Cloud being the best character in the game as a result of everyone else getting the nerf hammer much harder. Irregardless though, if you are playing cloud because you think he is viable, then you are playing cloud for the wrong reasons.

 

[GHNeko]

Irregardless

This is actually worse than all of the cloud nerfs combined.

 

[Fex13]

there is onee thing im reaaaaaally afraid of now. cloud is going to be even better now and that means it is only a matter of time until he receives a REAL nerf....that is going to make me so sad if he becomes more laggy and sower in general.

 

[HFlash]

This is actually worse than all of the cloud nerfs combined.

? Irregardless is a word. lol. It's nonstandard, but still a word.

 

[GHNeko]

? Irregardless is a word. lol. It's nonstandard, but still a word.

Absolutely not.

The most you could even convince me is that it's slang.

 

[Deleted member]

So Cloud got nerfed... I can't say that I'm surprised. Looking at the nerfs so far, it's nothing that's too significant; Cloud just needs to work more to get his kills. Even then, Cloud's power, damage output, and range are ridiculous that it still puts him on edge against a majority of the cast. I guess the Finishing Touch nerf was the most significant nerf, but I rarely use that move since it's very situational and punishable.

Cloud getting nerfed isn't the end of the world. He isn't considered top 5 to 15 for one reason; he is considered it for multiple reasons. During this game's lifecycle, I've seen characters that got even worse nerfs and removed what made them top tier. Hell, I play as Luigi; he was considered top tier, but now he's considered high tier because of his down throw nerf. A few nerfs shouldn't remove Cloud's viability as a character when he has so many tools at his disposal.

I'm not giving up on Cloud. The road towards winning will be more steep... but we need to embrace our dreams and whatever happens protect our honor as SOLDIER.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

The funny thing about Cloud's nerfs is that even before Finishing Touch got nerfed, it was already far less effective at KOing opponents with defense boosts. Also, while Finishing Touch normally deals 1% damage, it does have the potential to deal 2% damage on opponents who have negative defense values.

 

[GHNeko]

Witch Time's effect lasts for a shorter amount of time when done fresh (Witch Time vs WFT's jab 1 lasts for 188 frames in 1.14, 139 frames in 1.15). The scaling on it was SIGNIFICANTLY increased, Witch Time immediately after a fresh one lasts for only 57 frames in 1.15 (I don't have the numbers for 1.14 but it was much longer than that).

Skill Time is nothing to worry about anymore now boys lmfaooo.

 

[-m0]

Well, damn. Dsmash and dair to FT were my main killing methods. RIP.

Oh and GHNeko you can turn off users custom font colors in your account settings.

What I say goes...and I don't care. And you're too soft.

Er, no...you're doing fine, and don't we all have our ups and downs sometimes.

And Yuffie?

He is too soft

And yes, you can go on a date with Yuffie. It's difficult, but I think it's easier than Barret

Also it's near my birthday so I get to use this

 

[TTTTTsd]

Our tournament results are probably going to go up considerably. I'm very excited! We came out so unscathed compared to every other character and not only is our worst MU nerfed, one of our notable good MUs is going to be more relevant than before and we still handle Rosalina very well.

What a good patch for Cloud. The secret best buff is having your worst MU nerfed.

 

[JesseMcCloud]

I think that some of the nerfs are dumb as a matter of principal, but I will gladly take a 2 KBG nerf on LB CS in exchange for those ZSS and Shiek nerfs every day.
Cloud got clipped by the hammer. The Smash Sisters were smited. (Smote?)
Oh, and irregardless is most definitely not a word.

 

[CrimsonRick117]

Our tournament results are probably going to go up considerably. I'm very excited! We came out so unscathed compared to every other character and not only is our worst MU nerfed, one of our notable good MUs is going to be more relevant than before and we still handle Rosalina very well.

What a good patch for Cloud. The secret best buff is having your worst MU nerfed.

Pretty much. Cloud even though he was "nerf'd" he also got a indirect buff with some of his bad matchups being nerfed.. so silver lining XD..

 

[~Skelly~]

Shiek got nerfed. ZSS got nerfed. Corrin's Counter Surge got nerfed. And we barely got nerfs.

It was a good day.

 

[JesseMcCloud]

Shiek got nerfed. ZSS got nerfed. Corrin's Counter Surge got nerfed. And we barely got nerfs.

It was a good day.

Don't forget Witch Time got nerfed hard too!

 

[~Skelly~]

Don't forget Witch Time got nerfed hard too!

I was more excited for Counter Surge getting the hammer than I was for WT. WT wasn't all that troublesome for me tbh. It did need that nerf, though, that's for sure.

 

[JesseMcCloud]

I was more excited for Counter Surge getting the hammer than I was for WT. WT wasn't all that troublesome for me tbh. It did need that nerf, though, that's for sure.

Irregardless, the sky isn't falling, like some people are making it out to be.
I am just the slightest bit salty about U-air's nerf, tbh. That, and that a move's viability being affected by one specific setting (FT's abuse in Doubles) but whatevs, those Sheik and ZSS nerfs were long overdue.

