3.6 lucario discussion

[Zoa]

Ah, thanks for the inputs guys, it's just that I have to try much harder to approach and it's not working, so I end up camping/baiting them out instead. BTW what's FCAS?

I don't think it's that wise to force approaches with Lucario. He can DD extremely well, but his air speed and slow projectile (charged AS) don't really work well for approaches. However part of the problem is that we're still developing Lucario as a character, so his metagame at the moment isn't fleshed out. FCAS = fully charged Aura Sphere

 

[Rongunshu]

The taunt nerf was the most unnecessary nerf of them all. He gains less aura generally in every way (except for the FP and pummel aura gain Darkgun mentioned) so why have him take damage? To me, it looks like a "Just because" nerf and is honestly not a great tradeoff anyway of how much damage you take. Next thing you know they're gonna have Ness/Lucas take damage for their up-b recovery because "They electrocute themselves".

 

[Akkien]

The taunt nerf was the most unnecessary nerf of them all. He gains less aura generally in every way (except for the FP and pummel aura gain Darkgun mentioned) so why have him take damage? To me, it looks like a "Just because" nerf and is honestly not a great tradeoff anyway of how much damage you take. Next thing you know they're gonna have Ness/Lucas take damage for their up-b recovery because "They electrocute themselves".

As Strong Bad pretty much said, a taunt is a taunt, and I agree with that. I mean, it's still good that he can use it on his favor to some extent, but it shouldn't have been an actual tool for us in the first place imo. That being said though, it is a little overwhelming considering how he doesn't gain nearly as much aura as before. The sad part is that as long as Lucarios keep showing those cool combos that nobody knows can be punished, grabbed, and whatnot, I don't think we'll get anything changed back, tweaked, or buffed by 3.6's full release to compensate.

 

[LupinX]

People just don't know how to DI those combos i swear lol
Was there a reason why they changed his running animation?

 

[AceGamer]

People just don't know how to DI those combos i swear lol
Was there a reason why they changed his running animation?

I believe the reason they changed his run animation is because it didn't really suit the characters body shape plus in Lucarios appearances in the anime, movies etc he's never really run like that. The current run could use some touches though but it's actually growing on me

 

[Szion]

They were trying way too hard to make a "cool" running animation. The old one was better.

I like the new animation but yesits very obvious they tried too hard..




Alright so..the recovery nerf for up B into air dodge, i definitely understand that nerf.
aura on shield...well its already demoralizing to shield against luc because he can cancel into forcepalm onshield, so giving him aura for that, ehhh questionable.i wouldnt mind either way, but i think they already condition ppl not to shield cuz fp is kinda guaranteed...ive rarely had an issue with it.

uhh

the new taunt. I feel iffy on it. i think if its gonna do a whole 5% it should charge more than 5 points of aura. though, perhaps its homage to lucarios original design of risk for reward, that being lucario being at kill % for SOME THINGS then going into kill % for MANY things for the reward of a better neutral/damage

speaking of neutral, taking away the invince on lucario's DTC really freakin bothers me. i rarely uses it so i cant say i rely on it, but i think just shortening the invince wouldve been fine..

 

[Rongunshu]

The run animation grew on me and I like it now, when I first saw it I was dying of laughter but I like that it's a more "canon" run to when he was in the movie "Lucario and the mystery of mew".

 

[LupinX]

Even with the nerfs a lot I mean A LOT of people still complained. I ESC to wall jump to ES to recover on stage and my friend was upset of that "stupid" recovery, like you play Samus, I don't know why you're upset lol

on another note

I'm afraid what will happen to Lucario after the beta version. I don't want him to get nerfed again for lack of matchup knowledge. For what IPK did in EVO I doubt he'll receive even minor buffs.

 

[Szion]

The run animation grew on me and I like it now, when I first saw it I was dying of laughter but I like that it's a more "canon" run to when he was in the movie "Lucario and the mystery of mew".

He had sonic run though o.O i was wondering where the hell that is forever.

 

[ForgottenLabRat]

People need to realize that IPK is just a godlike player, not that Lucario is good.

 

[LupinX]

People need to realize that IPK is just a godlike player, not that Lucario is good.

It's time for lucario mains to play like **** to buff him up lol

 

[ForgottenLabRat]

Alright you heard him boys, time to play like the number two til 4.0!

 

[Smash_Ronin]

I don't think Lucario was a good character at all in 3.5, now that he for some reason got nerfed harsher than any other character he doesn't seem remotely viable. It's not that I am just bad at Lucario either, admittedly I'm no IPK, but a Lucario player has yet to win a large tournament, unless there is one that I am not aware of. Now this doesn't mean that in order for every character to be proven decent they have to win a tournament. That would be stupid, but he top tier in 3.0 and he has only received nerfs since.
It doesn't matter if people think he is balanced, truth is he can't stand up against other characters at even moderate level gameplay. People like I Punch Kidz have poured a lot of time into this character and and still haven't won a big tournament. Now I could feel very ignorant if someone shows me a tournament where some 3.5 Lucario messed **** up and did need some changes, but I have yet to see that.

i couldn't agree more with this! my biggest philosophy regarding us Lucario mains is that with such a simple set of laws dictating such a complex and improvisational application of his moveset, ultimately we are faced with an obstacle that (quite frankly) none of the other characters, or the players who main them, have to overcome. and now, on top of that we're having to deal with relentless nerfs!!!! to me it's nothing short of absurd. HOWEVER, there will always be the part of me that has faith in the developers to be making the right decisions. but when we're not even considered a real, true-to-life threat in a tournament and the nerfs STILL CONTINUE to be written into the new patches... i just ca't help but wonder what the flying F*CK IS GOING ON?!?!

 

[LupinX]

I don't know about yall, but Lucario is still manageable right now. Not saying he DOESN'T need a buff (ASC 8 frames to 6 when?) but it's still quite limited. Of course, it forces us to use other options, but those other options are very risky and most of the time not worth it for the work Lucario has to put in for just one charge. I also think his neutral is not as bad as people claim...and it's not as good as OTHER people claim to be as well. Lucario needs to mix up his options (to which are limited in 3.6) a lot more for guaranteed combos. I've seen people's personal tier lists and found Lucario top 10 character, even top 5, and I don't know if they are high but they need to work on their SDI lol. Lucario right now is either top 15 (like 15th) or top 20. That's just my 2 cents

 

[Zoa]

I'm still under the belief that there's too much focus on Lucario's aura by the DT instead of focusing on his traits aside from the reward system. Most of the changes so far have been largely focused on his aura system and specials. There have been constant nerfs and tweaks to it more than anything about the character itself. Now with all these nerfs, including the massive nerfs to gaining aura itself, wouldn't it make sense to begin adjusting his traits other than focusing most attention on OHC and aura?

 

[Smash_Ronin]

now THAT is an interesting thought. i think they've all but perfected the OHC system at this point, maybe working on his other moves would be a more sensible direction. but i also have to think that OHC and aura are more than just the backbone of this character. in my opinion (or at least how i approach Lucario mentally) those 2 concepts are everything to a Lucario main, and if that is in fact what the team is going for then i have to think that working on bettering the moves not involved with OHC would ultimately mean creating an OP character, which in turn means nerfing even more of the moveset that we already know and love.

i don't know? who really knows? all i do know is that whatever you or anyone decides to do, someone is going to have a negative opinion on it. hahaha