 

[Banjodorf]

Irregardless, the sky isn't falling, like some people are making it out to be. I am just the slightest bit salty about U-air's nerf, tbh. That, and that a move's viability being affected by one specific setting( FT's abuse in Doubles) but whatevs, those Sheik and ZSS nerfs were long overdue.

Considering FT just kills slightly later, it'll probably still be useful in Doubles. Honestly I'm OK with having to work for a few more % to use it.

 

[mario123007]

He is too soft

Oh, am I?

 

[JesseMcCloud]

So I've been doing some FG, and I have to say, while the nerfs haven't killed Cloud, there's been a couple of times where it's been noticeable, and by that I mean we just don't kill so ridiculously early. But all in all, he's better if only for the fact that Uair combos so much better.

 

[-m0]

Did any of you guys kill the submarine crew in FFVII? I attacked them because I heard you could steal some really good armor from them but as soon as that music started playing I restarted and took them prisoner instead.

And is dair->FT not a thing anymore?

 

[~Skelly~]

And is dair->FT not a thing anymore?

It still is, it just kills at a later percent than before.

Edit: Wait, nope, nevermind. Pretend I didn't say anything.

 

[KevN くコ:彡]

Did any of you guys kill the submarine crew in FFVII? I attacked them because I heard you could steal some really good armor from them but as soon as that music started playing I restarted and took them prisoner instead.

And is dair->FT not a thing anymore?

I never kill them. I always just take them as prisoner. Unless they have a game breaking summon I don't know about.

 

[GHNeko]

Irregardless

Trolling.

Lmao


All our English teachers are waking up out of bed in a cold sweat, feeling as if they've failed.

 

[-m0]

LADIES AND GENTS:

I give you Mr. Chocobo Head in all his glory

I like this a lot better than my previous drawing, the hair actually looks right and I like the shading I did

I never kill them. I always just take them as prisoner. Unless they have a game breaking summon I don't know about.

Far as I know the only thing you get from that is a bad conscience and the Shinra Alpha armor if you steal from the captain

 

[Chalice]

So Nairo posted on Twitter that he found Limit Charge to go from

6.02 secs > 6.44 secs

This barely changes anything. We now the best character lol

 

[-m0]

It still is, it just kills at a later percent than before.

Edit: Wait, nope, nevermind. Pretend I didn't say anything.

God ****ing dammit. Easily favorite killing method gone.

 

[Banjodorf]

So Nairo posted on Twitter that he found Limit Charge to go from

6.02 secs > 6.44 secs

This barely changes anything. We now the best character lol

Man WTF is with all this garbage about it taking a full second and a half longer? People need to stop.

 

[TTTTTsd]

Man WTF is with all this garbage about it taking a full second and a half longer? People need to stop.

Improper testing. Limit DOES take longer if you immediately charge after you blow it though (which is fair). Least I'm p.sure it does. ANYWHO yeah, ppl just aren't testin proper/fact checking. I'll get Liberation to change it, I'll coerce him with my alluring body or something.

 

[~Skelly~]

Y'know, looking at the Sheik nerf, I can't help but think about that one joke in The Emperor's New Groove.

Nintendo: "We got it! First, we'll have Sakurai turn Sheik into a safe character, the safest character in the game. Then we'll put her in the initial game and the first patch, then we'll put that patch into several more patches, and then mail it back to ourselves, and when it arrives, hehehe... WE SMASH IT WITH A HAMMER!" "It's brilliant, BRILLIANT we tell you!"

If it wasn't already obvious and because I'm repeating myself, I'm glad Sheik finally got nerfed. But we're not here to talk about Sheik, back to Cloud.

God ****ing dammit. Easily favorite killing method gone.

Don't worry, we still have LB CS, and FT is still good.

I'll get Liberation to change it, I'll coerce him with my alluring body or something.

I want pictures if you're going for the first option.

 

[Stylo Ren]

...I wonder if Dair->uair->ft would work, thinking about it. Or maybe Dair->nair->ft. In platform stages Dair-Ft could still work, since from what I understand, grounded FT is still the same. If you can dair them into a platform, and then land and FT, then it could work.

Also, sorry about my font color. I meant for it to be a cooler blue but I never got around to actually changing it.

Also, L-charge still forces approaches, and it creates a bait and punish game that Cloud is great at. Also, he has access to a few more combos, Like Uair to Climhazzard which can convert into a spike at the ledge for free. Uair Cross slash is pretty useful at lower percents too, and Cross Slash is really nice for punishing things like Ryu's Focus Attack.
Being able to not have to approach is amazing, and we lose that when we gain limit. However we become much more offensively focused with limit

This patch was pretty good for us all in all, Our 3 worst MU's just got a hell of a lot easier. Mk can't Rufio anymore, Shiek isnt as good anymore, Witchtime got a hefty nerf. We sitting pretty

 

[-m0]

Wait MK lost the Halberd Loop? I saw his uair got nerfed but that's bad if he can't do that anymore

And does that mean ZSS can't ladder anymore either?